Arrival - Aliens Are Here, Now What?
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Good to read it's not a disater like Interstallar or Contact, though they are sure share the common 'ending problem'.
While it was certainly a fun movie to watch, the ending was a letdown and I feel like it had way more weak plot points than some other space movies.
Still, worth seeing once, but I don't think I'd see it again after it loses its initial thrill.
Still, worth seeing once, but I don't think I'd see it again after it loses its initial thrill.
I actually saw this today and enjoyed it. I think if people have a problem with the ending is that the film isn't quite sure what tone to strike; it's not ambiguous, it's just unsure, whereas audiences are likely to have a more firm opinion about the character's actions. It's not something I'd bother to see again, but worth watching once, especially on the big screen.BloodRed Pixel said:
Okay, I've only watched the trailer so far, but is the issue of language compatibility ever addressed? In the trailer, the lead character (who I understand is a translator-turned-xenolinguist) is writing the aliens messages in English. Which, having studied the basic concept of communicating with alien life, is absolutely pants-on-head retarded. Use math, you idiots! Even if the aliens understand the concept of written language, there are human-produced languages out there that we can't translate. The two things you start with when communicating with aliens are 1) the ratio of the diameter of a circle to its circumference (pi) and 2) a 1420MHz RF signal (the spectrum signature produced by transition of two hyperfine levels in neutral hydrogen atoms).
It's semi-addressed; without giving too much away, the aliens have no ability to comprehend basic algebra but more complex mathematics is easy to them (and the reveal makes sense of why). Furthermore, and again there are reasons, the way "we" would go about attempting communication runs completely counter to their conscious comprehension. I would have expected to see more "maths" and numbers amongst the learning montage scenes, but the movie has to be sold to the mainstream and Hollywood has shown time and again its contempt for the intellect of audiences so simply don't use numbers when "feels" will do.Ravinoff said:
Okay, I saw the movie. Short version, it's good. I really can't discuss it in depth without spoilers, but basically, it's good. Pace is slow, but good, cinamatography is good (especially when they first enter the craft), the concept of the alien language is good, it's all around good. It shares a lot of similarities with Interstellar in regards to core ideas/themes, but executes them far better. So, it's good. Short version, I'd reccomend you see it. That said, it's not perfect, at which point, I have to enter spoiler territory:
So, as per the above comments, those are my flaws with the film. It stumbles IMO because it's trying to do too much, when the more basic premise (learning an alien language) is interesting enough in of itself. But still, I think it's quite solid. Not a great film, but still a good one.
Edit: Per comments earlier in the thread, it is explained (and quite well) why mathematics don't work. It's established early on that humanity has tried communicating through number sequences (e.g. Fibonachi), but it's basically because the aliens' very manner of perceiving reality is so different from ours that this form of communication doesn't work.
So, because of how the heptapod language works, how basically the start of a sentence is constructed simultaniously with the end of a sentence (as opposed to writing this, where I begin with "So," and work on from there), it basically rewires Louise's brain to be able to see the future, in what we believe are flashbacks initially, but are revealed to be flash-forwards. I'm actually okay with this. It stretches credulity, but no more so than the idea of aliens visiting in the first place. Like I said, it's far better than Interstellar, which had a convoluted plot that involved Cooper getting into the black hole, while the aliens are limited by a completely different morphology and nature of thought.
So, basically, the idea is that the aliens have to teach humanity their language, so after understanding that, they can impart a formula of sorts that'll take years to decode. Because the aliens can see into the future (or, more accurately, they see all time simultaniously*), they know that in 3000 years, they'll need humanity's help. So, the implication is that they uplift us now, in preparation for whatever we need to help them for. Okay, fine. I can roll with that. I can even buy that Louise contacting Shang and telling him his wife's dying words is enough to get him to call off his forces...sort of. It's basic pre-destination paradox, that him telling her the words and his cell in the future means that Louise can contact him in the present/past. Okay, fine. However, the whole ability to see past, present, and future all at the same time does raise some questions, such as:
-If the aliens knew a bomb would go off in the ship, why not take steps to prevent it?
-The big issue at the end is that even knowing that her daughter will die young, Louise still agrees to have a child with Ian. Now, I don't think this is the film's intent, but it does carry the suggestion that there's no such thing as free will, that Louise willingly gives herself over to fate, that her brain has become like that of a heptapod (which might explain why the heptapod who dies ends up...well, dying). That she knows what'll happen in the future, and won't do a thing to change it. This isn't an objective flaw, and I'm approaching it from a traditional, three-dimensional view, whereas the heptapods would presumably have a four dimensional view (e.g. time), but, yeah. To be honest, I don't think the film even considers this aspect, it just rolls with it. If anything, it might explain why the heptapod apparently willingly dies, that they're fatalistic by their very nature.
-Also, the atmosphere of the craft. If Louise can breathe in their atmosphere, why are they keeping themselves separate from the teams? Maybe to make it easier to communicate via written language?
*Which actually syncs up with one of Einstein's theories, that our view of time is confined to the present, whereas in reality, every second of every event is occuring all at the same time, but we can only comprehend what we perceive to be the present.
So, basically, the idea is that the aliens have to teach humanity their language, so after understanding that, they can impart a formula of sorts that'll take years to decode. Because the aliens can see into the future (or, more accurately, they see all time simultaniously*), they know that in 3000 years, they'll need humanity's help. So, the implication is that they uplift us now, in preparation for whatever we need to help them for. Okay, fine. I can roll with that. I can even buy that Louise contacting Shang and telling him his wife's dying words is enough to get him to call off his forces...sort of. It's basic pre-destination paradox, that him telling her the words and his cell in the future means that Louise can contact him in the present/past. Okay, fine. However, the whole ability to see past, present, and future all at the same time does raise some questions, such as:
-If the aliens knew a bomb would go off in the ship, why not take steps to prevent it?
-The big issue at the end is that even knowing that her daughter will die young, Louise still agrees to have a child with Ian. Now, I don't think this is the film's intent, but it does carry the suggestion that there's no such thing as free will, that Louise willingly gives herself over to fate, that her brain has become like that of a heptapod (which might explain why the heptapod who dies ends up...well, dying). That she knows what'll happen in the future, and won't do a thing to change it. This isn't an objective flaw, and I'm approaching it from a traditional, three-dimensional view, whereas the heptapods would presumably have a four dimensional view (e.g. time), but, yeah. To be honest, I don't think the film even considers this aspect, it just rolls with it. If anything, it might explain why the heptapod apparently willingly dies, that they're fatalistic by their very nature.
-Also, the atmosphere of the craft. If Louise can breathe in their atmosphere, why are they keeping themselves separate from the teams? Maybe to make it easier to communicate via written language?
*Which actually syncs up with one of Einstein's theories, that our view of time is confined to the present, whereas in reality, every second of every event is occuring all at the same time, but we can only comprehend what we perceive to be the present.
So, as per the above comments, those are my flaws with the film. It stumbles IMO because it's trying to do too much, when the more basic premise (learning an alien language) is interesting enough in of itself. But still, I think it's quite solid. Not a great film, but still a good one.
Edit: Per comments earlier in the thread, it is explained (and quite well) why mathematics don't work. It's established early on that humanity has tried communicating through number sequences (e.g. Fibonachi), but it's basically because the aliens' very manner of perceiving reality is so different from ours that this form of communication doesn't work.
