Constantine Is Faithful To The Comics, But To A Fault

K9

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I thought the pilot had its positives and negatives. A big negative to me was the sanitized version of Constantine himself; this may prove to be a fatal flaw right from the start. I did watch the Flash pilot around the same time when it leaked online over the summer and found this one to be more compelling. That may speak more to the strength of that Flash pilot than to the Constantine one. I'm someone who liked the Constantine movie well enough and will give this show its fair shot.
 

Albino Boo

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Woah that accent is bad, Constantine is supposed to be a Scouser not from Lancashire and to be frank its more generic Northen then even that.
 

Fanghawk

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P-89 Scorpion said:
Bah this was DOA the minute NBC put it in a Friday night death slot.
Honestly, Friday night is probably the best place for this show to thrive. Friday night isn't the "death slot" it used to be. You have shows like Grimm, also on NBC and a great lead in for Constantine, currently in it's third (or fourth, maybe?) season and it debuted on Fridays and shy of a very brief run on Monday (I think) it has never been in any danger of cancellation. In fact, it has been one of NBC's stronger performing shows. If NBC's treatment of Grimm is any indication of what we can expect from Constantine I would say that Constantine is anything but DOA.

Over on other Networks you had Smallville in it's last three or four seasons, along with Supernatural, finding decent numbers on Friday nights on The CW. Then on CBS you have Bluebloods and Hawaii 5-0 both shows that are currently airing that have survived multiple seasons on Friday nights. If anything, the trend seems to be that networks are actually looking for quality programming to attract viewers for Friday night television.

Now, to be fair, you aren't going to get the same type of volume of viewers on Fridays, either in core 18-49 nor in totals but networks realize this and adjust accordingly. Numbers that would mean cancellation on other nights are viewed as highly successful on Fridays. The bar is lowered in many ways to realistically account for the smaller audience overall and if shows are able to provide even modest numbers they have typically been supported and renewed
 

Fanghawk

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Constantine Is Faithful To The Comics, But To A Fault

The premiere of Constantine has all the trappings of a faithful adaptation... but it still doesn't impress.

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Jandau

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Ummm... while I will admit that the pilot didn't blow my mind, I did find it a decent start. But 2 stars? That's harsh! It's 3-3.5 material, with room for growth. And my only contact with the franchise was the Keanu Reeves film, so I'm hardly a fanboy. It's decent, solid urban fantasy. A more serious Supernatural. Kinda like Dresden Files, if Harry Dresden was a prick. I'll be watching this one and I encourage people to give it a chance, fans or not.
 

Gizmo1990

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Jandau said:
Ummm... while I will admit that the pilot didn't blow my mind, I did find it a decent start. But 2 stars? That's harsh! It's 3-3.5 material, with room for growth. And my only contact with the franchise was the Keanu Reeves film, so I'm hardly a fanboy. It's decent, solid urban fantasy. A more serious Supernatural. Kinda like Dresden Files, if Harry Dresden was a prick. I'll be watching this one and I encourage people to give it a chance, fans or not.
I am with you I think that it has the potential to be something good. My biggest problem with it was the woman with the bad American acccent and she is getting the boot so i have high hopes.

Still my expectations were low. I am a big Dresden Files fan and considering how bad the Dresden TV show was I was prepared for the worst.
 

P-89 Scorpion

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Super Not Cosmo said:
P-89 Scorpion said:
Bah this was DOA the minute NBC put it in a Friday night death slot.
Honestly, Friday night is probably the best place for this show to thrive. Friday night isn't the "death slot" it used to be. You have shows like Grimm, also on NBC and a great lead in for Constantine, currently in it's third (or fourth, maybe?) season and it debuted on Fridays and shy of a very brief run on Monday (I think) it has never been in any danger of cancellation. In fact, it has been one of NBC's stronger performing shows. If NBC's treatment of Grimm is any indication of what we can expect from Constantine I would say that Constantine is anything but DOA.

