Bad Games Can Give You Good Ideas
Playing Dark has left Yahtzee with a couple ideas for new games.
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Playing Dark has left Yahtzee with a couple ideas for new games.
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Bad Games Can Give You Good Ideas
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
I always thought a fun game concept would be a play off of multiple game playthroughs(New Game+ and etc), and the consequences of playing five times over on all the NPCs and your actual character.
They where sure that they beat the big baddie four times times already, but they just doing it again, and again, and again until insanity takes over.
Something sort of like Groundhog Day, but with games.
They where sure that they beat the big baddie four times times already, but they just doing it again, and again, and again until insanity takes over.
Something sort of like Groundhog Day, but with games.
I would actually put in another non-death motivator. Imperfect memory transfer.
The more you die the less you know. Memories sort of get overwritten by the host or they get lost. So the story changes and switches as you take on more and more bodies eventually resembling nothing of the original. It would be interesting to see if people would want to try their hardest not to die just to see the actual reason why they came to this endless dungeon.
The best place to think up ideas is a place you don't want to be. Because your mind has only one goal. Not being here anymore.
The more you die the less you know. Memories sort of get overwritten by the host or they get lost. So the story changes and switches as you take on more and more bodies eventually resembling nothing of the original. It would be interesting to see if people would want to try their hardest not to die just to see the actual reason why they came to this endless dungeon.
The best place to think up ideas is a place you don't want to be. Because your mind has only one goal. Not being here anymore.
This is easy to avoid with a vampire dealie by saying the bosses are already vampires. You can't turn something already facing the right way, or however that saying goes.
The transitional player character is also seen in that Zombie U, which was more or less favorably reviewed by Yahtzee aside from the "waiting for a curve ball that never came" problem. I'm also reminded of an old game called Avenging Spirit where the player character is a ghost that possesses enemies to whatever end the game has... I didn't play it very much. So here's a Youtube video.
Yahtzee, have you ever played the old arcade game Avenging Spirit? It was based around an enemy-possession mechanic that sounds like at least a troglodytic ancestor of what you're proposing.
Also, the last idea might make for an interesting indie movie, if not for the fact that it'd probably get turned into an anti-videogame crusade.
Also, the last idea might make for an interesting indie movie, if not for the fact that it'd probably get turned into an anti-videogame crusade.
I believe I did read something about a game where dying makes you possess the nearest NPC or something like that, Omikron: The Nomad Soul, I believe?
As far as death being penalized, either have the enemy wander out of the building or something before you possess him (so you are moved away from your objective, just like a checkpoint) or maybe turn the whole thing into a puzzle game where you have to use death to solve puzzles, e.g. to get up on a ledge you let yourself get sniped by the dude up there and that would be your traversal mechanism, of course every enemy could only act as a transport once and some might be placed so that you couldn't complete the puzzle if you were to be killed by them so you need to kill them somehow, etc.
As far as death being penalized, either have the enemy wander out of the building or something before you possess him (so you are moved away from your objective, just like a checkpoint) or maybe turn the whole thing into a puzzle game where you have to use death to solve puzzles, e.g. to get up on a ledge you let yourself get sniped by the dude up there and that would be your traversal mechanism, of course every enemy could only act as a transport once and some might be placed so that you couldn't complete the puzzle if you were to be killed by them so you need to kill them somehow, etc.
You should play Alan Wake's American Nightmare then, which has a similar concept. It got quite harsh criticism compared to the first one, which I never understood, it's simply a neat little experiment within the interesting universe of Alan Wake.TheProfessor234 said:
Sweet, thanks for the heads up. I was getting around to finish up the extra chapters on Alan Wake a little while ago, I'll be sure to give American Nightmare a spin.Rush Syks said:
wouldn't you just need the start point of the dungeon be on the other end of the body shoot that they throw all the dead people down down, and have the vampire curse thing kill the guy on the receiving end before re-rasing them. You could also have it be the morgue. This has the added benefit of an intro that explains the mechanics, as your first death could be at the hands of a mortician that freaks out and kills you when you wake up during the autopsy.
