Is it racist to ban the N-word? I'm confused here.

[michael87cn]

How could it be racist to ban a word? Especially a word commonly involved with drama, misunderstandings, violence... etc.?

Racism is basically, hatred for people that pertain to a specific race.

Censorship, maybe? Racism? Use a dictionary, people!

 

[Hawkeye21]

Everything white people do or say is racist. In the same time, it's okay and not racist at all for African Americans to call all white people crackers (meaning "whip crackers", slave owners and/or taskmasters), because white people should not be offended by that. When I lived in America, I've learned that despite being a descendant of polish jews, who were subjugated and enslaved long before African Americans were, I am still a dirty and unapologetic slave owner by virtue of being white, and I am a racist for thinking otherwise.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

It isn't racist because one race does not exclusively use the word. You are not infringing on one race's rights specifically. It's probably different in the US but I use it pretty commonly as a joke to mean 'guys' or 'friends' and I'm white. It is unfortunate because freedom of speech, and because it is often used today to mean something completely removed from its understandably offensive origins.

 

[Uhura]

Of course, then you run into the issue that black people don't all agree, nor does any group. Even within the same community or generation, you won't see actual consensus on the word or most other slurs, former slurs, reclaimed slurs, whatever.

Yeah, I'm surprised that so many people don't seem to get this point. Black bro-athletes, rappers, teenage boys ect. don't represent the entire 'black community'. Just because some groups have embraced the use of a slur, doesn't mean that the entire community approves it.

 

[Lucane]

I imagine it'd be like banning the word "mate" for British white guys. Black guys use it like we use bro, mate, pal etc. Banning it fucks up their way of talking.

It'd also reduce the amount of interracial smack talking, which is bad.

Words take on different meanings based on who's saying it and how. It's acceptable for a husband and wife to call each other "Sweetie", but it's uncouth when a boss calls his secretary "Sweetie." No one suggests that we ban that word because we recognize that relationships and context affect their meaning.

There are black athletes in the NFL who feel comfortable and rely on the word "******" when talking. This rule dictates that these black athletes are wrong for using this word, and they need to use the word in the same way white people do. It's ignorant and a bit racist.

The NFL already has rules to deal with unsportsmanlike conduct.

Black guys use it like we use bro, mate, pal etc. Banning it fucks up their way of talking.

Oh, well that was my entire point summed up in two sentences.

No offense or anything honestly, but not all of us feel that way about the word but in some circles they use it for people they socialize with. If you weren't attempting to generalize it then I'm sorry but it kind of leaned that way a bit to me and I just wanted to clarify if it did.

Yeah Banning words is a pretty foolish thing to do. For starters how would you explain what words you can't say or use if you can't say or use them?

 

[Lucane]

How could it be racist to ban a word? Especially a word commonly involved with drama, misunderstandings, violence... etc.?

Racism is basically, hatred for people that pertain to a specific race.

Censorship, maybe? Racism? Use a dictionary, people!

I wouldn't call it racist either, on the face of it though you could call it playing favorites at best since it's the only term mentioned for honorable intentions however misguided but since it only "protects" one group of people it could then be seen as looking down on other groups since they don't receive similar protections.

 

[werewolfgold]

My question is, what happens when a white person calls another white person ******?

Quantum singularity opens up and everything is annihilated?

 

[viranimus]

Sort of a catch 22 in a way. It CAN very well be construed as racist because taking proactive measures against the word indirectly empowers that word. Almost like forbidden fruit. You didnt want it till you knew you couldnt have it. Knowing that, it then goes without saying that there will be many people who see it as forbidden fruit and through that indirectly encouraged support of it proliferates its usage and worse amplifies its severity.

On the other hand though, viewing it as on offensive word to begin with gives it undue power. Words can only hold the power we give them. So when the word conjurs such thought and imagry in people and they have worked for years to in fact dis empower it, to have their work counteracted by well meaning but misguided actions is an indirect imposition that they could rightfully construe as an intended sleight.

Captcha: Half empty.
Yep, the ole amp tank is running pretty low. Thanks for the reminder. Ill get right on refueling. AMP AMP AND AWAY!!!!!

 

[keiji_Maeda]

It reminds of that one turian from Mass Effect. "You humans are all racist!" indeed.

Man, screw the Turians, with their mandibles and their calibrations. They started the First Contact War. Plus they suck at biotics.

Although to be fair, Turians, just like humans, aren't a race, they're a species.

But you forget, all humans look alike, are incapable of dedicating themselves to the simplest of tasks, and their colonists don't even wear facepaint! Also, they started the first contact war, stupid non-avian tomatocans.

 

[ASnogarD]

What gets me about this 'word' is how when a white uses it its offensive beyond belief and the person who used it can literally have their livelihood destroyed, yet a certain demographic of blacks use it as a common word...

Not long ago there was a huge scandal as a WHITE comedian used the word in a show, yet I was listening to the BBC where a black radio host with a well known rapper was chatting with that word used nearly as much as every second word.

