Columnist Links Games to Acceptance of Torture

Andy Chalk

One Flag, One Fleet, One Cat
Nov 12, 2002
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Columnist Links Games to Acceptance of Torture


In an article for the Huffington Post [http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kari-henley/america-doesnt-torture-we_b_194630.html], columnist Kari Henley claims that the laissez-faire attitude many Americans have toward "enhanced interrogation" - that is, torture - is the result of too much time spent indulging in violent media.

The use of techniques like waterboarding, physical violence and "stress positions" during interrogations of prisoners in the "war on terror" has been the subject of heated debate since the Obama administration took office and declared such tactics off-limits. While the general feeling regarding the revelations of torture by U.S. forces has been one of outrage, a recent survey [http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/04/30/religion.torture/] by the Pew Research Center found that a significant number of U.S. citizens believed the use of torture was "often" or "sometimes" justified.

In her column, Henley suggests that one of the reasons Americans are tolerant of torture is the influx of violence they're exposed to in their entertainment media, which she believes "drastically decrease" people's sensitivity to real-world violence. Violent themes feature prominently in television, movies and of course videogames, and Henley claims that fact is incontrovertibly linked to our casual attitude toward violent behavior. "Today the data linking violence in the media to violence in society are superior to those linking cancer and tobacco," she wrote.

"What about these modern Grand Theft Auto [http://www.xbox.com] where the point is to go around and kill people in a calculated way. Tell me again why this is supposed to be fun and relaxing?"

Henley is critical of the desensitizing effects of modern media in general but it's clear that videogames are her bugbear of choice. She quotes Lt. Col. Dave Grossman, a noted game critic [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/90185], who said, "We have raised a generation of barbarians who have learned to associate violence with pleasure, like the Romans cheering and snacking as the Christians were slaughtered in the Coliseum," and adds, "The line between fact and fiction is fine. If we want to stand as a leading nation in moral conduct, we must first explore why we are inundating ourselves with so many images of violence."

"I believe if we are going to truly come to terms with abiding by moral codes against extreme acts of violence, we first have to start in our own living rooms to explore the increased levels of violence we witness on a daily basis that serves as news or entertainment," Henley wrote. "We say we 'don't f**#$ torture,' yet Grand Theft Auto is our favorite video game."

via: GamePolitics [http://www.gamepolitics.com/2009/05/07/columnist-equates-violent-games-acceptance-torture]


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Yog Sothoth

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Dec 6, 2008
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These people need to die in a fire.

I believe that torture is warranted under some circumstances, but video games have absolutely nothing to do with that....
 

WhiteTigerShiro

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Sep 26, 2008
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"Today the data linking violence in the media to violence in society are superior to those linking cancer and tobacco," she wrote.
This right here is where I stopped giving her any credibility. Any more lines like this, and she'll just be a female Jack Thompson.
 

Barry93

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Mar 5, 2009
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Well, it looks like videogames are getting blamed again. I wonder if they ever thought people can be tolerant of torture just because it makes more sense than respecting moral rights. Now that Bush isn't in office, the liberal media has to find something to blame.

This Henley person sounds like... a noob.
 

BlueTimberwolf

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Oct 29, 2008
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Who says grand theft auto is our favourite video game. It maybe the Medias favourite video game to pick on but that does mean every household with a games console has one or it is played religiously or anything.

But more on topic torture was the favoured form of punishment and information extraction in medieval times and I?m quite sure GTA and computer games in general were not around in those times ... or movies ... or much media at all really. It all seems very flawed to me.
 

ElephantGuts

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Jul 9, 2008
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First you're blaming video games for the acceptance of torture, and next thing you know you're telling millions of people that the Jews are responsible for Germany's economic depression. It's happened before. And atleast Hitler was working towards a goal. This person's just an idiot.

And yes I was making a joke by comparing this to Hitler, but it's really only a half joke. It's essentially the same thing: Making unjustified claims and hate speech against something and blaming completely unrelated issues on it, just because you can get away with using it as a scapegoat because a large portion of the population are already biased against it, or are atleast willing to hop along on the hate train.

Not to mention that Henley and Hitler both start with the letter "H". Just saying.
 

Failcrow

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Mar 7, 2009
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This just seems to be another reason for people to say 'video games are bad'. How does playing GTA make me feel any different about torture?

As to torture, if making one man suffering saves 20 lives, i say that torture is useful. Im pretty sure these people would be singing a different tune if one of there family was killed and torturing someone could have revealed the plot and stopped the attack.
 

Eldritch Warlord

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Jun 6, 2008
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WhiteTigerShiro said:
"Today the data linking violence in the media to violence in society are superior to those linking cancer and tobacco," she wrote.
This right here is where I stopped giving her any credibility. Any more lines like this, and she'll just be a female Jack Thompson.
Run for you lives! It's the Thompsonette!

