I'm a straight male gamer, convince me diversity in games is a good thing

Genocidicles

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Normally I'm one to just stick my fingers in my ears and pretend everything is fine when discussions about diversity get brought up, but with all these articles about how the 'evil dudebro gamers' are dying off and how gaming will become more diverse and move forward as a medium (and how that's a good thing) have made me wonder:

Is this a good thing, for me? From where I'm standing, all diversity in gaming has brought us is shit like Gone Home. How can I get on board with 'diversity moving gaming forward', if it just means more crappy games I won't play on Steam? How is this a good thing exactly?
 

Sea Sponge

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One day they may make an MMO or single player RPG that doesn't have a chainmail bikini.

How is it a good thing?

Less semi naked avatars dancing on mail boxes. Although I doubt fully clothed ones will be as amusing.

I'll be honest, I don't know how it's going to change things. We've already got masses of absolute shit being plastered on Steam I doubt a game with someone's pathetic attempt at gender equality will make much difference.
 

Bad Jim

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There's a nice article here
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/columns/criticalintel/12105-Why-Straight-White-Guys-Shouldn-t-Always-Play-Games-As-Themselve

TL/DR The point of virtual worlds is that we can do things we can't do in real life, be people we can't be in real life and experience things we would not experience in real life. As a thirty something, white, straight, brown haired, devilishly attractive man I don't get that if my avatar is always thirty something, white, straight, brown haired and devilishly attractive.
 

Casual Shinji

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Because variety is the spice of life?

Look, growing pains are a shit phase to go through, but afterward you'll be happy you did.

Honestly though, I'd like more diversity of... species. Gives us your mudokons, your rayman's (?), your huddled lombaxes.

Seriously though, fuck off with all the humans, I wracked my brain just trying to come up with three different non-human game characters for that lame joke.
 

DefunctTheory

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Gone Home? You mean the game with an 86/100 on MetaCritic?

'Not my cup of tea' does not mean 'crappy.'

I admit, diversity is going to do nothing for the CoD Twitch Lord. But for people who give two shits about immersion, characterization, and storyline, diversification of characters opens up gaming to something beyond 'Bro shoots other bros for country/place to put penis.'
 

shrekfan246

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As another straight male who plays video games who hasn't and doesn't particularly plan on ever playing something like Gone Home, I wonder why it matters to you that it's a thing which exists. By all accounts it's actually quite a competently-made piece of entertainment, which is more than can be said for a lot of the "crappy games" being released on Steam lately, and why would any "gamer" ever begrudge the existence of more games in a far wider variety of genres, even if they happen to be genres you don't like or aren't interested in?

You might as well use Starcraft II and the RTS genre, or World of Warcraft and MMOs, or hey, Call of Duty and first-person shooters. It all has the same relevance at the end of the day.

Why is more and more new and different things a bad thing, exactly, when we're not actually losing the things we were getting in the first place?
 

Sea Sponge

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Bad Jim said:
There's a nice article here
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/columns/criticalintel/12105-Why-Straight-White-Guys-Shouldn-t-Always-Play-Games-As-Themselve

TL/DR The point of virtual worlds is that we can do things we can't do in real life, be people we can't be in real life and experience things we would not experience in real life. As a thirty something, white, straight, brown haired, devilishly attractive man I don't get that if my avatar is always thirty something, white, straight, brown haired and devilishly attractive.
The other problem is some people need to "relate" in some way to the character they are playing.

As a fourt*cough**cough**cough* something, white, straight, dark haired, body of a bronzed greek god amongst mere mortals .... i've got sod all in common with one eyed, one horned flying purple people eaters .... and that is why I didn't have the slightest clue what was going on in that movie.
 
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If you need to be convinced that diversity is a good thing, then you probably need to re-evaluate some priorities.
 

Genocidicles

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AccursedTheory said:
Gone Home? You mean the game with an 86/100 on MetaCritic?
'Not my cup of tea' does not mean 'crappy.'
Yeah, and a 5.4 user score. I think I'd rather trust the users than journalists trying to look hip and progressive.

I admit, diversity is going to do nothing for the CoD Twitch Lord. But for people who give two shits about immersion, characterization, and storyline, diversification of characters opens up gaming to something beyond 'Bro shoots other bros for country/place to put penis.'
Well surely that's a matter of writing, not diversity?

Bad Jim said:
There's a nice article here
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/columns/criticalintel/12105-Why-Straight-White-Guys-Shouldn-t-Always-Play-Games-As-Themselve

TL/DR The point of virtual worlds is that we can do things we can't do in real life, be people we can't be in real life and experience things we would not experience in real life. As a thirty something, white, straight, brown haired, devilishly attractive man I don't get that if my avatar is always thirty something, white, straight, brown haired and devilishly attractive.
Well if we're going for 'things we can't do in real life' why does it have to be playing as a woman, or a gay guy? Why not go all the way and have us play as transdimensional cyborgs with 2 brains? Or insect people with a rigid caste system? That actually sounds interesting to me.
 

