If someone is a post-op transsexual, are they obligated to tell the person they are pursuing/dating?

Innegativeion

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racrevel said:
I like it!
Trans people are like cake, best analogy ever!
Beats the prisoner one at least.
Got an analogy for what people are like parfait? A wanna be one of those :)
Canadians. Because nobody dislikes them, really, even if they won't admit it.
 

Sonic Doctor

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KelsieKatt said:
lisadagz said:
If a black person picks up a white person at a bar, and the white person is blind, do you think the black person should say "Oh, by the way, I'm black," out of respect for the possibility that the white person may be racist so that the racist person knows what they're getting into and can back out?
snip
Actually it is quite believable that a blind person can be racist. The person could have had sight most of his life and been racist, and then something happened to him and now he is blind.

So lisadagz explanation works perfectly in that situation.
 

LetalisK

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Yes, a trans should tell a person they're about to have sex with. To do otherwise is to violate the other's right to make an informed choice. And honestly, what kind of trans would want to fuck someone who has a serious problem with trans? There is no reason not to tell the other person.
 

Sonic Doctor

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Innegativeion said:
Actually, according to this "science side" you are referencing, sex is defined by your body structure.

That is, if you have a vagina you're a woman, if you have a penis you're a man.

Chromosomes determine how a body's cells will go about structuring themselves. XX means the cells will arrange female organs, and produce more estrogen that testosterone. XY means more testosterone and male organs. But the chromosomes themselves don't actually do anything in this regard, they are essentially just the instructions.

Think of it this way; someone starts making a loaf of bread, by reading a recipe. They have a dough mix set up, but someone puts in a lot of sugar and butter and some other ingredients. When the bread comes out, it's a cake. It tastes like cake, it has the consistency of cake etc. Would you call it a bread loaf, though, because the original instructions said it was so, even though said instructions are no longer adhered to?
That analogy doesn't work in this situation, because the transsexual was already one thing before the operation.

So the proper analogy going with your food reference: I mix the ingredients together to make bread, I bake it, and bread comes out.

Then after a day or two, I do something to turn that bread into a cake. Said bread use to be cake. I give that "cake" to a few people that really like cake, but hate bread. They eat the cake, and then I tell them they technically just ate bread. Now they don't speak to me for a week or never again because I deceived them and made them eat something that they hate.

It doesn't matter what the people are up in the head, if they come out as male, they are male. Then they go and have an operation and become female. That doesn't not change that fact that they use to be male.

I don't care what a person has had done to make himself look like a woman, if I find out that person use to be a man, I will forever consider that person a man. "She" had surgery, she is a fake woman.

It is like any other situation when I find out something is fake. Take a woman's breasts for example. If I like the looks of them, they will turn me on. If I some how find out they are fake, BOOM, I don't find them attractive in the slightest anymore. I don't find women that have had elective plastic surgery, to be attractive. It tells me that they are vain and most likely have personality issues that I don't care for.

When it comes to relationships, I only want what is natural. A girl that use to be a guy, isn't natural.
 

Vuljatar

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Yeah, absolutely. As soon as the relationship starts getting serious, and most certainly before anything physical occurs. Indeed, I'd consider sex with a partner who doesn't know to be rape by deception.
 

Sonic Doctor

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LetalisK said:
Yes, a trans should tell a person they're about to have sex with. To do otherwise is to violate the other's right to make an informed choice. And honestly, what kind of trans would want to fuck someone who has a serious problem with trans? There is no reason not to tell the other person.
Going back to the OP, the main topic is telling when dating, so that really means at any time. Then after that, the secondary part is about not being able to make babies, sex part.

I want to ask you: Why did you skipped the dating part and answer only about the sex part?

The reason I ask is that many people are only mentioning telling before sex and nothing else. Plus, there are the people that say that it is okay not to tell during the dating, but before sex it has to be told.

Why are people ignoring the point of the initial pick up and first date and normal dating stuff that comes before jumping in the sack?

Is the guy's time that is wasted during the dating process just not that important?

I find it important. The guy could have turned "her" down right away after being told she use to be a guy, then he could move on and find an actual girl.

People seem to only be half thinking about the guy in the relationship. Sex without telling him is bad, but it's fine and dandy to not tell him before that and waste large amounts of time in his life and possibly money before that.
 

KelsieKatt

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Sonic Doctor said:
KelsieKatt said:
lisadagz said:
If a black person picks up a white person at a bar, and the white person is blind, do you think the black person should say "Oh, by the way, I'm black," out of respect for the possibility that the white person may be racist so that the racist person knows what they're getting into and can back out?
snip
Actually it is quite believable that a blind person can be racist. The person could have had sight most of his life and been racist, and then something happened to him and now he is blind.

