Commentary on ?You Win or You Die?
- Thread starter Greg Tito
- Start date
Loved the episode, still don't think that we needed Little Finger's soliloquy at the beginning. We know what sort of man he is. If anything, it betrays the moment where he turns on Ned. Ned and Petyr have two scenes together in this episode and the first one is pitch perfect with its characterization of Lord Baelish. Duplicity, cunning, politics. Everything is there. We know what kind of man he is.
We didn't need to see Petyr telling two naked whores that he wins by fucking. I'm all for boobies, but that scene was just pandering to the audience. I'd hope it would be smarter than that.
We didn't need to see Petyr telling two naked whores that he wins by fucking. I'm all for boobies, but that scene was just pandering to the audience. I'd hope it would be smarter than that.
I actually think the scene showed a good bit of his Character. He's a man who must control everything, and his whores are no exception. Yes it was pandering, but it's HBO, you're gonna have that. Any scene with Aiden Gillen is pure win, so I'm not complaining about the added scenes. He is quickly overtaking Tyrion as my favorite character.Ne1butme said:
I think i would like the scene more if his instructions on how to seduce a man was more relevant to the story. But i couldn't see that. He doesn't seduce Ned. He tricks him, but Littlefinger was very explicit in his instructions the man knows what he paid for, but wants to look beyond that fact to expose his greatness.rickthetrick said:
Tyrion and Littlefinger are my favourite characters in the books and they also happen to be the smartest.
I wonder if that's a coincidence?
One of my only complaints of the series was that the actress playing Cersei was not nearly enough of a cold ***** that you want to stab in the face. This episode she finally did it.
Going to really miss Ned from Sean Bean. I still miss him in every book and I think that is what makes the books that much better.
Drogo and Danny's relationship is finally looking more like that in the book.
Also loved Barriston's increased role in this episode, he remains one of my favorite characters in the series.
And Tywin's first appearance, woot! He might not shit gold but that scene was gold.
Going to really miss Ned from Sean Bean. I still miss him in every book and I think that is what makes the books that much better.
Drogo and Danny's relationship is finally looking more like that in the book.
Also loved Barriston's increased role in this episode, he remains one of my favorite characters in the series.
And Tywin's first appearance, woot! He might not shit gold but that scene was gold.
Pardon us plebians for just enjoying the media for what it is, a tv show. I haven't read the books yet, because I didnt want to ruin the show with silly preconceptions, but the show needed that little bit of plot exposition if only to remind people of Littlefinger's carefully concealed insidiousness.Ne1butme said:
What I loved was how the Tyrion's trial by combat subtextually set the scene for the entire episode, especially when Lady Aryn said "You fought without honor" and Bronn said" No, but he did." Some people might think that as subtle, but for me it was like getting hit over the head with a hammer as soon as I saw the plot unfolding later on in the episode.
And I absolutely loved Tywin's intro where he was casual dressing of a carcass as he gave Jaime shit. Ooh, as a tv watcher it was a great opening to the wider elements of the plot yet to come (or so I assume).
Can't wait to see god Rohlololol take care of the 'other' one
Considering that this is the spoilers forum and that someone mentioned losing his head before me, i don't feel good or bad. But that's just me.monstersquad said:
But then again, i might have been a bit more careful before denigrating those of us with "silly preconceptions" because we read the book and are analyzing the series from that point of view.
I actually think we did needed the scene. Those of us that read the book have certain insights to characters because of the author's exposition, but any good TV show or movie has to show you this stuff and not just "tell" it to you, George RR Martin goes through great lengths describing the history behind every influential family in Westeros, but that sort of thing can't be done in the TV show easily.Ne1butme said:
That scene pretty much just establishes that Littlefinger fought for Catelyn's love against Ned's brother. I'm sure if I hadn't read the book that revelation would make me go "WTF? :-O "
There are many things that those of us who read the book already know about the characters at this point in the story, for example, we know that both Ned and Cate are very dutiful people, which is why they ended up married to each other. When Ned's brother died Cate was duty bound to marry into the Stark house and Ned was duty bound to keep his brother's commitment. Which is why Ned sees Jon Snow as a reminder if him failing his duty, not so much as him betraying the woman he loved (I think love entered that marriage long after Jon).
This and Littlefinger's motives is something that I believe those that are experiencing the story for the first time through the TV show need to know to.
We already knew that Littlefinger dueled Ned's brother for Catelyn Tully. The very first scene that we meet him, Petyr and Ned mention the duel with Brandon, the scar, and that the object of desire was Catelyn. There's nothing from the naked whore soliloquy that we didn't already know.El_Ganso said:
And here's thing about Petyr. We never know what he's thinking. He hasn't been a POV character in the book. All we know is what we see him do and say. He's an enigma to everyone. His true motivations are fluid and hidden.
I'd put the Spider in the same category. We've seen evidence in the series that he is both working against and working for the Targaryens. He is seen plotting with Illyrio, but at the same time, his assassination order on Dany was carried out.
Now just imagine if we had a scene where Varys spells out all his motivations and desires to one of his little birds. It would be out of character and damaging to his character.
I have the same feeling watching Littlefinger bare his soul.