"Get back to your own countries!" Says illiterate woman on tram O_o

[AngryMongoose]

"I do feel sorry for her, and while she might have had an interesting opinion in regards to immigration" Just so this thread can continue without getting derailed into how you can even remotely agree with this woman, can we have a sarcasm tag with what you just said? Please tell me it was sarcasm. At no point would she have an "Interesting opinion" on immigration.

It was interesting enough for us to be here talking about it.

Her idea of immigration control would involve snipers stationed in watch towers along the borders.

And I would find such an opinion interesting; at least academically from a psychology point of view. Say what you like, but "Dull" can't exactly be applied to a belief in genocide.

Well if nothing else she's got balls. Even if I did share her opinions (which I don't) I wouldn't have the nerve to voice them like that on a tram full of black people. However, that is where my appraisal of her ends.

Naa, she was just stupid enough to get that drunk and/or stupid enough that her survival to child bearing age is a fucking miraculous event.

 

[zehydra]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

hmm... your right, we should punish people who express an unpopular opinion! I mean why let people have the freedom to express themselves?! Outrageous! *sarcasm*

Get serious man, are you really supporting someone being CRIMINALLY charged because they expressed an opinion? Really? I mean really? lol, you know who else punishes people when they express an unpopular opinion? The CCP when people say things that are deemed "criminal" to say.

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

oh and out of the woodwork they came...

I don't know if it's illegal to be racist in Britain, but it doesn't really make sense to arrest somebody because they say something which offends somebody in a public setting, since that would be a slippery slope with no well-defined end to it.

I'm not entirely sure what the laws in the UK are concerning free speech, but in 'Merica, we have the 'Clear and present danger' thing. If someone's comments would purposely incite violence/panic, then it's illegal for that person to make them. Like in the video, that one guy looked like he was about to punch that woman's lights out before the other person stopped him. So in 'Merica, what she said and did would have been illegal, yes. Apparently it's also illegal in Britain, since she did get arrested.

There is no 'slippery slope'. It's been that way for quite some time.

I don't think situation would have applied to the "Clear and present danger" thing. That's more like yelling "fire" in a theater, or inciting a riot.

Riling up one guy with remarks won't get you arrested over here.

 

[Rednog]

Question, how do you know from the video that she is illiterate?

Chavs usually are If she was educated in the way I was at least, I'm pretty sure her argument would have far more structure and make more logical sense, using proper reference, possible historical proof. The only thing that made any sense was go back to your fucking countries, you fucking nicafriga, whatever or whoever that is

Well in the beginning she is criticizing a polish person, and apparently they are to Britian what Mexicans are to the USA. So I got that part...the rest yea...but still illiterate is an odd adjective to throw in there.

 

[zehydra]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

oh and out of the woodwork they came...

I don't know if it's illegal to be racist in Britain, but it doesn't really make sense to arrest somebody because they say something which offends somebody in a public setting, since that would be a slippery slope with no well-defined end to it.

I do think that the public transportation system should be allowed to kick her off the train though.

So you don't think that verbally abusing someone on the grounds of race in public is worthy of arrest? She not only insulted and attacked anyone on the train who wasn't white, but she also directly abused at least one black woman. We have laws about public disruption specifically to deal with people like this.

It is illegal to be racist in Britain, and before you counter with 'America land of the free', they have laws about public order disruption and racism in America too.

Otherwise it would be entirely legal to say whatever you wanted in public, and that would be absurd.

No, it is not worthy of arrest. They can and should however keep her off the train if they want. If she refuses then, they should be able to arrest her on the grounds of trespassing (or some kind of other law you want to enact that deals directly with this issue)

 

[Supertask]

I find myself a bit on the fence about the free speech issue. On the one hand I think free speech is very important and it entails putting up with even the most repugnant bile. Certainly I don't think what the women said just by itself should be a crime, despite being horrible (for example if she said it to friends, posted it on a blog or Youtube etc). However, maybe there is a case for criminalizing not the speech itself but the speech as it was delivered - with the express intent to cause trouble and harass people.

Imagine a thief who walks up to people, and tells them he will stab them if they don't hand over money, some people, terrified, do so. The thief never actually does anything other than talk. Of course this is a much more extreme example than the women on the tram but the point of this is that it is not the actual words the thief says that are criminalized, it is the context he says them in combined with his intentions. In that way it is probably justifiable to criminalize this womans behaviour. Both this women's speech and the thiefs would require a guilty mind, mens rea, of causing a specified kind of trouble. This would strictly limit the situations in which speech could be criminalized.

