Star Trek Beyond - Live Long and Prosper
- Thread starter Marter
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It has a scene of the starship riding of wave of giant robot space bees while blasting Sabotage by Beastie Boys. If that's Star Trek to you, what TV show were you watching?
'cause pretty sure you were watching Futurama, a parody of Star Trek. Or maybe were in a anti-protom induced fever dream where you watched Galaxy Quest and xXx at the same time and just assumed it was Star Trek.
The plot was riddled with holes and went all over the place, serving only to generate increasingly Fast and Furious style action scenes. The main villain was a total wash with no clear goal or motivation other than simply being 'the bad guy' which I'm pretty sure they even refer to him as. Kirk and Spock lack any chemistry at all. They never once try to negotiate or reach a peaceful solution. They don't do any technobable for fucks sake! And that wasn't a nebula, its an Asteroid belt! And even Asteroid Belts don't look like that anymore.
If you like the movie, that's fine. But saying its a good Star Trek movie is provably wrong. Its like saying Starship Troopers 3: Marauder is a great sequel to Balto. You can say it. You can even believe it. But you're wrong. Simply wrong.
'cause pretty sure you were watching Futurama, a parody of Star Trek. Or maybe were in a anti-protom induced fever dream where you watched Galaxy Quest and xXx at the same time and just assumed it was Star Trek.
The plot was riddled with holes and went all over the place, serving only to generate increasingly Fast and Furious style action scenes. The main villain was a total wash with no clear goal or motivation other than simply being 'the bad guy' which I'm pretty sure they even refer to him as. Kirk and Spock lack any chemistry at all. They never once try to negotiate or reach a peaceful solution. They don't do any technobable for fucks sake! And that wasn't a nebula, its an Asteroid belt! And even Asteroid Belts don't look like that anymore.
If you like the movie, that's fine. But saying its a good Star Trek movie is provably wrong. Its like saying Starship Troopers 3: Marauder is a great sequel to Balto. You can say it. You can even believe it. But you're wrong. Simply wrong.
This isn't a nationalist thing, but Simon Pegg is a fucking gift to entertainment. I really haven't seen anything bad involving him in any way. He is just a very positive influence for creativity.
I agree that taking Kurtzman and Orci off writing is an improvement, especially the Truther undertones they crammed in the script for Into Darkness.
And people say you hate movies! Which is funny because this has been the most positive thing I've heard.
I didn't think it was great [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/326.940909-tippy2k2-tells-you-what-to-think-Star-Trek-Beyond] but I didn't absolutely hate it either. Although the more I think about the plot, the worse I feel about the movie as very little of the plot made sense...
I didn't think it was great [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/326.940909-tippy2k2-tells-you-what-to-think-Star-Trek-Beyond] but I didn't absolutely hate it either. Although the more I think about the plot, the worse I feel about the movie as very little of the plot made sense...
Yes, it was a good Star Trek movie.
At the very least, it was more coherent than Into Darkness, which I liked less than the first one. Beyond flowed rather nicely from start to finish.
I did think the doomsday weapon was a little contrived though. I think they could have explained where it came from a little better than they did.
At the very least, it was more coherent than Into Darkness, which I liked less than the first one. Beyond flowed rather nicely from start to finish.
I did think the doomsday weapon was a little contrived though. I think they could have explained where it came from a little better than they did.
I saw it and thought it was overall good. Yeah winning through the power of rock part was cheesy and terrible, but it was fun cheesy and terrible. It was moments of fun between all the drama, something to keep the movie interesting and dynamic rather than a constant depressive dull bog. More Marvel, less DC.
Now, to be fair, a lot of the movies were more action-heavy than the TV shows were. I mean, did any of the 'Trek movies ever tackle subjects like Living Witness [http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/v891.php], The Measure Of A Man [http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/t135.php], or In The Pale Moonlight [http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/d543.php]?Silentpony said:
The 'Trek movies were always more... blockbuster-y than the series' that inspired them. And let's be honest, this movie is probably what Voyager and/or Enterprise would have been, if it weren't for their respective budget.
Sounds like the reboot series has rebooted the old Star Trek movie curse along with it, albeit with the order flipped. We had the first one, which was an alright bit of fun, then Into Darkness which was a load of crap, and now this one which is apparently really good.
I've liked the reboot films, except the second, they are good action movies, but as Star Trek movies they just don't work.
Star Trek was about getting out there and seeing what is about, we had years with the crews to learn about them. The Original Series movies still had that air of discovery and finding something new.
As much as I liked the Next Generation movies they seemed to have started the action shift of the franchise, and I expect they get a lot of passes from me because of the years I spent with the crew of the Enterprise-D.
