Hip-Hop and Rap: What are your thoughts?

[Vault101]

-snip-

I want to hear the conversation Kanye West had with his producer about this album art.

"So what do you want, Kanye? A close up of you scowling with some guns all around?"

"Naw, man, put a mufuckin bear there."

"What?"

"Yeah, a bear. Or maybe just a fuckin dude in a bear outfit. Have him sittin his ass on some bench lookin all sad n shit. Maybe havin him wearin fuckin people clothes on top too."

"But why a bear?"

"Idunno man, maybe people'll think it's deep n shit."

In other news, that's probably the most meaningful song I've ever seen by Kanye West. He's just such a douche I like to keep as far away from him as possible.

speaking of the bear I think its like his logo/symbol a bear was also featured in the music video for "good morning"

as far as mainstream rap goes he's not bad..

 

[Revolutionary]

My avatar will kindly attest to my preferred genre selection, however when it comes to rap I can only really listen to the "Old-school" material like tupac.

 

[Wintermoot]

I don,t know the difference between the two but I hate them both both are pretty much rich guys bragging about how much girls they have the only one I can appreciate a bit is "I,m on a boat" but as far as I know that,s a parody.

 

[Digikid]

Can't spell crap without the rap.

Well said....and Hiphop is just as bad.

 

[Tonimata]

You have to bear in mind, all music tends to get shitty exponentials when it becomes popular, and rap isn't an exception. Neither is heavy metal. Neither is NO genre.

Also, my captcha asked me to write japanese characters. WTF.

 

[Macgyvercas]

Let me put it this way...

The absolute worst stuff from the 80's is better than all of the rap and hip hop in the world combined.

Unless we are talking the stuff Wierd Al does. I like him.

Immortal Technique, Lupe Fiasco, Lowkey, Plan B, Mr Lif, Cypress Hill, you're saying they're all terrible?
If so I couldn't disagree more. Rap is nothing more than poetry with music, most of which features far more innovative uses to rhyme and phonetics than any other poetic style, though an awful lot of it is about crappy subjects and some of it (I'm looking at you, 50p) also sounds shit.

And if political/sociological themes aren't your cup of tea, there Mr B the gentleman rhymer or Optimus rhyme.

I really couldn't care less about what type of inovation rap uses, I personaly do not like the style it's presented in. Give me some Bealtes/Rolling Stones/Led Zeplin any day of the week.

Oh, and if you want poetry with music, I'd point you in the direction of every Moody Blues song ever.

 

[Kid Kurious]

Ugh, I always tell myself I won't get involved in these pointless debates but here I am. For starters, EVERY genre will have its low and high points. So this one is no different.

I love Hip Hop with a PASSION, but I love me LOTS of jazz, funk, soul, reggae, old R&B, blues, punk, bossa nova (Latin music in general), rock, metal, electronica, classical, lots of experimental shit, the list goes on. It's because of hearing how Hip Hop used it that made me want to hear what it originally sounded like before it was reinterpreted - so Hip Hop was responsible for introducing me to some stuff from all these genres [it's always been so much easier to hear something you like and then check out more of it out of your own interest than to ask someone for something good of the genre and have them bombard you with dogshit]. It's thanks to Hip Hop that people like myself have a massive fucking musical palette. People can ***** and moan all they want about it "stealing music", but the fact is these songs are sampled AND royalties are paid to the original artist. I'll agree some of it can be VERY lazy and tacky, but truth is that crate-digging and sample-hunting in Hip Hop production not only remind people of songs they hadn't heard in a long time, they shine light on songs/artists which garnered little to no attention back in their day. Hip Hop is probably the best way to discover the greatest artists you've never heard. Shit, even when Kanye sampled Daft Punk for Stronger, people got switched back on to Daft Punk like CRAZY! And even Daft Punk sampled for Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger (the original was Cola Bottle Baby by Edwin Birdsong), so Hip Hop is by no means the only genre to do so.

