Actual City of Juarez Wants Videogame Juarez Banned

[Wintermoot]

"It is true there is a serious crime situation, which we are not trying to hide," said Congressman Ricardo Boone Salmon. "But we also should not expose children to this kind of scenarios so that they are going to grow up with this kind of image and lack of values."

he doesnt bother covering it up so what,s the point of banning the game showing it?
also kids arent supposed to play this! its a game about crime!

 

[PrototypeC]

Maybe it's the lack of sleep talking, but I think this one might be justified in that we gain no thought-provoking new vision of this city's pain, we gain an alright West-themed shooter. I don't mean to insult the people who worked hard on this project, but it seems to me that this particular game isn't worth having a cow over were it to be lost to... um... were it not to be played nearly as much due to this.

This is a sensitive situation in a real place, and the game itself isn't something I'd throw myself in front of a bullet towards. It's nothing special, except in the offending people department. I'd like to know if someone out there has really been waiting on the edge of their seat for this game, really.

 

[JakobBloch]

Hmm I don't know where to begin honestly. Let us start with free speech.

Freedom of speech and fredom of expression is rooted in a the freedom of thought. You are allowed to think and believe whatever you want. Freedom of spech allows you to expound on those beliefs to others. I believe that there should be certain restrictions on free speech but that is a matter of delivery and not content.

As a firm believer in free speech I believe that speech is good. Getting ideas out there is a good thing. No matter how silly or untutored the ideas are. That is called discourse. When all the ideas are out there it is for people themselves to pick what ideas they are going to follow or even make up their own ideas. This is at the heart of a free and tolerant society. With the free flow of speech/information comes enlightenment and the ability to accept that other people have other world views.

Restricting free speech for ANY reason is the act of putting down a segment of the population. Be the reason, war, patriotism, religion, the kids ro anything else lessens the good you get from free speech.

Right that was a little long winded but lets move on.

Now lets move on to propaganda. I read a comment that raised the issue of anti-american propaganda. I have news for you. All information is propaganda. Indoctrination is not something only cults and sinister governements are into. Every school you have ever been in, every news story you ever read or saw, every book you read had propaganda in it. They were all indoctrinating you to feel a certain way. Saying that the goverment should ban certain ideas is gonna stunt the growth of the population as a whole. If the idea of plurality is firmly enough imbedded no man will lose his freedom as a result of propaganda (except the propaganda that made him believe in pluralism).

Now on to the issues of decency and "it-is-to-early". I believe in the thought that a certain amount of time has to pass before you can laugh at a catastrophy or great tragedy. However if there is an ongoing tragedy, the media don't just have the ability but the responsibility to bring attention to it. Call of Juarez: The Cartel does this. I live in a comfortable little country safely nestled in the middle of europe. Great distress for me is when my feet get wet when I walk in a puddle. I never heard of Juarez. I didn't know that there were rampant violence and lawlessness there. This controversy informed me of this. I am certain I am not alone and with a little luck maybe the information will spread. Perhaps people will discover that at the root of this problem is: Drugs. Drugs are what gives the Cartels their funding and there by their power. Cut off the funding and their power will dry up. So... don't do drugs kids.

Everyone is running around declaiming the harm this game will do. Granted the marketing of the game was a blunder. But we still cannot know what the story is about. Maybe you tobble o great cartel. In that case I would love for the people of Juarez to get their hands on it. Give them a moment empowerment in a hopeless situation. Maybe the game, that everyone insist gloryfies the gang lifestyle, shows the stark horror of the lifestyle. Maybe we should put off the absolute certainty that people seem to have on what the game is going to be about.

As for the "too early" bit. It is never too early to inform people of atrocities. If an atrocity is being commited the history books are too late. If you want to raise awareness you need to go bigger then local news show or even a national news show. You need to entertain at the same time. And in comes the movies, the books and the video games (music too a suppose though I am not much of a consumer of music so I often forget about it). Ubisoft and Techland used video games because that is their expertise.

Being silent because of decency when atrocities happen is like ignoring a problem. Silence is often construed as a ascent. So asking ubisoft to not release the game and asking the government to ban the game sounds to me like they don't want people to know. They don't want face the truth of the circumstances. I have this feeling that people don't want to know either. They don't want to know that their lives are being threatened or that their entertainments (as in drugs) are ruining the lives of others. People don't want to know that when they go and buy their "8-ball", it is all covered in the blood of the innocent and guilty alike. I may be giving ubisoft too much credit but I would rather give them the benefit of the doubt, rather then be convinced they are willfully profitering on the grief of others.

