A Formal Thread about Activision/Blizzard

Dirty Hipsters

This is how we praise the sun!
Legacy
Apr 18, 2020
6,994
1,153
118
Country
'Merica
Gender
3 children in a trench coat
And I already know most of that is bull crap and a rarity when they genuinely don't know.. Pat and Woolie pretty much debunked this in their video. They know what's going on, they just choose to be selectively oblivious or ignore it. Or make excuses or make the victim sign this type of fancy form, so they can get away with it or to people above/below can get away with it in their favor. And even if they truly didn't know, it's still a failure on their part. A huge failure. They're not getting my sympathy either way.
I wouldn't put too much stock into what Pat and Woolie said on the topic. Pat especially is talking out of his ass considering he's never worked in the video game industry and hasn't even worked an office job previously. The only job he's had was at a grocery store, so forgive me for not taking anything he says seriously about how HR works at companies he's never been at.

The only "debunking" I heard from them was their claim that HR could totally see everything that was happening because they've seen how video game companies are set up, and everyone's together in an open floor plan where you can see everyone. While that is how some game and tech companies are set up (usually smaller ones), this is not how Blizzard is set up.

Blizzard has a campus of something like 30 different buildings. Each team/function essentially has their own building. Things like HR, studio leadership, etc. aren't interspersed between all of the teams in each building watching everyone at all times. It's about as far from an open floor plan as you can get.

Frances Townsend also doesn't work at Blizzard, she works at Activision HQ in Santa Monica, some 60 miles away in another city in another county (and I don't think Bobby Kotick ever comes into any of the offices, Billionaires tend to work from whatever they feel like working). So it is very likely that she is telling the truth that she never saw any of the harassment. I would even be willing to believe that the majority of people working at Blizzard never personally saw the harassment. The leadership (especially at Activision) would be entirely reliant on information like this being passed along with the bottom, and if it wasn't then they really wouldn't be aware of it. In part this is by design in that it allows those at the top to be "ignorant" of issues they don't want to know about without having to lie about it.

There's really 2 issues though.

The first issue is the harassment itself. It almost certainly did happen, and probably exactly as is being alleged. It was also likely covered up by certain people in the company with the power to cover this up. The question is whether it was lower level middle managers in HR, or whether it was actually the studio leadership team at Blizzard.

The second issue is Activision's response. It's an understandable response, given that they are defending themselves from a lawsuit, and it's very difficult to defend yourself from a lawsuit if you publicly admit fault. Regardless of that, their response was terrible and embarrassing, and made them sound completely out of touch with their employees. If they really wanted to get ahead of this what they really should have done is said they're aware of the past allegations, they investigated them, they fired the specific people who were involved, and they're working ensure that something like this doesn't happen again, and they'll show evidence of their efforts during the lawsuit. The blowback still would have been bad, but they wouldn't have lost as much face if they had just showed that they were actually doing something about it.
 

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,714
2,901
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
I wouldn't put too much stock into what Pat and Woolie said on the topic. Pat especially is talking out of his ass considering he's never worked in the video game industry and hasn't even worked an office job previously. The only job he's had was at a grocery store, so forgive me for not taking anything he says seriously about how HR works at companies he's never been at.
I don't put too much stock into them, either; Pat especially, but they are and were always on to something. They called out how much of creep David Cage was a decade ago, before any controversy could slip. That includes when all 4 of the best friends were together at the time mind you. They mentioned how there is more than one AAA, plenty of them, doing the sexual harassment/racism/rape at these companies. And yet you had naysayers being "offended". Claiming that the Best Friends were way off base, too harsh, or "talking out of their ass". Just because Pat did not work in the game industry, does not mean he should be completely written off. You got plenty of assholes that don't know shit about gaming and they're given high positions of authority and power that they happily abuse.

Either way someone knew something and tried to hide it. A big problem, and most of them ain't close to innocent. If some of them didn't genuinely know, I suggest they help and fix the fucking problem. Time to step up.
 
Last edited:

Samtemdo8

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 25, 2020
1,038
319
88
Country
Private

Honestly as great as Unions are ideally, they are not infallible.

I mean Unions can become as corrupt as any other organization or corporation
 
  • Like
Reactions: Specter Von Baren

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 26, 2020
6,043
1,706
118
Country
United Kingdom
Then you, like Jim Sterling, are just unreasonably angry at the wealth
I don't think there's anything unreasonable about anger directed towards the extreme concentration of wealth in the hands of a small number of unethical, oppressive assholes.

They do not justify the salary or bonuses to begin with. And so if they fail to even fulfil one of the important functions of their job (creating a safe working environment) that makes it even more egregious.

If you're the boss, the buck stops with you. That's part of being the boss.
 
Last edited:

Cheetodust

Elite Member
Jun 2, 2020
528
672
98
Country
Ireland
I don't think there's anything unreasonable about anger directed towards the extreme concentration of wealth in the hands of a small number of unethical, oppressive assholes.

They do not justify the salary or bonuses to begin with. And so if they fail to even fulfil one of the important functions of their job (creating a safe working environment) that makes it even more egregious.