This reboot though has exploration firmly on the back burner. Wrath of Khan worked, not only because it was a well written movie, but because it was coming off the back of TOS episode Space Seed and relationships were already there. Into Darkness though wasn't well written and didn't have the nostalgia value.
Beyond is a good film but it's not Star Trek. It takes familiar names and puts them in adrenaline fueled action romps. It's a shame as the cast could do Star Trek genuine justice.
Star Trek was about getting out there and seeing what is about, we had years with the crews to learn about them. The Original Series movies still had that air of discovery and finding something new.
As much as I liked the Next Generation movies they seemed to have started the action shift of the franchise, and I expect they get a lot of passes from me because of the years I spent with the crew of the Enterprise-D.
This reboot though has exploration firmly on the back burner. Wrath of Khan worked, not only because it was a well written movie, but because it was coming off the back of TOS episode Space Seed and relationships were already there. Into Darkness though wasn't well written and didn't have the nostalgia value.
Beyond is a good film but it's not Star Trek. It takes familiar names and puts them in adrenaline fueled action romps. It's a shame as the cast could do Star Trek genuine justice.
I don't really agree there, the notion that films 1-6 were all about discovery.votemarvel said:
1 and 5, I'll grant you. Maybe 2, if we factor in that the Genesis device is new technology. However, Search for Spock? We're going back to the same spot that WoK ended in. Journey Home? Time travel to what was then the modern day. Undiscovered Country? Maybe the klingon prison world is new territory, but other than that, it's not really an explorative film, it's more a political thriller.
You bring up TNG as well, but while I only really see more of a shift to action in Nemesis (haven't seen Insurrection), of the three I've seen, only Generations comes close to being a story about exploration, with the whole Nexus thing. And it's still my least favorite Star Trek film.
The more more interesting angle in my eyes is what theme/core idea each film explores. I'd submit that it's as follows:
The Motion Picture: "Is this all that we are?"
The Wrath of Khan: Death (and life from death), age vs. experience, mortality
The Search for Spock: Loyalty (Really stretching here, but after watching Archengeia's review of the film, I can give the idea of this theme credence)
The Journey Home: Can't really peg a theme here.
The Final Frontier: Discovery, both outer and inner
The Undiscovered Country: Generational divide, changing times, the Iron Curtain, etc.
Generations: Time, "what we leave behind," 'generations'
First Contact: Betterment and aspiration
Insurrection: Can't say, haven't seen it.
Nemesis: Nature vs. nurture
2009: Doesn't have a theme that I can see
Into Darkness: Betterment vs. aspiration (similar, but not the same as FC), family, accountability
Beyond: Family (again)
Hardly claiming to have a monopoly over thematic interpretation, but by my reckoning, only one film (TFF) has the theme of discovery, and while I actually quite like said film (it's #6 for me), I'm well aware I'm in the minority there, and that Final Frontier is usually regarded as one of the worst. Just because saying a film has a theme doesn't automatically make it good (e.g. 2009 is without a theme, but it comes #4 for me).
It's not just about discovery of things out in space but discovery of things about ourselves.
Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home was about discovering how we are destroying our world and what repercussions it could have for the future. VI: The Undiscovered Country was about Kirk, his journey to discover how he could let go of old hatreds. The original series movies weren't just about discovering things in space, they were about discovering things about ourselves.
The Next Generation series had that same element of discovery. The movies not so much. Then again I'm still bitter that they could modulate the shield frequency against the Borg but not an ancient Bird of Prey.
We reach the reboot series and I do like them, again the second not so much, but they are good action movies. They don't try to stop and make us think, they jump us from set piece to set piece. The only reason we know of the relationships is from what we know of the originals.
Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home was about discovering how we are destroying our world and what repercussions it could have for the future. VI: The Undiscovered Country was about Kirk, his journey to discover how he could let go of old hatreds. The original series movies weren't just about discovering things in space, they were about discovering things about ourselves.
The Next Generation series had that same element of discovery. The movies not so much. Then again I'm still bitter that they could modulate the shield frequency against the Borg but not an ancient Bird of Prey.
We reach the reboot series and I do like them, again the second not so much, but they are good action movies. They don't try to stop and make us think, they jump us from set piece to set piece. The only reason we know of the relationships is from what we know of the originals.
"Discovering things about ourselves" could be applied to practically any story that has any form of character development. Those two examples may be the most prominent (since they both have the subtlety of a mallet in saying "this is our message! Save the whales!"), but they're not the only ones.votemarvel said:
Yeah...no. I can't speak for everyone, but you don't title a movie "Star Trek" (no subtitle) without the hope of being accessible to a wider audience. Since it was my first proper introduction, I had no problems in being introduced to the characters. There's plenty of people who never saw a Star Trek episode before the 2009 film, who may have never seen an episode since, and may not have the desire to. And anyway, relationships of the originals are a moot point in the new continuity.votemarvel said:
I was one of those people who saw the movie and did go back and see some of the seasons of the TV series (with very mixed reactions) and film series (also with very mixed reactions), but I don't imagine everyone did.
