Enders Game studio releases statement on Orson Scott Card's views

KeyMaster45

Gone Gonzo
Jun 16, 2008
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AJvsRonin said:
And what endless pride parade? I have no idea what you're talking about. Provide evidence of this endless parade, does it just go in circles or does it move from city to city?
Oh my gosh you haven't heard about the Endless Pride Parade? Dude you have no idea what you've been missing.

You see, legend has it the parade started as an acid induced hippie love jam conga line at Burning Man last year. Now normally such a thing would have died out on the outskirts of Burning Man, or as we'll refer to it from now on "Drum Circle Zero", however by an odd twist of fate they arrived in the next town over and got assimilated into the parade for a circus that was passing through town. Some of the veteran hippies, at this point coasting on their ample stores of weed, ended up joining said circus and turned it into an act that circled the tent while the show was on-going. This was the humble beginnings of the Endless Pride Parade.

Now the parade went undetected for months as it was carried from town to town with the circus until the circus found itself in sunny California. Wherein the veteran hippies that had been keeping the conga line alive as a circus act got high and sort of wandered off; taking a few of the clowns with them. It was at this point that the conga line began its mutation into the Endless Pride Parade that we know today.

The veteran hippies, and their newly acquired posse of misfit clowns, conga'd their way into the Castro District of San Francisco. Wherein the hand of fate played it's part once more and they were seamlessly integrated into an ongoing gay pride parade. The hippies and clowns remained none the wiser to what they had conga'd into and actually assumed they had just found their way back to Drum Circle Zero. It's at this point that our story grows uncertain as all we know is that the oldest and most burnt out of the hippies was seen congaing away from the parade that day with a small splinter group of rather flamboyantly dressed participants, the aforementioned misfit clowns, and a parade float populated by a group of Village People impersonators.

Unconfirmed reports have placed it in a number of places across the continental US prior in the months that followed, but the only ones which may be true include the description of a burnt out old hippie leading the charge. The parade would not officially resurface again until Mardi Gras during the Crew of Apollo's annual parade; the infamous Mardi Gras crew comprised entirely of cross-dressers. In what can only be described as a perfect of storm of lax law enforcement, copious amount of alcohol, various illegal drugs, and the general confusion of a New Orleans Mardi Gras, the Endless Pride Parade took its final shape and began it's ultimate march into the annals of legend.

The Apollo parade that year never ended; despite what the authorities would have you believe. It in fact found it's way out of the confines of New Orleans and now roams the great expanse of North and South America combined. It is believed that it's membership is fluid in nature, with participants joining and exiting as it comes upon unsuspecting towns, the only true marker left to indicate it is the lone veteran hippie leading the group; flanked on either side by the only two remaining circus clowns. Whether the trio is aware of what they lead is unknown. Wherever they travel they leave in their wake the remains of one epically fabulous party, tales of mystery and wonder, and confusion.

So if you ever find yourself enjoying a particularly beautiful day, where the area you live in could be described as uncharacteristically "sleepy", keep your eyes and ears open. For you may hear the faint sounds of the YMCA song and spy a burnt out hippie emerging 'round the corner, escorted by a pair of misfit circus clowns.
 

thenumberthirteen

Unlucky for some
Dec 19, 2007
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I'm not surprised they came out and said this since there is a growing boycott of the movie which is starting to get press. Obviously the studio wouldn't come out with something defending OSC in this climate, but at least it's something. Though the "benefit premiere" thing is a bit weird. A bit like doing a Black Pride screening of "Song of the South". Good intentions, but I don't think you get it.

I'm on the fence about "boycotting" the movie. I probably won't see it, but that's just because I only get the chance to see a few movies and I'm not very interested in it as a film. It's a tough one to deal with as it is a film based on a book written by someone who hates gay people; so there are a couple degrees of separation. If the book and movie contained anti gay messages then I wouldn't see it, but, as far as I know, none of his books have that. On the other hand I agreed with the boycott of Chick-Fil-A, and they don't serve a "God hates fags deluxe combo" because my money would be going into the pockets of so called "pro family" groups.

If the movie does really well then he'll sell more books and more of them will be made into movies. Then some of the money for which he'll put into the National Organization for Marriage. Which wouldn't happen if nobody saw it. So maybe a boycott is a good thing.

