210: A Risk of Romance

[Colin Rowsell]

A Risk of Romance

If videogame publishers want to extend their reach beyond the standard 18- to 34-year-old male demographic, they may want to form development teams with fewer gamers and more romance novelists. Colin Rowsell exhorts game developers to inject some fresh ideas into the design process.

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[Clemenstation]

This reminds me a bit of my girlfriend's experience playing Grand Theft Auto IV. She loved learning how to drive around the city and murdered many a pedestrian with her awkward three-point turns while mastering the controls. Then she met Michelle and her sole purpose in the game was to a) take Michelle on dates, or b) call Michelle every five minutes trying to ask her out.

Unfortunately, one day a planned moped drive along the boardwalk ended in tragedy. The moped struck a lamp post and Michelle was hurled into the sea. Needless to say, Michelle was not down for any further excursions. Glumly my girlfriend progressed into the rest of the game only to realize that she didn't want to shoot anybody. As soon as Niko got a gun, she put down the controller, never to return.

Think there could be a market for a sandbox dating game?

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Don't we already have dating sims? I know you can find a number of 'em on any flash game website and they're frickin' boring.

 

[Pseudonym2]

This reminds me a bit of my girlfriend's experience playing Grand Theft Auto IV. She loved learning how to drive around the city and murdered many a pedestrian with her awkward three-point turns while mastering the controls. Then she met Michelle and her sole purpose in the game was to a) take Michelle on dates, or b) call Michelle every five minutes trying to ask her out.

Unfortunately, one day a planned moped drive along the boardwalk ended in tragedy. The moped struck a lamp post and Michelle was hurled into the sea. Needless to say, Michelle was not down for any further excursions. Glumly my girlfriend progressed into the rest of the game only to realize that she didn't want to shoot anybody. As soon as Niko got a gun, she put down the controller, never to return.

Think there could be a market for a sandbox dating game?

Did you tell her about

Spoiler

the snow job mission.

How would the sandbox romance game work? Isn't the point of a sandbox game to incorporate as many elements as possible?

 

[Capo Taco]

How would the sandbox romance game work? Isn't the point of a sandbox game to incorporate as many elements as possible?

Even then the creators think of things they'd like to include and exclude. You don't have the ability to create the plague in GTA, do you? That's because it doesn't fit the setting, just as there's no ability to build muscle in populous 2. A sandbox game centered on romance would likely bear some similarities to the sims: going to parties and such, except in it might be better if the player controlled only 1 avatar, instead of multiple sims.

 

[Lord_Ascendant]

Well, its untrodden ground. Maybe make a game much like the romance subplots in every BioWare game, except a lot less action more Myst like point and click perhaps? Moving thorough the game world, making friends and enemies, trying to solve the games myriad puzzles. Except instead of finding away to to open a door its trying to get two people to get along or trying to woo the countess or whatever. Its a solid Ideas it would just need a whole to of trial-and-error idea bouncing before something actually forms from the incorporeal entity that is an idea.

 

[Arbre]

If you're not too kind about romance, but still think it has some place in a game without putting a foot into the syrupy bland stories of Final Fantasy, I'd say that Project Zero series have enough romance in the background to be noticed and matter, without distracting from the main constituents of the games.
One of my favorite series.

 

[mszv]

What a great idea - expanding both game content and gameplay. Romance is fine, but, more than the idea of "romance", I like the idea of doing something different, in a game. If it can be done on the Nintendo DS, I don't see why it can't be done on other platforms. What a lovely idea - expanding the market for games.

I'd also like that to extend to MMOs, but I'm not super hopeful, unless we really think about online games, expand our idea of what an online game is, and also think about who works on games. I remember the article The Escapist did where they all talked about (Escapist staff included) how much fun it was to jerk people around in online worlds - hey, part of gameplay! I'm paraphrasing, but the whole tenor seem to be "games are like that, cheat, kill (virtually), and just make people's virtual lives unpleasant - all great fun"! Now, I'm not like that - so perhaps I can hope that, one day, there will be more different types of MMOs on the market where that sort of thing is just not done. Hey - a person can hope!

 

[Emperorpeng]

This is a perspective we need. Shooters are fun, but when it's the ONLY thing out there it gets old fast. My favorite games are the ones that have "Tried Weird Sh*t", like Dark Cloud's town construction component, Katamari Damacy, Animal Crossing, even Chibi Robo.

I think having a parkour-based game would be fun. Freerunning was the only part I enjoyed about Assassin's Creed, so why not make an entire game of it? You could include points for skill and photo-taking missions, or just explore a detailed cityscape with well-written individual NPCs to interact with.

 

[Gunner 51]

I'm a little pessimistic about making romance the main focus of a game. However, the rewards are too small to carry a game.

OK, the reward at the end of the game is getting the girl, but what if the gamer isn't into the kind of girl in the game. But one person's princess is another guy's spoilt brat IMO.

But then there needs to be a sense of danger and risk. How could this be created in the game? Could the girl already be love with a gangster or something and it would be your role in the game to cut in and steal the girl while avoiding the gangster's goons?