Erttheking

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Let me reply to your question with another question. What is so great about seeing the same thing over and over again?

Because I'm a straight white male gamer, and playing as straight white men in EVERY SINGLE GAME is a wee bit boring. Also kind of insulting, because I'm starting to get the distinct impression publishers think my head will explode if I have to play as a woman, or someone with slightly darker skin, or someone who isn't 100% hetrosexual.
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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shrekfan246 said:
As another straight male who plays video games who hasn't and doesn't particularly plan on ever playing something like Gone Home, I wonder why it matters to you that it's a thing which exists. By all accounts it's actually quite a competently-made piece of entertainment, which is more than can be said for a lot of the "crappy games" being released on Steam lately, and why would any "gamer" ever begrudge the existence of more games in a far wider variety of genres, even if they happen to be genres you don't like or aren't interested in?

You might as well use Starcraft II and the RTS genre, or World of Warcraft and MMOs, or hey, Call of Duty and first-person shooters. It all has the same relevance at the end of the day.

Why is more and more new and different things a bad thing, exactly, when we're not actually losing the things we were getting in the first place?
I agree. If OP doesn't play those other games anyway, then what does it matter? There will always be a disproportionate amount of brown haired, blue eyed white males(this coming from a guy who does have brown hair, blue eyes, and that odd designer brown/green stubble. basically an IRL Chris Redfield) in gaming. And if that's your cup of tea, great! If not, great! There should be a wide assortment of games for everyone. I for the life of me couldn't come close to understanding why a train simulator would be fun, but there they are on Steam in the Best Seller list.
Likewise Gone Home. I remember when it came out I thought 'wow, not buying that, it looks boring.' So i didn't buy it and left it at that. Never ranted, raved or raged. Just not my thing, moving on.

But I do see where OP is coming from. I think he's saying there is a difference between having a variety of games, and being forced to play them. And not forced forced, but peer pressure 'if you don't play this game you're a racist/sexist/jingoist' I never played Mirror's Edge, and I do know gamers who would say that's sexist.

Correct me if I'm wrong here Genocidicles, but I think that's what you're saying. Variety games are all well and good, but it shouldn't be considered a negative to not play them. That's where us white boys get pissy; when not playing Tomb Raider is considered sexist because we're afraid of powerful women who don't need men yadda yadda
when really, it looks like a very derivative and boring game. And if that is the case, then I'd agree. Variety games would be harmful if they only serve to further polarize the community.
 

Andy Shandy

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Well, I suppose if you all you want is "Shooty McWhizBang 69" then no, diversity in games might not be a good thing.

But for me personally, diversity is a good thing as it will increase the chances of us getting a more diverse range of games, not only in characters, but in story, and gameplay. Hell, I myself might be a fan of "Shooty McWhizbang 69" but I wouldn't want every single game to be that.

And don't worry, "Shooty McWhizbang 69" won't be magically wiped out in the process.
 

Aerosteam

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Well, having a non-diverse cast isn't a good thing.

Look at the playable characters in Assassin's Creed Unity, they're all literally the same person! How boring is that?[HEADING=2]Very.[/HEADING]
 

shrekfan246

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Silentpony said:
I never played Mirror's Edge, and I do know gamers who would say that's sexist.
It may be just as extreme a thing for me to say this, but quite frankly if someone is going to call you "sexist" because you express no interest in Mirror's Edge or Tomb Raider then I feel it should be quite easy for you to simply ignore them and move on. Or at the very least express why you have no interest in it, in a concise, logical, and rational manner. Any argument that appeals to that sort of emotional response should be easily shut down by responding with "I don't like the look of its gameplay" or "The story doesn't seem interesting enough for me".

They're just the other side of the coin of people who are so hasty to accuse those who disagree with them of being "SJWs", and I don't feel either side is really worth engaging until they can refrain from engaging in such hyperbolic language.
 

Genocidicles

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Andy Shandy said:
Well, I suppose if you all you want is "Shooty McWhizBang 69" then no, diversity in games might not be a good thing.

But for me personally, diversity is a good thing as it will increase the chances of us getting a more diverse range of games, not only in characters, but in story, and gameplay. Hell, I myself might be a fan of "Shooty McWhizbang 69" but I wouldn't want every single game to be that.

And don't worry, "Shooty McWhizbang 69" won't be magically wiped out in the process.
But that's the thing, diversity just seems to be leading to easy crap that anyone could play. If it meant more strategy games, more roguelikes, more RPGS and whatever then great! But from what I've seen, all it has given us is walking simulators and shitty point and click adventures.

