Batman v Superman Writer Called Out For Sexist She-Hulk Shaming

[MovieBob]

Batman v Superman Writer Called Out For Sexist She-Hulk Shaming

Warner Bros "comic guru" calls Marvel heroine "chunky" and "a green porn star."

Warner Bros more or less annointed David Goyer as the "guru" of their work-in-progress DC Universe movies based on his close working relationship with The Dark Knight's Christopher Nolan and on Nolan himself moving out of the DC-adaptation game for things that actually interest him. But an unexpected internet outrage flare-up today (which was supposed to be a celebration of the exceptionally-silly, excessively-90s title [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/134682-Superman-Batman-Title-Revealed-And-Its-Hilarious] for the Man of Steel sequel/Justice League prequel) may have them regretting that decision.

Multiple comics/film sites are registering outrage (or, at least, grim bemusement) at comments Goyer made during Tuesday night's Scriptnotes Podcast [https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/scriptnotes-podcast/id462495496?mt=2] discussion of superhero movies. Riffing off of host Craig Mazin opining that the character's real name should be "Slut-Hulk" because of her more feminine (than The Hulk) build, Goyer offered that "She's still pretty chunky. She was like Chyna from the WWE." He then went on to theorize that "Shulkie's" conception was an attempt to give Marvel fans "A chick you could f*** if you were Hulk, you know what I'm saying?"

He also questions whether or not a man created the character, suggesting that he doesn't know - and while sites like he's supposed to be helping bring to screen. [http://www.themarysue.com/david-goyer-calls-she-hulk-sex-fantasy/]

For example, that She-Hulk (a female lawyer who got augmented Hulk powers via a blood-transfusion from Bruce Banner) was created by none other than Stan Lee and John Buscema as a preemptive measure to prevent producers of the Incredible Hulk TV series from making knockoff characters of their own (something you can just look up, [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/She-Hulk#Publication_history]) and that she's not (in mainstream Marvel canon) a sexual partner for The Hulk - mostly because they're cousins. And while the character's cult-fave 80s series was famous for it's sexy "cheesecake" artwork, it was in service of a self-aware humor gimmick (She-Hulk could break the fourth wall and talk to the audience) making fun of comic tropes like pointless "sexy" posing/costuming.

Goyer is credited with the "story and screenplay" of WB's upcoming Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, though said screenplay is currently being rewritten by Chris Terrio. The film is currently scheduled to open on May 6, 2016 opposite Marvel's Captain America 3.


Source: Badass Digest [http://www.themarysue.com/david-goyer-calls-she-hulk-sex-fantasy/]

Permalink

 

[Burnouts3s3]

Why does Warner Bros. insist on keeping him around?

I mean, his stupid political beliefs and lack of knowledge about the source material aside, Goyer seems to leak out a lot of important details that Warner Brothers wants to hide. Remember when he said "we aren't doing an in-continuity DC tie in to compete with the Avengers."

If I were an investor, and I heard this guy was spilling company secrets, I'd throw his butt on the street. Why is he still around? Do the executives think because of his credentials on Nolan's Batman that he's worth keeping around?

 

[Tanis]

Wow...just...wow.
The level of stupid of some people is amazing.

I think anyone in any kind of 'public light' needs to take a course on 'How To Speak In Public Without Coming Off As A Dumbass 101'.

 

[Agayek]

Huh, and I thought Goyer couldn't be any worse at his job. Go figure.

That explains a hell of a lot though.

 

[Jamous]

Really classy there, really classy. Because of course a female superhero is only there to be 'A chick you could f***'.
Fuck's sake the things we come out with just get worse and worse.

 

[BrotherRool]

Really classy there, really classy. Because of course a female superhero is only there to be 'A chick you could f***'.
Fuck's sake the things we come out with just get worse and worse.

The context is that he thought she was a bad female superhero because he felt that she was created for the purpose of titilating guys and not for her own right (with the assumption that he feels there are female superheros not created for this purpose). He still said a terrible thing, but if you read Badass' [http://badassdigest.com/2014/05/21/david-goyer-says-weirdly-sexist-stuff-about-she-hulk-hates-martian-manhunte/] article for example it does explain in some more detail why it's a terrible thing.

He then went on to theorize that "Shulkie's" conception was an attempt to give Marvel fans "A chick you could f*** if you were Hulk, you know what I'm saying?"

Whilst it was ultimately an awful thing to say, and lacking in any knowledge and thought. Putting the quote like that is a bit distorting right? Because it makes it sound like 'Heck yeah, she's a Hulk f***' instead of 'and I think this is a bad thing'

EDIT: Actually I've become less certain that's what he meant. Someone saying

She-Hulk was the extension of the male power fantasy.

would normally be implying negative connotations, but I'm not entirely sure with these guys

 

[DevilWithaHalo]

The film is currently scheduled to open on May 6, 2016 opposite Marvel's Captain America 3.

This was intentional?!! Opening a risk venture against a long standing cash cow, perpetuating the needless DC vs Marvel paradigm at the cusp of summer? What idiotic paper pushing accountant thought this was a good idea?

 

[Agayek]

This was intentional?!! Opening a risk venture against a long standing cash cow, perpetuating the needless DC vs Marvel paradigm at the cusp of summer? What idiotic paper pushing accountant thought this was a good idea?

