Reading these really make me want to pack my bags and grab my visa. A year for me at my college was 18k after scholarships and I had a crazed professor gun down some of her colleagues.
how do American and British universities compare?
- Thread starter lucaf
- Start date
The UK system is generally cheaper. For EU residents, it can be a lot cheaper.
That said, postgrads and oversees students get gouged relative to domestic undergrads, so if you're coming to study in England from the states you probably won't save that much money.
A lot of the money in the university sector nowadays comes from milking overseas students.
That said, postgrads and oversees students get gouged relative to domestic undergrads, so if you're coming to study in England from the states you probably won't save that much money.
A lot of the money in the university sector nowadays comes from milking overseas students.
I got in just before the fee hike, so I'm only going to be paying about £3000 per year. If you apply from now, however, the average is about £7500, with a maximum of £9000.
If you compare the better unis in each country, you'll probably find England a lot cheaper, £9000 compared to about £20000 or more. If you take into account the fact that you'll be paying a lot more for being an international student, I think the UK is probably a better bet.
If you compare the better unis in each country, you'll probably find England a lot cheaper, £9000 compared to about £20000 or more. If you take into account the fact that you'll be paying a lot more for being an international student, I think the UK is probably a better bet.
I figured that's how most universities operate. It's just right now I am scratching my head about what to do because my green card is about to expire here in the states. I was born in HK before the transfer and I have a British passport.
I don't remember what the pound to dollar exchange rate is, but unless it's four dollars to the pound, tuition is a helluva lot cheaper on your side of the Atlantic. Between tuition and living expenses, private universities, especially well-ranked ones, will charge you up to $50k, though most go around $30k. State universities tend to charge less, especially for in-state students, who can probably expect to pay around $10000 to $15000. Also, assuming NJ isn't some kind of special exception, they're quite generous with financial aid and scholarships.lucaf said:I guess I should start by saying I am NOT looking to start an argument about which are better. no, what I wanted to compare were two main things: fees and admissions. I live in England and will be applying to university in a few months, and while looking into it I began to see there appeared to be quite a big difference.
for a start, fees. in England there has been a lot of controversy over the recent fee hike, taking the maximum they can charge up to £9000 (and something) per year for tuition fees. this is because of government spending cuts due to the recession, and the government is still actually subsidizing a lot of the cost. so how much does it cost in the US 9or other countries)? especially since america tends to have less handouts, I would have assumed it is less subsidizes (no idea if that is true)
secondly, admissions. in the UK we have UCAS, a system that you submit your grades, references and personal statement, which it then sends to the universities you have chosen, who then reply through UCAS whether or not you are accepted or have an interview. does america have a similar system, or do you need to apply individually? also, do they ask for personal statements and interviews (or does it vary between uni)? I also take it that course selection works differently, since you take majors and minors, something that doesnt really happen over here
thanks for bothering to read that, I seem to have typed more than I intended
As for admissions, many (most?) colleges of all rankings use the Common App, which is one application (besides school-specific essays) for all participating colleges. Colleges might ask you for an interview, but it's usually not a game-breaker. They do accept, and sometimes require recommendations (I assume that's what you mean by personal statements), but usually just 2 or 3 tops.
You usually choose a major in your second or third year, but you can take other courses too.
Okay, Next time someone whines about tuition fees in the UK I'm going to point them to this thread. £9000/3 years is nothing compared to this.and the uni I'm hoping to go in a few months to has 10,000 students, which I thought was really high. 400,000.. my mind hurts. Thanks for educating me.
German Universities are mostly free.
You pay about 500 bucks a year for stuff like student-tickets etc. but apart from that, you usually don´t have to pay anything (at least in most states. Some still take about 1000 euro a year in fees, but no one expects them to keep it up for much longer.)
The admission process is whatever the Uni feels like.
Some do personal interviews or tests, most don´t.
Some courses require you to have a certain grade in your Abitur (the degree you acquire when graduating Gymnasium), but that´s pretty much reserved for humanities and other "easy" courses (or the really popular ones, which tend to be medical programmes).
Your Abitur basically gets you admission into an University, where you can get a world-class education for free.
