Jennifer Hepler leaves Bioware due to threats by fans

[Carpenter]

By now, i would shift some of the blame onto the developers themselves. You guys know you're dealing with morons here. One might argue about a vocal minority here but one death threat would be about enough for me to abandon any dreams of making games simply because i would be making them for those "People".
Other alternative: report to the police.

Certain threats are more then the occasional "ima kill you!" which would be ok if a quick "... in COD!" is added;
This one guy made it up to the point where he re-directed his anger towards the Children because he formed the thought that this would hit closer to home.

Or maybe he or she felt they needed to "remove her from the gene pool" which seems to be a very popular rant here on the escapist forums.

I do love how people are unable to see the parallels right in front of them.

 

[Carpenter]

When did censorship suddenly become cool? Thousands of people have died for freedom from it and other forms of government control and now everyone is just spitting on their graves.

Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying i approve of death threats to this woman or her kids. However i would prefer to know who the crazies and psycho's online are so i don't have to worry about associating with them. If people's ability to express themselves is so limited, how will you ever really know where people stand? The trolls wont just disappear. They will still be there, just now you wont know who they are till your already in the same corner with them.

On another note: who would we trust to be the internet thought police? I for one don't have any use for the current TSA. I definitely don't want to see the BS that will come with an internet equivalent. The young LoL player was just a sampling of what is to come if we collectively decide to hand over our free speech rights, and it will only get worse.

Wonder if you would be defending death threats as free speech if it was you or your family being targeted.

Keep in mind the main difference that she is "Famous" and therefore her personal information (such as where she lives) is often put on public display.

Nobody "fought and died" for your right to harass random people online. If you want to argue that it's a right you should have, great but don't pretend that it's something people have been fighting for. You really don't understand how "Free speech" works if you think it has anything to do with death threats.

Who grants you your right anyways? Your rights seem very important to you, where do they come from? Are they physical things or just lines on paper?

When does a right expire? When is a right created? How do we know the rights written up by a bunch of wealthy slave owners are morally justified and not outdated?


EDIT: BTW why did you ask when it became "cool?" That is just a really weird thing to say. Do you really base your reality on what is considered "cool" and if so, who is saying censorship is "cool?"

 

[RJ 17]

Actually she said she wanted people to be able to fast-forward through the game just so they could get to the writing. "Games have a way to button-through dialogue so people who aren't interested in it can get back to the fun of the game. There should be a way to skip the combat so people who like the dialogue can just enjoy that." or something along those lines, too lazy to scroll back up and read the actual quote. xD

Still, that statement PROVES that she just settled on gaming. She's a writer and wants people to enjoy her stories, I completely understand that. Sooooooooo why is she writing in an industry where the story is, for the most part, entirely optional and can just be "buttoned-through"? Shouldn't she be writing, oh I don't know....BOOKS? Or at least something where the story CAN'T be skipped through? Maybe she did try writing stuff like that and no one was interested in publishing it. If that's the case, then maybe she shouldn't be a writer in the first place. I honestly don't know if that's the situation she was in - that the gaming industry being the only place she could get a job writing, having tried and not been accepted in other areas - but I do know this: you might love to cook, but if all you can cook is Macaroni & Cheese, no restaurant is going to hire you.

Eh. I never really understood why this was so controversial. Some of my favorite games of the last five years have had utterly minimal game play draped loosely over extremely strong story content. The Walking Dead. To the Moon. Hell, people even whinged about how Bioshock Infinite's humdrum shooting only got in the way of watching the excellent story.

I think it's fine to bloviate about different directions you can take "gaming" in, even if one of those directions is "push button to advance narrative". The strength of gaming is interactivity and immersion, and putting you IN the story. That doesn't have to mean shootin' fools and takin' cover. It can be something as simple as picking a direction to walk in, or making a dialogue choice, and the illusion of agency is maintained.

Frankly, the best things about DA2 were the chunks of storytelling that didn't get mucked up by the disastrous pacing. I can see an argument for fast forwarding visiting the same fucking cave for the 48th time. Sometimes my girlfriend just wants to see what might happen if she said X to character Y, and doesn't want to have to kill the same 8 brigands again just to find out.

Hepler kinda had a point.

That's fair enough to a certain degree and fits in line with her response to that first question in the interview. However I'd argue that her response to the second question shows that she'd be much more comfortable working in any writing industry other than gaming. As you said: the strength of gaming is interactivity and immersion, putting you IN the story. From the sound of Hepler's responses, it's the whole "interactivity" that she didn't like about gaming. A good book can be immersive and draw you into the story, so you're right there beside Aragorn as he cuts down another orc. Games aren't the first medium to be immersive, they're the first medium to add the interactivity to that immersion.

