Prolific "video games make you bad" researcher exposed as planning to refuse to publish his work if it doesn't show video game make you bad + mor

Dwarvenhobble

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I mean their not. Sitting all day and playing games certainly isn't healthy, there is no debate about that.
Mentally healthy, but then you know what was meant and seemingly deliberately failed to get that.

Depends on what game and dev he was talking about. If he was talking about... what was that murder spree game that came out awhile back and really just sold on the whole anti-pc anti-sjw thing? Either way it would fit those guys.
So you think Hatred the Isometric shooter game is teaching people how to kill?


Changing media does change the culture, this is well known.
No generally culture influences media. If media had such an impact how come study after study seems to show the opposite? Hell do you think banning all violent media would end violence?

It sounds more like she was talking about the gender make up of developers and who was at the big trade shows. She did talk about some games but from the article I think its a combination of them. Either way, I don't disagree with most of her points, I'm not sure how many of them I agree with, but I don't disagree.
Yet she also mentions the games being shown off and the characters in them

I can list off over 40 female streamers that are popular, quite a few of them are really good at games. As an example.

Knew I should have added "And not Vtubers" lol

That's a lot of words to express that you have no idea what her videos actually entailed despite having such a rabid hate-boner. Fight on yee culture-warrior!
Ah you mean like when she said all male Gamers are like the cast of the Big Bang Theory? Or when she claimed Lego was sexist for trying to actually diversify to attract more women? Or the time she was upset over Doom 2016's violence? Or the time she lied about Watch_Dogs? Or the time she lied about I think it was Just Cause 2? Or the time she said video games should have moral restrictions applied to them to make certain content found in games like Assassins Creed and GTA IV just not allowed in the industry?


I'm amazed anyone's even still mentioning her. Her 15 minutes of fame have long since passed, and we should have all moved on.
People still push her talking points and echo her beliefs it seems.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Mentally healthy, but then you know what was meant and seemingly deliberately failed to get that.
Maybe, but mentally its also probably not the greatest, especially if you grew up in a generation that was more used to interacting with people face to face then online.

So you think Hatred the Isometric shooter game is teaching people how to kill?
Ehh, not really, but with how they marketed it and such, I wouldn't blame anyone for thinking it and I'm sure the devs are tools.
You could make the argument that VR shooters, especially those with realistic gun handling are though and it would be hard to really argue against that.

No generally culture influences media. If media had such an impact how come study after study seems to show the opposite? Hell do you think banning all violent media would end violence?
I don't know. I think it would probably reduce the violence, I don't know about get rid of but I think it would reduce it. If you can learn something from media then you can be influenced by it. To what amount it would be reduced is up for debate though, reducing lead in water and air probably reduced it more. But, all people at one time or another dream of spin kicking some total dick in the throat, might not be as many without media influence.

Yet she also mentions the games being shown off and the characters in them
Yeah but she also seems more down on the fact that the people on stage were like 95% guys.
 

Specter Von Baren

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Knew I should have added "And not Vtubers" lol
What does it matter? Using an avatar of some sort isn't new. Plenty of video makers have been using drawn images in various poses in place of showing their actual faces for a long time, this is just an evolution of that. Why should many successful women just be thrown out for no other reason than "EW weebs like it! Gross!"?
 

Dwarvenhobble

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Maybe, but mentally its also probably not the greatest, especially if you grew up in a generation that was more used to interacting with people face to face then online.
Yeh he's again more specifically on about the content of the games not social interaction kind.

Ehh, not really, but with how they marketed it and such, I wouldn't blame anyone for thinking it and I'm sure the devs are tools.
You could make the argument that VR shooters, especially those with realistic gun handling are though and it would be hard to really argue against that.
I don't think Hatred ever marketed itself as teaching people how to kill. Hell I've shot air rifles before and that really couldn't be argued it's teaching people how to kill. We have air rifle stands at fairs in the UK is that teaching kids to kill? They're actual guns as such but they've been round for years and people aren't going round killing.