Eh, it's 2 years out from now. They're almost certainly going to change it based on how well the next year or two does with building up hype for it. They probably just picked that date to make a statement about competing with Marvel still or whatever.

 

[lacktheknack]

Well, if we're perfectly fair, why WAS She-Hulk created?

To nab little girls? Or to titillate boys? I doubt it was because they thought she was a great character.

Anyway, how annoying. Not much else to say, just "How annoying".

 

[zelda2fanboy]

He was clearly joking about a fictional character. I hate when types of "controversies" come out. Just say it, "I don't like David Goyer." Hell, explain why in detail. I hated Man of Steel, too. Don't wait around and pick apart what he says like a petty child. I hope he doesn't apologize for this utter nonsense.

 

[Sniper Team 4]

I wonder how many people at the WB are now slamming their faces against their desks...

Why would you say this? I just don't get it. After all the flak, after all the anger, after all the firings that other people go through when they say these things in public, you'd think other people would start to learn. Apparently that is not the case. If you're joking, then there's a better way to tell the joke. If you're truly trying to say that you think something is dumb, there are better ways to phrase it than this.

 

[Baresark]

I think he was just being a dick. I honestly can't get all worked up into a frenzy over this(even as someone who likes She-Hulk as a modern character). One thing the entire internet is not about this kind of thing, is classy. I don't particularly care for what he said, I don't care for his writing, but the guy just said something stupid. I can get beyond it pretty quick when I don't care about what someone thinks.

She-Hulk was clearly created in an era where there was very little creativity and the best thing someone could come up with was to make a female version of the Hulk (Why stan, WHY!?!). She is a good and strong character now. Fiercely independent, strong willed, and girl who likes to have fun but isn't afraid to stand up against some bullshit. In the initial origins, the character Jennifer was struggling in law school and easily stepped on. The transformation also changed her personality, made her more outgoing and ready to tackle life. If anything, she should stand as strong character on her own from the beginning, also meaning that she would not give a shit about what David Goyer said about her. Everyone on the internet should take a page from that.

 

[Madame_Lawliet]

Ooooooh man is he going to regret that...
This is a really dickish statement, and it's just rife with all sorts of stuff that we in the biz call "PR suicide." Honestly, I don't feel any sympathy for this guy, the internet punishing him for saying stupid things is just natural selection at work as far as I see it.

Countdown to Tumblr rightly tearing him a new one begiiiiiiiins NOW!

 

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

*slowly facepalms*

Oh GOD he sounds so stupid...

Does he even realize how stupid he sounds? >_<

 

[Imp_Emissary]

Well, if we're perfectly fair, why WAS She-Hulk created?

To nab little girls? Or to titillate boys? I doubt it was because they thought she was a great character.

Anyway, how annoying. Not much else to say, just "How annoying".

The article mentioned why they made her.

"was created by none other than Stan Lee and John Buscema as a preemptive measure to prevent producers of the Incredible Hulk TV series from making knockoff characters of their own"

Also, I'd disagree that she isn't an interesting character.
She's Bruce's lawyer cousin, who because of a blood transfusion can hulk up(or whatever you call it) and while not being as strong as hulk, she doesn't turn into a big rage monster either.

Haven't read the comics, but I wonder if they let her prosecute the crooks she brings in.
The one case I saw of her was when she was defending Bruce in court. Not sure if she'd actually be able to do that either.

Conflict of interest and what not.

 

[Mr. Omega]

Well, if we're perfectly fair, why WAS She-Hulk created?

To nab little girls? Or to titillate boys? I doubt it was because they thought she was a great character.

A far more petty reason, actually. The article itself says that Stan Lee thought the producers of the Incredible Hulk TV show would make a female Hulk, and he wanted Marvel and himself to own the rights for that kind of character.

Anyway, to the topic at hand:
I don't mind him not knowing the trivia behind the creation of the character, or the fact that he isn't aware that Hulk and She-Hulk are cousins (though it makes his point both hilarious and nasty). It's him acting like he knows what he's talking about when he doesn't combined with the blatant dismissal of this sort of stuff that irks me, and just makes me keep thinking BvS probably isn't going to be that good.

The whole "Slut-Hulk" thing (not mentioned in this article, but in another) doesn't help.

 

[gigastar]

Right, first id like to remind people what the page image for fanservice on TvTropes is.

Spoiler: Probably NSFW

And She-Hulk has had relationships with many male characters over the years.

So his comment isnt entirely unfounded.

 

[Coruptin]

And while the character's cult-fave 80s series was famous for it's sexy "cheesecake" artwork, it was in service of a self-aware humor gimmick (She-Hulk could break the fourth wall and talk to the audience) making fun of comic tropes like pointless "sexy" posing/costuming.

first, full disclosure, i am not an expert on she-hulk

but... from what youre telling me
it seems like all they did was point out how stupid something was and then did that exact same thing anyway
that's not deconstruction or satire. that's just doing the thing except and at the end you get smug about it and say, "im way cooler than that i only did it to show you how stupid it was yeah totally man im not actually into that stuff"

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

I know he's putting it rather coarsely but let's face it, most superheroines are sexualized gender benders of preexisting male superheroes. She doesn't even have a name of her own, she's called SHE-Hulk. At least that's what I think Goyer was (poorly) driving at: disregarding a character as a superficial, sexified gender bender. Which, let's face it, she kinda looks like if you don't know anything about her.