Democrats already proposing austerity before DNC even ends

Eacaraxe

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For those who can't read WSJ, exceprts:


Further commentary:

 

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For those who can't read WSJ, exceprts:


Further commentary:

We already knew the pantry would be bare. It ALWAYS is after the GOP raids it. Why do you think the Dem's can never get what they planned done? Obama was handed an economic collapse from Bush. Biden will be handed an economic collapse from Trump. That is what we already knew would happen. Just look at what Trump spent on the military, his stupid wall and corporate welfare WHILE cutting taxes for the wealthy and then complains they don't have the money as an excuse to starve the poor.
 
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Dwarvenhobble

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Those who take the USA's debt serious have been shown to be more likely to win in recent times.

Obama vs McCain

Obama took the debt problem seriously. McCain dismissed it

Obama won

Obama vs Romney

Romney was on about how there was not debt problem and Obama was pushing to try and work towards solving it.

Obama won

Trump vs Hillary

Trump did bring up the debt issues often enough for people to notice. Hillary barely touched on them at least publicly it might have been in one of the 85 1,000 page policy documents she put out but never talked about but that would require far more time than I'm willing to put in, it gave the public perception she wan't taking it seriously.

Trump won.
 

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It's not bare at all, stop peddling austerity horseshit.
Have you seen the unemployment numbers? I don't agree with austerity, however, we could not afford the tax cuts for the wealthy under Trump and they never should have happened. Our local food pantries have been running out of food for months and cannot keep up with current demand. Homelessness is skyrocketing. This isn't going to get better without serious intervention at this point.
 
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Seanchaidh

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Have you seen the unemployment numbers? I don't agree with austerity, however, we could not afford the tax cuts for the wealthy under Trump and they never should have happened. Our local food pantries have been running out of food for months and cannot keep up with current demand. Homelessness is skyrocketing. This isn't going to get better without serious intervention at this point.
Joe Biden isn't talking about homelessness or food pantries. He's talking about the federal budget. And the fact that we have tax cuts of trillions for the wealthy is bad, but it isn't a limiter on future spending. The federal balance sheet is not 'bare'. The fact that we have so much unemployment will mean that deficit spending is absolutely fine; significant inflation is extremely unlikely under conditions of mass unemployment (and virtually impossible when there aren't weird things like pandemics going on potentially messing with the ability/inclination of people to work or normal property claims to be respected-- e.g. eviction morataria) and inflation is the only reason not to just print money without care. Joe Biden is saying that Trump has left things 'bare' in order to justify doing exactly the opposite of the serious intervention you correctly recognize is necessary in order to avoid an exceedingly grim future.
 

Trunkage

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Those who take the USA's debt serious have been shown to be more likely to win in recent times.

Obama vs McCain

Obama took the debt problem seriously. McCain dismissed it

Obama won

Obama vs Romney

Romney was on about how there was not debt problem and Obama was pushing to try and work towards solving it.

Obama won

Trump vs Hillary

Trump did bring up the debt issues often enough for people to notice. Hillary barely touched on them at least publicly it might have been in one of the 85 1,000 page policy documents she put out but never talked about but that would require far more time than I'm willing to put in, it gave the public perception she wan't taking it seriously.

Trump won.
That certainly is a pattern. I could probably agree. That spanner in this works is the gun control ideas Biden put out that just might ruin this streak. I think the second amendment would trump a balanced budget. We will see

Biden certainly has made November more interesting....
 

Revnak

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Joe Biden isn't talking about homelessness or food pantries. He's talking about the federal budget. And the fact that we have tax cuts of trillions for the wealthy is bad, but it isn't a limiter on future spending. The federal balance sheet is not 'bare'. The fact that we have so much unemployment will mean that deficit spending is absolutely fine; significant inflation is extremely unlikely under conditions of mass unemployment (and virtually impossible when there aren't weird things like pandemics going on potentially messing with the ability/inclination of people to work or normal property claims to be respected-- e.g. eviction morataria) and inflation is the only reason not to just print money without care. Joe Biden is saying that Trump has left things 'bare' in order to justify doing exactly the opposite of the serious intervention you correctly recognize is necessary in order to avoid an exceedingly grim future.
Capitalists don’t understand capitalism, more news at 11.
 

Revnak

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That certainly is a pattern. I could probably agree. That spanner in this works is the gun control ideas Biden put out that just might ruin this streak. I think the second amendment would trump a balanced budget. We will see

Biden certainly has made November more interesting....
It’s ahistorical. Romney and the Republicans in 2012 absolutely cared about the deficit it was literally all I heard for the entire election and the increased deficit under Obama was a core talking point for the Republicans for his entire presidency.
Edit: literally the first video when I searched “Romney 2012 campaign ad”
 
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Trunkage

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It’s ahistorical. Romney and the Republicans in 2012 absolutely cared about the deficit it was literally all I heard for the entire election and the increased deficit under Obama was a core talking point for the Republicans for his entire presidency.
Edit: literally the first video when I searched “Romney 2012 campaign ad”
Still doesn’t counter the fact that gun control is probably going to wash out any effect Dwarvenhobble hypotheses had anyway, even if you thought it was true
 

Revnak

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Still doesn’t counter the fact that gun control is probably going to wash out any effect Dwarvenhobble hypotheses had anyway, even if you thought it was true
Probably, yeah
 

Eacaraxe

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Capitalists don’t understand capitalism, more news at 11.
There is no "pantry" to begin with, the US holds global reserve currency status. US debt is floated by the fact most countries on Earth peg its value to the USD. Deficit and debt talk is red meat, dog whistle, bullshit root to stem and has no fucking purpose in the context of the US economy other than justifying austerity. Which is something, thanks to the USD holding global reserve currency status, the US absolutely, positively, cannot do at this juncture without sending the whole-ass global economy into a pissed-off rutting meth alligator death spiral.

