Editor's Note: Anti/Hero

[Russ Pitts]

Anti/Hero

In this week's issue of The Escapist, we look at some of gaming's best examples of blurring the line between good and bad.

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[Kollega]

Ummmm... Robin Hood is an anti-hero? Since when? He's Chaotic Good, robbing the rich and giving to the poor. If someone has to steal from the rich to give to the poor, the rich are obviously not generous enough - or they would have given to the poor themselves, wihtout a middleman enforcing it. Which means rich are greedy jerks, and let's face it - most of the times they indeed are, because power tends to corrupt.

In short, for me Chaotic Good characters (those who see law is unjust or obstructive, and break it to help the people) are much less of an "anti"-heroes than Chaotic Neutral characters (those who really are in it only for themselves).

 

[Russ Pitts]

Ummmm... Robin Hood is an anti-hero? Since when?

Since stealing was considered a crime.

Heroes generally don't break the law. That's pretty much anti-what they're supposed to be doing. Which is why folks like Robin Hood and Zorro are considered anti-heroes. They're doing admittedly bad things, but for a good - or at least auspiciously good - reason. But try telling that to the people who get their houses broken into.

You're correct that Robin Hood is what we would call chaotic good, in the D&D sense, but heroes, traditionally, are lawful good. Or at worst neutral good, or lawful neutral. True heroes are never, ever chaotic. Chaos is the antithesis of law and order, which is what traditional heroes are supposed to represent. Therefore, using your criteria, Robin Hood, by virtue of being chaotic good, is by definition an anti-hero.

To those who are poor or dispossessed, Robin Hood may be an outright hero, with no "anti," but a true hero doesn't subjugate one set of people for the benefit of another set, however much he or you may thing "the rich" deserve to be punished. That's not very heroic. By suggesting that, since you agree with his politics, Robin Hood is therefore a true hero, you're essentially saying that if The Joker, for example, used his poison gas on someone you happened to not like, killing that person, then he, too, would be a hero. That's not right. Killing people is against society's legal and moral code, therefore the Joker is a villain, regardless what subjective good may come from his actions.

Were the Joker killing people whom he and society at large considered "enemies of the people," like, for example, The Punisher, then he would be undertaking a heroic quest, but doing so in a less-than heroic manner, therefore: anti-hero. Heroes fight for the benefit of all - rich or poor - because a true hero is above petty judgments about who is more or less deserving of justice.

See Allen Varney's article about Batman [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_239/7109-Batmanalyzed] for more on this discussion. He makes a good case about Batman being a "capitalist hero," chasing after only lower-class villains. It's an interesting theory, and Batman is absolutely and definitely an anti-hero in almost any sense. But even Batman abides by the law. He doesn't punish criminals, he apprehends them and delivers them to the civilian authorities. He redistributes wealth by earning it himself and then giving it away. And he doesn't steal - ever.

So is Batman really an anti-hero? What would you say his alignment is?

 

[Kollega]

-snipped for sheer, brutal length-

I was reading the articles right about now, but somehow i arrived the last to one about Batman. What a shame.

Also, good one. Nice accusation on your part, telling that i would support Joker (who is, going by D&D alignment system, Chaotic Evil) if he killed people i don't like, and by the same token, equating someone i don't like getting killed and someone i don't like getting stuff stolen from them. I may not like them, but i'm not that immoral. Continuing with analogies, stealing from the rich and giving to the poor is more like if Joker started hunting down serial murderers... [small]or something to that effect, i'm not sure. Murder and theft are not equal anyways (theft is bad, but murder is flat-out worse), so this analogy dosen't work out in the end.[/small]

Good one on my part, too. When i hear "anti-hero", i assume the talk is about "nineties' comic book anti-hero", which is an extremely narrow definition. Gotta think bigger and wider then, i guess.

Spoiler: As for Batman's alignment... it depends.

 

[Premonition]

This has already reached infamous proportions, I tell ya.

 

[funksobeefy]

I think the world would be a better place if all we tried to be were the shinning knight of virtue and honesty. I wouldnt want to live in a world where are heroes are more like villains, how awful it would be to have everybody having the mentality "ends justify the means"?

I think while difficult to try and be the knight, its rewarding in a sense that no anti-hero can be. I want to be the person that does good because its good, and care because I actually care about others. As a society we lost that will to do the right thing be because its right, we only choose the quick and easy because its what our heroes of today are doing.

