Examples of how Feminism works to benefit men

Hagi

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Jiggy said:
Hagi said:
Jiggy said:
Thus far, with Hagi being the latest poster as I write this, nobody has actually fulfilled what the OP is asking for.
My apologies,

I was unaware that the purpose of a forum was to tell the OP what he wanted to hear. I was under the mistaken impression that the purpose was to exchange thoughts and opinions on the subject raised in the OP, whether those opinions fulfil what the OP is asking for or not.

In the future I will ensure that my replies fulfil exactly what the OP is asking for.
And you felt compelled to answer a post that mentioned you only as the last user to post because...?

Yeah, I couldn't think of any real reason for you to give me a snarky answer either.

See, I was just pointing out how thus far the only thing people have posted were claims without proof and shoddy arguments claiming that what the OP is asking for is unnecessary. I find that rather ironic considering how we had a Thread in which Users were insisting that Feminism is all about equality for both Genders and how they totally actively benefit Men. I find it amusing that when push comes to shove nobody seems to have a answer to what those supposed benefits are.
It's pretty easy to think of a real reason if you try.

It's fun!

I personally find it even more ironic that you're criticizing others for not giving sufficient argumentation without yourself giving any argumentation on that.

And you know, feminists are some kind of hive-mind. If one of them claims something it doesn't mean everyone else who also sees themselves as a Feminist suddenly feels exactly the same way. If you want answers about what other users posted in another thread then the solution might just be to quote those other users in that other thread about an answer.

Not criticize entirely different users in an entirely different thread for not providing examples to claims they did not make...

I look forward to hearing your reply explaining to me how you were deeply wronged and offended by my post. I also look forward to hearing more about the evil feminist hive-mind that's directly responsible for any and all claims made by women and people who appear to support women.
 

Gregory McMillan

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Well, it gets men to realize that women are one-half of a greater whole that is the human race. It helps us understand that women do some things better and that many female thought processes (i.e. long-term thinking) can be applied to every field for the betterment and advancement of the human race.
 

itsthesheppy

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I love the implication that somehow men deserve to be benefited directly. As though that would somehow grant legitimacy to a movement whose primary goal is the emancipation and equal, caring, dignified treatment of women worldwide. Allow me to cross my arms over my cardigan and selfishly demand to see how this does me any good.

Well here you go: How about the fact that granting women equality, command over their own reproductive rights and economic opportunity would not only service the economy by adding talent and "man"power we have so-far been handicapping ourselves? How about the effect it would have in helping women manage the number of children they have, thereby addressing the ever-increasing problem of global overpopulation? How about the fact that in many societies all over the world it is a real, tangible humanitarian crisis that deserves our undivided attention? How about in this country it is a source of violence and suffering for our fellow human beings?

I recoil at the suggestion that it somehow needs to put money in our pockets or add vacation days to our calendar or somehow else directly benefit us for it to be worth our effort to try and make life a little less miserable for the other half of the human race.

But if you really need it, here are some ideas for you:

It could help people have better sex, create more career opportunity, and give you more options for hobbies and such [http://melbel.hubpages.com/hub/How-Feminism-Benefits-Men].

This person suggests that women in the workplace means more opportunity for men to stay at home and have a close relationship with children, along with a number of other fairly subjective claims. [http://www.femagination.com/597/benefits-of-feminism-for-men/]

Overall, though, it's about empathy. It's about exercising your mirror neurons [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_neurons#Empathy] a little and being, overall, a better person for it. It's about recognizing the advantages and inequalities we are granted and saddled with in our society, and how we can work together to improve them.

Jiggy said:
Hagi said:
Jiggy said:
Thus far, with Hagi being the latest poster as I write this, nobody has actually fulfilled what the OP is asking for.
My apologies,

I was unaware that the purpose of a forum was to tell the OP what he wanted to hear. I was under the mistaken impression that the purpose was to exchange thoughts and opinions on the subject raised in the OP, whether those opinions fulfil what the OP is asking for or not.

In the future I will ensure that my replies fulfil exactly what the OP is asking for.
And you felt compelled to answer a post that mentioned you only as the last user to post because...?

Yeah, I couldn't think of any real reason for you to give me a snarky answer either.

