How do you feel about remembrance day?

Zhukov

The Laughing Arsehole
Dec 29, 2009
13,769
5
43
El Poncho said:
Zhukov said:
Let me put it yet another way. In the year 575 BC the Battle of Yanling took place between the states of Chu and Jin. A whole lot of Chinese guys died "for the freedom of their countries." Do you genuinely care about this? Are you going to commemorate this every year? Are you going to wear a little flower on your shirt? Salute a flag perhaps? Yes? No?
But it isn't my country, or my freedom... If I was chinese I may very well commemorate them every year having been educated about it.

The people you are honouring are the soldiers from your country, who fought for your freedom.
The chinese guys fought for their country and their freedom.
Exactly. You feel no connection to that event. You do not care because those people did not die for you.

That is how I feel about the events that you commemorate.
 

Jamieson 90

New member
Mar 29, 2010
1,052
0
0
I think your view on Rememberence day is somewhat simplistic, Remberence day and the appeals that go along with it such as the Poppy appeal, and Help for Heros appeal is not just about remembering the dead, Both charities work with ex servicement and those injured on the front lines as well as supporting their families etc.

Having said that its always important to show your respect to the dead, especially soldiers who sacrificed themselves to protect you, our country and our freedom. You might disagree with the politics but the Solders are just doing their job and following their orders.
 

Silent observer

New member
Jun 18, 2009
251
0
0
Boletes Net said:
I totally agree with you, other than you seem to think that remembering these things will prevent them in the future? which I personally don't agree with...I think thats against human nature and there are way worse sides of humanity yet to come.
I have many, many responses to this thread, most of which contain numerous expletives directed squarely at you.

However, that probably wouldn't be very constructive.

I think the reason remembrance day is so important is that we are remembering the dead of a war which affected literally everyone in the world. It contained completely ordinary people in extraordinary and horrifying circumstances.

Also, I disagree with your comment about remembering things not helping to prevent them - think about what would happen if people were to forget about the holocaust, or the effects of an atomic bomb, for example.

Also, you would not believe the amount of self control it took not to swear at you or insult you once in this post.
 

El Poncho

Techno Hippy will eat your soul!
May 21, 2009
5,890
0
0
Zhukov said:
El Poncho said:
Zhukov said:
Let me put it yet another way. In the year 575 BC the Battle of Yanling took place between the states of Chu and Jin. A whole lot of Chinese guys died "for the freedom of their countries." Do you genuinely care about this? Are you going to commemorate this every year? Are you going to wear a little flower on your shirt? Salute a flag perhaps? Yes? No?
But it isn't my country, or my freedom... If I was chinese I may very well commemorate them every year having been educated about it.

The people you are honouring are the soldiers from your country, who fought for your freedom.
The chinese guys fought for their country and their freedom.
Exactly. You feel no connection to that event. You do not care because those people did not die for you.

That is how I feel about the events that you commemorate.
The difference is that they didn't die for me and the soldiers you feel no connection to you did die for you. Whether you feel it or not.
 

Darkstar370

New member
Nov 5, 2009
117
0
0
Silent observer said:
Boletes Net said:
I totally agree with you, other than you seem to think that remembering these things will prevent them in the future? which I personally don't agree with...I think thats against human nature and there are way worse sides of humanity yet to come.
I have many, many responses to this thread, most of which contain numerous expletives directed squarely at you.

However, that probably wouldn't be very constructive.

I think the reason remembrance day is so important is that we are remembering the dead of a war which affected literally everyone in the world. It contained completely ordinary people in extraordinary and horrifying circumstances.

Also, I disagree with your comment about remembering things not helping to prevent them - think about what would happen if people were to forget about the holocaust, or the effects of an atomic bomb, for example.

Also, you would not believe the amount of self control it took not to swear at you or insult you once in this post.
Agree.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
-George Santayana
 

Yureina

Who are you?
May 6, 2010
7,098
0
0
I light a candle. That's all I really can do on a personal level. I do feel as if this is one of the more important days of the year however. The people who gave their lives in tragic past conflicts deserve to be remembered.
 