 

[pulse2]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

hmm... your right, we should punish people who express an unpopular opinion! I mean why let people have the freedom to express themselves?! Outrageous! *sarcasm*

Get serious man, are you really supporting someone being CRIMINALLY charged because they expressed an opinion? Really? I mean really? lol, you know who else punishes people when they express an unpopular opinion? The CCP when people say things that are deemed "criminal" to say.

I don't think you understand the difference between opinion and abuse :/

An opinion is something someone else can disagree or agree with and construct a debate or conversation about, even if said opinion is not in their interest, what she was doing was abusing. "Go back to your fucking country, you're not British, I am", is not an opinion. An opinion would be for me to say, "I don't think Britain should be so lenient towards immigrants, I think they should all be deported", to which someone else could feel entitled to ask me why, I then have the choice of giving them an answer or not. I am not imposing my beliefs on others or making radical claims with intention only to insult.

For example, your "opinion" that what she said was an opinion is in fact an "opinion", because here I am disagreeing with you, but had you told me to "Fuck off, go back to your country you black fuck", I would have instead been insulted, that's not an opinion, its just downright flipping abuse, to which I could equally respond with abuse or simply ignore you. In this case she was arrested, not for expressing an opinion but for generally being a prat and abusing others on the train who didn't want to hear her pointless rant or have their children hear her foul loud abusive language.

 

[Kopikatsu]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

hmm... your right, we should punish people who express an unpopular opinion! I mean why let people have the freedom to express themselves?! Outrageous! *sarcasm*

Get serious man, are you really supporting someone being CRIMINALLY charged because they expressed an opinion? Really? I mean really? lol, you know who else punishes people when they express an unpopular opinion? The CCP when people say things that are deemed "criminal" to say.

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

oh and out of the woodwork they came...

I don't know if it's illegal to be racist in Britain, but it doesn't really make sense to arrest somebody because they say something which offends somebody in a public setting, since that would be a slippery slope with no well-defined end to it.

I'm not entirely sure what the laws in the UK are concerning free speech, but in 'Merica, we have the 'Clear and present danger' thing. If someone's comments would purposely incite violence/panic, then it's illegal for that person to make them. Like in the video, that one guy looked like he was about to punch that woman's lights out before the other person stopped him. So in 'Merica, what she said and did would have been illegal, yes. Apparently it's also illegal in Britain, since she did get arrested.

There is no 'slippery slope'. It's been that way for quite some time.

SO if someone goes to hit you becuase they dislikeyour viewsyour views are wrong nd illegal ?
Sweet I now fe like punching ypu, police arrest this man.

Oh wait thatsjust fucked up and stupid. Before comedian wasattacked becuase a guy disliked his joke, maye he should have been arrested too.

You missed the main point. If you make public comments for the express purpose of inciting violence/panic, then it's illegal. It has nothing to do with people wanting to beat you up/kill you for said remarks.

 

[thejackyl]

Wow...

And I thought America was the worst place when it came to "Go back to your own country".

Personally, Immigration doesn't bother me. Diversity doesn't bother me. The thing that bothers me is when people immigrate and expect that country to bend over backwards to cater to them. If you are going to move(permanently) to a new country, make an effort to learn the new language.

A friend of mine from school moved to Germany, it took him 3 weeks to learn fluent German And I know people who have lived around where I live for 20+ years and haven't even attempted to learn English.

Sorry if any of the above sounded wrong: I'm just a little pissed that I got written up at work because a customer wrote in to the store (in Spanish): "I thought the Cashier (name) was rude because he refused to speak Spanish". I didn't refuse to, I told them politely that I do not speak Spanish.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

hmm... your right, we should punish people who express an unpopular opinion! I mean why let people have the freedom to express themselves?! Outrageous! *sarcasm*

Get serious man, are you really supporting someone being CRIMINALLY charged because they expressed an opinion? Really? I mean really? lol, you know who else punishes people when they express an unpopular opinion? The CCP when people say things that are deemed "criminal" to say.

She is not protected by freedom of speech, she's being abusive to members of the public and inciting racial hatred, i don't know how either of those are opinion.