I don't know. I think it would probably reduce the violence, I don't know about get rid of but I think it would reduce it. If you can learn something from media then you can be influenced by it. To what amount it would be reduced is up for debate though, reducing lead in water and air probably reduced it more. But, all people at one time or another dream of spin kicking some total dick in the throat, might not be as many without media influence.
Humans have been killing one another for a long time. Societies have had violence for a long time. The Vikings didn't need violent media to happily go round killing people and fighting.

As for learning stuff, well Piaget's theories on learning position it as the schema doing so. As such you can only learn from media what you don't already know or contradicts you schema. Add to that other psychologists pointing out the fictional divide also means people are somewhat less receptive and Vygotsky's theories about how we learn more from our peers than other and it's not media doing it. Anita and co keep using the claim "You don't have a magic shield protecting you" well modern understanding of mental development says we actually do have a shield as such built up by our years of development and the fact we use age ratings and other stuff to help prevent children being exposed to things deemed to not be appropriate or them to be ready for. It's actually oddly a weird case of illusory superiority from Anita and others that think they are somehow enlightened and are able to see the truth while everyone else is just drones who do what pieces of media tell them.

There is a kind of media designed to influence people. It's called propaganda, or advertising techniques. They are only somewhat effective at best. You know who uses a lot of such techniques in her work? Anita.

Quick cuts and rapid sequences of images disorientate the viewers senses making a person more open to suggested.
Using terms like "We" to try to include the viewer using sort of tribal grouping techniques to stop people wanting to object or question.
Relying on the natural laziness of the brain to not question statistics and to accept what's being deemed to come from sources of authority.
Relying on the natural trusting state of humanity to push lies thinking people won't check them because why lie right?
Presenting ones self as trustworthy and an authority to listen to.
Playing on primal fear of members of the group being harmed or even benevolent sexist beliefs.

You know why her 15 minutes of fame is over? Because the techniques only work for so long. Without McIntosh season 2 of Tropes vs Women wasn't anywhere near as well crafted in using techniques to influence people so she fell out of favour because she didn't seem needed now.

I always bring this advert up if you want to see media influence techniques on show


Watch it then watch it again with the following questions in mind.
"Do you worry when you get a paper cut about your finger falling off?"
"What else could blood from brushing you teeth be a sign of? Maybe Brushing a bit hard?"
"Clinically proven by who?"
 

Dwarvenhobble

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What does it matter? Using an avatar of some sort isn't new. Plenty of video makers have been using drawn images in various poses in place of showing their actual faces for a long time, this is just an evolution of that. Why should many successful women just be thrown out for no other reason than "EW weebs like it! Gross!"?
True lol.
The sort of issues would be trying to do collab streams with V tubers and would it work very well as it's kind of a mix of two different styles still.
 
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Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Yeh he's again more specifically on about the content of the games not social interaction kind.
Ehh.

I don't think Hatred ever marketed itself as teaching people how to kill. Hell I've shot air rifles before and that really couldn't be argued it's teaching people how to kill. We have air rifle stands at fairs in the UK is that teaching kids to kill? They're actual guns as such but they've been round for years and people aren't going round killing.
Of course it didn't, the only thing that does is military training stuff. It marketed itself as a spree killer game that had brutal executions against innocents.


Humans have been killing one another for a long time. Societies have had violence for a long time. The Vikings didn't need violent media to happily go round killing people and fighting.
Hence why I said how much it would reduce it is up for debate and that reducing lead probably would reduce it way more. I'm also going to ignore all your stuff about Sarkeesian since I don't care and don't feel like getting into a dumb argument about her stuff.
 

Dwarvenhobble

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Of course it didn't, the only thing that does is military training stuff. It marketed itself as a spree killer game that had brutal executions against innocents.
So Not a game that would teach you to kill?

Hence why I said how much it would reduce it is up for debate and that reducing lead probably would reduce it way more. I'm also going to ignore all your stuff about Sarkeesian since I don't care and don't feel like getting into a dumb argument about her stuff.
Problem is the dumb argument about her stuff is literally pointing out where the argument media can influence people comes from and how such things are done most effectively lol.

As for reducing violence, again it wouldn't at all really. Hell it could even increase it by removing outlets for those impulses.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
So Not a game that would teach you to kill?
Teaches you about as well to kill as anything that involves a detailed diagram of 'apply knife A to person B's throat in soon to be slot C just between rib cage.'