As for what made her comments so controversial, a lot of gamers saw it as a slap in the face, hearing a game writer say "My least favorite part of the gaming industry is the games." Besides that statement specifically saying what I just mentioned above, people found it insulting that someone would have that kind of view about gaming while working in the gaming industry (and many who didn't like DA2's story found it very indicative of WHY the problems they had with the story were there: the story was written by someone who apparently doesn't want to be writing for games). Again I go with the comparison I made in a previous response, what Hepler said would be the equivalent of asking Brad Pitt "What's your least favorite thing about being a movie star?" and having him respond with "Acting." Just begs the question "Then what are you doing here in the first place?"

 

[romxxii]

As much as I hated her work in DA2 for turning the once cheeky-gay Anders into the clingy gay terrorist Anders, I don't think death threats are in order.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

That's fair enough to a certain degree and fits in line with her response to that first question in the interview. However I'd argue that her response to the second question shows that she'd be much more comfortable working in any writing industry other than gaming. As you said: the strength of gaming is interactivity and immersion, putting you IN the story. From the sound of Hepler's responses, it's the whole "interactivity" that she didn't like about gaming. A good book can be immersive and draw you into the story, so you're right there beside Aragorn as he cuts down another orc. Games aren't the first medium to be immersive, they're the first medium to add the interactivity to that immersion.

As for what made her comments so controversial, a lot of gamers saw it as a slap in the face, hearing a game writer say "My least favorite part of the gaming industry is the games." Besides that statement specifically saying what I just mentioned above, people found it insulting that someone would have that kind of view about gaming while working in the gaming industry (and many who didn't like DA2's story found it very indicative of WHY the problems they had with the story were there: the story was written by someone who apparently doesn't want to be writing for games). Again I go with the comparison I made in a previous response, what Hepler said would be the equivalent of asking Brad Pitt "What's your least favorite thing about being a movie star?" and having him respond with "Acting." Just begs the question "Then what are you doing here in the first place?"

Eh. Gaming as an art form is still very much in its infancy. I think there's room still to define what it can become and where it can go. Hepler's just thinking outside the box. There have been plenty of developers and people in the industry to make sniffy comments about the state of gaming, and express desires to send it hewing off in bizarre directions. I just don't find it that outrageous. If whatever they come up with is bad, it won't find an audience. Simple as that.

As for DA2...the problems in DA2 can ALL be traced back to its disastrously short development cycle. I can't imagine a scenario in which any of its problems could be logically attributed to Hepler.

Whether she was happy in her choice of career or not isn't really of tremendous interest to me. I know very few people who are delighted with their career choice. Doesn't stop them from being competent at it.

 

[Madman123456]

Or maybe he or she felt they needed to "remove her from the gene pool" which seems to be a very popular rant here on the escapist forums.

I do love how people are unable to see the parallels right in front of them.

You could remove yourself from the gene pool by using condoms. You wont reproduce if you, well, don't reproduce.

But i get the meaning and of course, it's not a very nice thing to say.

What would be nice if the non existent mantle of anonymity behind which some people like to hide where to be exposed as non existent.
Many providers save your connection data and wont make a big fuss if the police comes asking who this and that guy with that IP address was at that time. Found something illegal and asked in a forum what would happen with the stuff, while the police i had called for that reason where underway. Some fellow in that forum was thinking that i was trying to sell that stuff and called the police, who called the administrator of the forum, who then called me and told me that he is obliged to give out my IP address at that time.
The Police came later, thanked me for reporting and then put everything away to be destroyed in a furnace.

Went off on a tangent there.

My point is that it wouldn't be much of a problem to pick out the worst offenders who actually put some thought into their death threats and have the police show up at their house. Mostly the Police will have to inform Mom and Dad that their child send out death threats over the internet and that would remove quite a lot of trolls from the internet.

 

[Doom972]

This makes me ashamed to call myself a gamer and a Bioware fans. It's only a fucking game, and Bioware should be able to take risks without the vocal part of the fanbase (not sure if minority or majority) starting a shitstorm that lasts for several years.

 

[Weaver]

Jesus Christ, I hate the internet sometimes.
Yeah, she wasn't the greatest writer in the world; but she's pretty much on par with most Bioware writing.
This is no reason to make death threats.

 

[Zeldias]

It's part of online culture now.

I reject that, and so should you if you think this is wrong.

I wish more people had your attitude. I'm sick of people just saying "Well that's the internet" and dismissing an actual problem.

Gamers have presented themselves as absolute scum, and unless we reject the "way things are", that isn't going to change. We need to shun these degenerates who post on /v/, /r/gaming and the like and maintain some sort of credibility.

