299: Casual Gamers Are Better Than You

SilverUchiha

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I think the biggest problem is that people equate hardcore with being interested in nothing more than generic FPS games that really aren't good anymore, but just have a massive online community full of dickheads (i.e. Halo and Call of Duty serieses). Not all people who describe themselves as "hardcore" would agree to that, but certainly a large number of closed-minded people I have come to know will say that.

In that, they dismiss hundreds, perhaps even thousands, of excellent titles that they'll never enjoy or experience because they have such a small bubble of enjoyment. They may never get into a true survival-horror game. They may never have fun with a well made RPG. They'll just sit around, shooting and T-bagging upon reflex. Again, not all people who are hardcore gamers do this, but I know enough where this could (if it isn't already) be a stereotype.
 

Halo Fanboy

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Read this as: Casuals have low standards, buy things based on novelty and are cheap. Frankly the insinuation that you get a better deal playing free and cheap games and paying for good hardware and games is stupid was kind of offensive.
 

BabySinclair

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Pros: The rapid expansion of the gaming community and demographics
Developers trying new idea in gameplay

Cons: Less sequals to IPs... wait, that's a good thing
More shovel ware (in some ways debatable)

How many copies of the same realistic FPS's have been sold? Homefront, CoD, MW, all follow the same format in multiplayer, just different maps. They may have a few differences but as someone who only plays them on console when at a friend's I couldn't tell you the difference in game since there really isn't one (haven't played Homefront so no knowledge there.) So why pay $60 for the same game time and again for a few new maps and occasional feature, not counting DLC? The "casual" gamers that so many look down will play the quirky random game that actually has innovation (farmville not being one) and will play a greater number of games.

So the system gets some crappy shovel ware, who cares, it doesn't take that much effort to push it out the door, relatively cheap to make and funds itself.

Its not that the casual gamers are dumber, hell to enjoy a simple game is harder to do than enjoy a more advanced game. What's better, a good feature film at full cost that has been remade three times or a series of 5-10 min shorts of different nature that don't cost anything and are mostly good? Claiming that people who find enjoyment in social games are dumb is a highly elitist, narcissistic and backwards view. I'm gonna wrap this us, the new causal market is helping the industry regardless of the hardcore elitist taking his blinders off.
 

SamElliot'sMustache

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Oct 5, 2009
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Casual gamers aren't so much 'better' or 'more open' so much as attracted to a slightly different type of shiny thing than the hardcore crowd. I pretty much see them as two sides of the same coin, with the casual group piling on the latest Farmville clone, and the hardcore group piling on the Call of Duty clones. Neither one would support games like Okami or Psychonauts. The article does raise some great points and uncomfortable truths, though, about why hardcore gamers are being 'abandoned,' or at least feel like they're being abandoned, because of piracy, stagnation, and so on. No one wants their work being stolen consistently, and only a mediocre developer wants to make the same game over and over with the only change being slightly shinier graphics (which is what the hardcore crowd prefers).
 
Apr 28, 2008
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diadia said:
Great article and a nice open discussion about the state of gaming and the gaming industry. I am enjoying reading the comments many people are proving one of his points right with their angry reactions. Don't take it personal guys but, from the perspective of a PC gamer who is not "hardcore" or even "core" this article makes a lot of sense and describes the way I and others like me see "hardcore" gamers and the state of the gaming industry.
What he said. All the people saying his article is factually wrong without providing facts themselves. Its both funny and sad...
 

More Fun To Compute

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diadia said:
Great article and a nice open discussion about the state of gaming and the gaming industry. I am enjoying reading the comments many people are proving one of his points right with their angry reactions. Don't take it personal guys but, from the perspective of a PC gamer who is not "hardcore" or even "core" this article makes a lot of sense and describes the way I and others like me see "hardcore" gamers and the state of the gaming industry.
I think that many of us have short tempers with Sterling because we know about his sensationalist tabloid journalist techniques.

But we would be interested in hearing your problem with the game industry and how it relates to failings in the customer base for their games. From the article there seemed to be arguments that certain types of promising games they are making are not selling enough copies because of negative people on web sites. Another is because console and PC gamers are sticking too much with games that they know will be good because they have had their fingers burned too many times by highly recommended games that turned out to be a waste of money.