I say black people should make up THEIR minds if this is a bad word or not, making it a word for use exclusive to blacks but not whites (funny enough if any other race uses it, its fine) is definitely racist.
In South Africa, blacks were often referred to by a certain word which to my understanding in Arabic actually means 'unbeliever' but when referring to blacks is a racial slur in South Africa... those blacks dont use the word themselves to refer to themselves, its offensive to them...

... so why is '******' conditionally offensive ?

FYI - The Arabic connection is due to how the current dominant black tribes came from north Africa but was pushed out by stronger tribes and eventually made their way down to South Africa where they in turn push the native black people, namely the San (Bushmen) and Hottentots, out of the best parts of the land and into the deserts.

 

[keiji_Maeda]

c) The point of insults is to anger the other person after all.

d) If a black guy has pissed me off I would drop the N bomb, that doesn't make me racist. It's just a word.

These are two very different matters,it's a shivvy stick alright but lemme give you a guidance.

Saying the N-word, whether or not you believe that there is a difference in colored folk's from Asians, Whites,hispanics or us mongrels, makes it racist. Yes, it does, you may not consider yourself racist, you may be a great philanthropist and loer of all-mankind, but at that moment, you are marginalizing black people with a word that essentialy means nothing but "ignorant-simply-shiftless-black-person" not Twat,not asshole or anyfink' else. It is specfically inteded to marginalize Black people and that is racist. In saying to someone else you are marginalizing 'em, and that is racist. Whether or not you intended for it to be.

Now i have scant hopes for digging you out of your entrenched position, so lemme make a different point. It'll piss them of, but as an insult? any five year old can drag racism out of the cupboard, and teens often do, it's simple and ignorant and not that great of an insult.

 

[keiji_Maeda]

I'd like to invoke something different in this discussion, i don't know how many of my fellow 'scapees are from the generation o' omine or thar' bouts but i was wondering if y'all Remember Dave chapelle?

The comedian? Brilliantly received comedy show exploring the complexities of racial inequality with liberal use of the N-word to highlight how willing people were to accept racism at face value, if it gave a few chuckles? Who gradually realized that the people who appreciated the show seemingly were almost completely unable to realize that the N-word wasn't supposed to be thrown around everywhere by everyone?

Mostly remembered for the "rick james" skit, unfortunately.

I remember reading that chapelle turned down a VERY profitable third season due to a mix of executive meddling and stress. But later, i read an interview where he gave a very heartfelt plea that the reason he headed to the hills of Africa(literally) was that he had a "my god what have i done moment" where people of all races started spouting of the N-word eachday, erryday,errywhere. The reason being that people completely failed to appreciate the satire part of his work and thought he was pandering to stereotypes and having a good laugh at ebonics.

I think Dave chapelle is one of my favorite comedians, and there is a powerful lesson to learn here, the power of words and the casual approach that we have to racism, and more over hatred as a whole works negatively to inoculate us towards a casual approach regarding racism.

Then again, i might just be putting him on a pedestal.

 

[userwhoquitthesite]

I doubt I'm the first to mention this, but you know what else used to be unacceptable to call black people? "Black"

****** is a stupid word made by people couldn't pronounce the word "negro". That is all
Are there racist assholes in the world? Fuck yes. And they will spit out the word "******" with all the distaste they have for those awful folk what DARE have darker skin then them. But there are just as many people who will never once use ****** to describe anyone, and are more racist than your inexplicably redneck uncle that neither side of the family wants to claim.

Words don't fucking matter. What needs to change is the actions of the people who use those words


Lemme give an example. I was at the mall the other day and see a black family doing their shopping. One woman in the group has a shirt on says "Black Power" (complete with panther fist), and another's shirt read "I [heart] being black"
No one will say anything to these women. But if white people wore the analogous shirts (white power/i heart being white), they would be ATTACKED for their crazy amounts of tshirt racism.



i think we need to stop worrying about slurs and start making sure people (black, white, hispanic, asian, everyone) just fucking learn not to be this person:

Spoiler

 

[keiji_Maeda]

What gets me about this 'word' is how when a white uses it its offensive beyond belief and the person who used it can literally have their livelihood destroyed, yet a certain demographic of blacks use it as a common word...

Not long ago there was a huge scandal as a WHITE comedian used the word in a show, yet I was listening to the BBC where a black radio host with a well known rapper was chatting with that word used nearly as much as every second word.

I say black people should make up THEIR minds if this is a bad word or not, making it a word for use exclusive to blacks but not whites (funny enough if any other race uses it, its fine) is definitely racist.
In South Africa, blacks were often referred to by a certain word which to my understanding in Arabic actually means 'unbeliever' but when referring to blacks is a racial slur in South Africa... those blacks dont use the word themselves to refer to themselves, its offensive to them...

... so why is '******' conditionally offensive ?

FYI - The Arabic connection is due to how the current dominant black tribes came from north Africa but was pushed out by stronger tribes and eventually made their way down to South Africa where they in turn push the native black people, namely the San (Bushmen) and Hottentots, out of the best parts of the land and into the deserts.

Well, to use an example, the K-word (kaffir) was used by south Africans in power with AWB party to derogatorily refer to the black people (english speaking AWB's of ol' SA refused to call black people anything except Kaffir and "Blacks") as property, servants and inferior, because otherwise, they wouldn't have lost the land to white colonizers and Europeans and the AWB considered it their land, by right of conquest and inheritance.