The means should always justify the end

 

[Kollega]

Many heroes were chaotic- thats where we get revolutionary heroes from.

Those that ran the underground railroad were technically chaotic and I'd call them heroes. Laws are not always good and breaking a bad law is not morally wrong.

Now let me clarify one thing at your expense (har har har!) - being Chaotic Good is about rolling along with the law when it's just, and breaking it without hesitation when it isn't. That's the point, or at least how i see it.

 

[Logan Westbrook]

Many heroes were chaotic- thats where we get revolutionary heroes from.

Those that ran the underground railroad were technically chaotic and I'd call them heroes. Laws are not always good and breaking a bad law is not morally wrong.

Now let me clarify one thing at your expense (har har har!) - being Chaotic Good is about rolling along with the law when it's just, and breaking it without hesitation when it isn't. That's the point, or at least how i see it.

Actually, that's Neutral Good.

 

[oliveira8]

*snip*

Still an anti-hero. His batmobile must have a huge speed limit bill. And he uses that Batplane(or whatever)I bet when ever is flying it's breaking a few rules when it comes to air traffic.

 

[Plurralbles]

way to rip off what has already been said in the comic book world for a long ass time and had a resurgence after, "The Dark Knight"

 

[Kollega]

Actually, that's Neutral Good.

Not quite sure. For me, Chaotic Good is about actively destroying the unjust law in question, while Neutral Good is about skirting around it while still doing good.

Then again - Good is still Good, no matter if it's Lawful, Neutral, or Chaotic.

 

[Falseprophet]

I know why anti-heroes are popular protagonists in video games: they give you license to act like a complete dick while still being better than the real scum you're up against. And that's fine: I like a well-written anti-hero who either struggles with the evil he has to do for the greater good, or who has just given up and accepts the world as hell on earth and tries to survive in it as best as he can. I wouldn't hold up either of those guys as a model to aspire to, but they have a compelling story.

Anti-heroes don't work for me when writers get lazy and focus on the superficial aspects with no deeper insights into the character. Too many writers--and not just in video games--focus on protagonists who wear dark colours, are capable of savage violence without remorse, and live by their own code, without really examining how they got to this place, or what it's cost them to be here.

The Dragon Age "Scattered Ashes" trailer almost turned me off, because it portrayed a bunch of badasses effortlessly dispatching a horde of monsters with pithy quips. Even when the dragon showed up they didn't break a sweat. Not once did I feel this was actually a struggle for them. How can you be a hero, anti or otherwise, if it doesn't cost you anything? Thankfully, the game's writers are better than that, and wrote flaws and back stories into the characters that makes them compelling people, even when they do horrible things.

 

[Rolling Thunder]

Interesting article. But I think you may have missed something. It's not just that we want someone who's a bit more like us - a bit more corrupt and a bit more human for it - but also, that, fundamentally, we're downright vengeful. We don't want the bad guys tied up for the cops and the judical system to deal with. We don't want those who hurt us to be dealt with in the course of law. We want to see them lying face-down in a poor of blood, eating pavement as they try to drag themselves away, before another gunshot or blood loss finishes them. We want to be able to act out that revenge fantasy, that moment when all the injustices come to a head and we can put seven point six-two milimetres of hot metal into the bad guy's heart...and walk away without the consequence. Without the moral anguish of having killed, or the physical issues of breaking the law. We want to be Batman, Dirty Harry, Bullitt.

Also, sometimes it's just about style. Sheer, raw style rarely comes from force-of-purity. It comes from ruthless, malevolent style. It comes from crushing your enemies beneath your feet. It comes from being so damn badass you play Ride of the Valkyries from loudspeakers even as you machinegun peasants with Kalashnikovs from the sky, and snarl with glee as a napalm strike vapourises an entire treeline.

 

[Russ Pitts]

*snip*

Still an anti-hero. His batmobile must have a huge speed limit bill. And he uses that Batplane(or whatever)I bet when ever is flying it's breaking a few rules when it comes to air traffic.

I agree. I was not trying to make the point that he wasn't an anti-hero, merely that he wasn't chaotic.

 

[Mirrored Jigsaw]

With all this talk about anti-heroes. I wonder when the concept of a villainous protagonist will catch on. God of War is pretty much the only one that I know does that.