However, if such a game was to be created - I can imagine it being very similar to Mass Effect in terms of it's dialogue. But there would have to be a load of action to balance things out.

 

[maantren]

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to read and comment so far - this was a tough piece to put together but I'm glad it's working well.

Though my original spark was romance, I got more interested in the broader idea of consciously bringing a bunch of unexpected/uncharted creative backgrounds into videogame development. If you were going to add something to the mix in this way (something that hasn't been seen before or hasn't really been pushed) what might it be?

Cheers

Colin

 

[cobra_ky]

Don't we already have dating sims?

yes we do.

I know you can find a number of 'em on any flash game website and they're frickin' boring.

that's the problem. they're also mostly made by lonely nerds in their basements. a better approach would be getting a bunch of men and women together, look at what makes dating sims in Japan so successful (besides the cartoon porn) and try to figure out how to translate that into a game palatable to Western audiences.

 

[boholikeu]

Personally I'd like to see more games about "life" than action and violence. Wouldn't it be cool to play a "coming of age" game?

I'm a little pessimistic about making romance the main focus of a game. However, the rewards are too small to carry a game.

OK, the reward at the end of the game is getting the girl, but what if the gamer isn't into the kind of girl in the game. But one person's princess is another guy's spoilt brat IMO.

But then there needs to be a sense of danger and risk. How could this be created in the game? Could the girl already be love with a gangster or something and it would be your role in the game to cut in and steal the girl while avoiding the gangster's goons?

However, if such a game was to be created - I can imagine it being very similar to Mass Effect in terms of it's dialogue. But there would have to be a load of action to balance things out.

No offense, but it seems like your opinion of a romance game is a bit colored by the fact that you don't particularly like romance.

I know you can find a number of 'em on any flash game website and they're frickin' boring.

that's the problem. they're also mostly made by lonely nerds in their basements. a better approach would be getting a bunch of men and women together, look at what makes dating sims in Japan so successful (besides the cartoon porn) and try to figure out how to translate that into a game palatable to Western audiences.

I assure you, the only reason dating sims are so successful in Japan is because they are made for lonely nerds living in basements. I don't know many people outside of the "Otaku" subculture that play those games.

 

[FunkyJ]

I've worked for a company which tried to hire people from outside the industry. We hired a film director and someone from the automobile industry. Four months later our studio was closed down and we were out of a job. Obviously there were other factors at play, but it's not hard to see a relationship.

It all worked out well for us in the end, but if my current company ever hired a romance writer, I'd be looking for a new place to work, because I would know the company wouldn't be around for much longer.

These ideas are fine for the huge companies, until of course something like the global economic crisis comes along. Or for that matter anything else which effects income streams of investors.

I understand the desires you have for the industry to open up, but the problem is the games industry doesn't pay well. To be attractive to these outside people, they've got to offer competitive salaries.

So they hire these new people with high salaries, and what happens? There's less money for making the actual game. Slipping quality, missing milestones, and heads are going to roll.

And the biggest problem is those people who are from outside the industry can weather losing their job, go back to doing whatever old crap they did.

Where is a games tester or level designer going to find a new career??

 

[cobra_ky]

I've worked for a company which tried to hire people from outside the industry. We hired a film director and someone from the automobile industry. Four months later our studio was closed down and we were out of a job. Obviously there were other factors at play, but it's not hard to see a relationship.

It all worked out well for us in the end, but if my current company ever hired a romance writer, I'd be looking for a new place to work, because I would know the company wouldn't be around for much longer.

These ideas are fine for the huge companies, until of course something like the global economic crisis comes along. Or for that matter anything else which effects income streams of investors.

I understand the desires you have for the industry to open up, but the problem is the games industry doesn't pay well. To be attractive to these outside people, they've got to offer competitive salaries.

So they hire these new people with high salaries, and what happens? There's less money for making the actual game. Slipping quality, missing milestones, and heads are going to roll.

And the biggest problem is those people who are from outside the industry can weather losing their job, go back to doing whatever old crap they did.

Where is a games tester or level designer going to find a new career??

the idea isn't to grab some random architect or romance novelist and tell them "ok, you're a game designer now." the idea is to reach outside the industry and find people with unique backgrounds who are interested in making games. Your company hired a film director and it didn't work out; EA got Steven Spielberg and they came up with Boom Blox.

 

[Leftnt Sharpe]

Anyone who has played Baldur's Gate 2 knows that in depth Romances in games can work well. Although woman were a little under catered for in that game, they only had one option whilst men could choose between three different ladies. Nevertheless the romances in Bioware games always seem to be popular amongst players and I'm not sure why other western developers haven't caught on. Hopefully Dragon Age can live up to this legacy.

 

[BehattedWanderer]

I'd love to see this go into effect. It would be interesting if the romance option could be an optional thing--like a side quest that actually effects the game. If the gaming industry would branch out to people temporarily, though, where mkaing these new additions isn't their full time job, but something they contribute to when a decent game comes 'round, I think it would have a better effect in the long run. Bring in a few romance artists to work out the details of the side quest/subplots, maybe some engineers to discuss bold new concepts for travel, then sit back and think to themselves 'hm, what now?', while supplying the most variable content but not overcrowding it, investors should see some return, the game would embrace varying audiences, and, feasibly, would be deemed a success. With that in mind, I can only fervently hope that we start seeing this kind of thing pretty soon.

