A Beheading In France

[Kae]

Tell that to Gethsemani

Yeah that's pretty fucking stupid, but to be honest putting trust in the current system is stupid, the environmental issues won't be addressed, it's not profitable to the corporate masters, so they simply won't no matter how hard you try, and the LGBTQ issues are important right now because they keep the people divided, in reality what we should do is disregard this pointless division of the working class and revolt against the government that is literally destroying the world in the name of profit, I'm saying y'all dumb.

 

[happyninja42]

And if they want to be a dick about their faith, then I'll react as such. I grew out of my angry atheist phase a long time ago, guys. I can criticize the bullshit of religion while also giving each individual a chance to just be a person. It is very possible to do both. I'm not defending brutal Muslim theocracies, evangelical control freaks or Hindu nationalists. I'm arguing against the assertion that being secular requires you to be an antagonist.

I've never said I don't give people a chance to be a person. I'm well aware I'm not required to be this way, thank you very much. Also I would like you to actually point out any posts of mine where I have personally directed my criticisms at an individual, that didn't initiate the personal point first. Because your post implies that I"m calling people out by name, because I'm some "angry athiest", when to the best of my memory, my posts have been at the institution of religion as a whole. With one exception that I can recall on this site. But they began the personal criticism, not me. But no I will not change my tone when referring to religions, as I think they are a poison on this planet, and they illustrate it every day, in the horrible things that people of all religious faiths, do in the name of their diety. So again, Fuck Religion. Not Fuck Steve The Christian (unless Steve gives me shit directly, in which case, Fuck Steve). Fuck Religion.

MY point, is that I frankly don't care anymore. I keep hearing "hey we shouldn't be antagonistic to them" and they just happily keep acting antagonistic to us without any reprisal. Well I don't feel like doing that anymore. I don't go around door to door and shove my non-religion in people's face, but they sure as hell do it to me. They hand me their little god pamphlets because they feel they have to peddle their god to anyone around them, and when I tell them "no thank you, I'm an athiest" and hand it back, they act offended. Like how DARE I not accept their trashy "did you know jesus died for your sins" chic tracks bullshit. I've sat at my workplace, listening to religious assholes, rant in our own fucking waiting room, about the sinful gays and non-christians, about how they are destroying our world, and that they're going to bring down god's punishment, and they say it GLEEFULLY. They WANT us to die, because they truly think we deserve it. Now, if that's not a more antagonistic worldview than my "Fuck Religion", then I don't know what is. I don't want them dead, and punished forever, but THEY want that for me.

I treat everyone individually with respect and decency, WAY more than they will often treat me, especially when I tell them I'm an atheist. THEY make themselves my antagonist, by declaring that I'm a heathen, and some sinful demon, deserving of hell because I don't believe in their invisible sky daddy. And the kicker is they actually think this is a JUST fate for me. That their "loving and forgiving" god, will send me to ETERNAL punishment and torture, simply because I'm not buying what their priests are selling. They have convinced themselves that they have some moral superiority, because they decided they did, and that because I don't share that belief, they have the right to treat me like shit. Both to my face, and in the more nebulous sense of feeling I'm deserving of mystical punishment. I've been accused of just wanting to rape and steal and "sin" because I don't believe in their god, as if all non-religious people are these raving savages that just roam the christian streets. And you might think this is a joke, but they actually make MOVIES that paint us exactly like that. That we are ALL these raving, evil psychopaths, and only the godly servants can keep us in check. And they peddle this shit to CHILDREN, brainwashing them into considering anyone that doesn't share their beliefs as evil, and beneath them, and deserving of any bad thing that happens to them. And they use that platform of self-declared moral superiority, to do horrible things in this world. And that's just the christian variety of religious bullshit, the passive aggressive, I'll quietly vote out your rights as a human, because my specific interpretation of the bible tells us this is what our god wants, though none of us can actually agree on what our god wants, to the point that their are several thousand iterations of christianity alone, who all have fundamentally different views on what their god wants, yet they all think they are right, and try and push their views on others.

So again, I'm perfectly happy to be nice to people individually, until they act like an asshole. I mean it's not like I wake up, stretch my arms, throw back my curtains and greet the day asking "ok, so how can I be an asshole to religious people today!?" jaunty whistle while I make my coffee. I don't do that. I DO however invariably look at various news sites, and see reports like the shit in France, which tends to sour my daily outlook.