Over on other Networks you had Smallville in it's last three or four seasons, along with Supernatural, finding decent numbers on Friday nights on The CW. Then on CBS you have Bluebloods and Hawaii 5-0 both shows that are currently airing that have survived multiple seasons on Friday nights. If anything, the trend seems to be that networks are actually looking for quality programming to attract viewers for Friday night television.

Now, to be fair, you aren't going to get the same type of volume of viewers on Fridays, either in core 18-49 nor in totals but networks realize this and adjust accordingly. Numbers that would mean cancellation on other nights are viewed as highly successful on Fridays. The bar is lowered in many ways to realistically account for the smaller audience overall and if shows are able to provide even modest numbers they have typically been supported and renewed

Friday 18-49 ratings are always low but shows can still get good view numbers I admit, I just don't believe a more obscure comic character like Constantine is going to get them.

There is also a lot of difference between an already successful show like Smallville moving to Friday's and bringing it's audience with it than there is with one premiering on a Friday.
 

Jandau

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Gizmo1990 said:
Jandau said:
Ummm... while I will admit that the pilot didn't blow my mind, I did find it a decent start. But 2 stars? That's harsh! It's 3-3.5 material, with room for growth. And my only contact with the franchise was the Keanu Reeves film, so I'm hardly a fanboy. It's decent, solid urban fantasy. A more serious Supernatural. Kinda like Dresden Files, if Harry Dresden was a prick. I'll be watching this one and I encourage people to give it a chance, fans or not.
I am with you I think that it has the potential to be something good. My biggest problem with it was the woman with the bad American acccent and she is getting the boot so i have high hopes.

Still my expectations were low. I am a big Dresden Files fan and considering how bad the Dresden TV show was I was prepared for the worst.
Oh god, don't remind me of the Dresden Files show, that was a disgrace. Some decent actors in there, but the material they were given to work with was atrocious. It literally made me depressed to watch what they did with the source material.
 

P-89 Scorpion

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Ratings for Constantine's premier are in 1.4/5 rating/share and 4.30 million viewers the lowest viewers apart from CW's.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/10/25/tv-ratings-friday-the-amazing-race-last-man-standing-slide-blue-bloods-rises-constantine-makes-ok-debut/318972/

Will update when final numbers come in.
 

Fanghawk

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P-89 Scorpion said:
Ratings for Constantine's premier are in 1.4/5 rating/share and 4.30 million viewers the lowest viewers apart from CW's.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/10/25/tv-ratings-friday-the-amazing-race-last-man-standing-slide-blue-bloods-rises-constantine-makes-ok-debut/318972/

Will update when final numbers come in.
Those are good numbers, honestly, if you put them into perspective. Not super great to be sure, but still pretty damn solid for a show that had it's pilot leaked months prior to airing in the Friday 10pm slot.

Grimm got a 1.5, only marginally better, and Constantine held onto almost the entire Grimm audience. Then in the 10pm hour it's self you have all three shows within a tenth of a point of one another with 20/20 coming in first with a preliminary 1.5, then Constantine at 1.4, and finally Blue Bloods at 1.3. After the final numbers come out Constantine could easily get a bump into the 1.5 range. It will also be interesting to see what the Live+3 DVR numbers are as they also have a small bit of weight.

If Constantine can stay in the 1.2 range or above it should get a full season order and eventually a renewal. The 10pm slot on Fridays is, simply put, brutal. If it dips anywhere under that though to 1.1 or sub 1.0 it's gone. Holding the Grimm audience will be key for Constantine.
 

marscentral

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I liked it and thought it showed promise. I'm not a big Constantine fan and only really followed his exploits since his transition to the mainstream DCU, so I'm going to be a little easier to please. Pilots are always a bit of a mess as they establish themselves. I think you have to allow for that and really track a show over it's first two or three regular episodes to get a feel for where it's going.
 

Smiley Face

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I rarely judge a show by a poor pilot, the pilot's made to show off what the show will be about, and then it's focus-tested to iron out the things that don't work. So it doesn't make too much sense to look at pilots for what they do wrong, since that will probably change, but more for what they do right, and in terms of the feel of it all, I'll keep watching it to see how things go.
 

