At The Drive-In, Math Rock and Loops

[Kill the messenger721]

All right, three part thread this time. To begin the discussion, one the most immediate (and still to this day lauded) Post-Hardcore bands is At The Drive-In. Without rehashing to much, At The Drive were a band from Texas that begin to become more well known with their swan song "Relationship of Command". Critically and somewhat commercially successful, this album but the band in the public's eye, but only only long enough before they went on an "indefinite hiatus". The members have since split into the Mars Volta and Sparta (although since this time have Sparta has also gone on hiatus). Anyways, given all the turmoil and feelings before their untimely breakup, what do you think would've happened had At The Drive-In stayed together?

2. Math Rock (and similarly Post-Rock) is a genre that has since it's beginnings in the 80's has become one of the polarizing genres and at the very least, one of the seemingly most despised genre labels. While talented outfits are able to juggle technical complexity, artistic creativity and musicality, this is perhaps the most widely thought of pretentious. Although that is open to interpretation, what are your thoughts of the genre that is home to Tera Melos, Hella, Piglet, This Town Needs Guns and Slint?

3. What are the differences between this:


and this?:


Believe you me, you don't need to know where I stand on this, but your opinion is wanted; Do you think it's better to openly acknowledge when music is useful for atmosphere than over pretentiously reiterated whiny Rock/Metal masquerading as musical creativity?

 

[funguy2121]

I didn't enjoy either of those clips. Never heard much At the Drive-In but I do love The Mars Volta.

 

[impcnrd]

1. i didn't listen to to much At the Drive-In but initiation and relationship of command are good albums. never dug too deep into them.
2. Post-metal is really good. i haven't taken the time to listen to post rock though
3. video one is atmosphere and really long, video 2 is short and more for ambiance and shitty production

 

[LikeDustInTheWind]

I'm not 100% sure what this whole thread is about but here's some awesome math rock by a band called Giraffes? Giraffes!

 

[triggrhappy94]

I. FUCKING. LOVE. At the Drive In!
This Station is Non-Operational is one of the best albums on my ipod.
They could have become the Modest Mouse of Post Hardcore. (Popular with everyone but remain true to their roots and not selling out).
I think they were one song appearance in movie away, but I don't actually know a lot about them.

 

[CrashBang]

1. I'm not actually that accustomed to At The Drive In but I am a huge post-hardcore fan so that's my 2 cents. My favourite post-hardcore band is Funeral For A Friend and I also adore Alexisonfire, Fightstar, This City and Architects new album which is very much post-hardcore inspired but not as good as their astoundingly awesome Hollow Crown album
2. Again not too familiar with math rock, at first I thought you were referring to mathcore (bands such as Periphery, Meshuggah, Architects, Rolo Tomassi, Every Time I Die's earlier albums etc) and I'd just like to say that I fucking love mathcore
3. Um, I don't get what you're asking... they're different. Wait, are you being pretentious? If so, leave, if not, elaborate

 

[Kill the messenger721]

1. I'm not actually that accustomed to At The Drive In but I am a huge post-hardcore fan so that's my 2 cents. My favourite post-hardcore band is Funeral For A Friend and I also adore Alexisonfire, Fightstar, This City and Architects new album which is very much post-hardcore inspired but not as good as their astoundingly awesome Hollow Crown album
2. Again not too familiar with math rock, at first I thought you were referring to mathcore (bands such as Periphery, Meshuggah, Architects, Rolo Tomassi, Every Time I Die's earlier albums etc) and I'd just like to say that I fucking love mathcore
3. Um, I don't get what you're asking... they're different. Wait, are you being pretentious? If so, leave, if not, elaborate

I'm being slightly pretentious but on the basis that you can create a different song with the same basic ingredients. My friends band is on top, mine on bottom, although mine is really just a mood piece on tape. Having some Pretense is better than being completely reserved and chaste band. But be too indulgent and pretentious and you get Dream Theater.
Also, Rolo Tomassi is my posse!

 

[Kill the messenger721]

I'm not 100% sure what this whole thread is about but here's some awesome math rock by a band called Giraffes? Giraffes!

