189: Rob from the Rich, Steal from the Poor

[Doug]

Erm, no. If the detectors went off even when you had nothing on you that you hadn't paid for, followed you home, and sat to watch you as you used your product, that'd be a fair comparasion.

Or if you were never allowed to remove a security tag from a product, and the tag often interfered with the operation of the product.

Actually it is a very fine comparison. The idea that a company, in their attempt to prevent you from copying and distributing their intellectual property, is labeling all their customers as thieves is as laughable as my comparison. The two are equally farcical.

Your comparison, on the other hand, holds no water because it assumes that all DRM will tamper with your experience, when it is obviously true that not all DRM does this. Some will and do, obviously, but the market will weed out those inferior products. Not tomorrow, but it will.

The market will not weed out inferior products. I think that's pretty clear. Companies with better marketing will always manage to sell their goods more easily that those who lack the expertise/capital.

As for the comparisons, its true that most of the time DRM won't interfer the majority of the time with each PC. However, you will have been most lucky if you've never had a problem with it yourself. Personally, I know one of my CD-ROM drives was crippled by a SecuROM version. Wouldn't run half the CD's put in it.

As for the tag comparison, I fail to see how its not equal? You can't remove DRM, unless the publisher decides that they can trust you not to be a thief and release a remover patch. If the DRM messes with your PC, tough - and normally they won't uninstall it with the game, so you have to visit a third-party site to restore your system to working order.

Yeah! It's like at stores, and those detectors that go off when you leave carrying something you shouldn't. I never shop at those retailers, because those stupid security measures are basically saying to me that I'm a thief!...

Whereas, of course, signs simply advising me not to steal are just really reminding people all the blood, sweat, and capitalist tears that went into building the store.

As I said, that is not a good comparison, because the store doesn't follow you home and sit on your computer, watching your DVD/CD drives constantly incase you're copying it. DRM does. And sometimes bars your windows for no good reason.

 

[dochmbi]

In theory, the idea of giving paying customers access to extra content and features via a connection to a central server (which also checks your cd-key against a database of sold games) is a good one. The only problem is once it becomes commonplace in popular games, pirates will figure out a work-around to accessing the content, or create private servers.

On the other hand private servers aren't as useful because you can't play together with people who have a legit copy and play on unmodified servers and use an unmodified client.

 

[Anton P. Nym]

Ding! Idea.

Ship the game without DRM, but crammed to the gills with in-game advertising. When you get the game home and register it online, the registry server detects whether the key is one that has been vended or not; if it's a vended one, the ads go away so long as the game gets to check the authenticity each time it boots. If the key used isn't one that was vended, or if the game can't verify the authenticity of the key, the ads stay.

Even better, if R. Matey keeps playing his unregistered/keygenned copy online, the authentication server tracks ad impressions and bills the sponsors appropriately. Pirates then cease to be "noble rebels against the system" and instead become yet more ad mules, and developers get paid when their games are played.

-- Steve

 

[SamLowry]

The industry as a whole needs to step back and ask themselves: Why is there so much of this going around? An honest assessment of this just might lead to some surprising solutions.

Very well executed posting. If I may add a link about similar ongoings in the music industry?
http://www.demonbaby.com/blog/2007/10/when-pigs-fly-death-of-oink-birth-of.html

And to answer to your quote:
Big media corporations, major labels, conglomerates and so on are like dinosaurs.
They have slept thru the digital age and now they are labeling p2p users, mass downloaders and torrenters worse than triple-time murderers or rapists.
They don't know what to do, because their time of might and power is over.

They are used to win big time by exploiting artists and game developers by shoving contracts down their throats where they win 10 times for every 1 dollar the real artist makes.
They are used to owning the rights and distribution of games, music and all other media.

But their time has passed.
The internet has emerged.
Habits have changed.

We don't buy antique CDs anymore (if you have noticed), because we are Generation iPod.

Distribution of media in the traditional way is ceasing as digital distribution is sky-rocketing.
The natural consequence of all this is the death of the dinosaur.

And that's what they will fight. One Grandmother Pirate at a time, one ridiculous lawsuit at a time. They will cling to their money, power and importance like a drug addict to his drug. In fact, you can't separate them - it's crooked.