Problem is the dumb argument about her stuff is literally pointing out where the argument media can influence people comes from and how such things are done most effectively lol.
Nope nope nope.

As for reducing violence, again it wouldn't at all really. Hell it could even increase it by removing outlets for those impulses.
So your saying if we didn't have all these movies and stories and shows and games and such about finding glory on the battlefield or through revenge we wouldn't be a more peaceful species? I mean you could say those are just reflecting what we are as a species but its actually kinda rare when you have an unprovoked war and by that I mean a war a country goes too without having some kinda justification "we were attacked first" "they are preparing to attack us" etc etc. Even nazi Germany pretended that Poland attacked their outpost before they declared war.
 

Seanchaidh

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Right. You have no answer, no rebuttal, no argument. Case closed.
No, I just don't want to pay any attention to Ms. Sarkeesian, which would be necessary to show you that she's not germane.

Or maybe she is, I really don't give a shit. But I don't think she is and you haven't presented any evidence beyond your assertion that she is. Case closed indeed.
 
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Dwarvenhobble

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Teaches you about as well to kill as anything that involves a detailed diagram of 'apply knife A to person B's throat in soon to be slot C just between rib cage.'
Again Hatred? Really?

Nope nope nope.
Oh yes, I mean if media influences people as you say then why wouldn't Anita's own content be the same, especially if it's designed to influence people?

So your saying if we didn't have all these movies and stories and shows and games and such about finding glory on the battlefield or through revenge we wouldn't be a more peaceful species? I mean you could say those are just reflecting what we are as a species but its actually kinda rare when you have an unprovoked war and by that I mean a war a country goes too without having some kinda justification "we were attacked first" "they are preparing to attack us" etc etc. Even nazi Germany pretended that Poland attacked their outpost before they declared war.
You'd just have religions based on finding glory on the battlefield instead lol, well more religions doing it.
I think we'd still have wars etc because part of humanity is the capability for violence. Hell it's part of nature too
 

TheMysteriousGX

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So video games continue to not have much at all to do with violence and that means we need to argue about Anita Sarkeesian because it's been 2014 for 7 years now.

The irony in continuing to villainize a YouTuber mostly famous at this point for inspiring a character in a video game to have muscles getting loads of death threats in a thread where science is showing no link between violence and video games is palpable.
 

Seanchaidh

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So video games continue to not have much at all to do with violence and that means we need to argue about Anita Sarkeesian because it's been 2014 for 7 years now.

The irony in continuing to villainize a YouTuber mostly famous at this point for inspiring a character in a video game to have muscles getting loads of death threats in a thread where science is showing no link between violence and video games is palpable.
The death threats actually come from masculinity. It's the lurking variable.
 

Chimpzy

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So video games continue to not have much at all to do with violence and that means we need to argue about Anita Sarkeesian because it's been 2014 for 7 years now.

The irony in continuing to villainize a YouTuber mostly famous at this point for inspiring a character in a video game to have muscles getting loads of death threats in a thread where science is showing no link between violence and video games is palpable.
 

Elijin

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Who in here was making death threats against her?
Don't create dishonest quote chains.

The irony in continuing to villainize a YouTuber mostly famous at this point for inspiring a character in a video game to have muscles getting loads of death threats in a thread where science is showing no link between violence and video games is palpable.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Again Hatred? Really?
I'm talking about how it was marketed.

Oh yes, I mean if media influences people as you say then why wouldn't Anita's own content be the same, especially if it's designed to influence people?
Because I'm not getting into Sarkeesian. Done it before long ago, no interest in doing it again.

You'd just have religions based on finding glory on the battlefield instead lol, well more religions doing it.
I think we'd still have wars etc because part of humanity is the capability for violence. Hell it's part of nature too
Religion is cover under stories. And they are a really bad at showing human nature anyway, since the big ones seem to be pretty harsh on humans sexual desires. We would probably still have wars but how those wars would work might be very different. In "less developed" societies conflicts tend to be more shouting and throwing rocks with a bit of fighting before everyone goes home. Its not till someone really develops tactics that things tend to get bloodier. Once those stories of glory spread then everyone starts doing it and things pick up and conflicts get messier.