Bioware blocks user from playing his store-bought copy of DA2, for bad-mouthing EA?

lowkey_jotunn

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Feb 23, 2011
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A few quick points:

-Freedom of Speech: irrelevant. The First Amendment only prevents the government from taking action against you. As far as I know, this guy wasn't thrown in jail, so there's no problem on that front. Plus, isn't he Euro?

-Thieves!! Not really. If tomorrow, every gas station in the world disappeared, that doesn't mean someone stole your car. You still own it, it's still yours. The fact that you can no longer use your car is a bummer, but not theft. He bought a couple CDs/DVDs ... and some paperwork to go along with it. He still owns those.

-Superban of justice!! Not a chance, you don't need to log in to play the games, once you've authenticated them. If I can unplug my computer from the interwebs and still play, I think he's fine, and just exaggerating.

-Plus, we have no idea if this is the fist offense. What if he's posted worse things a dozen times in the past and received warnings? Maybe he has been forum-banned before, and was finally told "last chance, play nice or you're cut off" and this is the result. Of course he wouldn't mention all the other stuff, and he or the devs probably deleted all that other garbage already.

-Contrary to what some people might think, companies like EA and Bioware aren't run by idiots. They didn't get to where they are today (very successful businesses) by throwing darts at the wall or better yet, throwing darts at their feet. They know what their doing.

-He'll be back. It's a 72 hour ban. Maybe he can go outside and meet a girl or something.
 

Torrasque

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RedEyesBlackGamer said:
If this is true I have officially lost the last bit of respect I had for Bioware.
^ this.
If he just said "fuck you Bioware!" or something along those lines, then yeah, he's kind of an idiot.
Suspension would be fine and dandy, but preventing him from playing his game? Thats downright rude.

I'm assuming he just flipped them off, and not criticized them, because if critique = bannage, then why is he even on the internet.
 

Ian Caronia

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I was reading what moderator Stanley Woo of Bioware forums had to say when he explained that Bioware is basically (from what I understand) under EA's community rules despite having community rules of their own. As an employee of Bioware, how Mr.Woo speaks and acts is how he portrays the company he works for (as with any employee). I can understand that the aforementioned fact of EA's rules overriding Bioware's rules is a sad thing, a very frustrating thing, and to have to tell the fans and consumers of the company you work for this fact is a touchy subject as well. I, as many do, believe you need to be sincere but also be understanding. I believe you need to let the consumers know that you, and thereby your employers, still care about them on a whole and grieve the punishment that your consumers deem severe while also letting them know this is how things are and will stay. However, instead of a response that conveys this attitude, we get this:
"Consider it an added incentive to follow the rules you say you're going to follow. ... End of line." - Stanley Woo, Bioware Forum Moderator

...I think Stanley Woo is ridiculous. I think Bioware as a company is ridiculous. Because of this moderator's attitude towards a snarky individual NOT BEING ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME HE BOUGHT (whether you consider it snarky or trollish, at that point it doesn't matter to me), I no longer want anything to do with Bioware. Unless I hear of a formal apology being sent out for such blatant disregard for the feelings of their consumers on this matter, or something equivalent to an apology from either Mr.Woo or Bioware, I don't believe this company deserves my money.
_In my opinion, Dragon Age 2 and, no matter how good it will be, Mass Effect 3 are NOT worth giving my hard earned (and, in this economy, very strained) dollars to a company that allows it's workers this kind of attitude. And, also in my opinion, those games sure are not worth giving ANYTHING to EA, a company that will KEEP YOU FROM PLAYING YOUR PURCHASED GAME if you say bad things about it (comically or trollish).
So, as I see things: with Bioware letting their moderators not show any regard about the people who keep their company alive, and in even BIGGER thanks to EA for having such a, in my eyes, ridiculous and overly-harsh punishment, I will not support either of these companies. You other consumers can all have my copy of Mass Effect 3 and Dragon Age 2.

EDIT: Even if it's only for 72hrs, even if it's not dealing with the First Amendment and such, and even if it was by FAR not his first offense, two facts still remain:
1. Bioware allows it's employees to treat their consumers with blatant disregard instead of going by, what I believe, is proper protocol to calm their consumers about a hot subject. (moderators are employees, and even if they weren't paid they work for a company/a site owned by a company and as such how they act and speak portrays their company in either a positive or negative light)
2. "EA's bans...can affect access to your game and/or DLC" -Stanley Woo, Bioware moderator
This powerplay over someone's purchased product/content is, to me, reason enough to avoid anything EA related.
What I said still stands.
 
Sep 14, 2009
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Sober Thal said:
gmaverick019 said:
Sober Thal said:
Read what you agree to.