All in all it is a hopeless, losing fight and they keep on refusing to see that.
So they try to eradicate the evil pirates. But as numbers show, that would mean you'd have to sue the major part of any industrialized country's population...

Well, dinosaurs and their crazy ideas of ruling the world again... too bad, they can't see that the world has changed and they have failed (and are still failing) to adopt.

Then again, there are others, who have "got" it. 4 words: Sins of solar empires.
I think it's no coincidence that they also developed their own digital distribution channel...

 

[ReverseEngineered]

"First, I don't see someone searching for a game on a torrent site, seeing that it's not there and then deciding to go and purchase it legitimately. They'll either keep searching until they find it or not buy it at all. Second, I suspect that most pirates are kids or college students who have more time than money. If I earned nine bucks an hour and had a ton of leisure time, I would probably choose to spend a little extra time getting the game for free and spend my 20 bucks on something else."

This is probably one of the most insightful things I've ever heard a game developer say. Now that I'm done university and am working as a software developer, I have more money than time, so I buy things. But when I was a student living on a tight, borrowed budget, paying $60 for a game wasn't an option (compare that to my living expenses, which were $550/month). That said, I had a lot of time to do nothing and I needed something to do with it. Some well-spent time on IRC, USENET, or various torrent sites, would eventually lead me to a few games that I absolutely loved. I actually own copies of these games now and I still play them.

It just goes back to a common counterpoint to the claim that piracy hurts developers: the people pirating your game likely wouldn't have paid for it in the first place. If you can make it worth their while, the people who would pay for it, will. Those that wouldn't pay, will either try harder and succeed, or give up and try something else -- either way, you'll never see their money anyway.

 

[Arbre]

"I used to pirate a ton of TV before Hulu ... I haven't been able to afford cable for years," McMillen admits. "But that's the thing - it's all about realizing sh*t has changed. If you want to do something about it, then grow up and realize that you have to bend a bit and work with the new setup, like Hulu and what NIN and Radiohead have done."

Fine and all, but you can't really turn to torrent the equivalent of a tour experience, while a torrent version of a game will be 99.9999% the same as the legal version.

It's impossible to measure how many additional sales Carmel generated when his comments on World of Goo's piracy rate were reprinted across the internet.

There's just a limited amount of opportunities to get some spotlight by complaining a lot.
In the end, no matter the method you use, buzzword, ultramedia ranting or viral marketing, a saturation will dilute the positive effect to the point it hits close to zero gain.

"If you count the extra seven days of the pre-release, that means the DRM-free version remained un-pirated more than four times longer than the protected WiiWare version," Carmel says. "I'd like to think that this has to do with the good faith we created with our audience by releasing the PC version without any DRM."

Tough luck that prominent PC game providers like Steam and co actually use a DRM system to secure the copy you have downloaded, eh?

 

[Jordan Deam]

"If you count the extra seven days of the pre-release, that means the DRM-free version remained un-pirated more than four times longer than the protected WiiWare version," Carmel says. "I'd like to think that this has to do with the good faith we created with our audience by releasing the PC version without any DRM."

Tough luck that prominent PC game providers like Steam and co actually use a DRM system to secure the copy you have downloaded, eh?

Actually, 2D Boy distributed pre-release copies of World of Goo through their own site, not through Steam.

 

[Arbre]

"If you count the extra seven days of the pre-release, that means the DRM-free version remained un-pirated more than four times longer than the protected WiiWare version," Carmel says. "I'd like to think that this has to do with the good faith we created with our audience by releasing the PC version without any DRM."

Tough luck that prominent PC game providers like Steam and co actually use a DRM system to secure the copy you have downloaded, eh?

Actually, 2D Boy distributed pre-release copies of World of Goo through their own site, not through Steam.

Yes, they did, but when they wanted to reach bigger audiences, they traded good faith for PC portals relying on authentication to varying degrees.
That said, I wouldn't complain too much about the overall majority of games present on Steam. It keeps getting better, offering more opportunities for easier gaming. We've certainly seen worse DRMs.

 

[Bongo Bill]

It seems that, at least in the short term, the prudent publisher should adjust development and marketing budget according to the assumption that 10% of customers are bearing the entire cost.