Well I am waxing poetic here so it is probably time to sign off. So to summerize: Getting information out there is a good thing even if people feel uncomfortable about it. Don't assume you know what a story is about by seing the boxart. Don't be ruled by fear. Accept that there are other ideas then your own (you are allowed to think they are inferior to your own).

 

[Random berk]

Maybe it's the lack of sleep talking, but I think this one might be justified in that we gain no thought-provoking new vision of this city's pain, we gain [bold]an alright West-themed shooter.[/bold] I don't mean to insult the people who worked hard on this project, but it seems to me that this particular game isn't worth having a cow over were it to be lost to... um... were it not to be played nearly as much due to this.

This is a sensitive situation in a real place, and the game itself isn't something I'd throw myself in front of a bullet towards. It's nothing special, except in the offending people department. I'd like to know if someone out there has really been waiting on the edge of their seat for this game, really.

To be honest I wouldn't even call it that. If I'm playing a Western themed game, I'd want it to be based on the actual old West,as in

The modern Cartel deserve no glorification, whether it'll affect people in Juarez or not.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

All I am gonna say is children shouldn't be playing that game anywhere in the first place.

 

[Yokai]

As knee-jerk reactive bans go, this one actually seems pretty reasonable. Sure, the game itself would have little effect on the disposition of the people in Juarez, but it would be in very poor taste. I'd say it's a prudent choice until things calm down there.

 

[RA92]

Who is on board of a 9-11 game? I mean, think about it. We could make it real cool, tell a real high octane story of survival and overall badassery, all from the passengers' viewpoint. Throw in some cool stealthy and shooting mechanics and you can have the videogame version of the first half of passenger 57.

You can retake the plane and feel the thrills of saving everyone onboard, changing the course of American history...forever!

How about that? I mean, this is the exact same kind of thing. If you agree with that game seeing the light of day (Call of Juarez) then you should agree with this game (9-11: Redux). At least for the sake of consistency.

I like censorship as much as I like this game, as I do admit it is pushing a rather sore spot, but whatever, have it your way guys, I do understand that you don't care, that you don't have to care, and that you are entitled not to care (no sarcasm here, honest). But let's all agree then that a 9-11 video game could be cool 'cause I'm starting to get some nifty ideas.

I'm a little confused. I couldn't find the plot of the game - is it about joining the cartel or taking it down? Would you by any chance have a link? Ubisoft's site was rather vague.

 

[Michael826]

I actually totally understand where they are coming from. This is not an attack on gaming as form of entertainment, it's just one of those things that strikes just a little too close to home. Seriously, 6000 in the last 2 years? You have to draw the line somewhere. No, that's not the game makers fault, but they shouldn't have to be subject to this game if they feel insecure about it.

 

[googleback]

the city is a fucking warzone right now. while I'm not sure what I think of this game (not because of the subject, simply because Ubisoft have no idea how to craft a good story)
I'm sure a game set in their city depicting the violence that they see everyday will be something they're interested in. although they may appreciate blasting the bad guys.

 

[Voltano]

I'm just speculating here, but I think this is the current version of "Bully" back on the previous consoles. A lot of people thought that would encourage children to commit violence in schools, which is just as much of a societal concern today as the violence in Mexico/parts of Texas. However "Bully" was a game pointing out (in a satirical way) what violence from bullies in schools could lead to and how it should be stopped. If one moral lesson could be learned from "Bully", its that violence in schools is not a good thing. To me, that is the total opposite of what people feared "Bully" would teach to their children.

From what I heard the story of this game hasn't been released yet and most of this negative press is just based upon the title alone. I'm guessing the protagonists in this game are mercenaries/eccentric police officers that go to extreme lengths to stop the violence in the town, kind of like "Dead to Rights." Yet I can also see the suspicions people in Mexico may have with this game, but I don't agree that censorship is the only option for something that is offensive.

 

[GeorgW]

Who is on board of a 9-11 game? I mean, think about it. We could make it real cool, tell a real high octane story of survival and overall badassery, all from the passengers' viewpoint. Throw in some cool stealthy and shooting mechanics and you can have the videogame version of the first half of passenger 57.

You can retake the plane and feel the thrills of saving everyone onboard, changing the course of American history...forever!

How about that? I mean, this is the exact same kind of thing. If you agree with that game seeing the light of day (Call of Juarez) then you should agree with this game (9-11: Redux). At least for the sake of consistency.

I like censorship as much as I like this game, as I do admit it is pushing a rather sore spot, but whatever, have it your way guys, I do understand that you don't care, that you don't have to care, and that you are entitled not to care (no sarcasm here, honest). But let's all agree then that a 9-11 video game could be cool 'cause I'm starting to get some nifty ideas.