You criticize me for being "angry", I think you aren't angry enough. Because they are more than happy to walk all over us and treat us like shit, to our face, and behind our backs, and in the halls of government. And we've been LETTING them get away with it, for decades, to the point where they are very close to turning the US into a theocracy on every level, not just pockets of it poking out here and there.

 

[Secondhand Revenant]

I've never said I don't give people a chance to be a person. I'm well aware I'm not required to be this way, thank you very much. Also I would like you to actually point out any posts of mine where I have personally directed my criticisms at an individual, that didn't initiate the personal point first. Because your post implies that I"m calling people out by name, because I'm some "angry athiest", when to the best of my memory, my posts have been at the institution of religion as a whole. With one exception that I can recall on this site. But they began the personal criticism, not me. But no I will not change my tone when referring to religions, as I think they are a poison on this planet, and they illustrate it every day, in the horrible things that people of all religious faiths, do in the name of their diety. So again, Fuck Religion. Not Fuck Steve The Christian (unless Steve gives me shit directly, in which case, Fuck Steve). Fuck Religion.

MY point, is that I frankly don't care anymore. I keep hearing "hey we shouldn't be antagonistic to them" and they just happily keep acting antagonistic to us without any reprisal. Well I don't feel like doing that anymore. I don't go around door to door and shove my non-religion in people's face, but they sure as hell do it to me. They hand me their little god pamphlets because they feel they have to peddle their god to anyone around them, and when I tell them "no thank you, I'm an athiest" and hand it back, they act offended. Like how DARE I not accept their trashy "did you know jesus died for your sins" chic tracks bullshit. I've sat at my workplace, listening to religious assholes, rant in our own fucking waiting room, about the sinful gays and non-christians, about how they are destroying our world, and that they're going to bring down god's punishment, and they say it GLEEFULLY. They WANT us to die, because they truly think we deserve it. Now, if that's not a more antagonistic worldview than my "Fuck Religion", then I don't know what is. I don't want them dead, and punished forever, but THEY want that for me.

I treat everyone individually with respect and decency, WAY more than they will often treat me, especially when I tell them I'm an atheist. THEY make themselves my antagonist, by declaring that I'm a heathen, and some sinful demon, deserving of hell because I don't believe in their invisible sky daddy. And the kicker is they actually think this is a JUST fate for me. That their "loving and forgiving" god, will send me to ETERNAL punishment and torture, simply because I'm not buying what their priests are selling. They have convinced themselves that they have some moral superiority, because they decided they did, and that because I don't share that belief, they have the right to treat me like shit. Both to my face, and in the more nebulous sense of feeling I'm deserving of mystical punishment. I've been accused of just wanting to rape and steal and "sin" because I don't believe in their god, as if all non-religious people are these raving savages that just roam the christian streets. And you might think this is a joke, but they actually make MOVIES that paint us exactly like that. That we are ALL these raving, evil psychopaths, and only the godly servants can keep us in check. And they peddle this shit to CHILDREN, brainwashing them into considering anyone that doesn't share their beliefs as evil, and beneath them, and deserving of any bad thing that happens to them. And they use that platform of self-declared moral superiority, to do horrible things in this world. And that's just the christian variety of religious bullshit, the passive aggressive, I'll quietly vote out your rights as a human, because my specific interpretation of the bible tells us this is what our god wants, though none of us can actually agree on what our god wants, to the point that their are several thousand iterations of christianity alone, who all have fundamentally different views on what their god wants, yet they all think they are right, and try and push their views on others.

So again, I'm perfectly happy to be nice to people individually, until they act like an asshole. I mean it's not like I wake up, stretch my arms, throw back my curtains and greet the day asking "ok, so how can I be an asshole to religious people today!?" jaunty whistle while I make my coffee. I don't do that. I DO however invariably look at various news sites, and see reports like the shit in France, which tends to sour my daily outlook.

You criticize me for being "angry", I think you aren't angry enough. Because they are more than happy to walk all over us and treat us like shit, to our face, and behind our backs, and in the halls of government. And we've been LETTING them get away with it, for decades, to the point where they are very close to turning the US into a theocracy on every level, not just pockets of it poking out here and there.