So yeah.
You pay about 500 bucks a year for stuff like student-tickets etc. but apart from that, you usually don´t have to pay anything (at least in most states. Some still take about 1000 euro a year in fees, but no one expects them to keep it up for much longer.)
The admission process is whatever the Uni feels like.
Some do personal interviews or tests, most don´t.
Some courses require you to have a certain grade in your Abitur (the degree you acquire when graduating Gymnasium), but that´s pretty much reserved for humanities and other "easy" courses (or the really popular ones, which tend to be medical programmes).
Your Abitur basically gets you admission into an University, where you can get a world-class education for free.
So yeah.
The EU as a whole has a policy of universities only being allowed to charge other EU students what they charge domestic students. The UK is the oddity of Europe though.
The Conservative (Cons) government cut funding to English and Welsh universities by 85% but allowed them to increase tuition fees from ~£3500 to £9000. To counter act this cut they were forced to hit the upper end of the scale with the expected average to be £7500, the actual was far closer to the £9000 limit. These fees apply from 2012/2013 onwards.
Welsh universities charge the previous ~£3500 levels of tuition fees (the university costs being subsidised by the Welsh devolved parliament) to Welsh students at Welsh universities while other UK (non Welsh) students pay on the £9000 fees brought in by the Cons.
Scottish universities have no tuition fees for Scottish students, and currently a tuition fee of around £1500 for other UK (non Scottish) students. The fee for non Scottish UK students is to rise to £9000 to prevent Scotland being seen as the cheap option and maintain more places for domestic students.
Northern Ireland matches England as far as I understand.
The fees are payed for you by your home nation government as a loan which you repay.
EU students are charged the same fees as domestic students.
Admissions are done by a UK wide body (UCAS) which charges a small fee (~£30) for which you can apply to 5 courses, with some limitations. The limitations being that:
You may not apply to Cambridge and Oxford in the same year
You may not apply for medicine more than four times
In applying for an EU (non UK) university you work though their UCAS equivalent and apply for funding through your home country.
The Conservative (Cons) government cut funding to English and Welsh universities by 85% but allowed them to increase tuition fees from ~£3500 to £9000. To counter act this cut they were forced to hit the upper end of the scale with the expected average to be £7500, the actual was far closer to the £9000 limit. These fees apply from 2012/2013 onwards.
Welsh universities charge the previous ~£3500 levels of tuition fees (the university costs being subsidised by the Welsh devolved parliament) to Welsh students at Welsh universities while other UK (non Welsh) students pay on the £9000 fees brought in by the Cons.
Scottish universities have no tuition fees for Scottish students, and currently a tuition fee of around £1500 for other UK (non Scottish) students. The fee for non Scottish UK students is to rise to £9000 to prevent Scotland being seen as the cheap option and maintain more places for domestic students.
Northern Ireland matches England as far as I understand.
The fees are payed for you by your home nation government as a loan which you repay.
EU students are charged the same fees as domestic students.
Admissions are done by a UK wide body (UCAS) which charges a small fee (~£30) for which you can apply to 5 courses, with some limitations. The limitations being that:
You may not apply to Cambridge and Oxford in the same year
You may not apply for medicine more than four times
In applying for an EU (non UK) university you work though their UCAS equivalent and apply for funding through your home country.
That sounds so incredibly laid back. Looks like I'm moving to Germany after I finish high school at the end of this year then, even though I don't speak the language.TheAmazingHobo said:
Australian university seems a little bit different that British and American universities. At the end of high school, everyone has to sit the same test called the HSC (Higher School Certificate) which gives you an ATAR (I can't remember what that stood for, Australian Tertiery something, but it changed recently from University Admissions Index), which is basically a ranking between 0 and 99.95 (I know, wtf right?) of where you stand across... well with the UAI, it used to be just your state, but now our silly government is trying to make it a national ranking, where only 35 people can get the highest rank ><" It only got implemented last year, so right now it only affects 4 or 5 states I think.