As for people who have a cry over its musical arrangement - not everybody likes hearing loud, heavy guitar riffs and solos and whatnot. In the same vein, others may not want to hear the same drum pattern being looped over every few bars. Yngwie Malmsteen may be very talented at what he does, but people can't help it if they don't like how something sounds. It doesn't stop them from respecting the dedication it takes to bust out what he does, so it shouldn't stop others from respecting what a beatmaker does. I'm not out to change what people like or don't like - that's their business, but don't be so narrow and egotistical that you denigrate an entire genre just because it is not suited to your tastes. Some people bang their heads to Cannibal Corpse, others bang theirs to Pete Rock & CL Smooth.

I can't even blame people having a ***** about the content because they think all it is is violence, misogyny, drugs and shallow materialism. That's the media-reinforced stereotype and I can't help it if people are stupid enough to fall for that. It's the shit that seems to sell, so it's the shit that is going to get thrown in your face. If people hate on rap based around what they are force-fed, then they are just as stupid and shallow as the very rappers they hate. It's so safe and secure to do that from a distance.

You ask them what artists they think of when they think of Rap/Hip Hop and chances are you'll get your stock list of rappers: Eminem, 50 Cent, Soulja Boi, Snoop Dogg, blah blah. And I'll agree, ALL these guys have massive egos to go with their massive bank accounts, and their lyrical content doesn't really leave much to the imagination (though Eminem's early stuff was incredible). Newsflash: nobody appointed these guys as the ambassadors of Rap/Hip Hop. And it's funny to me that people who listen to something like death metal complain that rappers have violent lyrics. Anyways, they'll scream about how Hip Hop is a violent culture based on these artists...but you throw names at them like A Tribe Called Quest, De La Soul or The Pharcyde and good luck on if they've ever heard of them. Music that was centred around peace, identity, understanding, social awareness WITHOUT being preachy or extreme, still make you want to party and to STILL have massive following? Why did they never hear of these guys? Because they were always so convinced that Hip Hop is built on drugs, misogyny and violence that they never bothered to see if there were really any alternatives which go against the stereotype that was built around it. And er, let's not forget Lupe Fiasco. I hate always having to go back to mentioning Lupe Fiasco but he is the prime example of a rapper who doesn't fit into the stereotype yet still made it to the mainstream through originality. If people haven't heard of artists like A Tribe Called Quest and De La Soul and such, they would be more likely to have heard Lupe. Oh, what? He has some violent, politically charged lyrics? And so did 2Pac, Public Enemy, NWA?? HOW DARE THEY!! Artists like Bob Dylan, Johnny Cash and Bruce Springsteen totally never had to resort to incorporating violent lyrics into their music when addressing a social injustice...nah, not once. Never.
It is hilarious to me though how people can hate on rap music but LOVE bands like Linkin Park, Rage Against The Machine or even Red Hot Chilli Peppers when so much of their style is owed to incorporating rap.

Ugh, rants. Fuck it. *puts on headphones and presses play on Beastie Boys' "Hot Sauce Committee Part Two" *

 

[Macgyvercas]

I really couldn't care less about what type of inovation rap uses

Then there's no point in a conversation with you. Different styles of rap are presented in different ways, as with all generic definitions it is meaningless in specifics, leading some people to believe it is homogeneous. Shame, seeing as the Beatles are 'pop' and lady gaga is 'pop' - I do not like the way pop is presented but that doesn't mean i'm going to miss out on some excellent music. Nor does it mean you have to miss out on excellent lyricism, unless you are deliberately close-minded.
I'm not flaming, I just can't comprehend your assumptions.

I do understand your arguement, I truly do. But I have given rap a chance before, and what I heard was not to my liking (add to that it doesn't help that most places now play music with an obscene amount of base, which physically hurts), hence why I focus my interest in classic rock and heavy metal from 1956-1990 in particular.

As for comprehending me, please don't try, as it is impossible (just ask my parents). Still as long as we can at least agree to disagree, I'm fine with letting other people have their opinions, and them letting me have mine.

 

[Twilight.falls]

Allow me to preface this by saying I have no idea what the difference between Rap and Hip Hop. I'll just give my opinion of Rap.

I'm not too fond of rap. The little I've heard is not pleasing to my ears, and I don't care much for the subject matter.

I'm sure there is Rap music I would like, but to this day I haven't found any.

 

[AgentNein]

for the record, im done with this topic. id rather not waste my time trying to convince people that rap and hip hop have ruined what could have been today's popular culture.

also, 100% of statistics are made up on the spot.