But how will you "reject" the "way things are?" Simply saying that changes NOTHING! You're talking about altering the mindset of hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people, who have spent years learning that being a total fuckwad leads to no consequences. This is not going to go away by changing your facebook profile picture. If you're even remotely serious about changing the state of the internet, you have to give it real thought.

What can *you* do to clean up the internet? What can anyone do? Have you contacted your local politicians, senators and congressmen and told them your issue? Have you inquired at your local police departments as to the state of their cyber divisions? Have you gone even higher up and talked to the state officials who oversee said police department?

That's seriously the scope of what needs to happen to effect any change to the internet. There will be backlash, and, on the whole, the internet will be worse off for being so strictly regulated (setting up a means to silence the vitriol will be a perfect framework for silencing anyone). The entire concept of free speech and free sharing is why SOPA and PIPA were brought down; but in order to truly combat the hatred and disgusting behavior you see, you have to seriously question the trade-offs. Would you rather see an internet without freedom, but also without hateful, spiteful comments sections? Is keeping the current freedom we have worth dealing with a few racist nutters or various other mentally ill netizens?

This is a serious issue with far-reaching consequences. Pushing too hard one way could undermine the entire strength of the internet; freedom of information. Is it worth it? Is losing that worth gaining slightly cheerier comments sections on cat videos on youtube, and the knowledge that the already incredibly rare graphic death threats sent by some nutter to someone they don't even know won't happen as often?

Rejecting the mindset of that lowest rung of internet netizens is not a simple task; and depending on how you go about fixing it, given the severity of the problem and its deep roots, many more problems could easily be created. Tread carefully; and above all, stay logical. Weigh the pros and cons of each action. Don't be blinded by "omg we must do ANYTHING to stop these guys from saying mean things" appealing to emotion; going down that path will have very dark consequences.

I really get tired of folks like you who tear down good-intentioned shit without offering anything positive on your own. This is a social phenomena; it would be enough to have people pushing back against the social phenomena instead of rolling over and accepting it. That's how social changes come about: litigation is unnecessary. No one said anything about destroying free speech and shit but you. All that was said was that "we ought to reject this shit where we see it arise." That's enough, at least for a start. Your slippery-slope argument doesn't really fit into the conversation as it is now.

I also don't get people saying she should call the police. If she quit because of the harassment and shit, then it's clear that the harassment was enough to make her feel she ought to disengage. Doesn't that make sense? It doesn't make sense to me to remain in a job where you get hyperbolic abuse heaped on you for no reason. If you've had enough of something toxic, abandon that shit. Why stick around? What the fuck did she owe to the people making the death threats?

I'm not gonna sit and pontificate about gaming culture and all that because that just strikes me as banal and tiresome without some statistics and interviews and well-reasoned shit like that, but the fact that so many folks are up for doing nutty shit like this and so many other people feel like it's OK to just emptily excuse it because "that's how it is" speaks to a failing of morality and empathy (because empty moderate rhetoric and toeing of the status quo doesn't do shit but allow bad shit to continue). Then again, when most games produced are about butchering every living being in the vicinity, I'm not sure that's a shocker. Not to say that games will lead folks to murder, but fans of an industry bent on creating indulgent power fantasies will naturally attract/generate a certain element of selfishness, wouldn't it?

Sucks that she left. I enjoyed DA2 far more than DA:O and it's hilariously awkward animations.

It's also revelatory to see how many people here referred to Hepler as "woman" or to women as "females."

 

[Micalas]

I understand that she's not the best writer but Jesus Christ guys...

 

[Something Amyss]

But how will you "reject" the "way things are?" Simply saying that changes NOTHING!

Simply saying something can make it socially unacceptable. That's how a lot of things are changed. Leaving it unchallenged, saying nothing, on the other hand, is the same as consent for these intents and purposes. You don't need some draconian slippery-slope fallacy to make change. However, shrugging and saying "it's the internet" basically accepts and condones this attitude.

Further, Western society has done a pretty good job of making death threats unacceptable and even illegal without devolving into a police state. I have trouble believing that threats to stalk and kill someone are vital to the sanctity of a free internet any more than they are in the real world.

That "jerk" that you need to "remove from the gene pool" is probably a mentally handicapped or emotionally damaged kid.

By your standards, most of the population is mentally handicapped or emotionally damaged. I also hope you appreciate the irony of assuming that after rebuking him for "assuming" all the people involved were males.

This is socially learned behaviour. We don't make any progress by assuming mental defect or emotional trauma.

By now, i would shift some of the blame onto the developers themselves. You guys know you're dealing with morons here.