Dark Souls actually does the second bit, (Spoilers from here on) if you go and ring the bells of awakening you meet Kingseeker Frampt, a giant snake who gives you a sort of standard hero's journey quest to get the Magical Macguffin(The Lordvessel), beat 4 bosses and then succeed Lord Gwyn, but it doesn't tell you that the whole purpose of the quest is so that The Age of Fire can go on for a bit longer, you "succeed" Lord Gwyn as kindling for the magical fire that keeps the Gods in power, not as a God yourself as his dialogue would have you believe, on the other hand if you avoid Frampt you can find Kaathe who reveals Frampt's plan and that if the Age of Fire ends the Age of Man can begin and asks you to help him start it, but Kaathe is also manipulating you so that it can be in power when the Age of Fire ends.
The only way to actually beat Dark Souls is not to seek out any ending but to just fvck around the world with Covenants and stuff, the game actually tells you that there's nothing you can do for the game world in the prologue "and soon the flames will fade, and only Dark will remain" and there's really nothing you can do about it.
The only way to actually beat Dark Souls is not to seek out any ending but to just fvck around the world with Covenants and stuff, the game actually tells you that there's nothing you can do for the game world in the prologue "and soon the flames will fade, and only Dark will remain" and there's really nothing you can do about it.
The thing about that possessing-the-enemy-that-killed you thing is that, for the most part, enemies are weaker than the player. That's why he's able to dispatch them in such high numbers. So getting picked off by a boring, bog-standard mook because you've been whittled down by a whole level full of them would put the player at a disadvantage, while getting killed by one of the rarer, more powerful enemies would be an improvement, perhaps, and is actually the primary method for leveling up your character. The incentive then becomes making yourself a target for those enemies without getting killed by the weakling mooks who are attacking you at the same time. Ensuring that the biggest baddie in a room is the one who gets to deal the killing blow.
The problem with such an idea is that the consequence for failing the first time is that you are now more likely to keep failing. Remember how much you hated that in Demon's Souls? At least a normal roguelike throws you way back to the beginning where the enemies are more or less matched to your power level. ZombiU, meanwhile, kept pitting you against the same boring old zombies, making it more of a test of endurance than a progressive difficulty curve, and if you wanted to you could also try your luck at retrieving your kit from your now-zombified former self.
The problem with such an idea is that the consequence for failing the first time is that you are now more likely to keep failing. Remember how much you hated that in Demon's Souls? At least a normal roguelike throws you way back to the beginning where the enemies are more or less matched to your power level. ZombiU, meanwhile, kept pitting you against the same boring old zombies, making it more of a test of endurance than a progressive difficulty curve, and if you wanted to you could also try your luck at retrieving your kit from your now-zombified former self.
Yes, Omikron does have a system like that. If you died in that game your soul would migrate to certain npcs at the cost of some kind of spirit energy or mana or such. Exceptions were areas where there are no possessible npcs or if you died at the hands of a demon, since they could absorb your soul and take it to hell for a permanent game over. Of course, most of the games bosses are demons.KDR_11k said:
You could also purposefully posses someone if you don't like the body you have or if you need a specific npc for something. Quick example, I think there was a section where you need to gain entry to a high security warehouse or something. One of the ways was following one of the guards to a secluded spot and then possessing him. I do seem to remember that possessing made your old body disappear, so no hopping back and forth.
I also recall a game called Messiah which also had a similar mechanic. You play as a cherub and have to possess the right people to infiltrate secret labs and military bases and such. That's all I remember though.
One small story-side problem with the body-switching idea: Why would getting killed by one of the bad guys make you into that particular bad guy? Or, from the other end, why would killing the monster make you into the monster?
I do love the "Protagonist" idea, though. Right up to the Wargames ending, that is.
--Morology!
I do love the "Protagonist" idea, though. Right up to the Wargames ending, that is.
--Morology!