Force Unleashed 2 Is Too Much
Yahtzee posits that an action sequence can be too awesome.
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Yahtzee posits that an action sequence can be too awesome.
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Force Unleashed 2 Is Too Much
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
i dont exactly understand how a game can be "too awesome" i mean, look at Saints Row 2, that was ridiculous in almost every way but people accept that
or inFamous or Prototype, both very ridiculous but also a spectacle to be enjoyed.
besides that, i always thought directors were trying to go for less "flash" and "bang" because of the rise of "realistic" games like Cash-In Of Duty and Grand Theft Auto 4.
or inFamous or Prototype, both very ridiculous but also a spectacle to be enjoyed.
besides that, i always thought directors were trying to go for less "flash" and "bang" because of the rise of "realistic" games like Cash-In Of Duty and Grand Theft Auto 4.
- Mar 31, 2010
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Have you even played any of the most recent COD's? The graphics may be on the grey/brown/dull-side but I wouldn't call it's action (one squad saving the world) by any stretch of the imagination "realistic".Azaraxzealot said:
but its by no means as much a spectacle as something like Gears of War or Bulletstorm.JoJoDeathunter said:
I agree about The Force Unleashed 2. That was the worst £50 I have ever spent on a videogame, ever!
Slightly off-topic, but has anyone played Assassins Creed Brotherhood, yet? Bloody brilliant game!
Slightly off-topic, but has anyone played Assassins Creed Brotherhood, yet? Bloody brilliant game!
I question your choice of words and even exposition this week, but I agree with the meaning: Stop turning everything up to 11.... million.
Anime is a good example of this... Particularly stuff like Naruto or Dragonball that suffer through abusive levels of power scaling, to the point where the "bit over the top fun fights" get mutilated into "meaninglessand absurd dick measuring clusterfucks".
The ultimate problem isn't necessarily that things go "too far" per say, it's that they simply go too far to still fit the established universe. Nobody questions that Superman can punch someone through a wall, but when a 12 year old kid on a realistically inclined show does it you start to wonder what the fuck.
I've wailed on The Force Unleashed series for this way too long to go on about it, but suffice to say that it's, at the very least, retardedly inconsistent. Based on the pre-existing Star Wars universe, even accepting the abortions that were the "new" trilogy movies (I, II and III), if Starkiller had ever existed then the original trilogy couldn't have happened, simply because Starkiller would be, hands down, the most powerful being in the entire fucking universe, and either he'd take over the galaxy for the dark side, or destroy the dark side for the light side. Yoda was some sort of never-before-seen force master, and he had to focus to levitate an x-wing out of a swamp... Starkiller drops a fucking star destroyer from orbit without blinking. Fuck you George, you mentally bankrupt whorehopper.
Anime is a good example of this... Particularly stuff like Naruto or Dragonball that suffer through abusive levels of power scaling, to the point where the "bit over the top fun fights" get mutilated into "meaninglessand absurd dick measuring clusterfucks".
The ultimate problem isn't necessarily that things go "too far" per say, it's that they simply go too far to still fit the established universe. Nobody questions that Superman can punch someone through a wall, but when a 12 year old kid on a realistically inclined show does it you start to wonder what the fuck.
I've wailed on The Force Unleashed series for this way too long to go on about it, but suffice to say that it's, at the very least, retardedly inconsistent. Based on the pre-existing Star Wars universe, even accepting the abortions that were the "new" trilogy movies (I, II and III), if Starkiller had ever existed then the original trilogy couldn't have happened, simply because Starkiller would be, hands down, the most powerful being in the entire fucking universe, and either he'd take over the galaxy for the dark side, or destroy the dark side for the light side. Yoda was some sort of never-before-seen force master, and he had to focus to levitate an x-wing out of a swamp... Starkiller drops a fucking star destroyer from orbit without blinking. Fuck you George, you mentally bankrupt whorehopper.