Do you agree with these points and how do you see improvements in other newer markets?
 

JonnWood

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Jul 16, 2008
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SilverUchiha said:
I think the biggest problem is that people equate hardcore with being interested in nothing more than generic FPS games that really aren't good anymore,
I don't. I've seen the kvetching over Dragon Age 2, Crysis 2, and Mass Effect 2. People complain about games being generic, but if anything is changed at all, fans start complaining.

but just have a massive online community full of dickheads (i.e. Halo and Call of Duty serieses).
Expand that to "any online game". There are plenty of jerks playing TF2 on PC.

Not all people who describe themselves as "hardcore" would agree to that, but certainly a large number of closed-minded people I have come to know will say that.
I find 'closed-minded' is often used as a synonym for 'has a different opinion than me'.
 

SilverUchiha

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JonnWood said:
SilverUchiha said:
I think the biggest problem is that people equate hardcore with being interested in nothing more than generic FPS games that really aren't good anymore,
I don't. I've seen the kvetching over Dragon Age 2, Crysis 2, and Mass Effect 2. People complain about games being generic, but if anything is changed at all, fans start complaining.

but just have a massive online community full of dickheads (i.e. Halo and Call of Duty serieses).
Expand that to "any online game". There are plenty of jerks playing TF2 on PC.

Not all people who describe themselves as "hardcore" would agree to that, but certainly a large number of closed-minded people I have come to know will say that.
I find 'closed-minded' is often used as a synonym for 'has a different opinion than me'.
It's easy to make someone sound stupid when you take their quotes entirely out of context.
 

JonnWood

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Jul 16, 2008
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SamElliot said:
The article does raise some great points and uncomfortable truths, though, about why hardcore gamers are being 'abandoned,' or at least feel like they're being abandoned, because of piracy, stagnation, and so on. No one wants their work being stolen consistently,
Such as how PC gamers pirated Crysis just to use as a benchmark, yet cried about it when the sequel was multiplatform?
 

BloodSquirrel

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Jun 23, 2008
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SamElliot said:
only a mediocre developer wants to make the same game over and over with the only change being slightly shinier graphics (which is what the hardcore crowd prefers).
Developers aren't the ones calling the shots- publishers are. And they LOVE making the same game over and over with slightly shinier graphics. It's cheap and it provides a nice, reliable money stream. This is, in fact, Bobby Kotick's stated strategy.

The casual market is simply larger, and more willing to buy cheaply made games.
 

Mantonio

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Apr 15, 2009
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My immediate reaction after reading this was 'Well fuck you too buddy'. I feel like I'm being attacked.

Core gamers cannot be counted on to support good games, but casual gamers can be counted on to support almost anything, so long as it piques their interest.
The problem with all the games you listed is that they had poor marketing. Even if your game is phenomenal, if nobody knows it exists then it's going to flop.

And yes, I suppose casual gamers can be counted on to support anything. Because after all, they are like magpies, buying something then abandoning it the second something shinier comes along.

So what, they're better because they don't research a bit before buying? They're better because they're mindlessly consuming?
 

PopcornAvenger

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Jul 15, 2008
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This article makes a lot of assumptions and dubious "givens". As a hardcore gamer, it's assumed I pirate games. I don't. It's assumed I don't like casual games. I do - Plants Vs Zombies (245 hours) is one of my all-time favorites, and I liked World of Goo. I'm close-minded, and won't trust new IP's? Hell, it's the "established" IP's these days I don't trust, with some of my favorite companies (Bioware, Crytek) churning out crippled, stunted PC games as they court the console player. Frankly, I'm very interested in new companies and new titles, as I hope they haven't yet been infected with the EA virus they call a business strategy, chances are better that they are not developing it multiplatform, and that they might actually have a fun game (with perhaps a fresh take on things).

Maybe I'm "unique" amongst those of us who call ourselves hardcore gamers. I doubt it.

A good portion of this article boils down to: ignorance is bliss. At least, it is for the gaming industry. Since us hardcore gamers are actually more knowledgable and a bit pickier about what games we'll spend our dollars on.
 