That is to say, if the meth alligator death spiral we're already in can even be stopped at this juncture at all. These are problems that need to have been solved six months ago.

Not as in "Great Depression" bad, which in and of itself was a depression bad enough to end in a second world war, but as in "end of civilization as we know it" bad. Because if the value of the USD croaks out, the value of every currency on the planet croaks out, with the possible exception of the yuan. Maybe. And if China wanted global reserve currency status to begin with, they'd have had it by now after the 2008 debacle damn near cratered the global economy thanks to American white-collar crime.
 

Seanchaidh

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An article about precisely this.
I'm not buying it. Biden is just trying to get support where he needs it from specific people who want to hear about " balanced budgets". Once he has their support, he is going to go back to his actual campaign plan that he has already made promises for. Once he is elected, he doesn't need their support anymore and he can go back to his plan all along. People really need to stop reading too much into these deals that come up every election campaign regardless of who is running. Reminds me of the nonsense they tried to put out about Bernie selling the people out and that was just as false as this nonsense is here. Like I said before:
Democrats have conservatives, Moderates, and progressives
Republicans have conservatives and far right.

For the democrats to win they have to bribe, beg borrow and steal all the conservative and moderate votes they can get their hands on to get the majority. THAT is exactly what Biden is doing right now. HE is doing what it takes to get the majority by any means possible. That does not suddenly mean he is going to be a traitor to his party simply because he IS doing what is needed to win the regions we have to gain to get a majority. He is at the point he has to do and say whatever it takes to get their support because without it, he will lose. That will have no impact on what will happen once he is actually in the white house, Instead all of those Bills the house passed that are collecting dust right now that will actually help the people? Remember those? Those will finally get passed.
 

Seanchaidh

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I'm not buying it. Biden is just trying to get support where he needs it from specific people who want to hear about " balanced budgets". Once he has their support, he is going to go back to his actual campaign plan that he has already made promises for.
That would fly in the face of his entire career.

Once he is elected, he doesn't need their support anymore and he can go back to his plan all along.
This very same logic works in the opposite way too, so it's not particularly compelling.
 

Eacaraxe

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Biden is just trying to get support where he needs it from specific people who want to hear about " balanced budgets". Once he has their support, he is going to go back to his actual campaign plan that he has already made promises for. Once he is elected, he doesn't need their support anymore and he can go back to his plan all along...That does not suddenly mean he is going to be a traitor to his party simply because he IS doing what is needed to win the regions we have to gain to get a majority.
The Senator who never saw a financial sector deregulation bill, tax cut to the rich, social security cut, or bailout package he didn't like; who was a key architect of the contemporary carceral and surveillance state; and has continually been one of the best friends of big business on Capitol Hill through legislation like the Telecoms Act and DMCA is a Sooper Dubble Seekrit Progressive all along. It was all an act and cunningly-laid plan of absolute obsequiousness to the ultra-wealthy and burning the country to the ground, all for this singular moment so he can take office and restore the country back to the point of...Clinton-era GOP policy.

Just, never mind his 36-year career in the Senate and voting record, his first two failed presidential campaigns, his eight years as VP, and his third one which was astroturfed to life by red state retail politics and Neoliberal Voltron. All his choices, votes, and actions at any given point in his political career to this point has been a cunning ploy. Just you wait, the guy who had union busters, pro-lifers, and anti-marriage equality officials on the DNC stage promising he's the candidate for the DNC specifically because he won't tack left in office, is quietly Biden' his time for the chance to strike and reverse the half-century of dumpster fire policy he helped enact in the first place.

Never before in American history has an elected official been so eager for the opportunity to destroy his own legislative legacy.

For the democrats to win they have to bribe, beg borrow and steal all the conservative and moderate votes they can get their hands on to get the majority. THAT is exactly what Biden is doing right now. HE is doing what it takes to get the majority by any means possible.
Good thing that strategy was tried once before and worked. I don't know why Biden tried to primary President Clinton in the first place.

C3EC7ppUcAAzg1I.jpg
 

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That would fly in the face of his entire career.



This very same logic works in the opposite way too, so it's not particularly compelling.
I disagree that it "flies in the face of his entire career". Him being a moderate does not mean he is going to hurt the poor here. Hell, if he plans " austerity" for the wealthy on the other hand in order to provide the necessary services to the poor that he has been proposing and reduces corporate welfare, I am not seeing that as a bad thing. At least he doesn't have outright disdain and contempt for the poor and try to trade Puerto Rico for Greenland because he thinks that Puerto Ricans are " dirty and poor" like Trump has vocally expressed repeatedly according to Trump's own staff. Biden didn't come from wealth, he grew up in a multifamily household struggling to survive and understand what real people actually go through here to survive. In the Senate he worked on consumer protection, the environment, government accountability, higher wages, increased unemployment benefits and to reduce homelessness. Although I do not agree with much of what he has said/ done, he is still a MASSIVE improvement over what happens if he loses.
 
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