In Shadow of the Colossus you are constantly in fear of being thrown off as this gigantic beast that you barely at the last minute are able to kill because you have a magical sword. It's not that unrealistic because you aren't some jumbo, overpowered meat man. You are a fragile youth that has to fight tooth and nail to climb up this giant and after climbing to it's weak point and stabbing it 3 to 4 times you finally bring it down.Bobic said:
I'd say Shadows of the Colossus gets away with it because it makes your character seem diminutive by comparison. Just as Indie is getting cut and thrown about on the tank, so is Wander as the giant colossi try to shake him off. Kratos on the other hand usually seems to be portrayed as being on equal footing with whatever he faces, even though his foes are usually larger than him. It's very believable, since he's got herculean strength, but it removes the tension from the fight, knowing this giant monstrosity is just another pest for him to deal with.Bobic said:
There is a game I like to talk about that really made me nervous and afraid of failing. That game was called Heavy Rain. It made my palms sweat (and that almost never happens when I play games) and had me shaking from sheer adrenaline because I could relate to the situations and knew that there was a very real risk of me failing. I can imagine the horror of being drugged and waking up, tied to a table in the basement of a crazy surgeon who is about to improvise an anatomy lesson with a power drill on me. Or the terror of being faced with cutting off your own finger to save someone you love.
Sometimes I think I am slowly getting too old for modern games, because they seem more and more tailored to teenage boys who are easily impressed by "wow"-sequences like Starkiller pulling a Star Destroyer out of orbit or aircraft falling out of the sky after an EMP-wave hits Washington D.C. In essence, I agree with what Yahtzee says. But I've always been a sucker for moody games as opposed to flashy games.
Sometimes I think I am slowly getting too old for modern games, because they seem more and more tailored to teenage boys who are easily impressed by "wow"-sequences like Starkiller pulling a Star Destroyer out of orbit or aircraft falling out of the sky after an EMP-wave hits Washington D.C. In essence, I agree with what Yahtzee says. But I've always been a sucker for moody games as opposed to flashy games.
Yeah, i totally agree with you and Yahtzee on this one... i've looked at TFU2 gameplay and thought to myself: "The fuck? This isn't Star Wars, this is God of War." Seriously, it was considered an achievement to use the Force as targeting aid to destroy the Death Star with a precisely-placed proton projectile in an homage to Dambusters back when the original Star Wars movie was new, but Starkiller could blow the Death Star up directly with the Force, just by thinking hard enough! If we accept the biological origin for the Force, then Starkiller must be 68% or even 99% midichlorians, and if it's spiritual in origin, then why the hell Luke or Yoda or Vader are "the chosen ones" when this guy dwarfs them all without even flinching an eyebrow?! To summarize, once again: "this may be cool, but it's not Star Wars by any stretch of imagination."Caliostro said:
/rant
As far as the Jedi cloning thing goes, according to TFU II,
which comes to a head when
A running theme through the game is that Jedi's cannot be cloned, which is why they theoretically can't just make an army of Starkillers.
The bad ending reveals that in fact they have achieved Jedi cloning, which is revealed when Starkiller is killed by a clone of himself.
Don't agree with you on some things Yahtzee, but definitely on that. It's starting to cross into TV/Movies and everything else (RTD and Michael Bay are especially fond of it)Yahtzee Croshaw said:
See, there's an Uncanny Valley, like that of facial recognition, where your mind just goes "Fuck this for a game of soldiers."
The latest casualty is that bad guy in Avatar. You know, the one that's marked as BAD GUY and carries around a sign saying BAD GUY, and the GOOD GUY has doubts about him being the BAD GUY - and in the end he betrays them, because he's a BAD GUY.
Sorry, don't know if you caught the subtle symbolism in Cameron's writing.
Anyway, this BAD GUY takes more hits than any other creature in the whole f-ing film. Seriously. Look at how hard those planes get tanked, look at what the big Mind-Tree takes...he takes that and more, and still does the "Kirk" where he brushes the blood of his lips and says "Let's get it on now."
There's a certain point where suspension of disbelief snaps.
In Doctor Who recently, there was a massive explosion of this during The Big Bang, where the Doctor was released from his prison by the Doctor.