Xaio30

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Nov 24, 2010
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So "hardcore gamer" now means that you're buying whatever the "big" companies release?
However, illseva.

Edit: Yes, that is both my captcha and the greatest counter-argument ever.
 

Plinglebob

Team Stupid-Face
Nov 11, 2008
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While I liked this article, and do agree with most of the points, I think you cast too wide a net when defining "Hardcore" gamers. Personally, I think of there being 3 different camps which (like everything) have overlaps at the edges; Casual, Populist and Hardcore. While hardcore gamers do have a lot to answer for as outlined in the article, I think blaming the demise of new IPs or crappy & exploitative DLC on them is unfair.

Other then that, great article.

Edit:
BonsaiK said:
Great article. I agree 100%, and I play both hardcore and casual games, so I consider myself unbiased.
Same. As long as the game is Fun, I'm all for it *goes back to Bejewelled*
 

GrizzlerBorno

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Sep 2, 2010
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"Core gamers seem to resist the new and distrust the unique"

Minecraft. Now STFU Mr. Sterling if that is you real name.
 

PopcornAvenger

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Jul 15, 2008
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The title should be changed from "You wish you were Casual" to "The Gaming Industry wishes YOU were casual".
 

The Funslinger

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Sep 12, 2010
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Meh. I don't lump myself with either party. Long time Halo player, along with CoD, and other games like Fallout, and Assassin's Creed. Just a small sample of my 360 games alone (I started with Sega as a kid.) I'll play basically any game genre. I play the aforementioned fairly core games, including RTS games, I've played the wii family games with my family, and I've played Plants vs Zombies and Doodle Jump on the iphone. I don't hate genres, I hate individual games.
 

Joost Klessens

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poiumty said:
Dastardly said:
Your own reaction should, if you take just a moment, serve to prove that point--even if you disagree with how the point was presented.
Correlation doesn't imply causation, and you're making assumptions you really shouldn't. My mind is very open and i certainly did consider the truth behind the article. It didn't last. Using debatable facts about piracy to prove a point about casuals, assuming certain things are true without proving them to be so, generalizing a lot more than he should, using a deliberately inflammatory point of view even though it wasn't needed at all and so forth.

But surely my calling of bullshit means i'm too closed-minded to accept his totally valid points. Logic 101.
Ironically enough, i'm not even the demographic he's targetting with this - i'm just pointing out he uses shock value to give him credibility rather than solid reasoning.
You are right that the conclusions drawn in this article are not exactly based on scientific research, but as it is not a news article it really doesn't bother me that much. I read it more like a column, in which, in my opinion, using shock value, fallacies and inflammatory point of views is generally more the rule instead of the exception. And reading it in that fashion does give an interesting insight in the author's reasoning about the popularity of casual games, both for (casual) gamers and for developers. Whether the reasoning is correct remains to be seen, but until it is either conclusively proven or rejected, it remains an interesting topic for debate.

Furthermore I see nothing wrong with someone sharing their point of view with us through the means of a column-like article and don't see why you should shoot that person down for fallacies etc. It's not a scientific article, so lighten up. :)
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
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I wish I wasn't so fucking jaded with this industry...I can hardly get excited for any game these days, for fear of disappointment. I remember when I was a young boy, and knew nothing of the industry. I bought games based on the box art and back-of-the-box descriptions, and rarely felt any tinge of disappointment. Every game I had brought me joy. I didn't read dozens of reviews on the internet (or in magazines), look up gameplay videos, and ask people on the forums about games. The most I ever did was play the occasional demo disc from my old "Playstation Underground" subscription. And even then, I didn't play every demo. Just the ones that appealed to me via their little description boxes.

I used to enjoy games that were really quite shit when I look back at them.

I hate being so fucking jaded.
 

Cheesus333

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Aug 20, 2008
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I don't think it's fair to assume that I[footnote]I'll take it personally because the article is in second person.[/footnote] look down upon casual gamers, or think I'm better than them. If they don't play the same sort of games, that's fine, I don't care. What I'm worried about is that game companies might stop catering to my demographic altogether, leaving my favourite activity completely dead to me.

And please don't try and insist that it's my fault if they do. I never pirate games, and I always buy the games I like and want to see more of.