Feds are reportedly abducting people in portland

[Trunkage]

Oh yeah, there are a ton of different libertarians since its a really naive political philosophy so each one tends to have their own views about how it would not actually work, but work.

I'd say there is just as many Marxists and Capitalists because both are pretty naive

 

[Gordon_4]

I've been meaning for years to have a thread discussing the various often-overlapping factions of the conservative movement (it's just generally fascinating how they've managed to wrangle so many competing and sometimes antithetical ideological components into a semi-cohesive political movement). But factionalization is a major thing, particularly when libertarians clash with social conservatives and defense (chicken)hawks. And even within those factions there's splintering.

Its the People’s Front of Judaea, just in real fucking life.

 

[Avnger]

Seems the biggest factor here is that they actually try to represent their various constituencies rather than leaning on "it could be worse".

Considering their voter demographics, Democrats represent their constituents pretty well.

Though at this point, I'm pretty sure the Platonic form "leftism" itself could be the ticket, and you'd still claim it's not pure enough to represent you and the "silent leftist majority" you seem to think exists.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Considering their voter demographics, Democrats represent their constituents pretty well.

Oh, are their voters all anthropomorphic dollar signs?

 

[Trunkage]

Oh, are their voters all anthropomorphic dollar signs?

No but it's closer than anthropomorphic dollar who goes around beating people up for their lunch money and then pretends the victim is being mean for existing

 

[Zeke davis]

Pretty Gnarly. Stay strong Portland.

 

[Seanchaidh]

No but it's closer than anthropomorphic dollar who goes around beating people up for their lunch money and then pretends the victim is being mean for existing

What are you even talking about?

 

[Revnak]

Considering their voter demographics, Democrats represent their constituents pretty well.

Though at this point, I'm pretty sure the Platonic form "leftism" itself could be the ticket, and you'd still claim it's not pure enough to represent you and the "silent leftist majority" you seem to think exists.

Hey, hey, you see this???

Pretty Gnarly. Stay strong Portland.

This is the sort of thing that has been going on in Portland for two months that Biden is ABSOLUTELY OK with. This is the sort of thing this thread is actually about, not you larping as an enemy of fascism by supporting the boys in blue over the ones in camo. Biden is part of the problem, the Democratic establishment of Oregon is part of this problem and your bullshit doesn’t resolve any of it. When Republicans complain about the chaos in the streets of Dem run cities, they aren’t lying about the fact that the democrats are to blame here, they’re just lying about what precisely the problem is.

 

[Avnger]

Hey, hey, you see this???

This is the sort of thing that has been going on in Portland for two months that Biden is ABSOLUTELY OK with. This is the sort of thing this thread is actually about, not you larping as an enemy of fascism by supporting the boys in blue over the ones in camo. Biden is part of the problem, the Democratic establishment of Oregon is part of this problem and your bullshit doesn’t resolve any of it. When Republicans complain about the chaos in the streets of Dem run cities, they aren’t lying about the fact that the democrats are to blame here, they’re just lying about what precisely the problem is.

No, he's not "ABSOLUTELY OK'" with it. He's called for a number of reforms to police departments and criticized police brutality and police militarization. If you don't think he goes far enough, that's entirely fair. To say he's fine with current practices is some grade-A bullshit though.

Biden made the comment in a video conversation with Ady Barkan, a prominent progressive activist who has ALS and just endorsed Biden.

[...]

Biden spoke to Barkan about how to improve policing. He called for a focus on community policing -- those comments did not appear in the video -- and for federal "pattern or practice" investigations into troubled police departments. He also criticized no-knock warrants for drug cases. And Biden said the federal government should have access to records about officers' misconduct.

[...]

"Surplus military equipment for law enforcement: they don't need that. The last thing you need is an up-armored Humvee coming into a neighborhood; it's like the military invading. They don't know anybody, they become the enemy; they're supposed to be protecting these people," he said.

[...]

According to the audio provided by the Biden campaign, Biden responded, in comments that were not included in the video, "I've proposed that kind of reform. And by the way, the idea though -- that's not the same as getting rid of or defunding all the police." He said you could not just send his daughter Ashley, who has a master's degree in social work, to the site of a domestic dispute; instead, he said, "you can send along a social worker with a police officer. We need significantly more help."

Biden continued by calling for the series of changes we outlined in our above fact check on the "enemy" remark, including a focus on community policing and more investigations of police departments. After Biden criticized the police use of military vehicles, Barkan interjected, "But do we agree that we can redirect some of the funding?"
Biden said, "Yes, absolutely."

The video omits the comments Biden made immediately after that. But those comments are important.
After his "absolutely," Biden immediately returned to his previous proposal about putting conditions on federal funding to police funding.