So lisadagz explanation works perfectly in that situation.
You're taking my post far too seriously and seemed to have missed the opening sentence I wrote in bold.

I never objected to any of it or said it wasn't an appropriate explanation. I simply had a good laugh about a funny concept.
 

Sonic Doctor

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KelsieKatt said:
Sonic Doctor said:
You're taking my post far too seriously and seemed to have missed the opening sentence I wrote in bold.

I never objected to any of it or said it wasn't an appropriate explanation. I simply had a good laugh about a funny concept.
Well, thing is, I find this topic to be quite a serious matter, and I don't find joking about it funny at all. So, it isn't that hard to me to miss such thing, even in bold, or ignore it, and make a comment.
 

KelsieKatt

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Sonic Doctor said:
KelsieKatt said:
Sonic Doctor said:
You're taking my post far too seriously and seemed to have missed the opening sentence I wrote in bold.

I never objected to any of it or said it wasn't an appropriate explanation. I simply had a good laugh about a funny concept.
Well, thing is, I find this topic to be quite a serious matter, and I don't find joking about it funny at all. So, it isn't that hard to me to miss such thing, even in bold, or ignore it, and make a comment.
I can understand missing part of a post because you're passionate about something. However, if you truly believe that humor cannot be funny in relation to certain subjects, I feel sorry for you, I truly do.
 

thethird0611

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DigitalSushi said:
Jaeke said:
WTF is with the Escapists obsession with transgender/transsexuals, its just unnatural and who cares? And yes they must tell them immediately.
We have a few transgenders, transexuals here and a few people with gender identity disorder, we don't have an obsession with them but its good to talk about these issues with each other like adults. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad, bad to you, not to others.

About it being unnatural?, wearing clothes, travelling in a metal structure which burns fossil fuels such as car's, trains and planes and microwaves are also unnatural. Caesarean section's are unnatural.

Don't get me started on non dairy cheese products.
Just gotta say, im reading through this thread, facepalming at so many emotional charged and logically lacking argument (from both sides, but there are a few good ones), and I almost stood up and applauded at this.
 

LetalisK

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Sonic Doctor said:
Going back to the OP, the main topic is telling when dating, so that really means at any time. Then after that, the secondary part is about not being able to make babies, sex part.

I want to ask you: Why did you skipped the dating part and answer only about the sex part?
I blame the large amount of alcohol I've consumed lately as well as....

The reason I ask is that many people are only mentioning telling before sex and nothing else. Plus, there are the people that say that it is okay not to tell during the dating, but before sex it has to be told.
Conceptions that serious dating and casual dating entail different rules and serious dating starts at sex?

Why are people ignoring the point of the initial pick up and first date and normal dating stuff that comes before jumping in the sack?
I can understand this one, as "Hey, I'm a tranny" is a bit more on the too heavy side for a first date. First dates are a dime a dozen, those are there to get the general feels for someone, not necessarily to learn some of their deeper secrets.

Is the guy's time that is wasted during the dating process just not that important?

I find it important. The guy could have turned "her" down right away after being told she use to be a guy, then he could move on and find an actual girl.

People seem to only be half thinking about the guy in the relationship. Sex without telling him is bad, but it's fine and dandy to not tell him before that and waste large amounts of time in his life and possibly money before that.
*shrug* I have no answer for this beyond what I said above. I also haven't dealt with this much, as I evidently come across as a very trustworthy man. You wouldn't believe some of the incredibly dark, depressing, and horrific secrets women have told me on first dates. My god....
 

Helmholtz Watson

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thethird0611 said:
DigitalSushi said:
Jaeke said:
WTF is with the Escapists obsession with transgender/transsexuals, its just unnatural and who cares? And yes they must tell them immediately.
We have a few transgenders, transexuals here and a few people with gender identity disorder, we don't have an obsession with them but its good to talk about these issues with each other like adults. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad, bad to you, not to others.

About it being unnatural?, wearing clothes, travelling in a metal structure which burns fossil fuels such as car's, trains and planes and microwaves are also unnatural. Caesarean section's are unnatural.

Don't get me started on non dairy cheese products.
Just gotta say, im reading through this thread, facepalming at so many emotional charged and logically lacking argument (from both sides, but there are a few good ones), and I almost stood up and applauded at this.
and I smh at the comment.
 

axlryder

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Jul 29, 2011
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Seriously, guys, there's no need to write "her" or "him" in quotations. They are the gender they claim to be.
 

