I'm starting to question why anyone lives in California

Specter Von Baren

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The detrimental effects of climate change have been downplayed for too long, and a dangerous public contempt towards the environment has been permitted to fester. In 1910 Theodore Roosevelt said "Conservation is a great moral issue, for it involves the patriotic duty of insuring the safety and continuance of the nation," but this would have been an obstacle to unfettered capitalism and shortsighted personal consumption, and so the US and the rest of the world has stumbled blindly ever closer to fundamentally altering the face of the Earth in ways which will soon prove catastrophic if something is not done.


The national Republican policy platform is written in blood. You may claim you don't intend for anyone to be injured by your cast ballot, which I'm sure will be of great comfort to the casualties.
A strange comment. I'm not sure what to make of you and Eacaraxe in regards to your feelings on Teddy.
 

09philj

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A strange comment. I'm not sure what to make of you and Eacaraxe in regards to your feelings on Teddy.
Roosevelt was anti big business, pro environmental protection, and generally in favour of putting the interests of the working class first. If he was alive today the Republican Party would accuse him of being a socialist. If he'd won the election on the Bull Moose ticket he'd have revolutionised the US. His Square Deal would have put more restrictions on unions than I'd like, but also would have gone after trusts and polluters with far more gusto than more or less any succeeding President. He was in favour of US imperialism which isn't fantastic, but he was positively dovish compared to his contemporary Woodrow Wilson who's basically the architect of the last hundred years of terrible US foreign policy. The people at the very top of US politics have all been various shades of right leaning, so none of them really align with what I believe, but as far as I'm concerned few, if any, had a greater regard for the people of the US and their environment than Theodore Roosevelt.
 
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tstorm823

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Roosevelt was anti big business, pro environmental protection, and generally in favour of putting the interests of the working class first. If he was alive today the Republican Party would accuse him of being a socialist. If he'd won the election on the Bull Moose ticket he'd have revolutionised the US. His Square Deal would have put more restrictions on unions than I'd like, but also would have gone after trusts and polluters with far more gusto than more or less any succeeding President. He was in favour of US imperialism which isn't fantastic, but he was positively dovish compared to his contemporary Woodrow Wilson who's basically the architect of the last hundred years of terrible US foreign policy. The people at the very top of US politics have all been various shades of right leaning, so none of them really align with what I believe, but as far as I'm concerned few, if any, had a greater regard for the people of the US and their environment than Theodore Roosevelt.
Suggesting Woodrow Wilson was right-leaning basically makes the term meaningless.
 

Eacaraxe

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Roosevelt was anti big business, pro environmental protection, and generally in favour of putting the interests of the working class first.
He also literally shrugged off a bullet to the chest and went on to deliver an 84-minute campaign speech, after an assassination attempt. That's a magnitude of "go fuck yourself" we need in a US President nowadays.
 

09philj

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Suggesting Woodrow Wilson was right-leaning basically makes the term meaningless.
Liberalism is generally a right of centre ideology. Making concessions to those at the bottom of the social hierarchy does not somehow negate a belief in the hierarchy (capitalism, in this case) and a preservation of it.
 
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Specter Von Baren

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He also literally shrugged off a bullet to the chest and went on to deliver an 84-minute campaign speech, after an assassination attempt. That's a magnitude of "go fuck yourself" we need in a US President nowadays.
Liberalism is a right of centre ideology. Making concessions to those at the bottom of the social hierarchy does not somehow negate a belief in the hierarchy (capitalism, in this case) and a preservation of it.
I'm curious if you two could share your thoughts on who else (If anyone) you think were noteworthy presidents (On the positive side) and why.
 

tstorm823

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Liberalism is a right of centre ideology. Making concessions to those at the bottom of the social hierarchy does not somehow negate a belief in the hierarchy (capitalism, in this case) and a preservation of it.
And that's how you would describe Woodrow Wilson? The man known best for the Federal Reserve, the League of Nations, and foreign interventions, you'd classify as "center-right liberal".
 

09philj

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I'm curious if you two could share your thoughts on who else (If anyone) you think were noteworthy presidents (On the positive side) and why.
All of these come with extreme caveats, but I'd say Roosevelt, Taft (Except for the racism), FDR (Except for the racism, Jesus Christ), Eisenhower (Except for the foreign policy, what the CIA did in Guatemala is inexcusable), LBJ (Except for Vietnam and exposing his cock to people), and, er, that's basically it. I'm not particularly au fait with anyone prior to Teddy, but Lincoln can have a cookie for defeating the Confederates and John Adams can have half of one for being the least horrible founding father. I think every Republican president after Eisenhower was basically evil and dislike the foreign policy of all the 20th century Democrats not listed above enough to exclude them (JFK gets a special mention because if he had been free to handle the Cuban Missile Crisis his way, we would all be dead). I'm an antiwar market socialist, so I'm not exactly predisposed to liking capitalist imperialists.
 

Revnak

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You spend all your time wishing literal death on people you disagree with, you actively bring up worries about who might be blamed for fires because you don't want Antifa blamed, you suggest yourself that the badness of theories about manmade fires would be somewhat mitigated by upperclass white people being blamed for it, and you're condemning me for pointing out Antifa demographics?