"And by the way, not just redirect -- condition them. If they don't eliminate chokeholds, they don't get Byrne grants. If they don't do the following, they don't get any help." Noting that most police funding comes from local and state governments, Biden continued, "It's only the federal government comes in on top of that, and so it says, 'You want help? You have to do the following reforms: you have to make sure you have no-knock warrants eliminated, if you have them, you don't get Byrne grants. If you have them, boom.'"

 

[Revnak]

No, he's not "ABSOLUTELY OK'" with it. He's called for a number of reforms to police departments and criticized police brutality and police militarization. If you don't think he goes far enough, that's entirely fair. To say he's fine with current practices is some grade-A bullshit though.

Odd, because he was fine with it in Ferguson and his primary complaint was that the Feds were involved. And where in there does he mention anything about tactics for suppressing protests and arresting dissidents. Not seeing that in your bullshit. Instead it boils down to reforms tons of cities already have which have done fuckall aside from sound like an attempt to address the issue on paper.

 

[Trunkage]

What are you even talking about?

Just using your creation for the Dems and throwing a GOP pastiche over it

 

[Specter Von Baren]

No but it's closer than anthropomorphic dollar who goes around beating people up for their lunch money and then pretends the victim is being mean for existing

You mean communists?

 

[Trunkage]

You mean communists?

No, that capitalists. Communists wouldnt have the dollar sign

 

[Avnger]

Odd, because he was fine with it in Ferguson and his primary complaint was that the Feds were involved. And where in there does he mention anything about tactics for suppressing protests and arresting dissidents. Not seeing that in your bullshit. Instead it boils down to reforms tons of cities already have which have done fuckall aside from sound like an attempt to address the issue on paper.

Literally that entire last part of the quote in my previous post about introducing community policing, restructuring police funding to use some of it for services such as social workers instead, increasing federal standards for receiving funds, and increasing investigations into improper actions. I was going to re-quote it, but it would put me over the post character limit.

From a speech this time:

"Congressman Jeffries has a bill to outlaw choke holds. Congress should put it on President Trump's desk in the next few days.

There are other measures: to stop transferring weapons of war to police forces, to improve oversight and accountability, to create a model use of force standard — that also should be made law this month.

No more excuses. No more delays."

[...]

"Looking ahead, in the first 100 days of my presidency, I have committed to creating a national police oversight commission.

I've long believed we need real community policing.

And we need each and every police department in the country to undertake a comprehensive review of their hiring, their training, and their de-escalation practices.

And the federal government should give them the tools and resources they need to implement reforms."

Again, feel free to say he doesn't go far enough. There's plenty of room to disagree and discuss which policies will have the most effect. However, to make the claim that he's pulling a "this is fine" meme is to ignore reality.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

No, that capitalists. Communists wouldnt have the dollar sign

(Smacks forehead)

Right, of course, silly me.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Again, feel free to say he doesn't go far enough. There's plenty of room to disagree and discuss which policies will have the most effect. However, to make the claim that he's pulling a "this is fine" meme is to ignore reality.

I don't know, this seems kind of bad.

 

[Trunkage]

(Smacks forehead)

Right, of course, silly me.

Capitalism likes to kill plenty of innocents.

The difference is that there isn't one leader doing the killing. It hundreds.

And the US, to make sure Capitalism wins, has killed how many? Trump killed about 4000 with drones alone since he started. But you know

(Smacks forehead)

Right, of course, silly me.

when you think about the tens of millions of innocents killed every year Capitalism, you kinda realise it’s no better than Communism. Generally it’s just Imperialism but companies do the invading and exploiting, not countries so it’s not much better than that

Capitalism and Communism are loser arguments. I hope one day that we can move past this false dichotomy

 

[Buyetyen]

Capitalism likes to kill plenty of innocents.

The difference is that there isn't one leader doing the killing. It hundreds.

And the US, to make sure Capitalism wins, has killed how many? Trump killed about 4000 with drones alone since he started. But you know

The body count in the US in the name of "reopening" the economy in the midst of a historic pandemic is... (checks notes) approximately 155,000 and climbing. And in only half a year, too. Some genocidal dictators aren't that productive.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Capitalism and Communism are loser arguments. I hope one day that we can move past this false dichotomy

Hey dude, once someone actually comes up with a new system that works, I'm all ears.

 

[Trunkage]

The body count in the US in the name of "reopening" the economy in the midst of a historic pandemic is... (checks notes) approximately 155,000 and climbing. And in only half a year, too. Some genocidal dictators aren't that productive.

Well, I wouldn’t count all of them. Some of it is just a pandemic, say a third. The reopening (and slow to react businesses) probably killed a third. Stupid government responses like Cuomo putting COVID patients in nursing home can have a quarter. Stupid individual citizens not being responsible can have a little left over,

I want to make sure the blame is spread around appropriately. Like, I don’t blame Trump for all the deaths.