Thing is, I would totally play a 9/11 game, just like I have watched a 9/11 movie. I mean, why not? Why should we all just ignore a significant historical and cultural event that has had repercussions that affects us every day, just cuz it was sad? Do you think they hid the Berlin wall? No, they made museums, they drew on what's left. They didn't hide the truth, they accepted, learned and profited from it.

I know this is in no way the same thing, this is an ongoing conflict, and is therefore different. Maybe this game shouldn't be released in Mexico? Mexicans can always import it. It's not that hard, it's just that kids can't.

 

[fulano]

Who is on board of a 9-11 game? I mean, think about it. We could make it real cool, tell a real high octane story of survival and overall badassery, all from the passengers' viewpoint. Throw in some cool stealthy and shooting mechanics and you can have the videogame version of the first half of passenger 57.

You can retake the plane and feel the thrills of saving everyone onboard, changing the course of American history...forever!

How about that? I mean, this is the exact same kind of thing. If you agree with that game seeing the light of day (Call of Juarez) then you should agree with this game (9-11: Redux). At least for the sake of consistency.

I like censorship as much as I like this game, as I do admit it is pushing a rather sore spot, but whatever, have it your way guys, I do understand that you don't care, that you don't have to care, and that you are entitled not to care (no sarcasm here, honest). But let's all agree then that a 9-11 video game could be cool 'cause I'm starting to get some nifty ideas.

I'm a little confused. I couldn't find the plot of the game - is it about joining the cartel or taking it down? Would you by any chance have a link? Ubisoft's site was rather vague.

I believe the plot is about kicking Cartel butt Wild West style, which is what I gather from the website and the absolutely horrid box art. Not exactly hinting at a thoughtful exploration of human nature. It's no less shitty than my proposed 9-11: Redux video game.

If a developer like Bioware had its name plastered on it then I'd hold my oppinion until after I saw the game, but this is just anotehr case of a publisher and a developer making a fun game that sells wads of cash and nothing more. You have to be careful with the source material, especially when it is as sensitive as it is, and that does not happen everyday with shooter. Now, add to that the fact that Call of Juarez franchise is no Half Life 2.

If they want to make a good, fun game, lots of us wouldn't be bothered. But as I said before: they are entitled to not care.

It sucks, but at least one can complain.

 

[fulano]

Who is on board of a 9-11 game? I mean, think about it. We could make it real cool, tell a real high octane story of survival and overall badassery, all from the passengers' viewpoint. Throw in some cool stealthy and shooting mechanics and you can have the videogame version of the first half of passenger 57.

You can retake the plane and feel the thrills of saving everyone onboard, changing the course of American history...forever!

How about that? I mean, this is the exact same kind of thing. If you agree with that game seeing the light of day (Call of Juarez) then you should agree with this game (9-11: Redux). At least for the sake of consistency.

I like censorship as much as I like this game, as I do admit it is pushing a rather sore spot, but whatever, have it your way guys, I do understand that you don't care, that you don't have to care, and that you are entitled not to care (no sarcasm here, honest). But let's all agree then that a 9-11 video game could be cool 'cause I'm starting to get some nifty ideas.

Thing is, I would totally play a 9/11 game, just like I have watched a 9/11 movie. I mean, why not? Why should we all just ignore a significant historical and cultural event that has had repercussions that affects us every day, just cuz it was sad? Do you think they hid the Berlin wall? No, they made museums, they drew on what's left. They didn't hide the truth, they accepted, learned and profited from it.

I know this is in no way the same thing, this is an ongoing conflict, and is therefore different. Maybe this game shouldn't be released in Mexico? Mexicans can always import it. It's not that hard, it's just that kids can't.

That is not the issue. I would play a game set in the mess that is my country right now, not just Ciudad Juarez, and I'd do it right now...if it was done with care and actual seriousness. But that is not the case with Call of Juarez: The Cartel that is only being made to be fun escapism. It's way too soon to treat this thing for shits and giggles--or at least that's what I think. Give it some time, let people move on, and then you do whatever you want.

The people caught up in this thing are not soldiers as were the case for the Fallujah videogame, or the whole Taliban/Opposing Force deal. They didn't sign up for this thing as they are merely civillians. To treat this thing the way the guys at Ubisoft are doing is rather tasteless and disrespectful.

 

[WrcklessIntent]

Honestly I can see them justifying a ban in Juarez. I mean if a game came out called death to Americans I would want it banned to, atleast in America. If their not pushing for the game to be cancelled I see this as being fine.

Yeah, because not liking something means no one should be able to see it, right?

Did i say no one should see it? No. I'm just saying it's like hitting someone when they are down. The people of the city of Juarez knows that its shit and they don't want to play a game about it just reminding them. If Juarez bans the sale of it in Juarez I still see nothing wrong with it.

