The only thing they did wrong was not making the musicians playing the song "The Rains of Castamere" obvious enough, I don't think non-readers would have likely gotten that it was the song they were playing. It was such an excellent moment in the book, when they slowly started to realise what was happening around them, although they did kind of do it by showing that Lord Bolton had chain-mail on.
Even though they did switch and move things around, I think they did a pretty good job overall, especially how they tied in Jon Snow and the Warg whose name I forget (the one with the eagle), whereas that happened much earlier in the books.
It still sucks that the Starks have been more or less "brought down", as they were my favourite family in the series. Especially the Dire Wolves, who have been very lacking in representation.
Now that I've known what was coming for literally years...It was STILL one of the most shocking things I've ever seen. Can we just give MIchelle Fairley all of the Emmys now?
Michelle Fairley's performance during the last five minutes of that episode was fantastic.
Watching her desperately try and secure Robb's freedom - pleading with Frey, grabbing/threatening his wife, offering herself as a hostage, even just the expression/s on her face throughout the scene, everything.
Very much looking forward to the finale, but not so much the long wait until season four...
Now all that's left is a lot of gossip and family intriges bullshit. It'll take forever until a good plotline re-arranges again, unless the story just jumps years forward and bring the white walker and the dragons all to King's Landings at once.
Now all that's left is a lot of gossip and family intriges bullshit. It'll take forever until a good plotline re-arranges again, unless the story just jumps years forward and bring the white walker and the dragons all to King's Landings at once.
I've grown insensitive and apathic to this kind of footage through years of internet exposure, but I was still touched by episode 9. Even though I read all the books and knew what was coming. The buildup toward the event was even more tense than the event itself though, at least for me.
The way it was executed, impartial and without any emotion, except at the very end, made it one of the best moments in recent television history for me.
lucky_sharm said:
LuisGuimaraes said:
SacremPyrobolum said:
LuisGuimaraes said:
Meh... No Players, No Game.
Now all that's left is a lot of gossip and family intriges bullshit. It'll take forever until a good plotline re-arranges again, unless the story just jumps years forward and bring the white walker and the dragons all to King's Landings at once.
Quite right, this is just the way Martin writes: no one is safe (well except a few, that's the theory at least), characters come and go. The lack of plot armor is one of the things that just makes this series and this story work imo.
I absolutely love authors who dare to take on this kind of challenge, there are very few of them indeed. Only ones I remember except Martin are Hiroya Oku (Gantz) and some works by Jack Vance (one of the inspirations for Martin, RIP Jack).
Now all that's left is a lot of gossip and family intriges bullshit. It'll take forever until a good plotline re-arranges again, unless the story just jumps years forward and bring the white walker and the dragons all to King's Landings at once.
Not to mention Tyrells, Dorne, and Daenarys (She 'does' wanna start a fleet at -some- point.... It's on the list at least) Not to mention Rickon. I mean, Sansa and Arya are girls and as such irrelevant outside Dorne unless they get married, and Jon Snow is oathbound to the Watch, and Bran's a wizard (Or a warg, whatevss!) Rickon is where it's at. He just has to gather an army and, well... Nevermind.
I found the episode very entertaining and the final scene was excellently done in my opinion, I loved how they did it however I also hate what happened. Roose is a evil guy but he has a certain charm about him but I wouldn't mind seeing him getting stabbed himself.
I was actually really OK with the end of that episode.
That plot thread was basically going nowhere, and I didn't much care for any of those characters to begin with. So it just lets the rest of the plot (wherein things actually happen) take up a little more space in an episode.
In terms of houses I was generally rooting for both, leaning towards Dany. This last episode just leaves me with one 'group' to root for even though there are still plenty of Stark characters still around.
Exceptionally well done. I've read the books, so the entire episode (since I knew what was going to come based on the title of the episode - "Rains of Castamere") I was on the edge of my seat with anticipation, waiting for the particular moment to come. I only had one real problem with the episode, and that was
That Greywind didn't get his epic moment before dying that he does in the books. In SoS, he manages to break free of his kennel and kill several Frey guardsmen before finally succumbing to crossbow bolts. Instead, in the episode, he just gets shot in the kennel. Still emotional, and I understand that it is difficult to train dogs to go on fake killing sprees (although they just did that with Summer and Shaggydog earlier that same episode). I just wished that would have gotten the same treatment as the books. The best part, in my opinion, was the very end with the look on Catelyn's face followed by slitting and then dead silent credits. AMAZING!
But, yeah, superb episode that has been built up over several episodes that finally pays off in a humongous way. Probably the best of the season so far, just like every episode 9 of every season, oddly enough.
Thing is, in the books you never actually see it. It just get's mentioned, once, second hand, that he managed to kill a few Freys, so it's actually kind of pathetic in the books. I actually thought the way the show did it was better and far more fitting. This way the direwolf, symbolic of the Starks and the Stark cause, and connected on a subconscious level with Robb himself, goes the same way as his master did. Neither of them get to go down fighting in the heat of battle, as much as I would have liked them too. Instead, they're both slaughtered when they're powerless to do anything about it. In the book, I didn't like the thought of Grey Wind dying (especially after what happens to his and Robb's bodies afterwards). However, Grey Wind' death in the books is just kind of lost in the long list of people who get snuffed out at the Red Wedding, not really carrying any emotional weight of its own. In the show, it did, especially with Arya being there to see it.