Woodsey

New member
Aug 9, 2009
14,553
0
0
Pirate Kitty said:
We remember not just the soldiers or what they did - we remember what needed to be done to (in an idealist's mind) protect freedom and home.

If we forget this, we become ungrateful, spoiled, and loose sense of just how bloody amazingly lucky and privileged we are.
Do you think this is actually remembered by people when they're told to be quiet for 2 minutes for 1 day a year and pay a £1 for a paper poppy?

I'm not disagreeing with your point by the way, just wondering.


HotFezz8 said:
Boletes Net said:
I don't want to appear cold hearted but frankly I don't really care about the dead....they always go on about how soldiers died for us but I pretty sure they died for the government....okay well theres an acception when it comes to WWII.....I still don't really give a shit and i'm not going to wear a poppy so that I can pretend I do :)
then you are a uneducated ****.

(coming from fifth generation military family.)
I thought the military was supposed to instill some sense of maturity?

OT: I get what you're saying, and I don't wear a poppy, but I don't disagree with the idea of it.

Like I said to the first guy/gal I quoted though (kind of) is it actually done for a purpose or just because that's what's done?
 

AngelSword

Castles & Chemo Founder
Oct 19, 2008
245
0
0
Zeithri said:
Do you respect those who just join up to get praise? Because I don't.
I find them disgusting. If you are going to join the army, join it for yourself. Don't join it for others.
Anyone who joins the military for the praise is a) grossly misinformed, and b) doing it for themselves.
 

alloneword

New member
Jul 9, 2008
109
0
0
Well here's the thing.

Remembrance Day (or Vets day to those of you in the States) is one of those things that we are made to understand at a very young age. Once the realization of what it actually represents actually kicks in (usually around age 8 or so) then kids usually start to feel saddened by the events that transpired.

From that point on, every year when Remembrance Day comes up, it becomes an exercise in guilt and desensitization. I've sat through so many of those assemblies where people get up and talk about our fallen soldiers and the recite Flander's Fields, that with every year that went by I found myself caring less and less.

Don't get me wrong, I'm grateful to live in a free country and I understand that what those soldiers did allows that to be the case. But declaring a day to set aside hours of the day in which beat us over the head with the information is not helping the cause.

Also: In the U.S., its a civic holiday. Banks and schools are closed. Just think about that for a few minutes.
 

Bucket0Bones

New member
Feb 19, 2009
215
0
0
The point the man makes at the end of this comic pretty much sums up my thoughts about remembrance day

http://i.imgur.com/30Mb2.gif

I see a few people have made the point earlier in the topic but, if we didn't have remembrance day then younger generations who weren't particularly well educated (which seems to include the OP) would forget the sacrifice that many men and women made.

To say you couldn't care less just seems insensitive and, quite frankly, ignorant to me.
 

maddawg IAJI

I prefer the term "Zomguard"
Feb 12, 2009
7,840
0
0
You mean Armistice day or Veterans day or whatever people are calling it?

Honestly, I like the idea of supporting 'living' troops. I quote the word living because it honestly takes on different forms when it comes to people. I wouldn't mind honoring a soldier fighting in the field right now for our freedom, but I certainly wouldn't blame someone for going to a cemetery and placing flowers on their grave or doing something to remember him.

That soldier may not be alive by definition, but to those people, he is still alive in their memories. I'm lucky to have members of my family in the armed forces and even luckier that nothing has happened to them and I hope that nothing ever does.
 

Phaerim

New member
Sep 15, 2010
139
0
0
We have conscription in Denmark. Nearly 50% of all male population has served in the military at some point (including myself), and because of that, it isn't as romantic, because everyone really knows how the military works.

We do it because its part of our law, or because its fun, not due to some romantic belief, that we are defending the honor and rights of our country. Those that have romantic viewpoints like that, get sorted away, because its not a very pragmatic way of thinking when in war. It makes you take irrational and emotional decisions.