My brother who just finished uni paid $8000 a year for his engineering course. From what I understand, we have a credit point system at uni where when you complete certain courses, you get credit points for them. Depending on what course you do, you have to do specific subjects, which are generally worth more credits, but you also get the occasional elective subject, which you can pick as long as its within the same field of your degree. You graduate once you get enough credits basically, and complete a thesis. You only get 4 subjects a semester though, so there isn't too much room for electives.
Wait, are you forced to do English, Maths and Science? If so, that sounds horrible. I'm looking forward to uni just so I don't have to do English anymore - it's the only subject that's compulsory in high school in Australia =="Harkonnen64 said:
Here in Northern Ireland the system is identical to Great Britain only the fees will be capped at something like 3000-4500 pounds.
Oh dear,
reading this read made me hate myself for being too shy to apply to university.
Is it my fault? I don't even know what to study.
reading this read made me hate myself for being too shy to apply to university.
Is it my fault? I don't even know what to study.
I freely admit that the system is NOT perfect and has some flaws. Amongst other things, Unis in Germany are always a bit crowded (at least before the tough exams start and students start dropping like flies) and the staff a bit overworked (generally speaking at least. Personally, I´m doing a CS degree at a University specialized in engineering and cs, so I don´t suffer from the same issues as a philosophy-student at a giant Uni would.)foodmaniac said:
But frankly, I´ve been to different Unis in different countries and ALL of them had the same problems, while taking a fuckton of money.
It depends, if you are a EU citizen, it´s usually pretty easy.Viral_Lola said:
You basically have to prove that you are able to attend a German University, which means
a) Proving that you can speak the language sufficiently well (though most Unis offer free German courses anyway and no one looks TOO hard if you can wave some certificate at them)
and b) Proving that you have academic qualifications equivalent to or exceeding the German Abitur.
Too what? Shy?! >_>Annoying Turd said:
Besides the interview and asking for recommendations, it requires almost no human contact!
It's okay if you don't know what to study. A lot of people go into university undecided on their majors, or they change their minds later anyway.
College is awesome both socially and academically. You learn stuff you actually care about, and you can choose your teachers (at least in my college) so you get awesome people teaching interesting stuff. It's probably the first time I've enjoyed learning stuff (besides reading wiki articles for fun). Absolutely worth applying, imo.
Well... Here's the thing. I am a British Overseas Citizen. (It means that I'm practically stateless.) What would be the academic qualifications?TheAmazingHobo said:
Just gone through the process, heading up to uni in a few months, first piece of advice, look at scotish or irish universities before american ones, they have much lower fees than english universities, 1860 in scotland compared to 3000 in england when i applied.lucaf said:
secondly make sure ou're going somewhere you want to go, i have a few friends going to uni to be with friends or girlfriends, its a bit silly. thirdly, choose a nice range of unis, i chose one that i was pretty much garunteed to get, one that was aspirational, and three that are about my level, i have friends again that applied for 5 universitys that each had the same grade requirements, which is crazy.
The American University System if very varied.
There are Public Universities, Private Universities, Technical Colleges, Liberal Arts Colleges, Conservatories. Lots of different options.
Community Colleges, they tend to be very, very, very cheap. Chabot College charges $36 a unit, so you might pay $108 for a class. If you are going full time, you probably spending $432 a semester. Community colleges tend to not have 4 year+ degrees, however. They tend to have 2 year degrees. So people will often go to a community college and then transfer to a bigger college. Community colleges also tend to be "commuter colleges"--so there are no residence halls, you aren't living on campus, they don't have the same sort of extra-curriculars.
Public Universities. They are run by and subsidized by individual states. The University of California, Los Angeles, Or Ohio State University. These schools can get really large. UCLA had 50,000 people running around on campus, for example. These schools tend to have a full range of degrees: Bachelors of Arts, Bachelors of Science, Masters Degrees, PhDs. Some of them have Law Schools, Medical Schools, Dental Schools, or Engineering Schools attached. These schools tend to be not as expensive if you are a state resident, expensive if you are an out of state resident. UT Austin's costs:
Texas resident on-campus $23,596 ? 24,936
Texas resident off-campus $23,734 ? 25,074
Non-resident on-campus $35,776 ? 45,960
Non-resident off-campus $35,914 ? 46,098
Big Public Universities are like private Universities in that they tend to offer big and varied experiences: Sports Teams, School Newspapers, Literary Journals, Orchestras, clubs, etc.