Now i a have an inclination to waxe long, so, in short.
Kaffir=you are inferior to me and means that you will never be a person in my eyes
******= you are a slave, the word means that you are property, intended to be used, abused and dictated by my deciding.

Now i've heard the idea that african americans use the n-word themselves because they refuse to let it be used against them, that it is to be reconquered from the oppressors, and thusly remove this hated word of ignorance against them. And it then fell into everyday use.

one last thing, the idea behind the n-word is also that black people were called "boy", "uncle" "ol' man" and so forth is simple. They were never allowed to believe that they could be simply MEN, that they could be people. Now in this instance it is an old use of language, and ignores women's rights (i profess ignorance as to what women were called besides the N-word) but there you go.

 

[keiji_Maeda]

I doubt I'm the first to mention this, but you know what else used to be unacceptable to call black people? "Black"

****** is a stupid word made by people couldn't pronounce the word "negro". That is all
Are there racist assholes in the world? Fuck yes. And they will spit out the word "******" with all the distaste they have for those awful folk what DARE have darker skin then them. But there are just as many people who will never once use ****** to describe anyone, and are more racist than your inexplicably redneck uncle that neither side of the family wants to claim.

Words don't fucking matter. What needs to change is the actions of the people who use those words


Lemme give an example. I was at the mall the other day and see a black family doing their shopping. One woman in the group has a shirt on says "Black Power" (complete with panther fist), and another's shirt read "I [heart] being black"
No one will say anything to these women. But if white people wore the analogous shirts (white power/i heart being white), they would be ATTACKED for their crazy amounts of tshirt racism.



i think we need to stop worrying about slurs and start making sure people (black, white, hispanic, asian, everyone) just fucking learn not to be this person:

Spoiler

aaah riley freeman. I look forward to seeing you in season four.

if i saw someone use the t-shirt "white power" with this symbol behind it
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/71/Afrikaner_Weerstandsbeweging_flag.svg

then yes, i would think they are completely fracking stupid.

That being said, black power and white power has different historical uses and the semantics of their differences are only understood from their historical uses. If we drop both for a certain amount of generations then they would (asumingly) mean the same thing. Forgetting all history and culture behind the separate movements. Which is difficult.

But yah'.

Let's not be racist, and let's not try to strive for negative popcultural examples of what-ever-genealogical heritage we stem from.

 

[keiji_Maeda]

My question is, what happens when a white person calls another white person ******?

We laugh at their stupidity?

 

[babinro]

Is it right? Yes.

I work in a call center. If I drop an F-bomb on the phone when talking to a customer I'll lose my job. When it comes down to it the NFL is a business. They don't want to potentially offend the viewers / fans. Codes of conduct are normal.

On a personal note...I think people in general are overly sensitive when it comes to language. The only thing that matters is the context. No one should get upset when the N-word is spoken regardless of a persons ethnic background unless the context of the spoken word is hateful.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Well, I can sort of see how it can be racist. There's a white NFL commissioner who wants to place a ban on a word used predominantly by black players simply because of the off chance that if a white player uses it it would be considered racist. Essentially, you have white people dictating to black people what they are and aren't allowed to say based entirely on the standards of white people. I'm rather certain that that falls under the category of "racism".

So then by that rational, is it also racist for a "white NFL commissioner" to want to ban the use of the racist slur "cracker" because it would mean that "white people dictating to black people what they are and aren't allowed to say based entirely on the standards of white people"?

OP:No it is not racist. Pointless maybe, but not racist.

 

[kurupt87]

c) The point of insults is to anger the other person after all.

d) If a black guy has pissed me off I would drop the N bomb, that doesn't make me racist. It's just a word.

These are two very different matters,it's a shivvy stick alright but lemme give you a guidance.

Saying the N-word, whether or not you believe that there is a difference in colored folk's from Asians, Whites,hispanics or us mongrels, makes it racist. Yes, it does, you may not consider yourself racist, you may be a great philanthropist and loer of all-mankind, but at that moment, you are marginalizing black people with a word that essentialy means nothing but "ignorant-simply-shiftless-black-person" not Twat,not asshole or anyfink' else. It is specfically inteded to marginalize Black people and that is racist. In saying to someone else you are marginalizing 'em, and that is racist. Whether or not you intended for it to be.

I know the insult is racist, I said it was in 2.b) Just like "*****" is sexist, "******" is racist and "bender" is homophobic. And of course there's a difference between the insults used for the different races dude, come on. ******, wog, spic, cracker etc.

Now i have scant hopes for digging you out of your entrenched position, so lemme make a different point. It'll piss them of, but as an insult? any five year old can drag racism out of the cupboard, and teens often do, it's simple and ignorant and not that great of an insult.

If I'm angry enough to be insulting someone then how "good", original or poetic an insult is I just don't care. Eloquence is one of the first things out the window when you're angry enough that you might be fighting soon.

And these insults are too good to pass up, they come with so much baggage and are almost guaranteed to piss the other person off.