 

[The_Yeti]

this is rediculous, he may as well be saying ALL violent games should be banned.

It's different, you don't understand there are people dying every day over there and it's a truly horrible situation, and to make it worse the government is not really doing anything to stop this, there are people getting raped and murdered over there, I don't know if you understand but it's really horrible to make a crime game in real city where people are getting killed and raped, and the cartels have practically taken over the place, it's really quite offensive for those of us who live in Mexico.

Horrible situation, people getting raped, murdered, blah blah blah, its terrible, we get it, its a place, grab whatever food, water, and other provisions you do or do not have and gtfo, obviously if the place is so bloody terrible living as a hobo in a safer town is a step up, if they've got the time and connections to beg the government they should be begging for a competent militant force, or maybe the emo citizens could grow a pair and kill off the cartels alongside what small militant force exists?

The game is not going to do shit to change the place, except maybe get a bit more public attention, which if is truly their aim there is better ways to go about it then hassling game developers with or without bad taste. By this logic every third world civilization in the world + peta should burn Mario in effigy for stomping delicious edible turtles, while the rest of the world curses his name for being a shroom addict.

P.S. Citizens of Juarez, either Get out, Fight for your land, or Stop Bitching.
P.P.S. Cartels run on druggies, might as well kill those sobs off too and get the enablers at the root.

It's amazing how complete ignorance makes even the most difficult problems trivial.

Pffft, in the grand scheme of things, we humans are less then ants on a universal scale, everything is trivial. Ignorant be they who still believe human existence is important, granted its still interesting.

 

[messy]

I can half understand though, shit be crazy there. If there were people shooting each other in my town and someone made a game wwith my towns name about shooting people I wouldn't look on it charitably.

Yeah I can see that to. I mean I don't live there so I can't really comment on the situation, but they probably see it as others profiting from their misfortune as well. I mean I don't know exactly the situation (and really someone inform me if I'm wrong) but its bit like having a game based on knife crime in certain areas of London

 

[RA92]

I'm a little confused. I couldn't find the plot of the game - is it about joining the cartel or taking it down? Would you by any chance have a link? Ubisoft's site was rather vague.

I believe the plot is about kicking Cartel butt Wild West style, which is what I gather from the website and the absolutely horrid box art. Not exactly hinting at a thoughtful exploration of human nature. It's no less shitty than my proposed 9-11: Redux video game.

If a developer like Bioware had its name plastered on it then I'd hold my oppinion until after I saw the game, but this is just anotehr case of a publisher and a developer making a fun game that sells wads of cash and nothing more. You have to be careful with the source material, especially when it is as sensitive as it is, and that does not happen everyday with shooter. Now, add to that the fact that Call of Juarez franchise is no Half Life 2.

If they want to make a good, fun game, lots of us wouldn't be bothered. But as I said before: they are entitled to not care.

It sucks, but at least one can complain.

Ah. Thanks for the info.

But I'm going to reserve my judgement till I see a plot. The thing is, Juarez right now is in a terrible state. The other day I found out a chief of police of Praxedis G. Guerrero, near Ciudad Juárez and Guadalupe, had been tortured and beheaded by the cartel, and no one was willing to take up his post to fend off the cartel, except for...

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2010/10/22/1287740982147/Marisol-Valles-Garcia-pol-006.jpg

Marisol Valles Garcia, a twenty year old mother and student in Criminology. The best of my wishes to her.

It's that bad.

 

[Aisaku]

The Congressman's argument is the old faulty 'videogames desensitize children, videogames make children commit violent acts' that doesn't have a leg to stand on.


STILL, I agree that the game's purpose is questionable and if not banned, rethought. Look at this from Mexico's perspective. This is a game that glorifies a grim reality people throught the country face. In the past year drug cartel violence has escalated to an unprecedented level. Shootouts, criminals holding cities hostage, daily executions and worse. People don't want to have their nightmares turned into a game.

It's distasteful, exploitative and just wrong.

How do you know that it glorifies these things? That sir is an assumption.

Indeed, an assumption based on the tagline (experience the _lawlessness_ of the modern wild west), the character art (the characters certainly aren't cops), and Ubisoft's track record.

They're putting criminals up as player characters, someone you will control and help along their goals, thus painting the wrong side of the law the only one you can side with. GTA gets a pass because things are nowhere as bad as the game paints them. In Mexico, sadly they are _that_ bad, and that's why it rubs people the wrong way.

And yet, from your comments I see there is little that can be done to stop this. Not that the game itself could worsen things. Still it points out the apathy of the videogame circles towards world news.