Impeachment 2, the reckoning revenge redemption.

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
So after trump whipped his supporters into a frenzy and they decided to attempt the most pathetic coup, which resulted in 5 dead. It looks like trump might be a bit too dangerous to leave as a lame duck for the next 2 weeks. There were two options being discussed, using the 25th amendment to remove trump, which allows a majority of cabinet members and the vice president to remove power from a president who is incapacitated or unwilling to fulfill the duties required, but Pence has said he has no interest in pursuing such an action. So it sounds like house democrats are writing up articles of impeachment again and will have those ready by next week.

EDIT: Adding info about the impeachment time table, will edit as more happens.

Time frame for impeachment.

Ok, so we have a good timeframe and methodology laid out for the democratic plan for this coming week.

Apparently on Monday democrats will introduce a legislative act requesting Mike Pence to invoke the 25th amendment. If house republicans balk then Democrats will hold a formal vote on Tuesday which will make it through since democrats control the house. If Pence refuses, which seems likely, then we move onto impeachment. The problem with impeachment is that you need all 50 democrats and 17 republicans to back it for removal, and the Senate is in recess till the 19th. Senators having to debate this would impact Biden being able to set appointments and impact his early legislation and priority legislation such as dealing with Covid. Democrats could hold onto the impeachment for 100 days though. Either way, going to be weird.


Edit again: Sounds like the impeachment trial in the senate will take place February 8th.
 
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tippy2k2

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Sure, why not I guess. We all know this is going to go nowhere (and if somehow it does go somewhere, it still takes time and Trump might have an afternoon of golf left in his presidency by the time this actually goes through) but I suppose nothing else is likely going to get done until January 20th anyway so might as well pretend to do something just to run out the clock.
 
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Topaz

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Impeachment took weeks (or was it months?) last time. Are they really going to be able to push this through in just 2 weeks?

Besides, call me cynical, but the fool has caused 4 years of damage. What's another 2 weeks?
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Impeachment took weeks (or was it months?) last time. Are they really going to be able to push this through in just 2 weeks?

Besides, call me cynical, but the fool has caused 4 years of damage. What's another 2 weeks?
I think if hes under impeachment then it prevents him from doing any pardons related to the impeachment. And he is preparing to pardon himself and his family and his aids and such.

So removing him would be good, but just keeping him under impeachment for the duration would also help prevent some of his bullshit.
 
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Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Impeachment 2: Impeach harder.

How's his support among his own senators these days? Did it drop due to a perception of him putting them at risk?
It seems to have, apparently at least one republican senator has said they are up for removing him. It seems like it would be a good idea for mitch to remove him too since that would allow him to establish power back with himself and attempt to show that republicans are more responsible then they were under trump and attempt to handwave the last 4 years. But, he still has his backers like that piece of shit ted cruz... among a few others who I'm too lazy to look up at the moment.
 

meiam

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Impeachment 2: Impeach harder.

How's his support among his own senators these days? Did it drop due to a perception of him putting them at risk?
Romney is the only one who spoke up. It's unlikely the other will move against him. Trump rabbid fanbase are still around and they don't seem to have become aware f how insane they are, so if republican move against Trump they'll lose a lot of support.

It's possible that if enough of them start speaking up it'll open the floodgate and more of them will move, safety in number and all, since Trump is becoming more of a embarrassment after they lost the senate.
 

Silvanus

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Besides, call me cynical, but the fool has caused 4 years of damage. What's another 2 weeks?
Cornered animals and all that. He didn't cause a physical threat to congressmen until the final few weeks.
 

09philj

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The benefit of indictment would be preventing him from running again, but the moral and intellectual cowardice of a large number of Republican politicians who won't want questions asked about their complicity in the last four years of Trump nonsense will doubtless prevent this from going anywhere.
 
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Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
The benefit of indictment would be preventing him from running again, but the moral and intellectual cowardice of a large number of Republican politicians who won't want questions asked about their complicity in the last four years of Trump nonsense will doubtless prevent this from going anywhere.
In all likely hood, there just isn't enough time left in his term for the process to even get to removal, but if hes under impeachment it does limit his powers, such as his pardons.
 

Hades

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Sure, why not I guess. We all know this is going to go nowhere (and if somehow it does go somewhere, it still takes time and Trump might have an afternoon of golf left in his presidency by the time this actually goes through) but I suppose nothing else is likely going to get done until January 20th anyway so might as well pretend to do something just to run out the clock.
Even if it goes nowhere he apparently can't pardon himself while under impeachment. So essentially it would mean Trump's time to pardon himself runs out and that he can be prosecuted when he leaves office.
 

tippy2k2

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Even if it goes nowhere he apparently can't pardon himself while under impeachment. So essentially it would mean Trump's time to pardon himself runs out and that he can be prosecuted when he leaves office.
That wasn't something I was aware of (and it wasn't in the article posted). In that case, I suppose it's not like it hurts to do it. Even if it ends up going nowhere as expected, it's at least got that benefit.