I'll admit that I don't know UK law, so I can only speak from an American perspective. That said, if it was in America, she could not be arrested for saying something racist.

Yeah, actually she kind of could. She was causing unrest and spreading racism while and inciting violence.

There's a difference between, "I personally do not like other ethnicities in my country," and, "ALL THESE FUCKING BROWN AND BLACK PEOPLE NEED TO GO BACK WHERE THEY FUCKING CAME FROM! THEY AREN'T WHITE OR ENGLISHA ND THEY DON'T FUCKING BELONG HERE!"

I'm sure you can see the difference there. Freedom of speech protects people's opinions, yes, but not if it's causing civil unrest.

Why the hell are people bitching at each other about which country is better? Are you guys serious? You're really going to do that after this video showed how moronic people who do that kind of shit are? REALLY?

Unless she is using "fighting words" she would not be arrested for expressing herself. Just look at the WBC.

 

[TheDoctor455]

i don't want to live on this planet anymore

Can I hitch a lift?

No seriously, can I?

 

[Nikolaz72]

A Brittish uneducated, drunk woman who uses a human shield to protect herself after verbally insulting a tram full of different ethnic minorities? Why has this child not been taken away from her yet?

 

[pulse2]

Question, how do you know from the video that she is illiterate?

Chavs usually are If she was educated in the way I was at least, I'm pretty sure her argument would have far more structure and make more logical sense, using proper reference, possible historical proof. The only thing that made any sense was go back to your fucking countries, you fucking nicafriga, whatever or whoever that is

Well in the beginning she is criticizing a polish person, and apparently they are to Britian what Mexicans are to the USA. So I got that part...the rest yea...but still illiterate is an odd adjective to throw in there.

Not at all, I hold on to that because it's my opinion, and my opinion based on what I've seen is that she is uneducated and has done little or no research, someone who had done research would have been able to construct a far more competent argument than hers, and possibly even made me rethink my own opinions or argument.

Putting it bluntly in a language everyone can understand, she's stupid and has no idea what she is even talking about, my seven year old sister can structure a better sentence and argument, that's what's so embarrassing, especially as she considers herself to be a representative of a "proper British born person", but yet all my British born white friends still think she is stupid and has no logical argument :/

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

She doesn't have an interesting opinion. She has a rampantly racist opinion and thinks that countless people who have put more into my country than she ever will should leave based on their skin colour. End of.

Edit: And before they crawl out the woodwork, no, she is not protected by freedom of speech. She deserved to be arrested and the police have every justification to punish her.

oh and out of the woodwork they came...

I don't know if it's illegal to be racist in Britain, but it doesn't really make sense to arrest somebody because they say something which offends somebody in a public setting, since that would be a slippery slope with no well-defined end to it.

I do think that the public transportation system should be allowed to kick her off the train though.

So you don't think that verbally abusing someone on the grounds of race in public is worthy of arrest? She not only insulted and attacked anyone on the train who wasn't white, but she also directly abused at least one black woman. We have laws about public disruption specifically to deal with people like this.

It is illegal to be racist in Britain, and before you counter with 'America land of the free', they have laws about public order disruption and racism in America too.

Otherwise it would be entirely legal to say whatever you wanted in public, and that would be absurd.

No, it is not worthy of arrest. They can and should however keep her off the train if they want. If she refuses then, they should be able to arrest her on the grounds of trespassing (or some kind of other law you want to enact that deals directly with this issue)

Well actually I suppose it doesn't matter what you or even I think, because the law is very clear.

Under the Racial and Religious Hatred Act 2006, the laws regarding breaches of the peace and disorderly conduct, this woman should be arrested. (UK)

If she was in America, then under whatever the state had as a law about disorderly conduct as well as racial relations laws she would be arrested.

What you think doesn't matter at all, because the rule of law both for America and Britain is clear. She incited racial hatred, she disrupted the peace, and she was guilty of disorderly conduct. Would you like me to find more laws she was guilty of breaking?

 

[-KC-]

I feel sorry for the kid who's being raised by such a *****. I hope that she won't influence him at least.

 

[MammothBlade]

Tell me wherehe incited violence, I didnt read anything along the lines of "these people should be shot if they dont leave" she didnt say anything violent, she was hostile, but thats not inciting violene.

Exactly, but since the draconian Race Relations Act even those comments can be interpreted as inciting violence. It's warped beyond belief.