See, I was just pointing out how thus far the only thing people have posted were claims without proof and shoddy arguments claiming that what the OP is asking for is unnecessary. I find that rather ironic considering how we had a Thread in which Users were insisting that Feminism is all about equality for both Genders and how they totally actively benefit Men. I find it amusing that when push comes to shove nobody seems to have a answer to what those supposed benefits are.
What do you mean "nobody"? The first eight replies all independently gave reasons. What are you looking for, if not for people to answer the question that was asked?
 

3quency

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Well I don't exactly have proof to back this up by my understanding is that feminism does raise awareness that male abuse and rape do happen and are problems, and as a knock-on of that men who have suffered either will feel less ashamed to speak out.

So feminism fights abuse of both genders which is good.
 

General Twinkletoes

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Jan 24, 2011
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Wolverine18 said:
GeneralTwinkle said:
It can help straight married couples have enough money to live comfortably :D!
Except that's the opposite of what feminism did. While I do think women should be given equal rights to work, by effectively doubling the work force you have in fact DEFLATED wages (basic supply and demand).

It used to be that a single wage earner could earn enough to support a family of 4-5. Now, the wages are such that it often takes 2 wage earners to support a family of only 2-3.

While feminism was trying to give women the OPTION to work, its pretty much FORCED them to work now because of the new equilibrium point for wages and the social pressures placed on women by other women.

I think its worth the harm to society cause by the doubling of the workforce to give everyone equal opportunities, but there is no doubt harm was caused.
Wat.
You're acting like because women got less money, they never worked at all when they're in a relationship in a man.
Just that idea alone makes it hard to take your argument seriously. Women never, ever worked then? Right.
And in no way are women forced to work, even by other peoples standards. There are plenty of people who are just fine with staying at home now. Feminism doesn't slap you across the hand if you actually want to be a stay at home wife.

Seriously? Doubling the work force? That may have been true compared to 60 years ago, but women started working long before the wage disparity was fixed. Feminist movements in the 70's 80's may have (Almost, probably close to 50%) doubled the workforce, but even after that there was a wage difference, which is now getting fixed. There is no way in hell that that has doubled the work force.
 

Clearing the Eye

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DevilWithaHalo said:
Your participation in this thread assumes the following; that you accept the position that Feminism is a movement dedicated to equality of the sexes.
"If you don't accept what I have to say, you aren't allowed to talk in this thread. I'm right. You're wrong. Go away."

Oh this thread will be fun.
 

Relish in Chaos

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Well, I?d assume that most men want to live in a world of equality, as well as not feel that they have to act ?manly? or take shit for having feminine qualities. I mean, balance is overall good for society and our growing economy in general. And both genders may be able to ?understand? each other better too, if they?re more on an even playing field.
 

Clearing the Eye

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Toilet said:
Feminism benefits me because it teaches me to steer clear of women who have Tumblr accounts.

Ho Ho, silly feminists and their aspirations to be taken seriously.
Whatever you do, don't call them a ****. Shit goes real bad if you do.
 

Basement Cat

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Jul 26, 2012
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Here's an example of how feminism benefits men: MONEY IN THE BANK!!!

The push for equal rights has resulted in the disparity between men and women's income closing notably. In time (possibly a lot of time) it will eliminate differences in income based solely because of gender differences.

How does this benefit men? In today's economy married couples routinely find that BOTH individuals have to work to make ends meet. With the (slow) elimination of the old style "Women are less capable so we pay 'em less" mentality that dominated the 20th century work field women's incomes are beginning to match men's job for job. Countless studies have shown that financial distress is the top reason for divorce in the modern era.

Equal pay==avoidable source of stress==more stable marriage.

Another (albeit long-term) benefit of equal pay benefitting men is that father's will know their daughters are being paid properly rather than being underpaid because they have ovaries rather than testicles. Knowing your children can take care of themselves financially is an enormous source of relief for caring parents. On what some might view as a selfish note it means parents don't need to worry about their daughters moving back in with them until they're 40 or so simply because they're being underpaid solely because of their gender.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Isn't it commonsensical that there is nothing inherently wrong with it, least until reason leaves the issue and you get whack ass extremism.
 

itsthesheppy

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Wolverine18 said:
GeneralTwinkle said:
It can help straight married couples have enough money to live comfortably :D!
Except that's the opposite of what feminism did. While I do think women should be given equal rights to work, by effectively doubling the work force you have in fact DEFLATED wages (basic supply and demand).