VoidWanderer

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You can almost imagine the writers digging through their reject pile of supernatural story ideas and frankensteining them together.
 

sc1arr1

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Honestly I loved the pilot and I'm looking forward to what they do with the series.
 

Veldel

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VoidWanderer said:
You can almost imagine the writers digging through their reject pile of supernatural story ideas and frankensteining them together.
I did I enjoyed it for what they did they took stuff from Hellblazer which came before supernatural.

Not best but far from worse I'm looking forward to the next ep.

I hope members of the JLD show up later on I'd love to see Deadman or Zatana
 

Baresark

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I liked the pilot well enough. I watched the leaked one over the summer as well, and was a bit surprised they are getting rid of that character. Her story was interesting and she wasn't a bad actress. That said, the thing that I don't like about this show so far is Matt Ryan. I could not be any less convinced of the lines he delivers. He feels like he is reading from a prompter to me. He is always looking off in the distance whenever he talks, it's really annoying. And that whole trying to summon my mothers spirit thing... I don't think he gives a shit at all. I just feel like he has no weight what so ever when he talks. Also, I couldn't agree more with the article about Chas's character. Talk about a waste. He was interesting (seemingly not being able to die and all) but he feels underused. He had like 3 lines. Once again, when he spoke though, I felt very little weight behind it.
 

ExtraDebit

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I must say, if the show is a faithful representation of the comic, wtf were people reading?

It was so boring I turn it off half way through. We already have shows like this that's much more interesting like supernatural, we don't need this shit.
 

D3P1KT

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People always seem to think that by leading the audience by the hand through everything is an effective method of storytelling and that it seems to be creeping into every T.V series I've watched lately; This doesn't do that. No. It grabs you and throws you into a world where you choose to watch and listen or you don't. It was refreshing. It was enlightening. Not some archetypal development (flashbacks for days, small insignificant characters get arcs for no reason, long drawn out explanations, 'oh, twist', etc) that is plaguing shows these days.

It always fascinates me the kind of feedback that is garnered on these kind of things. I've not read any of the comics or is anything vaguely understanding of the universe. But, I think this show has potential. Admittedly, I have a feel of pain in my gut; The PG feeling is strong (Removing the fact that the occult is being mentioned [THIS SEEMS TO OFFEND CERTAIN GROUPS OF PEOPLE - Even though without their ideologies{None of it would exist}] - removing the fact that this seems to draw on ancient cultures etc). In an age where things like Game of Thrones exists why is it that they feel that characters can only be portrayed in a certain light?

I'll likely have more things to RAMBLE on about after Ep2. Or when I can be bothered looking into the comics to see how 'accurate' the adaptation is.
 

RavingSturm

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ExtraDebit said:
I must say, if the show is a faithful representation of the comic, wtf were people reading?

It was so boring I turn it off half way through. We already have shows like this that's much more interesting like supernatural, we don't need this shit.
Well the show certainly isnt Hellblazer(yet). Its just too cleaned up as it is at the moment. People who have not read the comic probably wont stick around and Hellblazer fans will give up on it. He cant even smoke on TV. Faithful to the comic-the reviewer might be referencing the NEW 52 Constantine comic NOT Hellblazer. Hellblazer and New 52 Constantine are two different animals imho.
 

zumbledum

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Fanghawk said:
Constantine Is Faithful To The Comics, But To A Fault

The premiere of Constantine has all the trappings of a faithful adaptation... but it still doesn't impress.

Read Full Article
couldnt disagree much more , which is fine its all subjective after all. but speaking as someone that never read the comics isnt into DC at all and has no idea about any of the mythos of the character i found the first episode to be interesting and a good watch. didnt he leave the asylum because the dead guy (who was his friend?) left him a message the girl was in trouble? and the helmet scene worked well enough without knowing what it is.
 