AJvsRonin said:
Combine this with the fact that during these times it was actually legal to discriminate against homosexuals (fire them from jobs etc) forcing them to hide their identities
It still is in some US states. Which is funny since in the past two jobs I worked at if you fired all the gay/bisexual people you would lose over half the workforce :)
 

thenumberthirteen

Unlucky for some
Dec 19, 2007
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rob_simple said:
AJvsRonin said:
And what endless pride parade? I have no idea what you're talking about. Provide evidence of this endless parade, does it just go in circles or does it move from city to city?
That made me laugh a lot, and I totally agree with you. I've never even seen a gay pride parade, despite living in a massive city, so I don't know where this guy is living that he is endlessly swarmed by them.

Maybe he thinks that this train of fabulous moves from city to city attracting more gay people like a conga line, until eventually they're going to become Legion and march on the lawn of the white house to take over the country. At least that's the only situation I can hypothesise wherein someone could have a problem with gay pride parades.
I'm just imagining something akin to a Brazilian carnival slowly marching along the roads of the US with "Love Train" constantly playing. Then they all get on a cruise ship and sail the seas.
 

Darken12

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Apr 16, 2011
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Johnny Novgorod said:
I don't understand why people care so much about what this guy thinks about anything!
Because money.

If you give him money, he gets wealth and influence, which he is using to actively oppress LGBTQ+ people. He's not even secret about it. He's not some powerless old dude that we can quietly ignore. It would be as if Suzanne Collins or JK Rowling or Stephenie Meyers were dedicated to oppressing a marginalised group and every time someone bought their books or went to see a movie based on them, they donated their money to organisations who perpetuated that oppression.
 

repeating integers

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Mar 17, 2010
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KeyMaster45 said:
AJvsRonin said:
And what endless pride parade? I have no idea what you're talking about. Provide evidence of this endless parade, does it just go in circles or does it move from city to city?
Oh my gosh you haven't heard about the Endless Pride Parade? Dude you have no idea what you've been missing.

You see, legend has it the parade started as an acid induced hippie love jam conga line at Burning Man last year. Now normally such a thing would have died out on the outskirts of Burning Man, or as we'll refer to it from now on "Drum Circle Zero", however by an odd twist of fate they arrived in the next town over and got assimilated into the parade for a circus that was passing through town. Some of the veteran hippies, at this point coasting on their ample stores of weed, ended up joining said circus and turned it into an act that circled the tent while the show was on-going. This was the humble beginnings of the Endless Pride Parade.

Now the parade went undetected for months as it was carried from town to town with the circus until the circus found itself in sunny California. Wherein the veteran hippies that had been keeping the conga line alive as a circus act got high and sort of wandered off; taking a few of the clowns with them. It was at this point that the conga line began its mutation into the Endless Pride Parade that we know today.

The veteran hippies, and their newly acquired posse of misfit clowns, conga'd their way into the Castro District of San Francisco. Wherein the hand of fate played it's part once more and they were seamlessly integrated into an ongoing gay pride parade. The hippies and clowns remained none the wiser to what they had conga'd into and actually assumed they had just found their way back to Drum Circle Zero. It's at this point that our story grows uncertain as all we know is that the oldest and most burnt out of the hippies was seen congaing away from the parade that day with a small splinter group of rather flamboyantly dressed participants, the aforementioned misfit clowns, and a parade float populated by a group of Village People impersonators.

Unconfirmed reports have placed it in a number of places across the continental US prior in the months that followed, but the only ones which may be true include the description of a burnt out old hippie leading the charge. The parade would not officially resurface again until Mardi Gras during the Crew of Apollo's annual parade; the infamous Mardi Gras crew comprised entirely of cross-dressers. In what can only be described as a perfect of storm of lax law enforcement, copious amount of alcohol, various illegal drugs, and the general confusion of a New Orleans Mardi Gras, the Endless Pride Parade took its final shape and began it's ultimate march into the annals of legend.

The Apollo parade that year never ended; despite what the authorities would have you believe. It in fact found it's way out of the confines of New Orleans and now roams the great expanse of North and South America combined. It is believed that it's membership is fluid in nature, with participants joining and exiting as it comes upon unsuspecting towns, the only true marker left to indicate it is the lone veteran hippie leading the group; flanked on either side by the only two remaining circus clowns. Whether the trio is aware of what they lead is unknown. Wherever they travel they leave in their wake the remains of one epically fabulous party, tales of mystery and wonder, and confusion.

So if you ever find yourself enjoying a particularly beautiful day, where the area you live in could be described as uncharacteristically "sleepy", keep your eyes and ears open. For you may hear the faint sounds of the YMCA song and spy a burnt out hippie emerging 'round the corner, escorted by a pair of misfit circus clowns.