Epic? yes. Too epic?...it's straining. You COULD work it out by bringing in multiple re-tries, Blinovitch problems, shrinking universes - but it still stuck out like a sore thumb.
It's Deus Ex Machinae in another form, except it's Deus Ex Stilus now. (God in the Writing)
If Starkiller can do all this awesome shit, why do they even need a Death Star? He just concentrates and shatters a nearby moon. The asteroid shower will shred that planet.
Did you just punch out Cthulu? [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DidYouJustPunchOutCthulhu]
Oh I agree, the entire "Force Unleashed" thing is ridiculous. Also being set between known movie events to give it a "canon" type feel, the "real" seeming ending having to involve the protaganist's death is nessicary to explain why nobody ever knew about this guy with the other stuff that was going on.
All told the entire premise was not very good, and the Force was overpowered.
That said I think it got approved because if you understand Star Wars as only a TRUE nerd can, it is remotely plausible. The Force isn't really based on personal abillity, but rather it's own desires in making the universe follow a cycle (good, brief balance, evil, brief balance, good... ad infinium with each good or evil cycle lasting thousands of years). This is why personal abillity varies so much, and why you see situations where "the Force is Cloudy" as well as prophecies (like the one about Anakin) which plays into the whole predestined/manipulative aspct of the whole thing.
If one argues that Starkiller was a ridiculous super-Saiyan type figure (to referance Yahtzee's video) because of the universe's need to remove the various Jedi and other rediculous forces to make the transition happen, it could be argued to make sense.
It's still unnessicary and idiotic however, on that I agree.
I also will say that I agree with Yahtzee's point on something being "too awesome" though I prefer to think of it as being "overdone". Being "awesome" is a positive term that seems to hurt what he's trying to say. In a literal sense I guess the point is that if the "awe" comes from the sheer ridiculousness of a situation in context to the storyline, then it's a bad thing. I agree with that. His example is spot on: ginormous screen-filling bosses were cool when they weren't in every game, now that they are, they are just getting to be stupid and over done.
Context also matters, when your doing a super-hero storyline, people expect things to be campy and ridiculous. Even the most gritty and "realistic" ones are still that way, they just tell the story differantly. When your playing a super-hero in a game like "infamous" you expect it to be over the top. In something like "Indiana Jones" you expect a differant kind of set up, and a scene like the one involving Shia doesn't really fit in with the style.
All told the entire premise was not very good, and the Force was overpowered.
That said I think it got approved because if you understand Star Wars as only a TRUE nerd can, it is remotely plausible. The Force isn't really based on personal abillity, but rather it's own desires in making the universe follow a cycle (good, brief balance, evil, brief balance, good... ad infinium with each good or evil cycle lasting thousands of years). This is why personal abillity varies so much, and why you see situations where "the Force is Cloudy" as well as prophecies (like the one about Anakin) which plays into the whole predestined/manipulative aspct of the whole thing.
If one argues that Starkiller was a ridiculous super-Saiyan type figure (to referance Yahtzee's video) because of the universe's need to remove the various Jedi and other rediculous forces to make the transition happen, it could be argued to make sense.
It's still unnessicary and idiotic however, on that I agree.
I also will say that I agree with Yahtzee's point on something being "too awesome" though I prefer to think of it as being "overdone". Being "awesome" is a positive term that seems to hurt what he's trying to say. In a literal sense I guess the point is that if the "awe" comes from the sheer ridiculousness of a situation in context to the storyline, then it's a bad thing. I agree with that. His example is spot on: ginormous screen-filling bosses were cool when they weren't in every game, now that they are, they are just getting to be stupid and over done.
Context also matters, when your doing a super-hero storyline, people expect things to be campy and ridiculous. Even the most gritty and "realistic" ones are still that way, they just tell the story differantly. When your playing a super-hero in a game like "infamous" you expect it to be over the top. In something like "Indiana Jones" you expect a differant kind of set up, and a scene like the one involving Shia doesn't really fit in with the style.