Yeah, sure. That makes sense. Stay safe. I wouldn't wish on you any of what you wish on others on a regular basis.
Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
That sends the frozen-ground-swell under it,
And spills the upper boulders in the sun;
And makes gaps even two can pass abreast.
The work of hunters is another thing:
I have come after them and made repair
Where they have left not one stone on a stone,
But they would have the rabbit out of hiding,
To please the yelping dogs. The gaps I mean,
No one has seen them made or heard them made,
But at spring mending-time we find them there.
I let my neighbor know beyond the hill;
And on a day we meet to walk the line
And set the wall between us once again.
We keep the wall between us as we go.
To each the boulders that have fallen to each.
And some are loaves and some so nearly balls
We have to use a spell to make them balance:
‘Stay where you are until our backs are turned!’
We wear our fingers rough with handling them.
Oh, just another kind of out-door game,
One on a side. It comes to little more:
There where it is we do not need the wall:
He is all pine and I am apple orchard.
My apple trees will never get across
And eat the cones under his pines, I tell him.
He only says, ‘Good fences make good neighbors.’
Spring is the mischief in me, and I wonder
If I could put a notion in his head:
‘Why do they make good neighbors? Isn't it
Where there are cows? But here there are no cows.
Before I built a wall I'd ask to know
What I was walling in or walling out,
And to whom I was like to give offense.
Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
That wants it down.’ I could say ‘Elves’ to him,
But it's not elves exactly, and I'd rather
He said it for himself. I see him there
Bringing a stone grasped firmly by the top
In each hand, like an old-stone savage armed.
He moves in darkness as it seems to me,
Not of woods only and the shade of trees.
He will not go behind his father's saying,
And he likes having thought of it so well
He says again, ‘Good fences make good neighbors.’
 

lil devils x

🐐More Lego Goats Please!🐐
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You search the forums and find me or anyone with remotely similar politics wishing painful death on others, I will send you a cookie.
Anyone who wants to cut food stamps, welfare, housing, medicaid, the ACAC ,medicare and social security fits that description well. That is exactly what happens to people every day who lose access to these things. The reason we have so few elderly homeless is they usually die from the elements pretty quick. When you look at the HUGE increases of homeless from the age of 40- 64 and then the quick drop of in ages after that. The vast majority of the people didn't get housed btw, they just died a cruel painful death.
 
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09philj

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Did you know that living in constant low quality air sucks ass? It does.
It is one of the things I dislike about being at university. The city I study in doesn't have air bad enough to make you ill, but it does smell off and combined with the lights of the city it makes the sky glow orange at night. I dread to think what it would be like without the UK's fairly stringent laws about urban emissions, which were passed in the 1950s because of killer smog.
 

lil devils x

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Did you know that living in constant low quality air sucks ass? It does.
Yes, I understand it completely. Normal air is like that to me now and it feels like I am suffocating and you can literally TASTE the air and it sucks and you want to wash it off of you and wash your nose eyes and mouth out to make it go away but it is still there. I have air purifiers in every room now, massive filtration added everywhere. I literally have 4 air conditioners in an apartment now. I have the main central air, then I have these expensive ass portable ones on wheels that also work as additional air cleaners and air conditioner in addition to the air purifiers I have in ever room. THESE are the lengths I am forced to go through to live now on top of all my breathing meds.

So I sadly do understand your pain. It really does suck when you can't tolerate the air. People wonder why I complain about cities so much when I have to go through this just to be in my apartment with what others think is good air quality.
 

Seanchaidh

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And that's how you would describe Woodrow Wilson? The man known best for the Federal Reserve, the League of Nations, and foreign interventions, you'd classify as "center-right liberal".
Why not?
 

Kwak

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THANKS FOX FOR TELLING VULNERABLE PEOPLE TO FEAR OTHERS DURING A TIME OF CRISIS I AM SURE NONE OF THIS WILL COME BACK TO BITE ANYONE WHEN TONS OF HOMELESS, DESPERATE, AND ARMED PEOPLE GET IT IN THEIR HEADS THAT THEIR FELLOW DESPERATE AND HOMELESS PEOPLE CAUSED ALL THEIR PROBLEMS
Fuck I just read about that.



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The narrative was quickly seized upon by provocateurs. Right-wing website the Biggs Report claimed that antifa members were starting fires throughout the Pacific Northwest. “Possible ANTIFA Member Arrested For Starting Fires In Washington State,” said the post. A Washington state volunteer firefighter service linked to that story on Facebook, receiving 56 shares before the platform removed it.

At the same time, the Biggs Report, founded by a former InfoWars contributor, attempted to knock down rumors of their own, posting a second story that purported to debunk claims that members of far-right group the Proud Boys had started fires of their own. “The Boys Did Nothing Wrong!” said the story.

The group, which the FBI has labeled “extremist” and having “ties to white nationalism,” shared both stories on its Telegram channel.

The antifa narrative was also encouraged by a failed Republican Senate candidate in Oregon. His tweet was retweeted over 8,000 times and a screenshot of it spread on pro-Trump Instagram channels. It was also pushed by a Trump supporter affiliated with conservative nonprofit students organization Turning Point USA in Seattle. Her tweet went viral. “These fires are allegedly linked to Antifa and the Riots,” she wrote.

The rumor has been posted to virtually every social media network, including TikTok and the anonymous messaging board 4chan.
...


Paulsen said the ordeal has spooked and shocked her. “I know these people or I know their families, and they’re treating me like I’m an outsider, even though that’s where I went to high school. That’s where my parents live,” Paulsen said. “They were writing [on Facebook], “Shoot now, ask questions later. You don’t want your house catching on fire.’”
For the record, Trumbly and Paulsen said they are not members of antifa, although they are against fascism.
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Did you know that living in constant low quality air sucks ass? It does.
Hmm, be a shame if some kind of contagious virus that compromised lung health were to engulf the world right now wouldn't it?