They have every right to do this.

It should send a message to people who feel they are entitled to post whatever they want on the internet. Don't get me wrong, you can... but when you do so on someone else's site, beware the banhammer.
simple as this really, yes that was pretty harsh to do, if anything it should have been "justifiable" with a forum ban but still, it's in the rules, so gotta deal with it.

really though, don't do stupid shit and just enjoy your games and everything will go smooth, not too hard, is it?
I wonder if the guy who was banned the 3 days was truthful about exactly why he was punished. I can easily understand him not telling the whole story.

I have endured suspensions before on a forum, and after a couple, I really have been trying to be more civil. It's a shame I wasn't from the get go, but ya live and learn.
yeah i'm seriously doubting he was truthful, most people aren't, i'm sure he had some very awful comments to give them and probably even a few empty threats (i'm in customer service as my job so i've heard quite a few different things over the phone before)

yeah i've definitely said some stupid things, and just detaching yourself away from the situation from the minute can make all the difference sometimes, but then again like you said, live and learn
 

Magicman10893

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I am sick of everyone on here talking shit on Bioware because of this. It was made pretty apparent if you read the thread in the OP's link or even looked at the first page that the ban was made under EA's EULA or Terms of Conduct-whatever and that the ban was initiated because of an automated service set off by repeated reporting by the community. Bioware didn't do anything, EA locked him out. Even if assuming you think the reason is because his account is required for activation and this was an oversight by Bioware, it still isn't true because Bioware's bans are NOT tied to your games, EA's, however, is.

So, ironically, the person's comment that got him banned was absolutely, 100% correct!
 

Awexsome

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Mar 25, 2009
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If he did something to get a ban then his side of the story is completely unreliable.

But I agree that a ban from playing games on an account due to some misbehavior on the forums/chat-whatever isn't a fair move. I mean if he was really bad suspend him from posting on the forums for a month. But I don't think that punishment should've carried over to his account's gaming priviledges.

But it nice once in a while to see someone get their world rocked after trolling or being an ass of themself online because they think they can get away with it with no consequences. Even if this time was a bit extreme IMO.
 

Venereus

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llubtoille said:
mireko said:
Please review the EA Community Terms of Service, particularly sections #9 and #11. There are two levels of enforcement here:

1. BioWare community bans are forum-only and can be for as little as 24 hours. These bans should have no effect on your game, only your ability to use all the features of this website/community. these bans are handed out by BioWare Moderators as the result of our travels around the forum and/or issues reported by fellow community members.

2. EA Community bans come down from a different department and are the result of someone hitting the REPORT POST button. These bans can affect access to your game and/or DLC.

Because the BioWare community now operates under the same umbrella as all EA Communities, community members here have all explicitly agreed to abide by and be governed by both sets of rules. Consider it an added incentive to follow the rules you say you're going to follow.

If there are further questions or concerns, please send them to me via private message. Thank you.

End of line.

I have no idea who to blame at this point.

We need a little more context, but it seems that the user got themselves suspended from EA's side as opposed to being suspended by BioWare mods. It's an unnecessarily harsh punishment, but it could be an unintended side-effect of the suspension. Of course, since we're talking about EA they could just be fucking with him for fun. Their ToS does come with a laundry list of reasons to wreck your shit, after all:

11. Rules of Conduct

You may violate the Terms of Service if, as determined by EA in its sole discretion, you:

- Post, transmit, promote, or distribute Content that is illegal.
- Harass, threaten, embarrass, or do anything else to another player that is unwanted, such as repeatedly sending unwanted messages or making personal attacks or statements about race, sexual orientation, religion, heritage, etc.
- Transmit or facilitate distribution of Content that is harmful, abusive, hateful, racially, religiously or ethnically offensive, obscene, threatening, bullying, vulgar, sexually explicit, defamatory, infringing, invasive of personal privacy or publicity rights, encourages conduct that would violate a law or in a reasonable person's view, objectionable and/or inappropriate. Hate speech is not tolerated.
- Use abusive, offensive, or defamatory screen names and/or personas.
- Disrupt the flow of chat in chat rooms with vulgar language, abusiveness, hitting the return key repeatedly or inputting large images so the screen goes by too fast to read, use of excessive shouting [all caps] in an attempt to disturb other users, "spamming" or flooding [posting repetitive text].
- Impersonate another person (including celebrities), indicate falsely that you are an EA employee or a representative of EA, or attempt to mislead users by indicating that you represent EA or any of EA's partners or affiliates.
- Attempt to get a password, account information, or other private information from anyone else on EA Services.
- Upload any software or Content that you do not own or have permission to freely distribute.
- Violate any additional Rules of Conduct applicable to a specific EA Service that you are using.
- Promote, encourage or take part in any illegal activity including hacking, cracking, taking advantage of exploits or cheats and/or distribution of counterfeit software.
- Upload files that contain a virus, worm, spyware, time bombs, corrupted data or other computer programs that may damage, interfere with or disrupt EA Services.
- Post messages for any purpose other than personal communication, including advertising or promotional messaging, chain letters, pyramid schemes, or other commercial activities.
- Improperly use in-game support or complaint buttons or make false reports to EA staff.
- Use or distribute unauthorized "auto" software programs, "macro" software programs or other "cheat utility" software program or applications.
- Modify or attempt to modify any part of the EA Service that EA does not specifically authorize you to modify.
- Post or communicate any person's real-world personal information using an EA Service.
- Attempt to interfere with, hack into or decipher any transmissions to or from the servers for an EA Service.
- Use and communicate exploits to gain unfair advantage in a game
- Attempt to use EA Software on or through any service that is not controlled or authorized by Electronic Arts. Any such use is at your own risk and may subject you to additional or different terms. EA takes no responsibility for your use of EA Software on or through any service that is not controlled by Electronic Arts.
- Interfere with the ability of others to enjoy playing an EA Service or take actions that interfere with or materially increase the cost to provide an EA Service for the enjoyment of all its users.
- Unless expressly authorized by EA, you may not sell, buy, trade or otherwise transfer your EA account or any personal access to EA Services, Content or Entitlements, including by use of auction websites.
- You may not conduct any activities that violate the laws of any jurisdiction including but not limited to copyright infringement, trademark infringement, defamation, invasion of privacy, identity theft, hacking, stalking, fraud and the distribution of counterfeit software.
so re. the above ToS s.11 rules,
would he be in violation of
"- Transmit or facilitate distribution of Content that is harmful, abusive, hateful, racially, religiously or ethnically offensive, obscene, threatening, bullying, vulgar, sexually explicit, defamatory, infringing, invasive of personal privacy or publicity rights, encourages conduct that would violate a law or in a reasonable person's view, objectionable and/or inappropriate. Hate speech is not tolerated."?

for implying that EA is the devil...

EA must give warning before terminating an account unless it's in "violation of this Terms of Service, illegal or improper use of your Account, or illegal or improper use of EA Services, Content, Entitlement, products, or EA's Intellectual Property as determined by EA in its sole discretion."

If posting a very tame opinion on their forums is considered improper use of EA Services, then that would be a very good reason not use their forums.
I always laugh at the "reasonable person's view" argument. Seriously, this is some major screw up from Bioware/EA.

gmaverick019 said:
really though, don't do stupid shit and just enjoy your games and everything will go smooth, not too hard, is it?
Sure, just keep your head down and don't mind the shackles around you, no one likes unhappy people, so shut up and enjoy the silly distractions...
 

Soviet Heavy

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There is a rebuttal thread popping up. Check it out.
http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6465725
 

0effect

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I don't know what is more scary, the fact that a company is able to do something like this or that there are some people/sheep that are actually defending this kind of policies on Bioware forum.
 

Tssha

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May 8, 2009
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Okay, for those invoking freedom of speech here, I hate to have to say this again (since someone else said it before me) but here it is.

Freedom of speech only affects the government. It prevents them from arresting you for expressing an opinion. It prevents them from blocking your opinion. It allows you to make your opinion heard by any means within your power that don't disturb the peace (shouting your opinion on a megaphone, for instance, is a no-no outside of a formal protest).

EA servers are EA's servers. It's their house. They can kick you out if they don't like you. Sometimes it's a jerk move. Sometimes a person really is being offensive and annoying. Either way, they're legally allowed to do it.

This doesn't just apply to the internet either. For your edification, I propose the following experiment:

Audit a course at your local university (you could alternately pay for the course, it wouldn't change anything). At random points in the lecture, snicker. Argue the professor's points as he's talking. Greet every point in a particular vein with a derisive snort. Then see how long it takes before you're escorted from the building.

The constitution regulates laws. It says certain laws cannot be written and overrides those laws, giving courts the power to strike them down. This has happened several times with laws regulating sales of video games. This is what the constitution affects.

Freedom of speech also allows you to protest guest speakers, lecturers, political parties, laws, foreign leaders and other folks you don't like. Get a protest permit, gather your followers and no one can shut you up, even if you deserve it. Freedom of speech.