Give me a scene from the new movies that matches this, in every way it is amazing, as someone says it is the Galactic equivalent of reversing the car out of the drive way but the music, tension and the cause and purpose behind it all makes it fantastic and the bit were they switch to the exterior view of the spacedock and the music really kicks it up... amazing. Even the SFX still hold up pretty well, more or less. Oh and check out the view screen to the right of the Excelsiors Captian's shoulder, you know how Star Trek was often said to predict up coming tech... well clearly someone is charging their Ipod on that console 
Only downside to the scene is Chekov's outfit.... seriously wtf is going on there?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkJ3--2K7yo
Only downside to the scene is Chekov's outfit.... seriously wtf is going on there?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkJ3--2K7yo
TBH I'm not sure we've had a truly good Star Trek movie since Star Trek The Motion Picture, but I didn't mind the previous Abrams outings. Of course, I'm not really a Trek purist nor do I hold the overall franchise in especially high regard, so I suppose that helps.
I would say its theme was "our bad decisions today can have far reaching consequences in the future". Or some such thing...Hawki said:
'Blissful ignorance can be fleeting' or 'All good things must come to an end'
Or perhaps even 'The lengths we go for survival'. I dunno. I'm struggling here.
Maybe identity crisis around trying to find oneself while living up to your fathers standards?
You too? I consider Undiscovered Country to be one of my favorites. I might even go so far as to say that I like aspects of it more than Wrath of Khan.
Blasphemy, I know. I'm ready to be shipped off to Rura Penthe for my heresy.
It was a suitable Sci for action film as Star Trek it failed misteably and I fail completely to understand how any one can think otherwise.
The frustrating thing as the nice mcnuggets of Trek lore placed around the film this site was clearly written by someone who loves and understand Trek. So why is the plot so poorly done.
However I can see what has been done
Writer A: let's flesh out Krall and his parallels to what Kirk is going through
Director: Nah well leave that as a big reveal at the end to shock the audience. Plus it will cut into the extended sequences of the Enterprise being cut apart even though that was revealed in the trailer so feel like it has no stakes or emotional impact, a motorcycle fight and a stupid as sin beastie boys sequence.
I don't understand the bad rep Into Darkness gets sure Super Blood and Transwarp Beaming are utterly stupid (not as stupid as the Beastie Boys were in this....I get angry thinking about it). And yes the flipped death scene was kind of a stupid thing to do but the rest of the movie and plot worked well and touched on real Trek themes.
To the person who says it can't have both I will always point to The Undiscovered Country a film about the fall of Iron Curtain but still and exciting adventure/action film in its own right. Yes in my eyes it is best out of all the Star Trek films.
As a note after this film don't go home and watch an excellent TNG episode some like the Drumhead. It really will make you hate Beyond more if your an old school Trek fan like myself.
I like these films as generic Sci fi action but the Star Trek name should mean more than this drivel. If you were put off by the first trailer the way I was believe me the good reviews are flat out wrong.
The frustrating thing as the nice mcnuggets of Trek lore placed around the film this site was clearly written by someone who loves and understand Trek. So why is the plot so poorly done.
However I can see what has been done
Writer A: let's flesh out Krall and his parallels to what Kirk is going through
Director: Nah well leave that as a big reveal at the end to shock the audience. Plus it will cut into the extended sequences of the Enterprise being cut apart even though that was revealed in the trailer so feel like it has no stakes or emotional impact, a motorcycle fight and a stupid as sin beastie boys sequence.
I don't understand the bad rep Into Darkness gets sure Super Blood and Transwarp Beaming are utterly stupid (not as stupid as the Beastie Boys were in this....I get angry thinking about it). And yes the flipped death scene was kind of a stupid thing to do but the rest of the movie and plot worked well and touched on real Trek themes.
To the person who says it can't have both I will always point to The Undiscovered Country a film about the fall of Iron Curtain but still and exciting adventure/action film in its own right. Yes in my eyes it is best out of all the Star Trek films.
As a note after this film don't go home and watch an excellent TNG episode some like the Drumhead. It really will make you hate Beyond more if your an old school Trek fan like myself.
I like these films as generic Sci fi action but the Star Trek name should mean more than this drivel. If you were put off by the first trailer the way I was believe me the good reviews are flat out wrong.