It used to be that a single wage earner could earn enough to support a family of 4-5. Now, the wages are such that it often takes 2 wage earners to support a family of only 2-3.

While feminism was trying to give women the OPTION to work, its pretty much FORCED them to work now because of the new equilibrium point for wages and the social pressures placed on women by other women.

I think its worth the harm to society cause by the doubling of the workforce to give everyone equal opportunities, but there is no doubt harm was caused.
There is doubt that harm was cause. This is me, doubting that. I know plenty of families who've made a great deal more money by virtue of women entering the workplace. My family, for one. So... there's one example of your statement being mistaken, I guess.

The logic of your point is somewhat damaged by the reasoning that more people working means more people who have money, who then spend that money in higher volume, meaning the economy is more robust and grows, creating more jobs. When Wall Street is gambling the world away, that is.

Who were mostly men, it seems. Funny, that. But now I'm just being flippant.
 

General Twinkletoes

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Jan 24, 2011
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Wolverine18 said:
GeneralTwinkle said:
Wolverine18 said:
GeneralTwinkle said:
It can help straight married couples have enough money to live comfortably :D!
Except that's the opposite of what feminism did. While I do think women should be given equal rights to work, by effectively doubling the work force you have in fact DEFLATED wages (basic supply and demand).

It used to be that a single wage earner could earn enough to support a family of 4-5. Now, the wages are such that it often takes 2 wage earners to support a family of only 2-3.

While feminism was trying to give women the OPTION to work, its pretty much FORCED them to work now because of the new equilibrium point for wages and the social pressures placed on women by other women.

I think its worth the harm to society cause by the doubling of the workforce to give everyone equal opportunities, but there is no doubt harm was caused.
Wat.
You're acting like because women got less money, they never worked at all when they're in a relationship in a man.
Just that idea alone makes it hard to take your argument seriously. Women never, ever worked then? Right.
Actually most married women did not work prior to WWII.

And in no way are women forced to work, even by other peoples standards. There are plenty of people who are just fine with staying at home now. Feminism doesn't slap you across the hand if you actually want to be a stay at home wife.
My wife disagrees. While she is stay at home by choice, she catches lots of crap for it from other women.

Seriously? Doubling the work force? That may have been true compared to 60 years ago, but women started working long before the wage disparity was fixed. Feminist movements in the 70's 80's may have (Almost, probably close to 50%) the workforce, but even after that there was a wage difference, which is now getting fixed. There is no way in hell that that has doubled the work force.
Pre WWII almost no women, and most men, worked.

By 2012, most men and women work, if they can find jobs.

While not EXACTLY double, its roughly doubling the available workforce by including women as well as men in the pool of potential workers since there are roughly the same number of each.
Read what I said, man. Compared to 60 years ago, yes it's doubled. But I'm talking about today's feminist movement, which has totally different goals. Like fixing the wage disparity, which then helps couples live better. Then that takes us back to the OT :D
 

saintdane05

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Uch, I have to break out the Copypasta



Common myths and misconceptions about feminism include:

All feminists are women.
Just as it's possible for straight people to be in favor of same-sex marriage, or for non-Jews to be against anti-Semitism, it is very much possible for men to identify as feminist. Some well-known men who identify as feminists or have expressed feminist ideals include Alan Alda, Joss Whedon, Kurt Cobain, John Lennon, Hayao Miyazaki, Henrik Ibsen, John Stuart Mill, Linkara and most of his male colleagues, Frederick Douglass, and L. Frank Baum.
It's worth noting that there's a minority school of thought that says while men can (and should) support feminism, they shouldn't identify themselves as feminists, because they think feminism is fundamentally about women solving their own problems without looking to men to do it for them. Men sympathetic to feminism who agree with this point of view generally describe themselves as "pro-feminist."

All feminists are lesbians.
Lesbians have been an important part of the feminist movement pretty much from day one ? prominent lesbian or bisexual feminists include Andrea Dworkin, Valerie Solanas, Simone de Beauvoir, Judith Butler, Julia Serano, Camille Paglia and Mary Daly. However, many (probably most) feminists are straight women. There are also male feminists (straight, bisexual, gay and asexual), asexual feminists, transgender feminists, and feminists of any other sexuality and gender identity you can think of.
There have been a few feminist writers ? especially during the 1970's, before the movement had made as many gains as it had today ? who suggested that it might not be possible to have a truly egalitarian heterosexual relationship as long as sexism remained pervasive in society. This was fiercely debated even at the time, though, and it was never mainstream feminist dogma that women had to swear off sex with men to become feminists.

