CD Projekt: "Let's Treat Gamers as Grown-ups"

[Worgen]

It is, but it wasnt added by cdprojekt, it was added by the publisher

You do realise the CD Projekt RED's publisher is CD Projekt, right?

The DRM was added by CD Projekt because of contractual bullshit with the distributors.

The physical version published by Atari in the states and Namco Bandai in Europe, both those versions had securom on the disk, the version of the game that CD Project self published on gog.com had no drm on it what so ever. The disk version had the securom patched out of it very shortly after launch.

 

[Twilight_guy]

You reduce a complex issue of controlling IP and piracy into a strawman argument of who care for customers, thus talking down to gamers.

What the fuck are you on about dude? DRM isn't a complex issue.

Does it curb piracy or increase sales? []y [x]n

Does it greatly annoy your customers and make their experience with your product more negative? [x]y []n

Nothing complex about it.

I didn't say DRM, I said IP control and piracy. That is a complex and is bigger then DRM.

Not to mention that DRM is not simple, if it were that easy, a lot of modern technologies wouldn't have existed since at first they really sucked and then got better. 'Lol, horseless carriage, nope, don't want to pay for gas, wind it up, and fix it, horses are better'. Dismissing DRM completely because it sucks now is killing your patient and declaring him cured. There needs to be protection, that's a basic part of any store, and it needs to not suck. This is diminishing the whole argument and calling anyone who disagrees or thinks its more then that a child.

 

[Groenteman]

...

First off, it would be nice if you keep personal attacks out of this, and stop being so easily offended (both by by the article and forum peoples).

As for DRM, even if it could be developed to be perfectelly unpiratable, and of no hindrance at all to the customer, it adds nothing to the main product.
It would only allow publishers to continue driving up prices, continue with the rediculous DLC practices, etc etc. Not to mention that any 'perfect' DLC will automatically kil off any ability to mod the game.

This would basically make the PC a console with a mouse and keyboard. Utter dystopia in my opinion.

Hearing a company steer away from this (unlikely) future is good, I dont care whether or not its a PR stunt, or whether or not it has anything to do with 'repect'. I judge companies based on how they treat me and got nothing to hate CDR for.

 

[Twilight_guy]

...

First off, it would be nice if you keep personal attacks out of this, and stop being so easily offended (both by by the article and forum peoples).

As for DRM, even if it could be developed to be perfectelly unpiratable, and of no hindrance at all to the customer, it adds nothing to the main product.
It would only allow publishers to continue driving up prices, continue with the rediculous DLC practices, etc etc. Not to mention that any 'perfect' DLC will automatically kil off any ability to mod the game.

This would basically make the PC a console with a mouse and keyboard. Utter dystopia in my opinion.

Hearing a company steer away from this (unlikely) future is good, I dont care whether or not its a PR stunt, or whether or not it has anything to do with 'repect'. I judge companies based on how they treat me and got nothing to hate CDR for.

I checked, there weren't any personal attacks in either of my posts. I insulted the story and the Escapist, both of which aren't people. Also the company, or rather their PR department and the whole of the company by proxy for going along with the PR department. I should probably have gone easier on the Escapist though, the good stories outnumber the bad ones.

No, I will not alter how I perceive people and what I get offended by to suit your preferences. I'm not physically able to do so and even if I could I'd consider it a betrayal of my character to do so.

No, DRM doesn't add to the product. it's not designed too, its designed to prevent theft. Its like the little tag on cloths int he store that explode and squirt ink in your face if you try to steal something, it's to protect the company not to enhance the product.

Your going to have to provide me with a link between DRM and DLC and prices because I honestly don't see how they are connected(aside from all being things gamers have strong opinions on). As for Mods, I think if we're going to assume a perfect DLC then we could assume that it somehow can differentiate between mods that change gameplay and mods designed to pirate the game. A non-perfect DRM of course can't do this, but I'm sure there are ways of allowing mods with DRM if it really is an issue. For example, a DRM that allows approved mods to be installed but not unapproved mods.

Your free to like the company if you want. I don't really care, but I have a different opinion and I'm going to voice it. Freely voicing opinions is the foundation of any worthwhile discussion.

 

[Groenteman]

....... thanks a fakkin lot capcha. teach me to forget copying the text before hitting post.