Thank you. Thank you for no longer wasting our time as well with your silly made up statistics and crackpot theories on street crime.

 

[Spacelord]

Once you get to the underground DJ stuff, it's not too bad. Quite the opposite really, there's some truly great stuff out there.

Spoiler: Exhibit A

(note I resisted the urge to actually put up an Xzibit clip!)

However, chap-hop...

Why rap when you can rhyme rhythmically to a banjolele beat?

Spoiler: I call your Mr. B and throw down the gauntlet, sir!

Put up your dukes! Queensbury rules!

 

[The Diabolical Biz]

I'm not a big fan of either but my view is this.

Rap - Nursery rhymes with swearing and references to money, guns and bitches.

Hip-Hop - An actual music genre, personal I consider Hip-Hop to have a few good songs and it is essential rap without the chauvinistic wankers
E.G. - Rapper's Delight by The Suger Hill Gang despite having rapping is a Hip-Hop song.

Not really:
Hip-hop - a culture created in the 1970's in South Bronx in order to give the people from the ghettos a positive alternative to their otherwise miserable lifestyles (high crime rate, poverty, unemployment etc.). The forms of artistic expressions include music (rap, dj'ing, human beatbox), painting (graffiti),dance (breaking, popping, locking, etc.) and many more.

I suggest starting your experience with rap from the classics like:

KRS One:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnydK0phSqM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnI8JEW7Ty4

Rakim:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPkWYTUiPTo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y1Emb7Jyks

Chubb Rock:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyS6DeuX5R4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90g6iElTyAE

I've been saying this for a while but THE SO-CALLED "RAP" ON TV AND THE RADIO IS REALLY POP MUSIC.

OMG I LOVE CHUBB ROCK! Sorry, never seen anyone else who likes him. His voice is amazing.

I love Hip-Hop. Next to 19th century romantic Piano, it's easily one of my favourite Genres of music. It gets way too much hate from people who don't understand it. 1990s Stuff (I'm talking Illmatic, The Chronic, The Diary) is amazing, and there are some really fantastic artists there like Nas, Jeru the Damaja etc who aren't mainstream and don't get listened to when people are forming their opinions of the genre.

 

[MrShadowzs]

short version, most of it sucks there is some good stuff out there but most i'd rather not dwell on

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

See the problem with people who go "blarg blarg rap sucks because it only talks about money blarg" is that they only listen to music played to them on MTV or the Radio. I have an extensive collection of music that has both hip hop and various forms of rock. As well as combinations of the two.

Let me make a list of some songs to look up:
Ill Bill -War Is My Destiny
<youtube=JRLl2yVrJzE>

Canibus -Poet Laureate II
<youtube=8iUWGhnqBxM>

Cage Kennylz -Agent Orange
<youtube=zVtxW2AtbTg>


Also:
The Roots
Cannibal Ox
EL-P
Wu-Tang Clan
Tech N9ne
Slaine


Don't just listen to what's in the mainstream. If that were how I listened to my music I'd hate all of the pop rock that's pumped out ALL THE TIME. No rapper will ever get as much hate as Ke$ha or Justin Beiber.
Sage Francis
ATMOSPHERE!!!
Jedi Mind Tricks
Blue Scholars

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

Why are you mad about Rhymesayers being the one main defense for rap and hip-hop if they're not mainstream, not polluted, and come very close to Tupac's level of meaningfulness in their lyrics?

I'm not mad, I love Atmosphere personally. What I'm saying is that people take one look at the mainstream rappers and assume that's all the genre has to offer. Even with a globally renowned artist like Tupac as an example of how deep the genre can be, people still can't see past the current popular garbage. I guess what I'm mad about is that people have a 1-week memory when it comes to music.

I'm gonna step in here. Yes Tupac has some deep songs. But for the most part he spoke about growing up a black man in America. And near the end of his life he was the one of the most famous rappers, but he had game to speak about Blunts, Bitches, Money, and Being a thug. He heavily popularized the music we hate today. I don't get why he gets a pass on that. He was one of the most mainstream rappers during his time. I could say the same thing about Biggie Smalls. Great lyricist but he talked about violence and women. Listen to Canibus' Poet Laureate II and say that 2Pac is still the deepest rapper you know.