All feminists are hairy-legged, makeup-shunnin', boot-wearin' brutes.
As much as feminists dislike the "women must be dainty and pretty" messages that society/media blast at them, for most, it's the must part that they object to. Some feminists choose to avoid or reject mainstream beauty ideals as a statement of protest, and there are even some who adhere to a Real Women Never Wear Dresses philosophy ? but it's increasingly argued that valuing traditionally masculine behavior (like being unconcerned about looks) over traditionally feminine behavior (like wearing dresses and makeup) is ultimately pretty anti-feminist in itself. Most feminists just think men and women should be equally free to decide for themselves how much effort they care to put into their appearance.

Feminism was invented in the 1970s.
Go back to any place and time where there has been widespread discrimination against women, and you will find feminism. (Or at least something that looks like feminism if you squint hard enough.) The word "feminism" dates back to 1895, and Christine de Pizan was writing feminist works as far back as the early 15th century. If you believe that men can be feminists and that identifying with the movement isn't essential, then according to some interpretations of his work feminism may go all the way back to Euripides. That would make Feminism Older Than Feudalism. (On the other hand, some of his contemporaries called him misogynistic even by Ancient Greek standards.)

Feminists think men and women are 100% identical.
Most feminists would agree that there are slight, overall differences between the sexes. While sentiments like "men tend to be slightly physically stronger than women" can lead to arguments if stated/interpreted wrongly, the majority of feminists would concede that, yes, males generally have females beat in raw strength. What really grinds a feminist's gears are suggestions that:
Something that applies to one sex is universal and cannot apply to the other sex. ("Any man is physically stronger than any woman, ever, period.")
*Differences between the sexes are an excuse for sexual discrimination. ("Women are not as physically strong as men, and thus no women should ever be allowed to have jobs that require lifting heavy objects.") (Or, even worse, "Women are not as physically strong as men, and thus no woman should ever be allowed to have jobs.")
*Failure to adhere to expectations about one's sex is an excuse for ridicule. ("Any man weaker than a woman is a loser; any woman stronger than a man is a freak.")
Likewise, feminists often wonder how much of certain purported differences - say, girls being better at reading and boys being better at math - are actual innate differences, versus how much they might be a result of socialization (e.g., girls are scared away from pursuing math/boys refuse to spend time reading because they don't want to behave "inappropriately" for their gender and/or they're already convinced they'll be bad at it due to their gender). Most feminists don't deny that it's possible there are some real, innate psychological differences between the sexes ? they just think those differences are probably pretty small, and that it's better to just treat people to as individuals.
Feminists also have a problem with attributing to gender individual character traits that could have originated from other sources, like natural human reactions. For example, Jenny is crying because her father died ? which surely warrants a good cry ? but people observing her assume that she's emotionally distraught because she's a giiiiirl. (If you're about to protest that this sort of behavioral mis-assignment could happen to anyone, well, you're right: it's a known psychological bias called the fundamental attribution error.)
And just to complicate matters further, there's a whole school of thought (though, again, not the mainstream these days) called Difference Feminism, which argues that there are real, significant, biological differences between men and women, and that feminism should be not about treating men and women as the same, but about making sure feminine traits aren't devalued in comparison with masculine ones.

Feminists are frigid, hate sex, and want to stop anyone from enjoying porn or fanservice.
Feminists have a problem with porn tropes that promote a degrading or hateful view of women (Victim Falls For Rapist, Not If They Enjoyed It Rationalization, Sex Slave, etc.), and with the ways the porn industry exploits a lot of the women who work for it. Some (again, this was a more popular position in the 1970's than it is today) do think porn inherently objectifies women and is therefore always misogynistic; other feminists, though, think what the world actually needs is better porn ? porn that presents sex as something where both partners' desires should be equally important. There's more of a consensus on fanservice: feminists are generally not against seeing sexy ladies in media, but don't like how often the ladies' Character Development is pushed aside in favor of looking at their, err, other developments. In any case, most feminists enjoy sex just fine, and those who don't are typically at least okay with the idea of it. There's even a whole faction of the movement, called Sex-Positive Feminism, that focuses on working to promote positive and empowering views of sexuality.

