Improving Dragon Age 2

Soviet Heavy

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I won't deny that Dragon Age 2 has both flaws and benefits, but right now, I view it as a fixer-upper rather than a lost cause. There is a lot of potential in the game, that just seems to be squandered by obtuse decisions and a short development cycle. Here are the changes I would make to improve the overall game.

#1. Make Kirkwall Bigger
If you are restricting a story to one location, make sure it is one that you actually want to explore. In this case, it means making a bigger city. Over the course of the three acts, show off different parts of the city, make it feel more alive. Put in more NPCs, make more locations, just increase the overall scale.

#2. Remove universal cooldown from abilities.
This is especially true for healing effects and magic usage. It does no good to have a long ass cooldown between casting multiple spells. I understand why this was implemented to keep Mages from being war gods like they were in Origins, but it severely cripples their support role. Being able to only use a single healing spell before waiting on a cooldown makes healers very limited. And the universal healing potion bar is terrible for managing a party, especially in a dire situation where many are near death.

#3. Change the Prologue
The prologue of Dragon Age 2 is one of the weakest parts of the game. Running across "Shit Mountain" fighting hordes of cloned Darkspawn isn't exactly the most exciting way to start off a game. The whole section feels tedious, and an uninspired art direction does not help.

Compare to the prologue from Origins. This not only includes the origin story, but the entire section involving the Battle of Ostagar and the town of Lothering. This is how I feel it should have been handled:
#1. Origin - Following the Lothering's Bann to Ostagar, starting out with your farewell to your mother and sister as Hawke and Carver go off to war. Much like the Human Noble's origin. Battle at Ostagar acts as the combat tutorial, while being in a much more visually dynamic setting.

#2. Escape - Following the defeat, the game switches to the flee from Lothering as the Blight pours in. Here, you meet Flemeth and the whole shebang with Wesley goes down. But before you go straight to Kirkwall, instead show Hawke's family moving across Ferelden, until they make it to the docks. Then proceed into the game proper.


#4 Add a continuing plot throughout the three acts
This is the place where most of the criticism falls, that the acts feel like independent stories rather than a connected series of events. What I propose is an increase in the importance of the Qunari.

The first act takes place a little while after the first Qunari Invasion of Kirkwall, which was repelled by the smuggler fleets, including Isabella. Maybe have Hawke participate in this battle, and then have the stranded Qunari come into play in the second act. This way, it gives Hawke a motivation to complete the quests rather than just "make 50 Gold Sovereigns." Show the Mage/Templar conflict steadily growing, instead of relegating it to mostly sidequests until the third act. The infighting between the Andrastians allows Hawke to act as an agent of change in order to better fight the Qunari. Hawke's actions determine how severe the fighting gets, and how well prepared the city is to repel another Qunari attack that happened in Act 2.

That's all I've got for now, feel free to add your own suggestions. Or just ignore everything and scoff at another DA2 thread.

ADVISORY
Please try to keep it civil. I want suggestions on how the game might have been improved, not a "The game sucks so change the suckness of it" responses.
 

RedEyesBlackGamer

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Jan 23, 2011
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Just a personal one-get rid of the dialogue wheel and voice. Blank slate>pre-defined character in a RPG like Dragon Age. Also, the hell was with the race lock? You put me in a fantasy world and force me to be human? Really? Imagine if Skyrim forced you to be a Nord.

I agree with you on the prologue. Way to just throw me into the game and not let me get attached to my family.

Act 3 really needed a middle option.
 

CommanderL

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May 12, 2011
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i think there should have been another act after the third when every thing has gone to hell lets be honest the whole last part of the third act moved way to quickly
 

Liquidcool

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RedEyesBlackGamer said:
Just a personal one-get rid of the dialogue wheel and voice. Blank slate>pre-defined character in a RPG like Dragon Age. Also, the hell was with the race lock? You put me in a fantasy world and force me to be human? Really? Imagine if Skyrim forced you to be a Nord.
To me this is funny, because I feel the opposite. I love voiced protagonists, humans are my favorite race (boring I know, but it's true) and the same goes for Nords actually.