 

[Gunner 51]

Personally I'd like to see more games about "life" than action and violence. Wouldn't it be cool to play a "coming of age" game?

I'm a little pessimistic about making romance the main focus of a game. However, the rewards are too small to carry a game.

OK, the reward at the end of the game is getting the girl, but what if the gamer isn't into the kind of girl in the game. But one person's princess is another guy's spoilt brat IMO.

But then there needs to be a sense of danger and risk. How could this be created in the game? Could the girl already be love with a gangster or something and it would be your role in the game to cut in and steal the girl while avoiding the gangster's goons?

However, if such a game was to be created - I can imagine it being very similar to Mass Effect in terms of it's dialogue. But there would have to be a load of action to balance things out.

No offense, but it seems like your opinion of a romance game is a bit colored by the fact that you don't particularly like romance.

No offense taken.

I certainly don't mind romance, but I think it's all down to where and when it's used. Though I'm of the opinion that romance should only be used between two people interacting between each other.

Between boyfriend and girl friend out in the world or even a cyber-relationship is good for romance. After all, one can see their OH's eyes glinting with love through a webcam or gazing into her eyes across the restaurant table. And one can read from eyes alone that the person who are seeing really cares for you and she can see the same with you.

I guess cyber and real-life romance work because there's someone physically tangible with their own thoughts and feelings on the other end.

But romance in a game is IMO stretching it a bit - at least with currently existing technology. Come a romance based game, you know deep down that there's no-one really there. No one that cares or feels the same way about the gamer as the gamer feels about the character.

But that's just my worthless opinion.

 

[Laura Kinsale]

Thanks for a really interesting and long overdue angle. Ah, the vexed question of how to get females to play games.

I've been a successful romance novelist since 1986. I've been gaming since 1994. I've thought a lot about games, gamers and game developers, having spent most of my online life among them. Hardcore gamers are brilliant and strange and kinda romantic in their own right. (Which makes me snort a bit at the idea of romance authors providing nimble adaptation to changing technology. We think Twitter is cutting edge.)

So of course I've thought about romance in games. I even participated in a hobby MMO dev project for a time. No question the gaming industry has no clue What Women Want. But a romance novel, and the story and character skills involved, are quite different than the elements involved in games. Not to say they can't have some relationship and adaptation, but if you try to make a game about romance directed toward women, you will end up with some sort of pink puffy Barbie Saves Ken and They Fall in Love thing, a sort of interactive novel that is the worst of both worlds. Or the dating games. These have been tried and failed miserably because neither world wants them.

Game devs really do miss the boat for female players, but mostly in the same way that romance novelists miss the boat for male readers. They each just target to what their perceived audience wants. In the case of male gamers it action action action, challenge, tension, glory, speed, dominance, competition, with some cool puzzles and a bit of story framework in case they happen to want it to make sense. But mostly they don't care about the story.

Games do not really center on characterization or plot. They pay lip service to stories that take the player through the game, and sometimes those stories are reasonably entertaining, but the stories are peripheral to the play and the rewards and challenge of the play itself.

Can you romanticize that play itself by throwing in romantic story lines? I don't know that it can't be done but I think it's the wrong way to bring women into games. The right way is to appeal to the things women enjoy--social frameworks, cooperation (vs competition), creativity within an environment, attachment. In any MMO, the crafting, housing, clothing and retail will be where many female players congregate. We love beauty and we dislike ugliness. Of course female players will PvP and many are outstanding players of ferociously difficult end-game content, but that's not what will attract more female players.

We do want to attach to something. We will attach to our damn horses with great affection if the devs don't give us anything else. I will never forget the dog I tamed in Ultima Online that limped along behind me so loyally. That was instant love. And then I had to leave him onshore because I had to take a boat and he couldn't come with me. I was utterly devastated. Intellectually I knew it was a bunch of pixels but the graphic of that dog was brilliant. He broke my heart waiting there onshore for me as I sailed away.

He wasn't there when I got back. If he had been, or if he had found me, then maybe you have the beginning of a love story in a game. Get it?

Like there are bad games, there are bad romance novels. There are also brilliant ones. You can't judge the romance genre on a few books or authors chosen at random anymore than you can go into Gamestop, grab some random boxes off the shelves and judge games and gamers.

And by the way, I do not write silly books. ;P

Laura Kinsale

 

[boholikeu]

But romance in a game is IMO stretching it a bit - at least with currently existing technology. Come a romance based game, you know deep down that there's no-one really there. No one that cares or feels the same way about the gamer as the gamer feels about the character.

But that's just my worthless opinion.

Who says you have to be the recipient of the romance in the game? =) Acting as a "matchmaker" could be a fun game, and it probably wouldn't require an AI as good as a game where you are meant to fall in love with the npc.