Feminists hate men, think women are better than men, and think women should have more power than men.
Women who seriously blame men for everything are known to readers of this wiki as Straw Feminists and to mainstream feminists as "wrong." Most feminists don't think sexism is primarily something all individual men do to all individual women ? the problem is patriarchy, which is the name for the whole system of cultural ideas and institutions that function to oppress and control women. Women can ? and frequently do ? act in ways that support patriarchy, and men can ? and do ? fight patriarchy. The point of feminism (as much as such a vast and highly fragmented movement can be said to have a point) is to raise women to the level of rights/respect that men have had for centuries, not to drag men down to subhuman levels as some cosmic act of revenge.

Feminists think women are the only ones who are hurt by sexism, and don't care about men's problems.
It's pretty uncontroversial in feminist circles to point out that patriarchy hurts men in plenty of ways. (Some would argue that it hurts women more on the whole, but others think the whole question of whose oppression is worse is a pointless distraction from actually working to fix things.) A lot of feminists specifically focus on the ways men's oppression and women's oppression are linked ? for instance, many argue that companies need to start granting paternity leave both so that fathers can have the chance to bond with their kids, and so that women aren't always assumed to be the ones who are automatically responsible for child care.

Feminists burn bras.
Back in The Sixties, there were some public demonstrations in which feminists threw bras, high heels, and other fashion-related items into trash cans to protest unrealistic standards of beauty. A newspaper headline compared these actions to men burning draft cards during The Vietnam War. The two ideas got jumbled together in the public consciousness, and the myth of bra-burning continues to this day.
Feminists are angry, bitter harpies.

Most feminists will have certain Double Standards they especially loathe; however, they don't go around being cranky all the time, any more than atheists do. (Besides, don't we all have certain double standards we especially loathe? Fundamental attribution error at work again, ladies and gentlemen.)

Now, if you excuse me. *walks away from the flames.*

<youtube=JPZOaPg1fqo>
 

Phasmal

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Jun 10, 2011
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Wolverine18 said:
And in no way are women forced to work, even by other peoples standards. There are plenty of people who are just fine with staying at home now. Feminism doesn't slap you across the hand if you actually want to be a stay at home wife.
My wife disagrees. While she is stay at home by choice, she catches lots of crap for it from other women.
Whatever your life choice, there will always be someone who disagrees with it.
I know people who have decided not to have kids, and they get crap for it.
I know people who have decided to have kids and stay at home, they get crap for it.
I also know people who have kids and work, do you know what they get for it? Crap.

It doesn't really prove your point that individuals disagree with other individuals.

I'm a feminist who plans to stay at home with kids, and I've always worked in a `pink-collar` job. It has nothing to do with whether or not I view genders as equal.

OT- Daystar /threaded this quickly.
 

Hagi

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Jiggy said:
See above, the one person that I actually quoted is one of said people, all everybody else was told is that they didn't actually answer the Thread accordingly.
Which is the part I replied to.

They have no obligation whatsoever to do so.

Now please, tell me more about how I should wear protection and how amazingly snarky you can be as well.
 

Aanorith

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Mar 17, 2009
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You know what? I am tired of feminism being discussed all the time. Every single discussion its the same patterns. Feminism is good for everyone, men are discriminated to, not to the same degree, there is sexsism everywhere, double standards, feminists enabled porn, feminists are aginst porn, bla bla bla.

I refuse the term of feminism. I do not acknowledge and ISMs.
Cant we all just agree that 2-3 or multiple people doing the same job deserves equal pay regardless of gender.

People living in the same country, same rights regardless of gender.
Same rights socially in society regardless of gender.

And one thing that has been bothering me for such a long time now, where everyone and everything in media and education are trying to wipe the line out between genders. Its good to some extent, nothing sould be limited to anyone. BUT we are (especially Sweden) getting to a point where some people doesnt even seem to want to ackknowledge that there ARE different genders.

How about, instead of a thread that reads: Examples of how works to benefit
Driving work, education, social, national, global whatever equality forward.

No more labels, we're all people.