I liked the dialogue in both origins and 2, but I gotta go with 2 just because it's voiced. It just feels a little off to me when NPC's talk to me and I respond in text, especially in a third person game.
 
Sep 14, 2009
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Soviet Heavy said:
I won't deny that Dragon Age 2 has both flaws and benefits, but right now, I view it as a fixer-upper rather than a lost cause. There is a lot of potential in the game, that just seems to be squandered by obtuse decisions and a short development cycle. Here are the changes I would make to improve the overall game.

#1. Make Kirkwall Bigger
If you are restricting a story to one location, make sure it is one that you actually want to explore. In this case, it means making a bigger city. Over the course of the three acts, show off different parts of the city, make it feel more alive. Put in more NPCs, make more locations, just increase the overall scale.

#2. Remove universal cooldown from abilities.
This is especially true for healing effects and magic usage. It does no good to have a long ass cooldown between casting multiple spells. I understand why this was implemented to keep Mages from being war gods like they were in Origins, but it severely cripples their support role. Being able to only use a single healing spell before waiting on a cooldown makes healers very limited. And the universal healing potion bar is terrible for managing a party, especially in a dire situation where many are near death.

#3. Change the Prologue
The prologue of Dragon Age 2 is one of the weakest parts of the game. Running across "Shit Mountain" fighting hordes of cloned Darkspawn isn't exactly the most exciting way to start off a game. The whole section feels tedious, and an uninspired art direction does not help.

Compare to the prologue from Origins. This not only includes the origin story, but the entire section involving the Battle of Ostagar and the town of Lothering. This is how I feel it should have been handled:
#1. Origin - Following the Lothering's Bann to Ostagar, starting out with your farewell to your mother and sister as Hawke and Carver go off to war. Much like the Human Noble's origin. Battle at Ostagar acts as the combat tutorial, while being in a much more visually dynamic setting.

#2. Escape - Following the defeat, the game switches to the flee from Lothering as the Blight pours in. Here, you meet Flemeth and the whole shebang with Wesley goes down. But before you go straight to Kirkwall, instead show Hawke's family moving across Ferelden, until they make it to the docks. Then proceed into the game proper.


#4 Add a continuing plot throughout the three acts
This is the place where most of the criticism falls, that the acts feel like independent stories rather than a connected series of events. What I propose is an increase in the importance of the Qunari.

The first act takes place a little while after the first Qunari Invasion of Kirkwall, which was repelled by the smuggler fleets, including Isabella. Maybe have Hawke participate in this battle, and then have the stranded Qunari come into play in the second act. This way, it gives Hawke a motivation to complete the quests rather than just "make 50 Gold Sovereigns." Show the Mage/Templar conflict steadily growing, instead of relegating it to mostly sidequests until the third act. The infighting between the Andrastians allows Hawke to act as an agent of change in order to better fight the Qunari. Hawke's actions determine how severe the fighting gets, and how well prepared the city is to repel another Qunari attack that happened in Act 2.

That's all I've got for now, feel free to add your own suggestions. Or just ignore everything and scoff at another DA2 thread.
regardless of me still really enjoying DA2, i will say i agree on all of this, at least they could've had decent modding tools to lets modders take the game away and make kirkwall what it SHOULD have been.

honestly by act 3, kirkwall should've been fucking huge and should've been amazing.
 

DEATHROAD

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May 14, 2008
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Liquidcool said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
Just a personal one-get rid of the dialogue wheel and voice. Blank slate>pre-defined character in a RPG like Dragon Age. Also, the hell was with the race lock? You put me in a fantasy world and force me to be human? Really? Imagine if Skyrim forced you to be a Nord.
To me this is funny, because I feel the opposite. I love voiced protagonists, humans are my favorite race (boring I know, but it's true) and the same goes for Nords actually.

I liked the dialogue in both origins and 2, but I gotta go with 2 just because it's voiced. It just feels a little off to me when NPC's talk to me and I respond in text, especially in a third person game.
I agree totally, First person I can tollerate, like in oblivion, hell when im at my most nerdyness I even catch myself saying the diologue lines aloud then clicking, really creates imersion, but you just cant do that in 3rd person, like it or not, you will never 100% FEEL like your character in 3rd person and therfore i see no problem with them being voiced.
 