OT: The episode was just... my God. I don't even know what to say. I've read all the books so I knew exactly what was coming, and I thought I would be emotionally prepared. I guess it stands as testament to all involved in the show that they made me feel physically sick regardless. The build up was perfect. From the first line of 'The Rains of Castermere' playing, I felt exactly the same way I did first reading it in the book ("No... this isn't right. This isn't right at all... Oh God, get out of there, get out of there now!"). That 'You should have seen this coming' moment between Cat and Roose Bolton was perfect. Tulisa's death made me audibly gasp. The execution was perfect, the way it just seemed to drag on and on and on, getting worse and worse. The ending was perfect.
I actually though it did a couple of things better than the book. The aforementioned slaughter of Grey Wind is more fitting and it carries more weight. I also thought replacing a half-mad grandson with Walder Frey's wife in Cat's ultimatum was an improvement. In the book, you know full well just how little of a fuck Lord Frey is going to give about losing one grandson before he says so, so it just seems stupid, rather than desperate, on Cat's part. In the show, it was still only the faintest glimmer of hope, but you can imagine Cat thinking that there was at least a tiny chance that Walder Frey wouldn't so casually discard a young, fertile wife, so when he does it's all the more crushing.
As to where I thought it fell short in comparison to the book, any objections I have are not with the presentation of the Red Wedding itself, but rather the episodes running up to it. I wish they'd spent time discussing the cultural significance of Guest Right, to further underline the extent of the betrayal, and to make it slightly more plausible for the Starks to believe that they're not waling into a trap. I also wish they'd developed more of the Stark banner men other than Lord Karstark and Lord Bolton, so it would have been more than just a bunch of extras being murdered alongside Robb, Cat and Tulisa (where the fuck has The Greatjon from Season 1 gone?!).
And they messed up his line! "The Lannisters give their regards." No! "Jamie Lannister gives his regards." I'm pretty sure they kept the bit in where Jamie tells Bolton to give his regards to Robb Stark, so why would they change that line? Would it not have been obvious enough that Bolton had sold out Robb to the Lannisters?
Because they've spent so much time this season building up Jaime as something of a sympathetic character, and they need all the opportunity they can get to focus audience hatred on the Lannisters we're meant to hate. Not to mention that there's significantly less evidence of Tywin' involvement in the show than in the books, so any potential nod to his involvement is one they have to take. I was initially a bit put off too, but quickly realised it makes sense, as we don't have Jaime's internal monologue to help temper our perspective of him.
I've yet to see anyone complain about the fact they gave the line to Roose, instead of some nameless Frey.
Er, it's also to really drive home that the Lannisters are ultimately responsible for allying the Boltons and the Frey's against Rob. There are plenty of hints that the Lannisters are involved for the observant, but it would have totally flown over the heads of the tits/blood crowd if they didn't make it patently obvious.
Now we know why Tywin was writing so many letters all season when he had a war to win, eh?
As to where I thought it fell short in comparison to the book, any objections I have are not with the presentation of the Red Wedding itself, but rather the episodes running up to it. I wish they'd spent time discussing the cultural significance of Guest Right, to further underline the extent of the betrayal, and to make it slightly more plausible for the Starks to believe that they're not waling into a trap. I also wish they'd developed more of the Stark banner men other than Lord Karstark and Lord Bolton, so it would have been more than just a bunch of extras being murdered alongside Robb, Cat and Tulisa (where the fuck has The Greatjon from Season 1 gone?!).
The salt and bread I've needed to explain to all of my friends. It came up in S1, but we haven't heard of it since then.
And even if people "got" that it was an indication that they were guests or something, no one understands that after the Red Wedding no one in Westeros will trust or like the Freys and everyone thinks they're cursed by the gods.
Now all that's left is a lot of gossip and family intriges bullshit. It'll take forever until a good plotline re-arranges again, unless the story just jumps years forward and bring the white walker and the dragons all to King's Landings at once.
The war didn't get to happen.
Thousands of lives were spared.
Everybody is back to their own business.
It /was/ a happy ending.
I wanted to see the war. Or at least, the game.
I'm still more annoyed that I only saw the outcome of the game and not the winning move.
Because they (TV show) only showed the perspective of one team, the one that loses specially.
So smart for the faction with the "the winter is comming" words.
That is, unless "the Lannisters send regards" doesn't mean it's /their/ move and it was all Frey's lone-wolfing for no reason. If it was all about "mimimi you didn't marry my daughter, I'm taking my ball home...", then yeah, that's soap opera. If Tywen made an alliance with them and offered them /money/ or /lands/ or /power/, then that's quite the good, and the song does mean it's what happened. But, I didn't see the winning move, only the losing move and the outcome...
For Frey, he better sleep with an eye open, because one of her wife's daughters is sure going to slit his throat.
so how manty lives were spared with joffrey holding the throne? i mean in war yea, soldiers got spared, but do you think joffrey's/ lannister's reign will be preferential over a war and a stark reign?
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