Well, looking back to your other post, you seem to be blaming the chill muslims he knows for not stopping not so chill muslims in other countries from laws about apostasy, is if their shared religion is going to give them political power in another country. And honestly, they probably don't have much power even if they did live over there, but assuming they don't since I'm assuming Buyetyen doesn't live in some Islamic theocracy. You say things like 'their countries' as if they somehow have more ownership over them. You're treating them all like a singular mass in the way you talk.

It's not as if I don't recognize the depths of what people get up to and the twisted ways of thinking they have, it's just that it's not all universal. And when it comes to this kind of thing, I really don't think it's all universal among them. Like those movies, pretty sure a lot of people wouldn't even know those shitty Christian movies exist. And when it comes to Muslims, they're probably as indifferent to the day to day lives of foreign Islamic countries as most other people in their countries are, unless they have some kind of connection via family. Plenty of people live passively with entirely ordinary lives, probably not even thinking too much of their religion most of the time, but the way you talk you'd think they're all frothing at the mouth ready to get us.

It's entirely fair to be angry, I think the issue is it sounds like your anger is just in a general direction lumping all the evils of religion together and sort of aimed at many not responsible for them.

 

[Trunkage]

Well, looking back to your other post, you seem to be blaming the chill muslims he knows for not stopping not so chill muslims in other countries from laws about apostasy, is if their shared religion is going to give them political power in another country. And honestly, they probably don't have much power even if they did live over there, but assuming they don't since I'm assuming Buyetyen doesn't live in some Islamic theocracy. You say things like 'their countries' as if they somehow have more ownership over them. You're treating them all like a singular mass in the way you talk.

It's not as if I don't recognize the depths of what people get up to and the twisted ways of thinking they have, it's just that it's not all universal. And when it comes to this kind of thing, I really don't think it's all universal among them. Like those movies, pretty sure a lot of people wouldn't even know those shitty Christian movies exist. And when it comes to Muslims, they're probably as indifferent to the day to day lives of foreign Islamic countries as most other people in their countries are, unless they have some kind of connection via family. Plenty of people live passively with entirely ordinary lives, probably not even thinking too much of their religion most of the time, but the way you talk you'd think they're all frothing at the mouth ready to get us.

It's entirely fair to be angry, I think the issue is it sounds like your anger is just in a general direction lumping all the evils of religion together and sort of aimed at many not responsible for them.

If I was a Christian, I wouldn’t want to be blamed for the actions of Christians like Reagan, Clinton, Bush x2, Obama and Trump. How many millions have those guys unjustly killed over ideology in the last 40 years

 

[Secondhand Revenant]

If I was a Christian, I wouldn’t want to be blamed for the actions of Christians like Reagan, Clinton, Bush x2, Obama and Trump. How many millions have those guys unjustly killed over ideology in the last 40 years

I mean, a lot of them do deserve to be blamed that lived through it and supported them and even some of their specific actions, but yeah, Christians are not all united in that support.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

This is absolutely ridiculous, there's no reason why both issues can't be addressed.

Yes.... that's my point. I'm proposing something ridiculous to show how ridiculous it is for Geth to use Whataboutism here.

 

[stroopwafel]

Read what I wrote. I never spoke about them being in the same league (and in fact explicitly pointed out that Daesh was more active). My post was about the radicalization process and how it is similar between Islamist Terrorism and Alt Right groups like Red Pillers and Neo-Nazis.

I wouldn't say it's the same at all. The glorification of violence, delusions of grandeur, organizational qualities and willingness to act and just the sheer global scale of the threat is much different than the incompetent rage of incels/red-pillers or whatever other fringe phenomena from mom's basement.

They really don't. Stop posting obvious and easily verifiable lies.

They do. They have subsidized muslim organizations, numerous subsidized committees to support integration and I don't know whatever else subsidized multicultural deliberation nonsense. Not to mention that most of this tax money disappears in a void they are also disproportionate nett receivers of welfare, subsidized housing and collective healthcare costs. In nanny states like Sweden or Holland there is particularly no excuse. But no, they still rather spit in the face of the country that gives them these opportunities and 'free' benefits to listen to the hate-filled speech of an imam with medieval beliefs from some Saudi sponsored mosque.

I'll tell that to my mother's cousin, who married (and later divorced) a muslim man. I'll also tell that to my friend who dated an Assyrian muslim girl for several years. Or to my old muslim co-worker who is currently living with a Swedish woman with no problems from his family. Once again, you need to stop posting obvious lies.