Since many share that belief in Denmark, we sort of don't worship our military to the same extent that Americans does. We have a flag day, which our Conservative/Liberal government introduced (yes we have that in Denmark, its possible :) ). It was very small, and no one cared.

Honestly, its not like we dislike our soldier or military or anything. It's just that heroes are made by good deeds, not by just signing up for a uniform and a gun. I know a guy who saved a village from a bomber in Afghanistan, and I think he is one of the most awesome people I know. Some of his friends though, do not deserve that credit, and I won't give a general praise to an institution when the result is that any, often conservative, prick can sign up and demand to be called a hero.
 

ffian1

New member
Mar 10, 2010
83
0
0
Akai Shizuku said:
I oppose Remembrance Day, as it is a day for remembering the soldiers who killed and were killed in the name of narrow nationalism and corporate interest. Fuck that shit.

Also, the whole "they died for our freedom" bit is a load of right-wing propaganda.

1) What freedom?
2) Suppose your country got its ass kicked in WW1 and lost out on its imperialist gains, and murdered less indigenous peoples to take over their land and resources than Austria or something. Or suppose the Nazis kicked your country's ass in WW2 and the Soviet Union plowed through them anyway just as they already would have (considering that the USSR was the main force against the Nazis, did most of the fighting, and ultimately were the ones who not only defeated Nazi forces but plowed right through Berlin and put the Soviet flag up on the Reichstag while most other countries fighting the Nazis [INCLUDING YOUR RED WHITE AND BLUE] were little more than a distraction and were considered insignificant by them). What then?

This video made by a friend of mine further explains the position I have on this, particularly current wars.


tl;dr
Remembrance Day is a load of nationalistic propaganda.
You, friend, are a man after my own heart.

War, to me at least, seems to be an extension of evolutionary primal tactics to control more assets e.g. food, women to breed with (evolutionarily speaking) etc. If you consider the amount of assets poured into the notion of war (including self-defense, invasion, time, troops and R&D), does that really outweigh the total cost? If the assets were used for something else beneficial for all - I bet we could feed and clothe the world many, many times over.

The only good thing to come from war in general is the R&D, allowing for some incredible advances in machinery and computation - but again, if assets were used to fund this sort of thing more often anyway then you completely eliminate the whole notion of war.

Personally, I don't support Remembrance Day. If anyone cares enough to remember them, they should do it every day to be thankful. The idea of relegating the supposed importance of remembrance to a single day devalues everything about it anyway.
 

Zhukov

The Laughing Arsehole
Dec 29, 2009
13,769
5
43
El Poncho said:
Zhukov said:
Exactly. You feel no connection to that event. You do not care because those people did not die for you.

That is how I feel about the events that you commemorate.
The difference is that they didn't die for me and the soldiers you feel no connection to you did die for you. Whether you feel it or not.
Did they really?

Consider the following.

I am Australian. Australian soldiers have been involved in the Boer War, WWI, WWII, the Korean War, the Malayan Emergency, the Vietnam War, the Gulf War, the war in Iraq and the war in Afghanistan. Plus a few UN peacekeeping operations and regional assistance missions. Not one of these conflicts involved a direct threat to Australia. (The one possible exception was the Japanese in WWII, but we have since learned that they had no intention of invading us.) Australia became involved in every single one of these conflicts at the behest of other nations. Furthermore, our contributions to these conflicts were negligible in scale and of no real consequence.

In short, the "freedom of my country" was never under threat. And if it was, the actions of Australian soldiers were neither necessary nor relevant in securing said freedom.

So... how exactly did they die for me?
 

rwllay

Regular Member
Oct 9, 2009
68
0
11
i share my birthday with rememberence day, so i always think it gives me some perspective. also i respect anyone willing to risk their life, for a cause they believe in(wether i believe in it or not), whether it be king and country, religion, ideology or whatever.