You win "best post of the week", my friend. Thank you for making me smile.
 

Bruce

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Jun 15, 2013
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He's a board level member of the National Organization for Marriage.

That particular organisation is linked to attempts to make homosexuality a death penalty offence in Uganda.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2012/dec/30/disgrace-papal-blessing-ugandan-homophobia

Relevant passage:

Uganda has been a target for western evangelicals who see that they're losing the gay marriage battle in their own countries. Religious leaders and rightwing groups, including Rick Warren and the National Organization for Marriage, have gone to Uganda for years to spread anti-gay propaganda and bolster homophobia.
But hey, who cares if a portion of the ticket takings goes towards actually killing people if the movie is good, right?
 
Aug 31, 2012
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fi6eka said:
I'll end this with something interesting for you to think about:In my contry all parades/gaderings promoting sexual, racial, and religious superiority/inferiority of one group over another, are forbiden by law and the only group for whom this law is overlooked, are the LGBT community.Why?
For a moment I was stuck for an answer, then I looked at your wording again, and as far as I can tell, the LGBT community aren't promoting superiority, they are drawing attention to inferiority.
 

rob_simple

Elite Member
Aug 8, 2010
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fi6eka said:
I'll end this with something interesting for you to think about:In my contry all parades/gaderings promoting sexual, racial, and religious superiority/inferiority of one group over another, are forbiden by law and the only group for whom this law is overlooked, are the LGBT community.Why?
How about this: Generally speaking, religious people are allowed to practice their religion, black people and women are allowed to work and vote. Their protests are unnecessary because, again generally speaking, they have won their fight. The LGBT community are the only community who, even in the civilised world, are still denied basic rights like the ability to marry someone they love.

Are these other groups completely free of social oppression and prejudice? Absolutely not, but for the most part none of them actually still have actual laws impacting their lives for being something they had no control over. Again, I will make this point: If there was a law passed tomorrow stating that black people weren't allowed to drive cars because they were black, would you be okay with that? If they outlawed women in the workplace would you just be like, 'yeah whatever' and get on with your day?

I don't know why you think that your country's decision to remove the rights of other people to protest but not the LGBT community is somehow the fault of the LGBT community. If a government chooses to oppress the rights of some people to speak but not others, then that is the fault of the government, not the one community who is still allowed a voice.

Also, you are mixing up gay pride parades with gay rights protests. Gay pride parades do not promote 'gay superiority' as you describe it (nor do the protests, for that matter); what they promote is peoples right to be whoever they want to be without being discriminated against because of their sexual orientation. They're just a bit of fun. Do I want to see some guy in a thong crotch-thrusting his way down the street? Not particularly, so I wouldn't look at it. That doesn't mean I don't completely support his right to do that in the kind of environment where it's understood that's going to be going down. Do you also think Mardi Gras parades are disgusting when scantily clad women in flamboyant dresses dance down the street? Do you think the St Patrick's Day parade is pushing some sort of alcoholics agenda?
 

HellbirdIV

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May 21, 2009
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manic_depressive13 said:
Lionsgate will continue its longstanding commitment to the LGBT community...
If they are so pro-equality why would they collaborate with someone who is against it to begin with? Is there any evidence they gave a single fuck about gay rights before their pockets were threatened? They're either liars or hypocrites, and I'm not too keen to financially support either, let alone a nutjob like Card.
Ender's Game is still a beloved scifi story... or so I've heard, I never actually read it. I don't think an adaptation should need to be "tainted by original sin", y'know?

J.R.R. Tolkien was a South African-born white man with the same racial beliefs as most white men of his era - IE, that blacks can all suck it - and Peter Jackson's adaptation did keep all of its black actors hidden under prosthetics, makeup and black cloaks... So, Peter Jackson's LotR trilogy is thus racist and shouldn't have been made?

Maybe Orson Scott Card is a dick, I wouldn't know, I have only heard and read some tangental points - but really, does it matter? Do we want to see a movie made about Ender's Game or not? Does the writer's political beliefs -really- matter to this adaptation? It certainly hasn't stopped people liking Frank Miller's stuff, and he's a sexist pig.
 

manic_depressive13

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HellbirdIV said:
Ender's Game is still a beloved scifi story... or so I've heard, I never actually read it. I don't think an adaptation should need to be "tainted by original sin", y'know?