Dude, Giraffes? Giraffes! are still one of my favorite Math bands, behind older Tera Melos and Piglet. Thanks for bringing them up.

 

[Fwee]

When I bought Relationship of Command I didn't listen to anything else for eight months.
Love that band, love that album.
I'm actually working on a script for a musical using the album. Short description: Les Miserables meets Dark City in 1984 (the story setting, not the year). It'll probably never get anywhere past getting written though.
Mars Volta is great as well.

With any type of music there's going to be the shining examples hopefully bobbing on the surface of a sea turds. Personally I enjoy Hella, Meshuggah, and to a slightly lesser Math Rock extent Marnie Stern.

 

[Kill the messenger721]

When I bought Relationship of Command I didn't listen to anything else for eight months.
Love that band, love that album.
I'm actually working on a script for a musical using the album. Short description: Les Miserables meets Dark City in 1984 (the story setting, not the year). It'll probably never get anywhere past getting written though.
Mars Volta is great as well.

With any type of music there's going to be the shining examples hopefully bobbing on the surface of a sea turds. Personally I enjoy Hella, Meshuggah, and to a slightly lesser Math Rock extent Marnie Stern.

I would see that musical, for sure. Like the bands you mentioned but Marnie hurts my ears.

 

[CrashBang]

I'm being slightly pretentious but on the basis that you can create a different song with the same basic ingredients. My friends band is on top, mine on bottom, although mine is really just a mood piece on tape. Having some Pretense is better than being completely reserved and chaste band. But be too indulgent and pretentious and you get Dream Theater.
Also, Rolo Tomassi is my posse!

Wait, are you saying you know Rolo Tomassi or you just fuckin' love them? If you know them, I'm gonna kiss your ass a little bit
And Dream Theatre are fantastically awesomely epic and they deserve to be aware of that fact!

 

[Fwee]

When I bought Relationship of Command I didn't listen to anything else for eight months.
Love that band, love that album.
I'm actually working on a script for a musical using the album. Short description: Les Miserables meets Dark City in 1984 (the story setting, not the year). It'll probably never get anywhere past getting written though.
Mars Volta is great as well.

With any type of music there's going to be the shining examples hopefully bobbing on the surface of a sea turds. Personally I enjoy Hella, Meshuggah, and to a slightly lesser Math Rock extent Marnie Stern.

I would see that musical, for sure. Like the bands you mentioned but Marnie hurts my ears.

I can see how that could happen. I got hooked on the song Every Single Line Means Something while playing Saints Row 2.

 

[nohorsetown]

At The Drive-In was a huge deal for me growing up, and influenced my own music quite a bit. Vaya is a frickin' awesome EP.. their best work, IMO (except that backwards-talky "300Mhz" song). In-Casino-Out and El Gran Orgo are also very cool. Relationship of Command is too relentless and produced for my taste, but there are some good songs on it.

If they had stayed together? I can't really imagine that happening, since there were some pretty polarizing differences. Parts of Relationship of Command sound like a natural transition to The Mars Volta's first EP, to me. I think Cedric and Omar were getting more and more creative and spastic, and Jim Ward probably couldn't keep up / wanted to "let it mellow" / go in a more mainstream "Emo" direction (which resulted in Sparta.. some pretty boring stuff IMO). I guess if they had stayed together, the 'fro-duo would probably have dominated everything and pushed the other members to the sidelines.. Cedric would have continued to berate and abuse the boring-white-2nd-guitar-guy.. yeah, I just can't see it happening. Maybe they could have cranked out one or two more albums before the inevitable split. Sounds like a waste, to me.

2. I like (some) math rock. Sure, it gets pretentious, but that's fine with me as long as it's interesting. I usually listen to music "actively", and I don't go for background/head-nodding/soundtrack-of-my-life kinda stuff. ATDI's/Mars Volta's pretentious lyrics are weird puzzles that I play around with. Dream Theater's pretentious lyrics are boring "universal" thematic crap (my opinion!). Mars Volta's pretentious music is crazy and creative. Dream Theater is just a buncha standard wank, to me. Oh yeah, and let's not forget Rush, considered by many to be the progenitors of math rock.. yeah, they're standard wank, too.