Me55enger

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Never has the phrase "this content is unavailable" sounded quite so condescending.
 

Zen Bard

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I've read the comics and I liked the show, even though it was very much a "network television adaptation".

As expected, certain aspects were sanitized and simplified for the "mainstream" audience. And I couldn't help wonder what a basic cable network like FX or AMC could have done with it.

But, considering where it is, I thought it was well done.

Looks like the show (or this season anyway) will be following the early "Supernatural" template, with Constantine and Co traveling across the U.S. to battle demons and other occult creatures.

Could be interesting. I'll certainly watch through the season.
 

happyninja42

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K9 said:
I thought the pilot had its positives and negatives. A big negative to me was the sanitized version of Constantine himself; this may prove to be a fatal flaw right from the start.
What do you mean by sanitized specifically? I didn't read much of the comics, but the only signature trait of Constantine that I didn't see expressed in the show was his smoking habit. Everything else seemed very much Constantine from what I've seen of the Books of Magic, and some of the Hellblazer series.

K9 said:
I did watch the Flash pilot around the same time when it leaked online over the summer and found this one to be more compelling. That may speak more to the strength of that Flash pilot than to the Constantine one. I'm someone who liked the Constantine movie well enough and will give this show its fair shot.
Yeah, I enjoyed the Constantine movie as well. I was somewhat annoyed with bits of the pilot, mostly the use of cliched tropes, though a few of the tropes they inverted on me in a pleasant way. If I had to rate it, I'd give it a 6, maybe 7/10, with some hope that it's got room for improvement.


Though I will probably be way more forgiving of this pilot, as in my experience, no pilot is ever terribly good. Just about every pilot I've ever seen is a mad scrabble to establish what's going on and why in 40 minutes, which usually means a lot is left unclear for now. But that's ok to me, since the premise is that the answers will be given out over a series.


A friend of mine did say he felt it was basically just an episode of Supernatural to him. Seeing as I've never watched Supernatural I can't comment on that, but another friend made mention that since Hellblazer was out long before Supernatural, it was probably more accurate to say that Supernatural is like Constantine. *shrugs*

Decent pilot, several flaws, but I enjoyed the cast overall, and hope they do something with it in the future.
 

Winnosh

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I like that they are connecting it to the Larger DC Universe. There's a lot they can do with this.
 

Ariseishirou

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Call me shallow, but I lost interest as soon as I heard they were going to make him a non-smoker, straight, and just cast a brown-haired actor and dye it blond (badly). (Okay okay the last one is a personal bent because I am blond and I'm tired of the seemingly never-ending Generic Brown-Haired 30-Something Male Protagonist.) I'm not interested in network sanitized!Constantine. Sounds like I didn't miss much.
 

Travis Fischer

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Fanghawk said:
Given Aberdeen's departure, I suspect this episode was heavily edited to lay seeds for a new direction, and that led to these structural problems.
Having seen the original pilot and the new one, I can tell you that's not the case. The only change was the ending.

In the original, Liv comes across that crime scene at the end and it convinces her to ask John to go on a cross country helping people tour. Which was John's plan all along, he just wanted her to think it was her idea.


Sadly, it was the most spot-on bit of Constantine's "magnificent bastard" character in the episode and it got axed with Liv.
 

RavingSturm

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Aspects of Hellblazer that are probably NOT going into the show: Demonic man raping dogs, gory human violence,violent animal deaths, a subplot of an angel having a baby with a demon(which became the basis for Preacher),the "Dangerous Habits" arc(it revolves around the repercussions of smoking 30 sticks a day),killing his brother in utero, lots of cursing, the portrayal of JC as a selfish and unlikable character(I think they're going more for the anti-hero thing).
If the show is going for PG, and wont up the intensity, I feel it wont survive past 2nd season. There's nothing that's really standout about it. Some people might even think its a ripoff of the Dresden Files imho.
 