J.R.R. Tolkien was a South African-born white man with the same racial beliefs as most white men of his era - IE, that blacks can all suck it - and Peter Jackson's adaptation did keep all of its black actors hidden under prosthetics, makeup and black cloaks... So, Peter Jackson's LotR trilogy is thus racist and shouldn't have been made?

Maybe Orson Scott Card is a dick, I wouldn't know, I have only heard and read some tangental points - but really, does it matter? Do we want to see a movie made about Ender's Game or not? Does the writer's political beliefs -really- matter to this adaptation? It certainly hasn't stopped people liking Frank Miller's stuff, and he's a sexist pig.
With the difference being that when I watched the LotR trilogy Tolkien was well dead. If he was alive and petitioning for the continuation of apartheid in South Africa you can bet your ass I wouldn't be funding his project. It has nothing to do with "original sin". It has to do with the simple fact that I don't want to finance someone's disgusting, discriminatory agenda.

There's a difference between merely being sexist or homophobic, and actively petitioning to push sexist and homophobic legislation. I don't know much about Frank Miller but unless he is an anti-abortion lobbyist or something, it's not really comparable.
 

DefunctTheory

Not So Defunct Now
Mar 30, 2010
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thenumberthirteen said:
rob_simple said:
AJvsRonin said:
And what endless pride parade? I have no idea what you're talking about. Provide evidence of this endless parade, does it just go in circles or does it move from city to city?
That made me laugh a lot, and I totally agree with you. I've never even seen a gay pride parade, despite living in a massive city, so I don't know where this guy is living that he is endlessly swarmed by them.

Maybe he thinks that this train of fabulous moves from city to city attracting more gay people like a conga line, until eventually they're going to become Legion and march on the lawn of the white house to take over the country. At least that's the only situation I can hypothesise wherein someone could have a problem with gay pride parades.
I'm just imagining something akin to a Brazilian carnival slowly marching along the roads of the US with "Love Train" constantly playing. Then they all get on a cruise ship and sail the seas.
For some reason, this made me think of the gay roller. Even though you didn't really describe it.


 

Bruce

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Jun 15, 2013
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HellbirdIV said:
Just one thing that I have seen repeatedly put here that bugs me:

J.R.R. Tolkien was a South African-born white man with the same racial beliefs as most white men of his era - IE, that blacks can all suck it
No he wasn't. He was critical of apartheid and of racism in general. While his work could be argued to have Eurocentric biases, which is to say he was still a product of his time, when it came to what he personally advocated it went totally the other way.

He was actually quite progressive for his time.

A more apt point would be bringing up his support of Franco, but that wasn't really based on anything to do with race but rather the Spanish Red Terror.

*edit just to fix quotes
 

rob_simple

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Aug 8, 2010
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fi6eka said:
Ok, I probably didn't word it properly.We are all equall, so just because you are a christian or negar, doesn't mean you deserve special attention.It's like putting God on the dollar in the US - doesn't that exclude atheists from society, or muslims since it doesn't specify wich god.Imagine having to put up with that shit.The law simply put states that "there are a million other people in this fuckin' country and you're nothing special, so shut the fuck up an pay your taxes shithead".
Okay, here's something you need to understand: we are not all equal. We should be, but the very fact that gay people have been fighting for the right to get married, and still are in other parts of the world --again, in some places they are fighting just to stay alive-- proves that we are not all treated as equals in this world.

Are you white? I have to assume that you are, because everything you say absolutely reeks of White Man's Privilege. You seem to be working on the assumption that gays, 'negars' and Christians are all fighting to become the dominant force in society, and while that is certainly true of a minority of religious factions (not the consensus of the religion as a whole) for the most part people are just asking for acceptance and, if that's not on the cards, tolerance.

You're whole 'wahh it's a double standard' argument is the exact same bullshit I always see men pulling in Feminist threads when they complain that women have the audacity to want equal pay and yet you're not allowed to fuck them just because you buy them dinner. You don't seem to understand what a double standard is: If one group is only slightly less oppressed than the other, that's not a double standard; it's a sad reflection of society, as a whole.

No one is saying that gay people deserve special treatment, what they are saying is they don't deserve to be hated just because they happen to be attracted to the same sex. What you are doing is tantamount to victim-blaming and, in my experience, people who pull that shit are seldom well received by anyone other than those who also share their ignorant views.