It's painfully obvious to me that the Thompsonette Henley knows next to nothing about video games, notably describing the Wii as "G rated."

Additionally violent entertainment has been part of society for all of recorded history, executions are almost always a favorite public spectacle and Victorian generals sent hundreds of men to their deaths in a highly ritualized 'game.' The difference is that now we're not actually killing people and this woman thinks things are now worse?
 

Scary_Bob

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Sep 24, 2008
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WhiteTigerShiro said:
"Today the data linking violence in the media to violence in society are superior to those linking cancer and tobacco," she wrote.
This right here is where I stopped giving her any credibility. Any more lines like this, and she'll just be a female Jack Thompson.
Agreed. Show me the biological mechanism linking videogame use to violence and I'll believe her.

Anyone else read that article recently in New Scientist where studies showed a higher aggression level when playing driving games than FPS's.
I think Mario Kart Wii is to blame for our acceptance of torture. Who's with me?
 

Agayek

Ravenous Gormandizer
Oct 23, 2008
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Yog Sothoth said:
These people need to die in a fire.

I believe that torture is warranted under some circumstances, but video games have absolutely nothing to do with that....
Completely agreed. Yay for "Vidyo gams r bad!" bandwagons
 

Fanboy

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Oct 20, 2008
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What an outrageous thing to say!

If I wasn't so busy torturing people in Grand Theft Auto I would go over to wherever she lives and give her a good torturing!
 
Feb 13, 2008
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As I posted some time ago in a different forum

"The real problem is that genetic mutations that normally would have died out are now being allowed their own newspaper columns."

Remind me though, wasn't Rome the only non-barbarian state in that particular time? And surely Lieutenant-Colonel Dave Grossman should realize that the army trains people to associate violence and pleasure, which is why waterboarding might exist?

I mean, it's a long shot, but it might just explain it.
 

matnatz

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Oct 21, 2008
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Malygris said:
"While I happen to enjoy the 'G' rated Grand Theft Auto [http://www.wii.com] where the point is to go around and kill people in a calculated way. Tell me again why this is supposed to be fun and relaxing?"
The mantra of a non-gamer talking about something that they do not understand. She has never played any of the two games that she mentioned. But, becuase she has played a Wii game or two she thinks she understands all games (and gamers) and knows what it is about games that makes them fun. She also generalizes games, saying that they should all be relaxing as it's something we do in our spare time. People play sports in their spare time, is Rugby meant to be relaxing? No. It depends on the game.

I agree with the above poster that the military teaches people an assosiation between violence and treasure.
 

Goldeneye1989

Deathwalker
Mar 9, 2009
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jesus christ we know it's know REAL

we do this because in GTA you can hold two sub macheine guna hands out firing into a bunch o innocents because WE KNOW WE CANNOT DO THIS IS REAL LIFE

we play wow because we know we cannot turn people into sheep or cows that turn into plants

we play tf2 because we know a german and a russian will never get along

we play mine sweeper because we know we will never be mine sweepers

we play these games because we will never do them in real life, the fun is not killing a bunch of office worker's the fun is doing thing we wont be able to ever do.... why do people like 3d movies because it involves us in something we dont know.

or if i may take a quote from the gaming world.... FOAD... look it up
 

HobbesMkii

Hold Me Closer Tony Danza
Jun 7, 2008
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I dunno. I think there's a point to this. I think the trouble does not lie in violent media in general, but violence portrayed as the best option without any lasting blowback. And in that case, I wouldn't stress that videogames are the major perpetrators. I mean, in Call of Duty, I must kill thousands on a daily basis in unique and extremely painful ways. But there's no emotional fallout for me, nor do I note that the character feels anything about. Certainly none of the characters with lines mention it. But in reality, lots of soldiers are seriously traumatized by combat.

I certainly don't think videogames are the epicenter of this, if there is a relation. And I certainly don't agree with Grossman's take, which has always struck me as preaching doom. I think American culture and government has stressed a world wherein violence has become an accepted mode of behavior. But then again, I think a lot of world cultures have also stressed that. Chess, for example, derives from battle. Each of those pieces represents a figure on a battlefield. Before there was Company of Heroes there was chess.

I also would be careful about being too dismissive of these articles. I think part of the problem with the videogame industry is we don't have a lot of mainstream highbrow. We can't compare Die Hard to Saving Private Ryan like movies can and note that one is essentially a glorification of violence and the other a more realistic take on it. So all videogames are defended against this criticism equally. But there will be (and there probably are) games that are what this reporter is talking about.