You are free to express any opinion you like on the internet. Just set up your own server (or rent from very forgiving server owners), hook it up to the internet, register the DNS and no one can stop you from speaking your mind. Since freedom of speech exists on the internet, no one can say "I can't express my opinion on the internet" because you can totally say whatever you want on your own server. You can't say whatever you want on someone else's server because they own it and have the right to kick you off for whatever. They also have the right to shut down a service for any length of time that they choose, since it is a service (though I don't agree that it's right and don't assume that's what I'm saying), they can refuse to serve you if they just plain don't like you. You can demand a refund, and should totally get it if you want it, but that's about as far as it goes.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm not saying it's not a jerk move. However, all you folks invoking freedom of speech are wrong. This is why. Brush up on constitutional law sometime.


EDIT: To clarify since I know I'm gonna be labelled an apologist by someone here; no, I don't think this is right. I hate DRM, I hate EA accounts, I don't want to have an EA account, and I don't like the fact that a ban by EA locks you out of your newly bought game for 72 hours because of online activation. I don't dislike these enough to boycott EA, but I don't love them for it either. It is a jerk move, but they're legally allowed to do it.
 

w00tage

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Well, at first I thought it was just an oversight by zealous IT people at Bioware. But then Stanley Woo chimed in and said the following

"Please review the EA Community Terms of Service, particularly sections #9 and #11. There are two levels of enforcement here:

1. BioWare community bans are forum-only and can be for as little as 24 hours. These bans should have no effect on your game, only your ability to use all the features of this website/community. these bans are handed out by BioWare Moderators as the result of our travels around the forum and/or issues reported by fellow community members.

2. EA Community bans come down from a different department and are the result of someone hitting the REPORT POST button. These bans can affect access to your game and/or DLC.

Because the BioWare community now operates under the same umbrella as all EA Communities, community members here have all explicitly agreed to abide by and be governed by both sets of rules. Consider it an added incentive to follow the rules you say you're going to follow.

If there are further questions or concerns, please send them to me via private message. Thank you.

End of line."

Translation - "hey, when you created a forum account, you agreed to let anyone on the forum who hits the "report post" button deny you access to the games you've paid for. So thanks for your money and take a hike".

Given this response, I believe that Mr. Woo has answered the poster's original question. Yes, Bioware has sold their soul to the EA devil.

So much for me considering Bioware games in the future. They were already on thin ice with ME2, and this just dropped an anvil on said ice right at their feet.
 

Russian_Assassin

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I can't understand how can some people here support Bioware on this one.

"He didn't respect the rules so he deserves it! NYEH NYEH NYEH!"

NO! He didn't deserve it. He payed 50 euros, not a small amount in our days, to purchase a product. The company that made it gratefully took his money and then they turn to him and say:

"Yeah, thanks for your money, but you were a meanie in our little club so you can't play!"

I believed in you Bioware. I guess once you make a certain amount of money you become blind to humanity and profit is the only value in your life... Piracy is a better alternative to this (not that I will pirate this game, even if I did my pc would choke to death on such a heavy game). Bioware, you will get my money again when you prove you deserve it!
 

keideki

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Sep 10, 2008
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Way for Bioware and EA to be dicks. Guess they just lost a sale, I wont buy from them anymore. This is not the only reason, just the final straw.
 

Ian Caronia

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w00tage said:
Well, at first I thought it was just an oversight by zealous IT people at Bioware. But then Stanley Woo chimed in and said the following

"Please review the EA Community Terms of Service, particularly sections #9 and #11. There are two levels of enforcement here:

1. BioWare community bans are forum-only and can be for as little as 24 hours. These bans should have no effect on your game, only your ability to use all the features of this website/community. these bans are handed out by BioWare Moderators as the result of our travels around the forum and/or issues reported by fellow community members.

2. EA Community bans come down from a different department and are the result of someone hitting the REPORT POST button. These bans can affect access to your game and/or DLC.

Because the BioWare community now operates under the same umbrella as all EA Communities, community members here have all explicitly agreed to abide by and be governed by both sets of rules. Consider it an added incentive to follow the rules you say you're going to follow.

If there are further questions or concerns, please send them to me via private message. Thank you.

End of line."

Translation - "hey, when you created a forum account, you agreed to let anyone on the forum who hits the "report post" button deny you access to the games you've paid for. So thanks for your money and take a hike".

Given this response, I believe that Mr. Woo has answered the poster's original question. Yes, Bioware has sold their soul to the EA devil.

So much for me considering Bioware games in the future. They were already on thin ice with ME2, and this just dropped an anvil on said ice right at their feet.
I totally forgot to mention that point about the "report post" thing. An incredible oversight on my part. Add this to what I said. I'm in agreement with you, w00tage.
 

Kavic86

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May 28, 2010
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Things like this is why more and more people pirate games. Why pay money to a corporation who can prevent you from playing the game you bought if you bad mouth there corporation.