Chased

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Sep 17, 2010
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I'm playing it now for the first time and my biggest gripe is with the setting of Kirkwall. Since the town is your go to place, the game designers should have created a town I would actually want to go to. I'm fine with the voice options but more of the stories choice driven pieces should be driven by action instead of dialogue. Overall though, I'm liking the game.
 

Braedan

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Sep 14, 2010
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Remove Enemy waves. Made combat stupid beyond belief. Why are there so many bandits and why are they repelling from the roof? WHY WERE THEY UP THERE ANYWAYS.
 

DEATHROAD

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May 14, 2008
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Soviet Heavy said:
I won't deny that Dragon Age 2 has both flaws and benefits, but right now, I view it as a fixer-upper rather than a lost cause. There is a lot of potential in the game, that just seems to be squandered by obtuse decisions and a short development cycle. Here are the changes I would make to improve the overall game.

#1. Make Kirkwall Bigger
If you are restricting a story to one location, make sure it is one that you actually want to explore. In this case, it means making a bigger city. Over the course of the three acts, show off different parts of the city, make it feel more alive. Put in more NPCs, make more locations, just increase the overall scale.

#2. Remove universal cooldown from abilities.
This is especially true for healing effects and magic usage. It does no good to have a long ass cooldown between casting multiple spells. I understand why this was implemented to keep Mages from being war gods like they were in Origins, but it severely cripples their support role. Being able to only use a single healing spell before waiting on a cooldown makes healers very limited. And the universal healing potion bar is terrible for managing a party, especially in a dire situation where many are near death.

#3. Change the Prologue
The prologue of Dragon Age 2 is one of the weakest parts of the game. Running across "Shit Mountain" fighting hordes of cloned Darkspawn isn't exactly the most exciting way to start off a game. The whole section feels tedious, and an uninspired art direction does not help.

Compare to the prologue from Origins. This not only includes the origin story, but the entire section involving the Battle of Ostagar and the town of Lothering. This is how I feel it should have been handled:
#1. Origin - Following the Lothering's Bann to Ostagar, starting out with your farewell to your mother and sister as Hawke and Carver go off to war. Much like the Human Noble's origin. Battle at Ostagar acts as the combat tutorial, while being in a much more visually dynamic setting.

#2. Escape - Following the defeat, the game switches to the flee from Lothering as the Blight pours in. Here, you meet Flemeth and the whole shebang with Wesley goes down. But before you go straight to Kirkwall, instead show Hawke's family moving across Ferelden, until they make it to the docks. Then proceed into the game proper.


#4 Add a continuing plot throughout the three acts
This is the place where most of the criticism falls, that the acts feel like independent stories rather than a connected series of events. What I propose is an increase in the importance of the Qunari.

The first act takes place a little while after the first Qunari Invasion of Kirkwall, which was repelled by the smuggler fleets, including Isabella. Maybe have Hawke participate in this battle, and then have the stranded Qunari come into play in the second act. This way, it gives Hawke a motivation to complete the quests rather than just "make 50 Gold Sovereigns." Show the Mage/Templar conflict steadily growing, instead of relegating it to mostly sidequests until the third act. The infighting between the Andrastians allows Hawke to act as an agent of change in order to better fight the Qunari. Hawke's actions determine how severe the fighting gets, and how well prepared the city is to repel another Qunari attack that happened in Act 2.

That's all I've got for now, feel free to add your own suggestions. Or just ignore everything and scoff at another DA2 thread.
I adored Dragon Age 2, but these changes would still improve the game 10 fold, I would honestly pay money for some DLC that implimented these.

I also think the game could be improved slightly if when you dont have a person in your party and your not at their hangout and provided your in kirkwall there should be a chance you could run into them, they might even wave, greet you / passive agressivly insult you depending on what they think of you, Small chance, but would have helped the party members i DIDNT use actually feel like people too, instead of rejected tools gathering dust.
 

BlackStar42

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MAKE MORE LEVELS. Seriously, the biggest problem for me was the blatant level recycling, every cave, every warehouse was the exact same. At least they changed it a little bit in the DLCs.
 

