David Cage's place in the game industry (Aftermath of Beyond: Two Souls)

DrunkenMonkey

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Sep 17, 2012
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So I just finished Beyond Two Souls and I've got to say it was a pretty damn interesting story. Cage has definitely sacrificed choice for coherency in this one. Anyways this thread is not about my review of Beyond Two Souls, but my thoughts on the point that the gaming industry is def. where Cage belongs.

People who normally dislike Cage's works normally throw out the point, that he's a shitty writer who wants to turn games into movies. Following that people argue that he should stop making games and just go into the movie business. I normally never really had a rebuttal for that point.

Now I kinda disagree with that because I've got a good idea of Cage's writing style. For all intents and purposes Cage cannot tell a truly serious story that's grounded in reality. Indigo Prophecy, early script of heavy rain, and now B:TS show that Cage wants to write b movie material, while at the same time injecting some very serious themes in his stories. B movie material when transferred into the interactive realm of video games becomes rather video gamey, in the sense that the story is taken marginally more seriously because you are actively controlling the protagonist in some way.

Cage excels at writing videogamey (not sure if that's a word)stories. What B:TS shows is that he has some talent in writing those stories to be taken seriously. I realize that I'm going into some very subjective territory here, but I believe Cage knows his shit regarding this point.

Please note I'm not talking about his spiel of freedom of choice, and interactivity. B:TS clearly proves that you cannot make a photo realistic game, while giving a player options to move the story into different places. But you know for all his bullshit about "emotions" based on graphical fidelity, B:TS actually was riveting in its own way (again my opinion)

Sorry for the post length, and the rant. Thanks for reading (if you made it this far)
 

kazann

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Jan 18, 2013
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We'll from what im hearing Beyond two souls is getting a whole heap of negative reviews... Honostly, I think he's a mediocre writer that thinks too highly of himself - however i respect that he is adding something different to the games industry.

ill leave this here too.

 

DrunkenMonkey

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kazann said:
We'll from what im hearing Beyond two souls is getting a whole heap of negative reviews... Honostly, I think he's a mediocre writer that thinks to highly of himself - however i respect that he is adding something different to the games industry.

ill leave this here too.

Nah, the numerical scores the game is getting is completely justified. 10-12 playthough for 65 bucks is steep, in addition to the fact that the game railroads you harder than indigo prophecy.
 

T_ConX

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I loved Indigo Prophecy and Heavy Rain, but I'm going to be sitting out on B2S for a while.

I'm getting real tired of this 'Games as Art' movement. Ten years ago I was in love with the idea, but after 'playing' a bunch of 'games' like Gone Home, I'm starting to wonder if devs are just trying to hide behind the art label in order to write of legitimate criticisms of their 'games'.

Yeah, okay! Your game is art.

That doesn't mean it's good. It also doesn't mean that me not liking it makes me a moron for 'not understanding it'.

Between how busy I am now, and the size of my backlog, I think I'm better off waiting until I can pick up a used copy for cheap. Oh don't give me that look, Cage. It's not my fault your replay-value-free game will be the first on the chopping block when other gamers need trade-in credit for Call of Duty 10.
 

kazann

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T_ConX said:
I loved Indigo Prophecy and Heavy Rain, but I'm going to be sitting out on B2S for a while.

I'm getting real tired of this 'Games as Art' movement. Ten years ago I was in love with the idea, but after 'playing' a bunch of 'games' like Gone Home, I'm starting to wonder if devs are just trying to hide behind the art label in order to write of legitimate criticisms of their 'games'.

Yeah, okay! Your game is art.

That doesn't mean it's good. It also doesn't mean that me not liking it makes me a moron for 'not understanding it'.

Between how busy I am now, and the size of my backlog, I think I'm better off waiting until I can pick up a used copy for cheap. Oh don't give me that look, Cage. It's not my fault your replay-value-free game will be the first on the chopping block when other gamers need trade-in credit for Call of Duty 10.
Dont let the actions of some effect how you feel towards it all.

Otherwise we would not have games like Deus ex and max payne 1 and 2.
 

Full

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Sep 3, 2012
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Despite the fact he's apparently a dick, Cage's premises/ideas are great, and I think he just needs a(n at least better or more outspoken) team of editors and writers. Can't speak personally for Beyond, but it's apparently one of Quantics best stuff yet, despite being received all over the place.
 

Zhukov

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Dec 29, 2009
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I don't really have anything against the guy or his work, but I do think he's a wee bit full of shit.

He thinks he's got something to say, and maybe he does, but I'm yet to see any evidence of it. His games have their moments, but they never amount to anything notable, at least not to my eyes.

Oh, I also have nothing against movie-ish games. They can be done badly, sure, but so can every kind of game. The Walking Dead proved to me beyond any doubt that they can make for an awesome experience. People always come up with the, "Oh, but it's not really a game anymore" thing. So what? Semantics. Let's call it a Xgplfet then. Happy? Now get lost until you have something interesting to say.

Lastly, I don't see why he gets so much shit over the graphical emotions thing. Yes, character models with higher fidelity and better animation can in fact convey emotions better. Saying something to this effect shouldn't be some terrible sin that causes Jim Sterlng to make smarmy, smug comments for all eternity.
 

Lucem712

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Jul 14, 2011
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While he has been (really) full of himself in the past and currently, there a-lot of people like that. -cough- James Cameron -cough-

I've been playing it since I got home from work. Really solid, best so far as been a scene involving her adventures with homeless people. I know people consider them QTE button mash-em-ups but it isn't "PRESS THIS OR DIE", most of it you have ample time to react and think about it. Quantic is an example of how QTE should be handled. Hell, I've managed to get through 3 whole games based on the mechanic.[footnote]I barely made it through RE5's without wanting to shank someone[/footnote] (Glad they did away with that R2 to walk jazz though)

Action scenes are good and make sense in a story like this.It has good dips (So far) between normal (for Jodie, at least) times and moments of blood pumping action. (Not kind of stuffed action bits to make Heavy Rain easier to get through)

I read the IGN review that said something along the lines of not really feeling involved with the gameplay. I feel that way a bit with Jodie since she can get along fine without me, but I really feel connected to the entity "Aiden".

I don't think too much of game scores though, considering CODs [footnote]Nothing against them, just not exactly 10 for 10[/footnote] regularly get top notch scores.

Well, I can say one thing. It amazing games like this are even made. I mean, how much money is this going to bring in? Probably not top dollar, or anywhere near it. It's definitely not a cow for Sony.