 

[Frizzle]

Ding! Idea.

Ship the game without DRM, but crammed to the gills with in-game advertising. When you get the game home and register it online, the registry server detects whether the key is one that has been vended or not; if it's a vended one, the ads go away so long as the game gets to check the authenticity each time it boots. If the key used isn't one that was vended, or if the game can't verify the authenticity of the key, the ads stay.

Even better, if R. Matey keeps playing his unregistered/keygenned copy online, the authentication server tracks ad impressions and bills the sponsors appropriately. Pirates then cease to be "noble rebels against the system" and instead become yet more ad mules, and developers get paid when their games are played.

-- Steve

I do like this Idea to a point. Here's my problem with it. What if you want to play on a computer that isn't accessing the internet? I know it's less common these days than in the past, but sometimes people just don't have internet. If I go to the store and buy a legit copy, bring it home, and I don't have internet on my computer, I have to suffer a poorer gaming experience because I'm not connected to the WWW.

I know this is an old game, but if anyone remembers Escape Velocity: It was shareware, and if you didn't put in a key after 30 days, then the game would send a little ship after you and blow you up until you bought the game. That ship pissed me off to no end. I would've bought the game anyway, but I'm sure something similar can be employed today.

 

[ReverseEngineered]

This is probably one of the most insightful things I've ever heard a game developer say. Now that I'm done university and am working as a software developer, I have more money than time, so I buy things. But when I was a student living on a tight, borrowed budget, paying $60 for a game wasn't an option (compare that to my living expenses, which were $550/month). That said, I had a lot of time to do nothing and I needed something to do with it. Some well-spent time on IRC, USENET, or various torrent sites, would eventually lead me to a few games that I absolutely loved. I actually own copies of these games now and I still play them.

I find it discouraging that your sense of entitlement is so great that you didn't think of the other obvious answer: Time + no money = get a menial job. No.. instead you figured that, what the hell, what the developer put in for his or her time wasn't as important as your entitlement to sit on your ass and spend your time hunting through the internet to use their work for your entertainment. Hopefully as a software developer now you at least have the sense to feel some guilt about what you did when you were younger.

It was much less a sense of entitlement and much more a sense of providing for one's self. Growing up poor, I did what I had to do even just to get clothes and meals (yes, that kind of poor). I learned how to get what I needed, and in the same way, get what I wanted. So it was less a matter of, "If they won't give it to me for free, I'll just take it," and more a matter of, "This is the only way I'm ever going to get this." As for menial jobs, I was already doing one. Playing games in my spare time was the only thing that kept me sane amongst the rest of the stress -- I wasn't about to give up the last of my leisure to work more.

Keep in mind, I'm not saying that what I did then was right or even acceptable, just that it was how I survived. I'm also not saying that people need video games to survive, just that people will always use their means to get what they desire. My concern wasn't with the faceless corporations (or the invisible developers) who wouldn't be seeing my money, I was too focused on finding something to occupy my mind so I wouldn't have to think about how much work sucked, how hard school was, and how helpless my financial situation was.

As for how that affects my current position as a developer, I realize now just how important it is that customers get what they pay for. What may seem a paltry sum to me now could be a week's savings or the only gift that a child receives at Christmas. I remember what it was like to be given an expensive game, only to find out it was a steaming pile. I do my damnedest to make sure whatever I develop is worth the money I ask for it.

 

[Cid Silverwing]

The tighter the DRM security the greater you taunt the pirates into destroying it and rebelling against your bureaucratic bullshit.

Finally someone who realizes the futility of fighting piracy. (The developer, I mean)

 

[EvilEngineNumberNine]

What about a move to ingame advertising? I know this is something EA are playing with and I'll probably get a heap of scorn thrown at me for mentioning it but if they give the game away and then have it contact a central server to play ads back you can keep a track of impressions and probably end up making more money than the cover charge of the game.

Take Fallout3 for example (as it's a good one) - plenty of billboards and ingame own make brands advertised, how hard would it be to link in to real-life adverts - the amount of hours I've spent on that game would surely mean if they had ads in it the revenue from so many I would've seen would be far greater than the £30 it costs.