3. I can't listen to those clips right now, so I'll have to skip part 3. Sorry.

I haven't kept up with math rock in almost ten years, so I'm sure most of you know a hella (har har) lot more than me on the subject. I just popped in cuz' I saw At The Drive-In in the thread title. My favorite math rock (or at least, with elements of math rock) band is probably Deerhoof. Lots of creativity, not a lot of wank.

 

[Kill the messenger721]

I'm being slightly pretentious but on the basis that you can create a different song with the same basic ingredients. My friends band is on top, mine on bottom, although mine is really just a mood piece on tape. Having some Pretense is better than being completely reserved and chaste band. But be too indulgent and pretentious and you get Dream Theater.
Also, Rolo Tomassi is my posse!

Wait, are you saying you know Rolo Tomassi or you just fuckin' love them? If you know them, I'm gonna kiss your ass a little bit
And Dream Theatre are fantastically awesomely epic and they deserve to be aware of that fact!

I like Rolo Tomassi and Dream Theater are the biggest proponents of indulgence (Read: 40 minute songs that lose steam in the first 10). They are epic; just epically boring.

 

[Kill the messenger721]

At The Drive-In was a huge deal for me growing up, and influenced my own music quite a bit. Vaya is a frickin' awesome EP.. their best work, IMO (except that backwards-talky "300Mhz" song). In-Casino-Out and El Gran Orgo are also very cool. Relationship of Command is too relentless and produced for my taste, but there are some good songs on it.

If they had stayed together? I can't really imagine that happening, since there were some pretty polarizing differences. Parts of Relationship of Command sound like a natural transition to The Mars Volta's first EP, to me. I think Cedric and Omar were getting more and more creative and spastic, and Jim Ward probably couldn't keep up / wanted to "let it mellow" / go in a more mainstream "Emo" direction (which resulted in Sparta.. some pretty boring stuff IMO). I guess if they had stayed together, the 'fro-duo would probably have dominated everything and pushed the other members to the sidelines.. Cedric would have continued to berate and abuse the boring-white-2nd-guitar-guy.. yeah, I just can't see it happening. Maybe they could have cranked out one or two more albums before the inevitable split. Sounds like a waste, to me.

2. I like (some) math rock. Sure, it gets pretentious, but that's fine with me as long as it's interesting. I usually listen to music "actively", and I don't go for background/head-nodding/soundtrack-of-my-life kinda stuff. ATDI's/Mars Volta's pretentious lyrics are weird puzzles that I play around with. Dream Theater's pretentious lyrics are boring "universal" thematic crap (my opinion!). Mars Volta's pretentious music is crazy and creative. Dream Theater is just a buncha standard wank, to me. Oh yeah, and let's not forget Rush, considered by many to be the progenitors of math rock.. yeah, they're standard wank, too.

3. I can't listen to those clips right now, so I'll have to skip part 3. Sorry.

I haven't kept up with math rock in almost ten years, so I'm sure most of you know a hella (har har) lot more than me on the subject. I just popped in cuz' I saw At The Drive-In in the thread title. My favorite math rock (or at least, with elements of math rock) band is probably Deerhoof. Lots of creativity, not a lot of wank.

I definitely see what you mean about ATDI. I've always thought if they stayed together, the two main forces of the band( Cedric/Omar and Jim ) would've just caused a later dissolution, even if they were able to stay together. I also agree with your stance on Math Rock. It was never my strong suit but when implemented well, is good. As for the 2 videos, they aren't really worth watching. Thanks for the input.

 

[LikeDustInTheWind]

I'm not 100% sure what this whole thread is about but here's some awesome math rock by a band called Giraffes? Giraffes!

Dude, Giraffes? Giraffes! are still one of my favorite Math bands, behind older Tera Melos and Piglet. Thanks for bringing them up.

Someone who knows them that isn't me! Awesome!