Anyhow, on the point of DRM and DLC:

The relation there is that once DRM becomes perfect, there is no longer much of an incentive for reasonable pricing. Control generally drives up prices, and not allways reasonable ones. Compare for instance a fully locked down, publisher controlled platform like Nintendo DS, the more loosely controlled iOS, and uncontrolled Android. Similar or even indentical games cost less respectivelly.
Having no control over whether or not software is pirated forces developers to offer paying customers something else. Updates, free content and automatic updates, customer service, online gimmicks, that stuff. Id pay for that much much rather.

As for the modding point, I wrote that wrong. Meant to say DRM, not DLC. Perfect DRM means withholding content from the user, which makes modding extremely difficult at the best, and impossible in the worst, more likely case.
This is under the assumption said DLC works as some sort of partial cloud-based system, not perfect as it requires constant internet access, but the closest thing to it, beside hiring a guy to state over people shoulder making sure they do nothing naughty (1984, gamers edition?).

To me, indulging DLC in its current form is like allowing someone to shit on your carpet, because one day he may start shitting gold.

 

[Strazdas]

They treat costumers with respect and they are wining. where have n i seen this before? oh right, any industry but gaming.

and i very much agree on their wish for old times, but id like to point a little thing out.

Back when retail games were dominant, we had expansion packs. These were really large chunks of content, which were worth their price. If today's DLCs offered the same amount of content, they would be worth paying for, but in most cases players think they are overcharged for what they receive.

Back when retail games were dominant and internet were a luxury, game PATCHes had more new content than DLC has now for many games. and those were completely free. Expansion packs back then were like a 2nd game on same engine and setting. Now we get a DLC that adds 3 new guns? seriuosly? a patch woudl add a whole new gamemode back then.

P.S. capcha: teh inter webs oh you mindreader

 

[Goofguy]

A class act. While I have yet to play the Witcher games (I bought both from this past Steam summer sale), I can respect these guys for their outlook and attitude. Kudos to them.

 

[The Unworthy Gentleman]

Is this not a good thing, or am I too much of an optimist for these forums?

You'll get used to it. You should have seen it before we decided to stomp on misanthropy, those bastards were everywhere.

OT: Cool, I can't see it taking off. Bigger publishers are too disconnected from the market to actually realise stuff like this. Developers have a better grasp on what the consumer wants because they're a part of this, publishers are businessmen first and foremost and need to look out for a safer profit; making DRM appear the smarter, safer, more profitable option.

 

[JonnWood]

In before pirates saying that this means piracy isn't so bad, really.

Oh, wait.

This is better than a lot of people deserve. They create a great game without DRM, they treat us like adults, as pirates say DRM doesn't, and pirates repay them by pirating the game by the shedload. Good job, guys. You've proved once and for all that you don't really care if a game has DRM or not.

 

[JonnWood]

They treat costumers with respect and they are wining. where have n i seen this before? oh right, any industry but gaming....

You are aware that TW2 was pirated like gangbusters, despite the complete lack of DRM and CDP bending over backwards to be fair? They claimed they were pirated 4.5 million times by year's end.

 

[sniddy_v1legacy]

....yeh I gotta say this is the kinda studio I can support, the kind that I odn't mind pre-ordering from....and that despite the opportunity I won't pirate

 

[Strazdas]

They treat costumers with respect and they are wining. where have n i seen this before? oh right, any industry but gaming....

You are aware that TW2 was pirated like gangbusters, despite the complete lack of DRM and CDP bending over backwards to be fair? They claimed they were pirated 4.5 million times by year's end.

You are aware that ANY game is pirated like gangbuster provided its a good game (pirating a game you dont want to play is pointless isnt it?) despite the allegedly half a million dollars going into GTA4 DRM and so on? According to Torrentfreak, in 2011 [http://torrentfreak.com/top-10-most-pirated-games-of-2011-111230/] it does not even make the list whic would put it AT LEAST under 3,2 millions. They also claimed to sell a million copies, and a 3:1 pirating ratio is something most games dont seem to come close to. Besides, pirating has absolutely nothing to do with being fair to your costumers. No DRM has ever stopped pirates. Best it managed to do is delay the pirated version a week (gta4) and worst it managed to do is let only pirates play (assasins creed 2 servers were overloaded and legal costumers couldn't play, while pirates were playing happily). By loosing DRM CDP has not so much won by not interfering with peoples games as it was an awesome PR stunt as everyon was DRM gearing, the users hate it and here comes a white knight saying "fuck the system". Except that this time the rebel is right. Thats how revolutions are born.

 

[legendp]

.