Lies? It's not exactly a secret that the vast majority of women who marry muslim men must convert to islam first. And don't give me that 'of their own free will' crap. It's just another example of that religion's absolutism. Assyrian might be an outlier since from what I understand they are such a minority that they had it pretty rough in Iraq as well.

What is a lie about the fact that muslims don't give up their anti-democratic beliefs when they live in European cities? Or the fact that this and their misplaced superiority complex might be one of the most important reasons for their failed integration?

So you didn't read my post about the average Daesh volunteer. A post that can be verified rather easily, mind you.

What does it matter? Their intent is still to destroy liberal democracy. It's also not like they are all sore losers. The 9/11 ringleader Mohammed Atta had like a PhD in urban planning or something.

Are you suggesting that it is muslims who are the driving factor behind Front National, Sverigedemokraterna and PVV? Because that conservatism hasn't come from a minority with very nominal political power, but from the rise of neo-conservative/neo-fascist parties that mainly market themselves as anti-immigration and Islamophobic.

Not really. It's the fault of the establishment that have allowed segregation of entire communities at the expense of poorer people that lived there and promoting unmitigated immigration. All the while calling these people 'racist' when they expressed their concern while the decision makers themselves live in their ivory towers. And yes it might have taken a worse turn now. You reap what you sow and all that.

 

[Crystal Violet]

I wouldn't say it's the same at all. The glorification of violence, delusions of grandeur, organizational qualities and willingness to act and just the sheer global scale of the threat is much different than the incompetent rage of incels/red-pillers or whatever other fringe phenomena from mom's basement.

But not the level-headed American soldiers who joined the American military to "kill rag-heads"? Quote famously used by American Navy Seal Christ Kyle and echoed by former US soldiers turned away from joining Kurdish rebels. I think the difference between ISIS and the US military is budget. The difference between Muslim extremists and right-wingers is melanin. I was a detective for French police and domestic terrorism was a big threat always downplayed.

They do. They have subsidized muslim organizations, numerous subsidized committees to support integration and I don't know whatever else subsidized multicultural deliberation nonsense.

You said " In European welfare states muslims are even getting preferential treatment with welfare checks, collective healthcare and plenty of opportunities with subsidized education and employment programs." This is not remotely comparable to integration programs which exist for immigrants everywhere in most countries and not just Muslims. They have been widely successful. My family from Hungary and Israel and friends from Pakistan have used them to learn French and enter the work force. You are deliberately or ignorantly confusing the welfare safety net with integration programs. Most of the research is from Germany where integration programs have been successful.

Not to mention that most of this tax money disappears in a void they are also disproportionate nett receivers of welfare, subsidized housing and collective healthcare costs.

Do you have evidence to support your unsubstantiated claim? Let me show you how that works:

Migrants to the UK claim less benefits than people born outside the UK. Did you see what I did there? I made a statement about foreigners and benefits and I linked to the research to support my claim. That's why that part is written in blue. It's a link. To the evidence. Which I have. Which you don't have. Because you are posting hateful lies.

I cannot take anything you say seriously if you keep failing to pass a fact-check with everything you say.

 

[stroopwafel]

But not the level-headed American soldiers who joined the American military to "kill rag-heads"? Quote famously used by American Navy Seal Christ Kyle and echoed by former US soldiers turned away from joining Kurdish rebels. I think the difference between ISIS and the US military is budget. The difference between Muslim extremists and right-wingers is melanin. I was a detective for French police and domestic terrorism was a big threat always downplayed.

Come on, most American service people aren't the equivalent of islamic terrorists. That is just bogus. From what I understand many to most choose it as a career because they lack other prospects and because it pays for college or a way out of some hilbilly town. Even that is probably a dying breed now with high-tech, specialized militaries.

You said " In European welfare states muslims are even getting preferential treatment with welfare checks, collective healthcare and plenty of opportunities with subsidized education and employment programs." This is not remotely comparable to integration programs which exist for immigrants everywhere in most countries and not just Muslims. They have been widely successful. My family from Hungary and Israel and friends from Pakistan have used them to learn French and enter the work force. You are deliberately or ignorantly confusing the welfare safety net with integration programs. Most of the research is from Germany where integration programs have been successful.