Sonic Doctor

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axlryder said:
Seriously, guys, there's no need to write "her" or "him" in quotations. They are the gender they claim to be.
I don't see it that way.

You are saying that if a person claims to be something, they are something.

What if surgeons grafted large amounts of cat fur over my body, and gave me whiskers on my face and attached a tail to my butt?

If I walked up to you and told you, "I am a cat", would you believe me? If people argued and said that I am only a human, would you come to my defense and say, "since he claims to be a cat, he is a cat"?

If people did that, I would call them humans, doesn't matter what they did surgically to make themselves look like cats.
 

KelsieKatt

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Sonic Doctor said:
I don't see it that way.

You are saying that if a person claims to be something, they are something.

What if surgeons grafted large amounts of cat fur over my body, and gave me whiskers on my face and attached a tail to my butt?

If I walked up to you and told you, "I am a cat", would you believe me? If people argued and said that I am only a human, would you come to my defense and say, "since he claims to be a cat, he is a cat"?

If people did that, I would call them humans, doesn't matter what they did surgically to make themselves look like cats.
Don't be an idiot. There's no physically possible way that cat genes could wind up in a human's DNA unless you're some kind of mad scientist tampering with the laws of reality. Humans cannot be naturally born with cat brains.

Contrary to what you may believe, there is actually scientific research on the subject which, while not 100% conclusive does show that transsexuals share similar brains to gender they claim to be. (Which is something that homosexuals do not share in common, no matter how much people may like to throw trans and homosexuality into the same camp and love to tell trans people to just shut up and be gay.)

As it is, it's also extremely possible that children can get wrong doses of hormones while in the womb and develop a mismatched brain for what their chromosomes entailed. Birth defects happen all the time, including other bizarre outcomes such as intersex and this seems to be the most likely reason at the moment.

I'm not going to stop you from disagreeing, but if you're going to go around judging other people come up with a better reason than that that illogically asinine and outdated argument.
 

Sonic Doctor

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KelsieKatt said:
Sonic Doctor said:
Don't be an idiot. There's no physically possible way that cat genes could wind up in a human's DNA unless you're some kind of mad scientist tampering with the laws of reality. Humans cannot be naturally born with cat brains.

Contrary to what you may believe, there is actually scientific research on the subject which, while not 100% conclusive does show that transsexuals share similar brains to gender they claim to be. (Which is something that homosexuals do not share in common, no matter how much people may like to throw trans and homosexuality into the same camp and love to tell trans people to just shut up and be gay.)

As it is, it's also extremely possible that children can get wrong doses of hormones while in the womb and develop a mismatched brain for what their chromosomes entailed. Birth defects happen all the time, including other bizarre outcomes such as intersex and this seems to be the most likely reason at the moment.

I'm not going to stop you from disagreeing, but if you're going to go around judging other people come up with a better reason than that that illogically asinine and outdated argument.
You totally missed what my analogy was about. Plus I never said anything about genes or DNA, I just mentioned grafting on pieces and changing parts.

I couldn't care less about what's going on up in people's heads. If a person is born, physically, a boy, I don't care what that person does to himself later, I will always consider that person male.

I was never talking about DNA and such, only the original and then the fake, surgical appearance.
 

CrimsonBlaze

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I don't believe that someone should reveal their sexuality/transgender self upon first meeting. If they decide to pursue a date/relationship/physical contact/sexual contact/sexual intercourse, then that's when they need to be a little more open.
 

KelsieKatt

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Sonic Doctor said:
You totally missed what my analogy was about. Plus I never said anything about genes or DNA, I just mentioned grafting on pieces and changing parts.
I understood perfectly fine what you were trying to say. Doesn't make it any less of a completely asinine analogy which makes your argument look ridiculous beyond belief.
 

Teachingaddict

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Sonic Doctor said:
You totally missed what my analogy was about. Plus I never said anything about genes or DNA, I just mentioned grafting on pieces and changing parts.

I couldn't care less about what's going on up in people's heads. If a person is born, physically, a boy, I don't care what that person does to himself later, I will always consider that person male.

I was never talking about DNA and such, only the original and then the fake, surgical appearance.
What an absolutely one sided and closed mind you have. It is our DNA/Genetic make up that makes us who we are. Not only that, but any person with female only body parts is female, and vice versa for males. It is silly people that have this opinion that make the life forthose people who NEED the operation, HELL. I happen to know a transexual, and one who has had the operation. SHE went through years of hell, including manic depression and attempted suicide on more than one occasion, all because society treat her with your 'once a man always a man' style of attitude. Go do some research, and understand the term/situation, before you make a bigoted view.