Actually, hold on, I think we've got to the crux of the entire problem with your argument:

I can arrest the Neo-nazi on the grounds of disturbing public peace, but I can't do the same to the gay guy
If you honestly...HONESTLY...cannot see the difference between a celebration of pride for being who you are in spite of antiquated social taboos and the work of a group who exist ONLY to preach hate and the eradication of people they don't deem 'racially pure' there is no point in arguing this further.
 

Tono Makt

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Mar 24, 2012
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Henrik Knudsen said:
Tono Makt said:
Henrik Knudsen said:
Ehhh what is the fuzz?

Guessing Orson said something terrible terrible about gays and now the LGBT community is whining again, wanting people to boycott the movie?
And has been a Board-level member of the National Organization for Marriage, which has actively campaigned against Same Sex Marriage.

It's a wee bit more than just saying "Teh gayz r bad."
Oh I see, and now the movie will bad and I shouldn't see it because I might hurt someones feelings?

Guess I will go see it, I'm not too fond of the LGBT community anyway.

I mean, everyone has their civil rights to love whomever they want or dress anyway they feel like. I really couldn't care less, I'm just tired of constantly being bombarded with "Gays in Russia gets beaten by police, sign petition" or the endless pride parades.

Wonder what would happen if I tried to arrange a straight parade... "Homophobe!" I bet would be yelled a lot.

Worst thing is that several gays I know feel exactly the same.
You seem to be deliberately missing the point. It's not merely about hurting feelings - it's about OSC actively working to deny legal rights to same sex couples which heterosexual couples take for granted. It isn't merely about hurt feelings.

And the reason people might yell "Homophobe!" if you tried to arrange a Straight Parade is that your posts that I've responded to in this thread have shown both a lack of understanding of the issue and a lack of caring that you lack an understanding of the issue. If you understood that this was about the actions of OSC in working to deny marriage rights to SSM couples and that you either supported his efforts or you didn't care about his efforts, it would be different. Because of that, it appears that you're simply trying to get a rise out of people and not making an honest attempt at discussion. Given that impression, it would be likely that people would see your Straight Parade as a larger version of the same thing - that you wouldn't be attempting to show pride in being heterosexual, but that you were mocking homosexuals.
 

Thaluikhain

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Apr 4, 2020
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Just because someone calls for a revolution to overthrow the government because it's too tolerant of gay people, doesn't mean he's not a good person. Apparently. Gay people must have too many rights as it is or something.
 
Aug 31, 2012
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fi6eka said:
Zykon TheLich said:
For a moment I was stuck for an answer, then I looked at your wording again, and as far as I can tell, the LGBT community aren't promoting superiority, they are drawing attention to inferiority.
Ok, I probably didn't word it properly.We are all equall, so just because you are a christian or negar, doesn't mean you deserve special attention.It's like putting God on the dollar in the US - doesn't that exclude atheists from society, or muslims since it doesn't specify wich god.Imagine having to put up with that shit.The law simply put states that "there are a million other people in this fuckin' country and you're nothing special, so shut the fuck up an pay your taxes shithead".
As you worded it, protesting to promote superiority is illegal. LGBT rights are not promoting that, as you mentioned, they are promoting equality, which is something they don't have. That is why (I suppose)they are not being dealt with under that law.

Now your attempt to clarify just confuses things "there are a million other people in this fuckin' country and you're nothing special, so shut the fuck up an pay your taxes shithead" basically says to me that, no you can't protest at all. Maybe this is again a problem of wording/translation, but that's not what you said first of all.

RE: God on the dollar etc, yeah and people can protest that shit too, it might not lead to change but they have the right to make a fuss about it.

Also, as a final FYI the Muslim and Christian god is the same, they just differ on which prophets to follow.
 

Imperioratorex Caprae

Henchgoat Emperor
May 15, 2010
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Fighting for the right to halve your assets, spend years in messy divorces, pay alimony to someone because they didn't work and don't want to be married anymore... sounds good to me. Everyone has a right to equal misery. Just as much as they have a right to equal joy, if they can find it.
That said, there will always be detractors to your worldviews, your orientation, etc. And there will always be things you aren't comfortable or tolerant to. And not everyone has self control enough to say, well its not my cup of tea but have at it.
I see the whole debate as silly. Marriage law is ridiculous all the way around and has more potential to fuck you over than it does to "make you happy."
But if you really wanna fight for equal misery, go for it... Get recognized... I think we have bigger issues to work out in this country... bigotry will always be around. Other things won't.
Rodney King said it best "Can't we all just get along?"
No, we can't. Sorry.
Ask the Jews if you really wanna know what oppression is...