Well no, I made a clear distinction and you are conflating the issue. It was in response to how it's the fault of European society that young muslim men radicalize of which I just listed the many benefits and privileges they receive. Paid for by, indeed, the taxpayers of that society.

Do you have evidence to support your unsubstantiated claim? Let me show you how that works:

Migrants to the UK claim less benefits than people born outside the UK. Did you see what I did there? I made a statement about foreigners and benefits and I linked to the research to support my claim. That's why that part is written in blue. It's a link. To the evidence. Which I have. Which you don't have. Because you are posting hateful lies.

I cannot take anything you say seriously if you keep failing to pass a fact-check with everything you say.

Yeah, 'non-E.U. citizens'. I think it's pretty obvious we were talking about people with a European passport here. Otherwise it wouldn't even be a problem in the first place.

 

[Crystal Violet]

Come on, most American service people aren't the equivalent of islamic terrorists. That is just bogus. From what I understand many to most choose it as a career because they lack other prospects and because it pays for college or a way out of some hilbilly town. Even that is probably a dying breed now with high-tech, specialized militaries.

No. But most Muslim soldiers are fighting against ISIS. I am pointing out that young men are easy to radicalise if you can show them they can be a hero.

Well no, I made a clear distinction and you are conflating the issue.

No, I did not. I contradicted each of your points one by one with evidence. Integration programs do not specifically target Muslims but they do save the taxpayer money when used properly. I then explained that you are wrong about welfare claimants. I as well showed you evidence that white people are given preferential treatment over Muslims in job applications. You have not addressed any of these points with evidence. You shifted the goal posts, ignored or doubled down without any evidence to your claims. If you make claims like this you must be prepared to back them up or else you will look hateful, ignorant and arrogant.

It was in response to how it's the fault of European society that young muslim men radicalize of which I just listed the many benefits and privileges they receive. Paid for by, indeed, the taxpayers of that society.

Still waiting for that evidence to corroborate you.

Yeah, 'non-E.U. citizens'. I think it's pretty obvious we were talking about people with a European passport here. Otherwise it wouldn't even be a problem in the first place.

Was it? Or are you shifting the goal posts because your claim did not survive a fact check? Or were you talking about Muslim EU countries like Romania and Canada? It is hard to tell because I have not been able to find the answer in any of the evidence you posted.

Edited for clarifications

 

[Terminal Blue]

I wouldn't say it's the same at all. The glorification of violence, delusions of grandeur, organizational qualities and willingness to act and just the sheer global scale of the threat is much different than the incompetent rage of incels/red-pillers or whatever other fringe phenomena from mom's basement.

Go to the wikipedia incel page and scroll down to the section on "violence". Here. I'll link it for you to make it really easy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incel

Dismissing incels as incompetent losers in their mother's basements is both concretely wrong, and misundertands the problem.

Incels and other lone self-radicalized far right killers who end up carrying out attacks often plan and prepare for those attacks extensively. Many have an interest in guns, law enforcement and the military, and have received training or opportunities to practice shooting. They are incredibly committed, and often kill themselves or incite others to do so as part of the attacks because they know by doing so they will become martyrs to the online communities which shape their values.

Additionally, what this list will make very clear is that incel violence is part of a broader milieu of far right extremism. Incels often have other far right views, particularly white supremacy and a hatred of racial and sexual minorities, as well as more general misogyny and anti-feminism. There's a significant overlap between incel killers and other spree killers, who all tend to have similar politics and overlapping communities.

Incels and other lone far-right spree killers are always presumed to be motivated by personal issues, or by mental health problems. Their politics, even when very clear, are often downplayed or dismissed as mere symptoms of their personal maladjustment. Islamists, on the other hand, are seen as having entirely political and religious motivation. They are typically presented as "normal" Muslims, when in reality they are typically people who have failed to integrate in mainstream Muslim communities.

In reality, both groups tend to fit a very similar profile. That's why you have so many Islamists whose families and social contacts later claim they didn't even know they were religious. It's why you have people like Amedy Coulibaly, who dealt drugs and never attended Islamic prayer, or Omar Mateen, who didn't seem to know the difference between Islamic State and Hezbollah, despite the fact one is Sunni and the other is Shia and they were currently at war at the time.