Private Universities, like Harvard, Princeton, Yale. Tend to be expensive. Harvard's Tuition is $33,696 and the total cost with fees, room, and board was $48,868. A place like Harvard has a lot of resources, the full college experience, Professors who are leaders in their field, and they actually aren't that big. They have around 7,000 undergraduates and 14,000 post graduates.
Small Liberal Arts Universities tend to be expensive and really small. They may not have all the sports teams or extra-curriculars...they probably also won't have the research labs of a big University. They also, often don't have graduate degrees. But the education they offer tends to be really, really amazing. I went to Mills College. A women's only college in Oakland with an enrollment of around 700 undergraduates. Liberal Arts colleges also tend to end up being $50,000 a year with room and board.
Those tend to be the four big categories. There are other things like a conservatory where you go to get a Bachelor's in Music and just play Music with minimal academics. There are technical colleges where you do minimal academics, but go to learn to be a Mechanic or Paralegal or something like that.
Note about cost: US Universities are expensive on the face of it, but those don't tend to be what people actually end up paying. We have extensive financial aid, and there are lots of scholarships. Big, rich private universities also tend to give lots of scholarships as well. If you are a person without a lot of money, you can often leave your institution only having paid a small fraction of the total cost.
For example, Mills College, where I went for my undergrad cost $51,547 a year (including room and board). I don't have that sort of money to be sure. But I got Pell Grants (grants from the federal government), Cal Grants (grants from the California state government), I got scholarships from Mills College itself, I also had the GI Bill (money paid by the government for people who had served in the military). I paid for some of the bill myself through student loans. So, how much did I pay total for four years at that pricey school? $11,000...or $2,750 a year. It is something similar at places like Harvard, Princeton, and Yale. So while the price tags look high, that is often deceptive.
You tend not to have to pay for PhDs if you get admitted to a top-rated university.
Applications:
In the US you apply to individual schools. Many of the schools want similar things (High School Transcripts, SAT/ACT exam score, sometimes personal statements, sometimes essays or writing samples, sometimes resumes). But each school is different, and they all have slightly different requirements.
And one of the big differences between British and American (US) universities:
In Britain you apply into a major. So you apply to study German or History (or whatever). If you end up going to the University of Liverpool for History, and after a year you decide you'd rather do German Studies...well you have to reapply to University. That isn't how US undergraduate institutions generally work (there are exceptions for Schools of Engineering or Conservatories). In the US you apply to the institution in general. While you might indicate a major interest, you don't apply to a major. When you come into the University, you don't have a major declared. Most Universities and Liberal Arts Colleges require you to take between 8-10 courses across different disciplines (general education or distribution requirements) in order to make you a well rounded scholar and to give you access to different kinds of thinking. Students then usually declare their major (or double major or major/minor) in their second year of college. Though, some declare in their first year, because they know what they want. Others might declare in their second year...and then change their mind and declare something different in their third year.
Of course, graduate school--Masters or PhD's--you apply for a specific major and don't tend to take (m)any courses out of your major. But that is a different situation.
Hope that helps some. I'm a University Professor, so I can give further insights if you have specific questions.
There are Public Universities, Private Universities, Technical Colleges, Liberal Arts Colleges, Conservatories. Lots of different options.
Community Colleges, they tend to be very, very, very cheap. Chabot College charges $36 a unit, so you might pay $108 for a class. If you are going full time, you probably spending $432 a semester. Community colleges tend to not have 4 year+ degrees, however. They tend to have 2 year degrees. So people will often go to a community college and then transfer to a bigger college. Community colleges also tend to be "commuter colleges"--so there are no residence halls, you aren't living on campus, they don't have the same sort of extra-curriculars.