And then there's the fact that it is affecting our normal games too. Like Anita Sarkeesian's comments to Dice about Mirror's Edge 2:

http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/TheKodu/the-sarkeesian-the-dice-and-the-mirror--235992.phtml

How is dumbing games down so that more women can play them a good thing exactly?
 

Bad Jim

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Genocidicles said:
Well if we're going for 'things we can't do in real life' why does it have to be playing as a woman, or a gay guy? Why not go all the way and have us play as transdimensional cyborgs with 2 brains? Or insect people with a rigid caste system? That actually sounds interesting to me.
It's not actually a great idea for fantasy to be so far removed from everyday experience. The audience needs to understand the subtleties, which is a lot easier in a universe that mostly works like the real world. Properly understanding an insect people would require an awful lot of exposition. Understanding a woman or black guy or a homosexual is a lot easier because they exist in real life.
 

Erttheking

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Genocidicles said:
Andy Shandy said:
Well, I suppose if you all you want is "Shooty McWhizBang 69" then no, diversity in games might not be a good thing.

But for me personally, diversity is a good thing as it will increase the chances of us getting a more diverse range of games, not only in characters, but in story, and gameplay. Hell, I myself might be a fan of "Shooty McWhizbang 69" but I wouldn't want every single game to be that.

And don't worry, "Shooty McWhizbang 69" won't be magically wiped out in the process.
But that's the thing, diversity just seems to be leading to easy crap that anyone could play. If it meant more strategy games, more roguelikes, more RPGS and whatever then great! But from what I've seen, all it has given us is walking simulators and shitty point and click adventures.

And then there's the fact that it is affecting our normal games too. Like Anita Sarkeesian's comments to Dice about Mirror's Edge 2:

http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/TheKodu/the-sarkeesian-the-dice-and-the-mirror--235992.phtml

How is dumbing games down so that more women can play them a good thing exactly?
Oh Christ, are we really going down the "Filthy causal" road again? I thought we were done chasing that boogyman!

You know what I consider to be some of the good examples of diversity in games? Fallout New Vegas (features a cast with women, People of color, LGBT characters and the only game in recent memory that has had a in depth and dramatic look at Dissociative Identity Disorder), Rogue Legacy, (Commonly has female playable characters, along with characters that suffer from a variety of disorder in a way that actually adds game play variety. Except vertigo, fuck that.) Shovel Knight (Has a damsel in distress character who is actually a character and not just a trophy to be won. The emotional connection between her and the main character is commonly explored. Also the upcoming gender swap mode, as you mentioned an hour or two ago) X-COM Enemy Unknown (Just for showing female soldiers working alongside male soldiers without drawing any special attention to it. Really liked that) The Wolf Among Us (Important female characters, awesome female villain, prostitute characters that were more than just eye candy and had agency of their own) the Walking Dead (One of the best stories I've seen in awhile, good characters of color, female characters, one of the best child characters in awhile, and a southerner who wasn't sterotypical) Dark Souls and Dark Souls II (Armor designs for female characters that are reasonable and not designed to pander) Tomb Raider (Action game with female main character) Borderlands (Always people of color and female characters to select from, to the point where the next one is getting two female characters...and Claptrap...for some fucking reason) Point is, there's diversity outside of point and click games.

Dumbing them down so that women can play? Can we please stop pretending that Anita is the mouthpiece of anything? Because I know one female friend who'd want to shove her copy of Mirror's Edge down Anita's throat if she read that. Just stop giving her and her idiotic points attention, that's the only reason people still remember what her name is. I care about women in gaming and I keep forgetting she exists until ten page flame wars about her videos I haven't watched pop up.
 

shrekfan246

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Genocidicles said:
If it meant more strategy games,
Endless Space, Sins of a Solar Empire, Age of Wonders III, Eador: Masters of the Broken World, King's Bounty, Galactic Civilizations 3, X-COM: Enemy Unknown.
more roguelikes,
FTL, Rogue Legacy, Risk of Rain, The Binding of Isaac, Sword of the Stars: The Pit, really too many others for me to even remember at this point.
more RPGS
Divinity: Original Sin, Pillars of Eternity, Torment: Tides of Numenera, Transistor, Nekro, Grim Dawn, Wasteland 2, Shadowrun Returns, The Witcher, Dark Souls.
and whatever then great! But from what I've seen, all it has given us is walking simulators and shitty point and click adventures.
You should start looking harder.
 

Mikeybb

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Anything that widens the options available to a consumer creates a healthier, stronger more creative environment.

If diversity was prevalent enough in games to make this a non issue, then no one would have to feel as if their games were being 'diversified', as there would be games for all people already.

The more games there are, the less homogenized they become.

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head.