The cards weren't the entirety of the problem. The company is the problem, pretending to be mature and to treat us like adults, then lathering their games in shallow, pandering sex. It's designed to sell to men and the developer thinks so little of said men and of women, that they turn most females into sexual mountains to be climbed and offer the promise of breasts as incentive. "C'mon, play the game. We have boobies! We all know how much you love boobies. Buy the game and see some." It's as pathetic as booth babes and just as disgusting.

It's related to the inane concept of men being nice to women to get in their pants and then complaining when the girl doesn't "give out." The game rewards behavior with nudity and sex; if you perform certain actions, your rewards aren't complex or developing, but straight up do [this] then she will have sex with you. Then do it again with the next woman. And the next. And the next. The game turns women and their bodies into rewards and objects to be obtained.

In The Witcher's world, women are all whores. It's sickening.

the australian version took most of that out (for the record), I guess am just wasting my time no one will read this anyway. I agree with your point, thats why I downloaded the australian censored version. I really don't care for any of the sex in the video game (it's just a game), and I am male and I bought it so I wouldn't generalise all the male customers like that.

 

[legendp]

They treat costumers with respect and they are wining. where have n i seen this before? oh right, any industry but gaming....

You are aware that TW2 was pirated like gangbusters, despite the complete lack of DRM and CDP bending over backwards to be fair? They claimed they were pirated 4.5 million times by year's end.

and yet in that year figures where released showing crysis 2 to be the most pirted (the wicther 2 wasn't even a million pirated)

 

[legendp]

.

The cards weren't the entirety of the problem. The company is the problem, pretending to be mature and to treat us like adults, then lathering their games in shallow, pandering sex. It's designed to sell to men and the developer thinks so little of said men and of women, that they turn most females into sexual mountains to be climbed and offer the promise of breasts as incentive. "C'mon, play the game. We have boobies! We all know how much you love boobies. Buy the game and see some." It's as pathetic as booth babes and just as disgusting.

It's related to the inane concept of men being nice to women to get in their pants and then complaining when the girl doesn't "give out." The game rewards behavior with nudity and sex; if you perform certain actions, your rewards aren't complex or developing, but straight up do [this] then she will have sex with you. Then do it again with the next woman. And the next. And the next. The game turns women and their bodies into rewards and objects to be obtained.

In The Witcher's world, women are all whores. It's sickening.

the australian version took most of that out (for the record), I guess am just wasting my time no one will read this anyway. I agree with your point, thats why I downloaded the australian censored version. I really don't care for any of the sex in the video game (it's just a game), and I am male and I bought it so I wouldn't generalise all the male customers like that.

There's a different version? First I've heard of this.

Well the australian government likes to cencor a lot of things because of no R18 rating, It's usually annoying but on this particular game I actually agreed with removing that "objectification" content. I whish the standard version atleat had an ingame swicth where you could enable or disable this (it might but I would't know as I don't have that version

Edit 1: here is the article if your looking for it
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/109795-The-Witcher-2-Sexed-Down-for-Australia

 

[legendp]

.

The cards weren't the entirety of the problem. The company is the problem, pretending to be mature and to treat us like adults, then lathering their games in shallow, pandering sex. It's designed to sell to men and the developer thinks so little of said men and of women, that they turn most females into sexual mountains to be climbed and offer the promise of breasts as incentive. "C'mon, play the game. We have boobies! We all know how much you love boobies. Buy the game and see some." It's as pathetic as booth babes and just as disgusting.

It's related to the inane concept of men being nice to women to get in their pants and then complaining when the girl doesn't "give out." The game rewards behavior with nudity and sex; if you perform certain actions, your rewards aren't complex or developing, but straight up do [this] then she will have sex with you. Then do it again with the next woman. And the next. And the next. The game turns women and their bodies into rewards and objects to be obtained.

In The Witcher's world, women are all whores. It's sickening.

the australian version took most of that out (for the record), I guess am just wasting my time no one will read this anyway. I agree with your point, thats why I downloaded the australian censored version. I really don't care for any of the sex in the video game (it's just a game), and I am male and I bought it so I wouldn't generalise all the male customers like that.

There's a different version? First I've heard of this.

Well the australian government likes to cencor a lot of things because of no R18 rating, It's usually annoying but on this particular game I actually agreed with removing that "objectification" content. I whish the standard version atleat had an ingame swicth where you could enable or disable this (it might but I would't know as I don't have that version

There's an R18+ rating now. So there's that.

Here I'll just relink this incase you missed it. We hae an R18 rating, since when, I'll have to investigate this? I believe the australian version is still cencored, canot be sure though (if not chances are someone has made a mod to censor and uncensor the game)
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/109795-The-Witcher-2-Sexed-Down-for-Australia