Public Universities. They are run by and subsidized by individual states. The University of California, Los Angeles, Or Ohio State University. These schools can get really large. UCLA had 50,000 people running around on campus, for example. These schools tend to have a full range of degrees: Bachelors of Arts, Bachelors of Science, Masters Degrees, PhDs. Some of them have Law Schools, Medical Schools, Dental Schools, or Engineering Schools attached. These schools tend to be not as expensive if you are a state resident, expensive if you are an out of state resident. UT Austin's costs:
Texas resident on-campus $23,596 ? 24,936
Texas resident off-campus $23,734 ? 25,074
Non-resident on-campus $35,776 ? 45,960
Non-resident off-campus $35,914 ? 46,098
Big Public Universities are like private Universities in that they tend to offer big and varied experiences: Sports Teams, School Newspapers, Literary Journals, Orchestras, clubs, etc.
Private Universities, like Harvard, Princeton, Yale. Tend to be expensive. Harvard's Tuition is $33,696 and the total cost with fees, room, and board was $48,868. A place like Harvard has a lot of resources, the full college experience, Professors who are leaders in their field, and they actually aren't that big. They have around 7,000 undergraduates and 14,000 post graduates.
Small Liberal Arts Universities tend to be expensive and really small. They may not have all the sports teams or extra-curriculars...they probably also won't have the research labs of a big University. They also, often don't have graduate degrees. But the education they offer tends to be really, really amazing. I went to Mills College. A women's only college in Oakland with an enrollment of around 700 undergraduates. Liberal Arts colleges also tend to end up being $50,000 a year with room and board.
Those tend to be the four big categories. There are other things like a conservatory where you go to get a Bachelor's in Music and just play Music with minimal academics. There are technical colleges where you do minimal academics, but go to learn to be a Mechanic or Paralegal or something like that.
Note about cost: US Universities are expensive on the face of it, but those don't tend to be what people actually end up paying. We have extensive financial aid, and there are lots of scholarships. Big, rich private universities also tend to give lots of scholarships as well. If you are a person without a lot of money, you can often leave your institution only having paid a small fraction of the total cost.
For example, Mills College, where I went for my undergrad cost $51,547 a year (including room and board). I don't have that sort of money to be sure. But I got Pell Grants (grants from the federal government), Cal Grants (grants from the California state government), I got scholarships from Mills College itself, I also had the GI Bill (money paid by the government for people who had served in the military). I paid for some of the bill myself through student loans. So, how much did I pay total for four years at that pricey school? $11,000...or $2,750 a year. It is something similar at places like Harvard, Princeton, and Yale. So while the price tags look high, that is often deceptive.
You tend not to have to pay for PhDs if you get admitted to a top-rated university.
Applications:
In the US you apply to individual schools. Many of the schools want similar things (High School Transcripts, SAT/ACT exam score, sometimes personal statements, sometimes essays or writing samples, sometimes resumes). But each school is different, and they all have slightly different requirements.
And one of the big differences between British and American (US) universities:
In Britain you apply into a major. So you apply to study German or History (or whatever). If you end up going to the University of Liverpool for History, and after a year you decide you'd rather do German Studies...well you have to reapply to University. That isn't how US undergraduate institutions generally work (there are exceptions for Schools of Engineering or Conservatories). In the US you apply to the institution in general. While you might indicate a major interest, you don't apply to a major. When you come into the University, you don't have a major declared. Most Universities and Liberal Arts Colleges require you to take between 8-10 courses across different disciplines (general education or distribution requirements) in order to make you a well rounded scholar and to give you access to different kinds of thinking. Students then usually declare their major (or double major or major/minor) in their second year of college. Though, some declare in their first year, because they know what they want. Others might declare in their second year...and then change their mind and declare something different in their third year.
Of course, graduate school--Masters or PhD's--you apply for a specific major and don't tend to take (m)any courses out of your major. But that is a different situation.
Hope that helps some. I'm a University Professor, so I can give further insights if you have specific questions.
oh no, I wasn't planning to study in america at all, I was just curious. I plan on going nottingham with any luckAirsoftslayer93 said:
and why on earth is it that english people pay the most in the UK for eductaion? I mean, scotland get free universities, and ireland and wales are both cheaper. its a bit of a piss take to be honest, I doubt they pay much different in tax