RedEyesBlackGamer

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Jan 23, 2011
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Braedan said:
Remove Enemy waves. Made combat stupid beyond belief. Why are there so many bandits and why are they repelling from the roof? WHY WERE THEY UP THERE ANYWAYS.
Didn't you know? Street thugs in Kirkwall attend ninja classes on the weekend. Their recruiting is fantastic too, seeing as how you have to slaughter dozens of them every time you try to cross the damn street.
 

Agayek

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Oct 23, 2008
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Braedan said:
Remove Enemy waves. Made combat stupid beyond belief. Why are there so many bandits and why are they repelling from the roof? WHY WERE THEY UP THERE ANYWAYS.
This. So many times this.

I had one large complaint with DA2, and it was that the combat was ridiculously bad. The mechanics themselves were much improved to Origins, I actually thoroughly enjoyed the class combo system and how you could play things off each other.

The encounters, on the other hand, were examples of some of the worst design decisions I have ever seen. There was no strategy involved aside from "Stand in a group and AOE". It was utterly ridiculous.

Beyond that, I'd like there to be a coherent story between the three acts (you know, make them actually relate to each other instead of being completely separate) and more than 5 dungeon maps.

If those changes were made, I'd change my rating of DA2 from "Utter Shit" to "Decent". It would take an act of God to make DA2 "Good" though.
 

solemnwar

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RedEyesBlackGamer said:
Just a personal one-get rid of the dialogue wheel and voice. Blank slate>pre-defined character in a RPG like Dragon Age. Also, the hell was with the race lock? You put me in a fantasy world and force me to be human? Really? Imagine if Skyrim forced you to be a Nord.
Well the story they had would've been impossible to do with an elf or a dwarf. That's probably the problem right there, the story was way too focused on Hawke's family. I don't mind the voice though.

I get a sort of dark humour laugh out of M!Hawke being the creepy human rapist from the Elf Commoner origin, though. And then hitting on Merril. I know I'm a terrible person xD
 

StormShaun

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Feb 1, 2009
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I agree with all of those things but one personal agenda has to be settled if I were to love this game, Dual Wielding warrior, just give me it, I love playing that class in DA:O but in this game I cannot.

Worst decision ever Bioware.
 

FilipJPhry

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I would also improve the mage talent webs. Once I got the +100 Fortitude talent, I no longer needed to add more talents to my battlemage.

It's been a while since I've played it, and I would've added more, but the above posts listed most of the problems I remember.
 

TheCowman

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Oct 22, 2011
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Agayek said:
Beyond that, I'd like there to be a coherent story between the three acts (you know, make them actually relate to each other instead of being completely separate) and more than 5 dungeon maps.
This complaint was the one that surprised me the most when I first heard it. I really liked how the three acts fit together. The first act was all about pulling yourself out of the gutter and while doing so you kept hearing about the tensions with the qunari and the volatile relationship between the mages and the templars.

But you couldn't deal with that; you were too busy trying to improve your lot in life.

Second chapter; you've done it!! You're a big wig now, but you remember those qunari? Yeah, they're still there. Remember those couple missions you did involving them? Well, it's gotten worse since then. And with your new status, suddenly it's your problem too. Also, things still suck with the mages and templars, but you can't focus on that now what with the qunari-rage growing.

Third chapter; well, you're more popular than ever now. That means that lingering templar/mage hostility that's been a constant background factor up to now? Yeah, that's something you gotta deal with now.

I rather liked how these plot threads would move to prominance over time. It was like, "mages and templars? Qunari? Huh, those are some interesting background elements". Then the next act would roll around and suddenly I'd realize that, "oh no, this shit really IS fucked up".
 

RedEyesBlackGamer

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Jan 23, 2011
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Also, who thought it would be a good idea for the first act to be about grinding 50 gold? That isn't a good way to get rolling as it kills motivation and pacing. Particularly when it is compared to the much better second act.
Edit: Whoops, now I've gotten on a roll. It is hard to stop talking about a game's shortcomings/successes once you get going.
 

Ascarus

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here's an idea. make it an RPG. not an action game with generic RPG elements.

game was trash compared to Origins. plain and simple.