Better Representing Muslims: A Few Ideas
Muslims don't always have to be antagonist of the war game.
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Muslims don't always have to be antagonist of the war game.
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Do the Muslims you know want to kill you if you don't become a Muslim yourself?AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
Aaaand the Bible includes a line about stoning gays to death and several about slaves. Should we really, truthfully, be tolerant of a religion that encourages the death penalty for homosexuals and the ownership of slaves?AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
I recall reading a passage from the Koran that specifically forbids forced conversion. The logic being that Islam is so perfect that its perfection will be obvious, so no one should be forced to convert. Of course, fundamentalists of any stripe will seize on any passage they can argue means they get to kill people.RoonMian said:Do the Muslims you know want to kill you if you don't become a Muslim yourself?AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
And then you run into people like Sufyan al-Thawri, a medieval Muslim scholar who argues that the hadiths about execution should be used for those who politically betray the Muslim community, not refuse to join the religion (As Islam is both a religious and political system, with no clear divide between the two, this causes a lot of confusion).AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
The problem comes from fanaticism. The Bible is a horrible book with terrible life lessons and even worse characters, and thankfully not many people follow it. Judaism and Christianity have been around long enough to have...mellowed...out some. They did their Crusades and Inquisitions and whatnot. Islam is the youngest of the three and still going through its difficult teenage years. And embracing a troubled teen doesn't make them any LESS a troubled teen.Falterfire said:Aaaand the Bible includes a line about stoning gays to death and several about slaves. Should we really, truthfully, be tolerant of a religion that encourages the death penalty for homosexuals and the ownership of slaves?AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
Most Muslims aren't exactly on board with the idea of murderizing anybody who isn't Muslim, no matter what their holy book says.
The thing is: Just like the Bible the Quran is a whole clusterfuck of conflicting sentiments. Mostly because the Prophet went from small time merchant in Medina to all powerful autocratic emperor with direct link to God in Mekka while writing it. So the older suras are the nice ones (no killing, religious tolerance) while the later ones are the fucked up stuff. Sadly, fundemantalists have a solid foundation in preaching the radical stuff because of sura two which gives younger suras priority when suras conflict because God can do everything, including changing his opinion.SlightlyEvil said:I recall reading a passage from the Koran that specifically forbids forced conversion. The logic being that Islam is so perfect that its perfection will be obvious, so no one should be forced to convert. Of course, fundamentalists of any stripe will seize on any passage they can argue means they get to kill people.RoonMian said:Do the Muslims you know want to kill you if you don't become a Muslim yourself?
AldUK said:I really hope I don't get warned for this post, but I just have to say after reading this, that most of the stereotypes have some grounding in reality. But it's the same for everyone, no matter where you're from. Also, the muslim religion specifically states that followers should convert all non-muslims with refusal meaning death. There's no misinterpretation there, look in the Koran and you can read it for yourself. Should we really, truthfully be tolerant of a religion that wants to kill anyone who isn't a part of it?
Sadly there is fucked up stuff like that in the Quran. In the ninth sura is a verse that tells you to "slay the idolaters wherever you find them" and because of the stuff I wrote earlier that overrides everything else because it is one of the youngest suras.TheKrigeron said:Where in the fuck did you read that?
"Exchange them with good intention and tolerance"
that sentence is repeated many, many times in different ways, even Islam is taken from Salam which means peace. the only case where you are allowed to kill is in war as far as my knowledje goes
What kind of documentary did you watch? get your fats straight
I'm hardly tolerant of Christianity either, truth is, I see all religions as a negative influence on the world, though some more than others. But what has that got to do with anything?Falterfire said:Aaaand the Bible includes a line about stoning gays to death and several about slaves. Should we really, truthfully, be tolerant of a religion that encourages the death penalty for homosexuals and the ownership of slaves?
Most Muslims aren't exactly on board with the idea of murderizing anybody who isn't Muslim, no matter what their holy book says.
I haven't asked.RoonMian said:Do the Muslims you know want to kill you if you don't become a Muslim yourself?
Unfortunately we see this all too often these days. I really feel like a lot of people are running out of patience when their government tells them to be tolerant of a minority preaching bloodshed as God's will.SlightlyEvil said:Of course, fundamentalists of any stripe will seize on any passage they can argue means they get to kill people.
No thanks. I'll look to myself for morality as I knew the difference between right and wrong and I don't need a two-thousand year old book of fairy tales to do it for me.Thunderous Cacophony said:Look to God for your morality, not books.
Very true, but that also doesn't change the fact that a significant number of people are doing exactly - or as close to exact as possible- what these books say. Look to Christian 'gay reform' camps in America for example.RoonMian said:My point is that just because something is in the Quran or the Bible or the Veda or whatever doesn't mean that everyone is actually doing it or that even anyone is actually doing it.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm - 'fats'TheKrigeron said:Where in the fuck did you read that?
"Exchange them with good intention and tolerance"
that sentence is repeated many, many times in different ways, even Islam is taken from Salam which means peace. the only case where you are allowed to kill is in war as far as my knowledje goes
What kind of documentary did you watch? get your fats straight
All right, you challenged my Google-Fu.TheKrigeron said:@RoonMian I'd really like to see examples of contradictions
Well, if they were really following their militant missionary erm... mission... You would have noticed without asking I think.AldUK said:I haven't asked.
And are you condemning the whole Christian religion because of those camps? Because that's the vibe that others and I got from your first post.Very true, but that also doesn't change the fact that a significant number of people are doing exactly - or as close to exact as possible- what these books say. Look to Christian 'gay reform' camps in America for example.
Seeing as how games have a problem putting up a female protagonist, that might take some effort. Though, unless the character speaks and acts through pre-scripted events in ways that demonstrates they are a normal person with a cultural heritage, while not being stereotypical, he'd just become a darker toned main character.DVS BSTrD said:Or maybe we could you know, play as one?
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/05/28/uk-britain-killing-idUKBRE94O04Y20130528 Wouldn't it be nice if they had 'noticed.'RoonMian said:Well, if they were really following their militant missionary erm... mission... You would have noticed without asking I think.
And are you condemning the whole Christian religion because of those camps? Because that's the vibe that others and I got from your first post.Very true, but that also doesn't change the fact that a significant number of people are doing exactly - or as close to exact as possible- what these books say. Look to Christian 'gay reform' camps in America for example.