Charles Phipps

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I was more or less positive toward the show and wrote my review on the Bookie Monster website.

http://bookie-monster.com/2014/10/constantine-1-01-non-est-asylum.html

Still, the plot wasn't very good.
 

happyninja42

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RavingSturm said:
Aspects of Hellblazer that are probably NOT going into the show: Demonic man raping dogs, gory human violence,violent animal deaths,
Yeah probably not, it's a tv show after all.

RavingSturm said:
a subplot of an angel having a baby with a demon(which became the basis for Preacher),the "Dangerous Habits" arc(it revolves around the repercussions of smoking 30 sticks a day),killing his brother in utero,
These I could actually see happening. The "child of both sides" thing could be easily done in my opinion. The whole "love crossing boundaries" cliche is very popular, though I don't know how it played out in the comics, if it was love, or some kind of rape thing.

The cancer thing from smoking could still easily happen, you can get cancer all kinds of ways that have nothing to do with smoking. Maybe he gets liver cancer from his hard core drinking, or any number of other terminal diseases that put the fear of hell into him. Really all you need for this plot is a terminal illness that he can't recover from.

As for the killing brother in utero. Seriously? Is somebody trying to blame that on him in the comics? That seems kind of pushing the boundaries of guilt and personal accountability to me, to blame a child still in utero for murder. Hell by most Christian standards, he's basically incapable of being responsible at that age, he's not even done cooking yet.

RavingSturm said:
lots of cursing, the portrayal of JC as a selfish and unlikable character(I think they're going more for the anti-hero thing).
The cursing they can get away with by letting him use British curses. I mean in the pilot he said "bollocks", which as I understand it, would have to be censored on British tv. So yeah, in an odd sort of way, they can be really filthy with the language, and get away with it by using another countries profanities. xD

As for him being selfish and unlikeable, he did threaten the nerd hacker guy to help him, by pinning the previous case on him with the cops. That's kind of a dick move. If they continue with that, he would develop a pretty unlikeable nature. Though I agree it's probably still going to push for you to like him, since he is the tv shows protagonist. Shows with a main character the audience doesnt' like, usually don't last long.
 

maninahat

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Dull as ditch water. In the very first Hellblazer comic I read, we see a guy force feed himself to death; it's horrific and mysterious and all very ironic (in regards to what the victim was like). The devils had a lot of imagination and a lot of fun when it comes to being devilish. This pilot decided to go with a demon who only kills people off screen, and only by beating people up. Also, the demon is only visible by possessing people, so it looks like a normal person with contact lenses. That's boring!

Also, Constantine needed to down play things a bit. I imagine him being quietly snarky, melancholic and reticent. Not loud and hammy. The one character detail that was meant to carry the pilot was that he got an innocent girl sent to hell. This sounds like something that should have been left in the background to be eventually teased out by the supporting characters, rather than something they shove in your face within the first five minutes or so. We don't know who the girl is and we have been given no opportunity to previously sympathise with either her or Constantine. It's less a character building detail for Constantine, and more of a perfunctory task for him to complete by the series end. Perhaps Constantine's most interesting characteristic from the comics is that he is willing (if somewhat reluctantly) to throw his friends and lovers under the bus if it means serving a higher purpose. That should have been his character defining moment in the pilot, and it never comes up.
 

maninahat

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Happyninja42 said:
The cursing they can get away with by letting him use British curses. I mean in the pilot he said "bollocks", which as I understand it, would have to be censored on British tv.
Bollocks wouldn't unless it was a children's program, but otherwise I generally agree you could get away with it by sticking to British terms. In one episode of the The Simpsons, they are throwing the word "Wanker" quite a bit; a word which definitely would get censored in anything pre-"watershed" (along with tosser). Prat is an odd one, in that I have seen it in children's shows despite it being a borderline swearword. Berk appears a lot too, despite it being a pretty harsh euphemism.
 

RavingSturm

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They could have guest stars that get killed or sacrificed to a demon as part of the show's gimmick. I would really like to see body horror or some of the demons from the comic like Nergal, The First,2nd, 3rd and Norfulthing.