If you're the boss, the buck stops with you. That's part of being the boss.
I mean I thought the reason they deserved so much money was because they worked so hard for it? But like when I worked in senior management for a chain of coffee shops I earned way less than Bobby Kotick and literally none of my employees were sexually harassed to death.

Once more with feeling, the only good billionaire is a dead one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Buyetyen

Hades

Elite Member
May 7, 2020
1,194
442
88
Country
The Netherlands
I stopped reading at this point because if you need to use that level of cliched armchair psychoanalysis, then you have no rebuttal to the substance of my point. Leaders take responsibility. Assholes don't.
Oh its very easy to spot that Sterling has developed a seething hatred for the ultra wealthy. Its just that we reached a point where this is completely reasonable. If they do things like force their employees to poop in bottles so they can afford their vanity space trip, or try to keep their stores open during a deadly pandemic without doing anything to protect their employees, or are named Bobby Kotick then that hatred quickly becomes justified.
 

Specter Von Baren

Annoying Green Gadfly
Legacy
May 4, 2020
3,170
794
118
I don't know, send help!
Country
USA
Gender
Cuttlefish
I wonder if its a coincidence that Riot does League of Legends, and Blizzard does Overwatch, both of them huge in the E-sports scene, and from the sounds of it both companies act like their big sports companies.
These are also two of the most open video-game companies I know of. They both have tried to be companies that communicate with their communities and keep a more relaxed environment in their offices.
I suspect that a consequence of this is going to be companies looking at this and having the takeaway that they should be as corporate and tight lipped as possible, making it even harder to deal with this kind of thing.
 

Hawki

Elite Member
Legacy
Apr 5, 2020
7,363
820
118
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
These are also two of the most open video-game companies I know of. They both have tried to be companies that communicate with their communities and keep a more relaxed environment in their offices.
I suspect that a consequence of this is going to be companies looking at this and having the takeaway that they should be as corporate and tight lipped as possible, making it even harder to deal with this kind of thing.
I've noticed that Blizzard's been a lot less open over the years though. Also a lot less generous. They've basically stopped doing free short stories, comics, and animations for instance. Probably in part due to Activision's penny pushing.

I can't comment on Riot, but Riot does seem to be intent on being the next Blizzard, at least in as much as cornering sections of the market. LoL dominates MOBAs. Valorant is arguably a competitor to Overwatch. And Riot's making its own MMO and ARPG - both genres that Blizzard has (or had) a firm grasp on until relatively recently.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dalisclock

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,714
2,901
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
Riot does seem to be intent on being the next Blizzard, at least in as much as cornering sections of the market. LoL dominates MOBAs. Valorant is arguably a competitor to Overwatch. And Riot's making its own MMO and ARPG - both genres that Blizzard has (or had) a firm grasp on until relatively recently.
Then they can have fun getting sued by the state of California (or whatever state their headquarters is at) for their evil actions as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dalisclock

SilentPony

Previously known as an alleged "Feather-Rustler"
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
10,749
1,151
118
Corner of No and Where
Then they can have fun getting sued by the state of California (or whatever state their headquarters is at) for their evil actions as well.
But as others have said, these lawsuits probably won't amount to anything. California is bringing lawsuits to a felony fight. They're huge multinational billion dollar companies with armies of lawyers, spin doctors, and legions of fans who honestly don't care. They'll pay some peanuts to shut a few victims up, everything will be sealed behind court documents, they'll admit to no fault, most of the more extreme allegations will be labeled as false/unprovable and people will move on.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Specter Von Baren

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,714
2,901
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
But as others have said, these lawsuits probably won't amount to anything.
In and your opinion. You can stop the whole "it'll be pointless or no matter what we do we're all screwed!" rhetoric. I'm getting bored and tired of it. You have fun believing whatever you want. Some type of changes definitely going to happen and it's not like people are going to forget about this next year or several years.

Giving up or saying how nothing changes is what they want you to do and think. They want that type of attitude. Don't give them an inch.
 

Specter Von Baren

Annoying Green Gadfly
Legacy
May 4, 2020
3,170
794
118
I don't know, send help!
Country
USA
Gender
Cuttlefish
In and your opinion. You can stop the whole "it'll be pointless or no matter what we do we're all screwed!" rhetoric. I'm getting bored and tired of it. You have fun believing whatever you want. Some type of changes definitely going to happen and it's not like people are going to forget about this next year or several years.

Giving up or saying how nothing changes is what they want you to do and think. They want that type of attitude. Don't give them an inch.
I don't think Silent is meaning to be "Well whatever, nothing will come of it so why bother." Just that these measures, this situation, and these circumstances won't lead to much. It doesn't mean that nothing can or should be done.
 

BrawlMan

Lover of beat'em ups.
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
9,714
2,901
118
Detroit, Michigan
Country
United States of America
Gender
Male
Just that these measures, this situation, and these circumstances won't lead to much.
I know exactly what he said. It is how and the way he said it, that it might as well been the same difference. That type of thinking is just giving more ammunition to those assholes.