Islamists and incels tend to be young men who are not happy with their lives, who often have pre-existing mental health and behavioural problems or other issues in their lives, and who have an incredible rage at a society they see as having failed them. That's why they are drawn to beliefs that prey upon and vindicate their personal sense of isolation and anger at the world. While there are differences, Islamists often have far more deliberate and coherent radicalization networks for example, the process is ultimately very similar.

 

[Houseman]

Incels and other lone self-radicalized far right killers who end up carrying out attacks often plan and prepare for those attacks extensively.

Someone really needs to come up with a new word that more accurately describes this, instead of just a shortening of "involuntarily celibate".

 

[stroopwafel]

Go to the wikipedia incel page and scroll down to the section on "violence". Here. I'll link it for you to make it really easy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incel

Dismissing incels as incompetent losers in their mother's basements is both concretely wrong, and misundertands the problem.

Incels and other lone self-radicalized far right killers who end up carrying out attacks often plan and prepare for those attacks extensively. Many have an interest in guns, law enforcement and the military, and have received training or opportunities to practice shooting. They are incredibly committed, and often kill themselves or incite others to do so as part of the attacks because they know by doing so they will become martyrs to the online communities which shape their values.

Additionally, what this list will make very clear is that incel violence is part of a broader milieu of far right extremism. Incels often have other far right views, particularly white supremacy and a hatred of racial and sexual minorities, as well as more general misogyny and anti-feminism. There's a significant overlap between incel killers and other spree killers, who all tend to have similar politics and overlapping communities.

Incels and other lone far-right spree killers are always presumed to be motivated by personal issues, or by mental health problems. Their politics, even when very clear, are often downplayed or dismissed as mere symptoms of their personal maladjustment. Islamists, on the other hand, are seen as having entirely political and religious motivation. They are typically presented as "normal" Muslims, when in reality they are typically people who have failed to integrate in mainstream Muslim communities.

In reality, both groups tend to fit a very similar profile. That's why you have so many Islamists whose families and social contacts later claim they didn't even know they were religious. It's why you have people like Amedy Coulibaly, who dealt drugs and never attended Islamic prayer, or Omar Mateen, who didn't seem to know the difference between Islamic State and Hezbollah, despite the fact one is Sunni and the other is Shia and they were currently at war at the time.

Islamists and incels tend to be young men who are not happy with their lives, who often have pre-existing mental health and behavioural problems or other issues in their lives, and who have an incredible rage at a society they see as having failed them. That's why they are drawn to beliefs that prey upon and vindicate their personal sense of isolation and anger at the world. While there are differences, Islamists often have far more deliberate and coherent radicalization networks for example, the process is ultimately very similar.

There have always been unhappy people that lash out for whatever reason but to put it in the same league as islamic terrorism is just ridiculous. It's a global threat that toppled entire states. Yeah. really comparable to an angry moron who can't get in a girl's panties and writes angry rants about it on 4chan.

 

[Iron]

Someone really needs to come up with a new word that more accurately describes this, instead of just a shortening of "involuntarily celibate".

This was hijacked from the original founder, a female girl.

The woman who founded the 'incel' movement

When Alana started a website for lonely people struggling to find love, she had no idea where it would lead.

www.bbc.com

 

[Dreiko]

I don't get what incels have to do with the islamists. Aren't they supposed to be people who can't get dates and are salty about being short and stuff?

I mean, I'm sure a few of them have done some crimes like people of any group but I'd imagine that's just a numbers game where out of any group you'll get a few nutjobs which use whatever excuses their group membership affords them to justify their crimes.

Islamists fundamentally believe in lording over other religions and countries. Incels believe in...I dunno...thots being unfair to them? Fundamentally I think their fault is letting themselves be defined by this one aspect of themselves. You can be unfuckable but you don't have to let it run your life and turn you into a bitter weirdo. Incels put women on a pedestal and let them run their emotional health a lot more than male feminists do, which is hilariously ironic.


One also translates into violence a loooot easier than the other does.

 

[Crystal Violet]

-snip-

I'm amazed that your comment could so thoroughly fail to comprehend the point that was iterated in about half the posts that became before and still manage to be more amazingly stupid with the rest of what you said. Bravo.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Aren't they supposed to be people who can't get dates and are salty about being short and stuff?

No? Terminal Blue did post a wiki link a few posts up.

In any case, while the term "Incel" may have started out as short for "Involuntary Celibate", that's like PETA meaning People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. Incels are a specific subculture, with a hate fueled ideology, not just men who can't get a date.