Although part of me was hoping he'd try to do it just so that the courts would finally be forced to actually rule on it. All ignoring the "Can the President Pardon Himself?" question does is kick the can down the road if (when?) we get ourselves another Trump in office...
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
That wasn't something I was aware of (and it wasn't in the article posted). In that case, I suppose it's not like it hurts to do it. Even if it ends up going nowhere as expected, it's at least got that benefit.

Although part of me was hoping he'd try to do it just so that the courts would finally be forced to actually rule on it. All ignoring the "Can the President Pardon Himself?" question does is kick the can down the road if (when?) we get ourselves another Trump in office...
The courts would most likely rule against it, but during that time he would also pardon his family and the rest of his cabinet/aids etc etc. Possibly even the rioters in a big blanket pardon, which he almost certainly could do.
 

Cheetodust

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Romney is the only one who spoke up. It's unlikely the other will move against him. Trump rabbid fanbase are still around and they don't seem to have become aware f how insane they are, so if republican move against Trump they'll lose a lot of support.

It's possible that if enough of them start speaking up it'll open the floodgate and more of them will move, safety in number and all, since Trump is becoming more of a embarrassment after they lost the senate.
It would be nice if this could be the end of the republican party. Or at least the beginning of the end. Not like they'd be gone, just that this could split the party. Maybe get huge numbers going libertarian or something because they believe the RINOs have taken over the party. Trump definitely has enough supporters that he could challenge the Republicans.

I know it's unlikely but Sinn Fein managed to become the single most popular party here in 2020. We had basically a two party system with FF and FG. FF were in government 16 years straight at one stage. I guess the big difference is that we have a preferential system and each constituency has multiple seats so it gives you some chance of getting at least one seat in the Dail. With first past the post they know it would just lead to splitting the votes. Has the US had any senators or congressmen from a third party?

The upside to a split in the republican party would mean the left could split from the dems and have some chance. Anyway seems unlikely but so did a lot of the shit in the last 5 years. Surely something has to bring an end to the two party system eventually.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Wouldn't it set a worse precedent if we didn't try to punish a president for pulling something like this?
Yes, but impeachment isn't necessarily the best punishment because that gives Republicans an in I'd rather they didn't have. And he's fucking off one way or the other anyway. I say prosecute him for it (and a million other things) after he steps down.
 
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Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
Yes, but impeachment isn't necessarily the best punishment because that gives Republicans an in I'd rather they didn't have. And he's fucking off one way or the other anyway. I say prosecute him for it (and a million other things) after he steps down.
That is true, it would give them a means to make a clean break with him and be able to say they aren't the party of trump anymore. Although it would allow him to get more people off the hook for federal charges. But, also impeaching him for this might also help the democrats look stronger, since democrats like to keep things running that means compromise which looks weak cause people are dumb. Its hard to tell how it would turn out since the previous impeachment just made him look better to republicans.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
It would be nice if this could be the end of the republican party. Or at least the beginning of the end. Not like they'd be gone, just that this could split the party. Maybe get huge numbers going libertarian or something because they believe the RINOs have taken over the party. Trump definitely has enough supporters that he could challenge the Republicans.

I know it's unlikely but Sinn Fein managed to become the single most popular party here in 2020. We had basically a two party system with FF and FG. FF were in government 16 years straight at one stage. I guess the big difference is that we have a preferential system and each constituency has multiple seats so it gives you some chance of getting at least one seat in the Dail. With first past the post they know it would just lead to splitting the votes. Has the US had any senators or congressmen from a third party?

The upside to a split in the republican party would mean the left could split from the dems and have some chance. Anyway seems unlikely but so did a lot of the shit in the last 5 years. Surely something has to bring an end to the two party system eventually.
We kinda had that with the tea party. They were a split within the republican party and were causing all sorts of issues, but then the more moderate republicans started losing to them and that pushed the republican party further to the right on a lot of things. So its totally possible there will be one, really I was kinda expecting trump to end up becoming a third party for 2024 cause I can see him being dumb enough to do that.

Also yes we have a couple independent senators and a number of them in the house.
 

Revnak

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Theoretically, this is the only way to “preserve the Republic.” Make a dude face consequences for power grabs and corruption before the only consequences they can face are delivered solely from a gun. It could happen, but I get the feeling Trump might be willing to say he’s sorry now and play along meaning the only people who will face actual consequences will be the people he duped. This will infuriate them, and we’ll see a series of escalations.