It would also be an incentive for game houses to make games that last a bit and have a good replayability so you keep coming back and see more ads - better than some of the disposable crap pinched out of late.

The ads in Rainbow Six Vegas 2 were okay, if you ask me. It took place around 2008 (2005/2010), and some scenarios involved casinos and convention center type areas. I'd expect a lot of ads there, and they were actually appropriate.

But seeing ads for Dodge or BMW, or Siemens in a Fallout game, or basically anything that isn't set in our 2009.. that'd really kill the setting.

I'm sorry but even before I knew about the advertising in that game I realized that every car model in the second level was a dodge and it creaped me right out and ruined the gameplay experience. THEN I saw the huge DODGE billboards and was like OOOOHHHHHHH! Still haven't beat that game. Not on general principal or anything, the ads are just too jarring and they keep jerking me out of my little fantasy world where I'm an elite member of the most badass tactical assault squadron evar! Excuse me now, I must pretend I'm flying a spaceship to another planet. Pew-pew-pewwww!!!


EDIT: I was talking about R6V, you were talking about R6V:2. I should learn to read.

 

[theultimateend]

No matter how much piracy there is, I think that there will always be artists who develop games, and there will always be people who manage to make a living off writing them. Of course will there be big-budget, 40 million dollars in development games if piracy is allowed to be too convenient? No. And honestly I don't care, because my best game experiences have all been in garage games without the huge cinematic, voice-over budgets.

I think I got more entertainment value out of a shareware copy of Scorched Earth that we played for months in the dorms in college than in my $60 copy of Oblivion which now sits on the shelf, having been drained of every bit of interest it once had over a couple weekend.

I know right haha. I really don't care if huge budget games die because most of the time they are terribly uncreative and uninteresting. While I liked Gears of War I've played better indie games for a quarter of the price.

 

[theSovietConnection]

What about a move to ingame advertising? I know this is something EA are playing with and I'll probably get a heap of scorn thrown at me for mentioning it but if they give the game away and then have it contact a central server to play ads back you can keep a track of impressions and probably end up making more money than the cover charge of the game.

Take Fallout3 for example (as it's a good one) - plenty of billboards and ingame own make brands advertised, how hard would it be to link in to real-life adverts - the amount of hours I've spent on that game would surely mean if they had ads in it the revenue from so many I would've seen would be far greater than the £30 it costs.

It would also be an incentive for game houses to make games that last a bit and have a good replayability so you keep coming back and see more ads - better than some of the disposable crap pinched out of late.

The ads in Rainbow Six Vegas 2 were okay, if you ask me. It took place around 2008 (2005/2010), and some scenarios involved casinos and convention center type areas. I'd expect a lot of ads there, and they were actually appropriate.

But seeing ads for Dodge or BMW, or Siemens in a Fallout game, or basically anything that isn't set in our 2009.. that'd really kill the setting.

Perhaps its just me, but I think it'd be cool to see billboard ads that would suit the era, like use some of Coca-Cola and Dodge's old advertisements they used in the 50s. For me, anyways, it would make the world in the game a little easier to relate to. I don't think it would be a bad idea so long as the game is set in an era where the advertising companies existed, one could simply mine their archives for ads that would suit the timeframe. As for games like WoW and fantasy games, I don't think it would work to well at all, they are hardly, if ever set on our planet, so having our companies advertising in-game wouldn't make sense.

 

[Whispering Death]

The declining rate of "good PC games released in a year" is is direct alignment with the upswing in internet game piracy.

Then people ***** about why games aren't as good as they used to be.

Companies don't exist to please YOU they exist to please their PAYING CUSTOMERS, if you are a paying customer - bravo! But that's an important fact to realize. If the only people who are buying PC games are the casual gamer that's too ignorant to know how a torrent works and just wants to play generic Halo ripoffs, then generic Halo ripoff games are all you're going to see in the market.

These self-styled "hardcore gamers" that pirate nearly everything they play say they want something new, different, and innovative. But at the same time that they're complaining on message boards they're torrenting World of Goo instead of paying for it. They'll play the whole game while wondering why there's so many terrible Halo ripoffs and not enough new innovative gaming experiences