You know there are bad people in the world. By your logic, some of the blame falls to you if you leave your home and happen to get murdered, raped, robbed, beaten, or eaten by cannibals.

While I suppose that's technically true, it's true only in the most meaningless, absurd sense.

Besides, Hepler is a really shitty writer. Where else is she going to get employment but in video games? Maybe pro wrestling, but they've had people actually assaulted and stabbed before. Where else would she go with her narrow skill set?

Pretty much. I love games. I hate gamers. I hate gamer culture. I don't even know why I've been working to enter an industry whose consumers are such self-entitled, confused and abusive little s***theads. I should probably just settle for some retail position and spare myself the headache.

Oh, furthermore, anyone who seriously links that absolutely asinine video by "Instig8iveJournalism" can kindly get the hell out of my face. Flicking through the comment section on that video alone confirms every accusation of sexism and misogyny the treatment of Hepler has generated.

What I love is the way we are so horrified to be portrayed this way, then shrug our shoulders when people act this way. and then, the next time we are portrayed this way, everyone's at a loss for why. I mean, honestly, how do people not pick up the pattern?

 

[Carpenter]

Or maybe he or she felt they needed to "remove her from the gene pool" which seems to be a very popular rant here on the escapist forums.

I do love how people are unable to see the parallels right in front of them.

You could remove yourself from the gene pool by using condoms. You wont reproduce if you, well, don't reproduce.

But i get the meaning and of course, it's not a very nice thing to say.

What would be nice if the non existent mantle of anonymity behind which some people like to hide where to be exposed as non existent.
Many providers save your connection data and wont make a big fuss if the police comes asking who this and that guy with that IP address was at that time. Found something illegal and asked in a forum what would happen with the stuff, while the police i had called for that reason where underway. Some fellow in that forum was thinking that i was trying to sell that stuff and called the police, who called the administrator of the forum, who then called me and told me that he is obliged to give out my IP address at that time.
The Police came later, thanked me for reporting and then put everything away to be destroyed in a furnace.

Went off on a tangent there.

My point is that it wouldn't be much of a problem to pick out the worst offenders who actually put some thought into their death threats and have the police show up at their house. Mostly the Police will have to inform Mom and Dad that their child send out death threats over the internet and that would remove quite a lot of trolls from the internet.

I personally don't want it to become a legal matter. At least not having police show up at their home. If it is a kid, call the parents. I am sick of my tax dollars being used for things like that while I get to drive past an obvious crack house every day for work, a crack house that nobody does anything about.

It's fun to think about vigilante stuff, but it's not fun that in our reality we ("We" being every tax payer) pay to have people deal with issues like that.

But the system can't make money off drug dealers if they don't let them flourish a bit. They just kind of let the problem grow and then pick the fruits.

but that's another issue. I think this is a private matter and making everything about her and every other artist a public matter is exactly what created this problem in the first place, but that's just my opinion.

 

[RonHiler]

I can't believe there are people defending those who wrote death threats against children in this thread.

This is not a question of censorship. Sending death threats is illegal, regardless of the methodology for doing so (internet, letter, video tape, whatever). Just like you can't yell "Fire" in a theater because of safety issues, you cannot threaten someone's life. Just because you think you are anonymous doesn't mean you can't be tracked down.

Were I to receive a death threat against me or any member of my family (ESPECIALLY my children), I'd take it straight to the police and have that person tossed in jail. You think it's funny to threaten the lives of my kids? Well, I think it's funny to let you rot in a jail cell. I win.

 

[MammothBlade]

This makes me so damn mad. Who the flying fuck does stuff like this? Deranged trolls? Idiotic fanboys?

Whoever is behind it, this is completely unacceptable. I wish the gaming community were more proactive in rooting out these nasty vermin. I hope Ms. Hepler receives enough positive fan-mail to reconsider her decision. It needs to be made clear that the vast majority of gamers are 100% against the PLAGUE of foul and moronic hatemail.

 

[Something Amyss]

You could remove yourself from the gene pool by using condoms. You wont reproduce if you, well, don't reproduce.

But i get the meaning and of course, it's not a very nice thing to say.

The larger issue here is that a lot of the people condemning it say the same thing about people all the time without thinking.

 

[Fiz_The_Toaster]

Oh for fuck's sake.

So she helped write the story to DA2 and it wasn't liked by some people and suddenly it's okay to send death threads to not only her but her family as well? Over a game. A GAME. Sweet Jesus tap-dancing Christ, some people need to learn some perspective.

This is why I don't want to be associated with the gaming community.

Well done internet, well done.

 

[Varrdy]

This is BANG OUT OF ORDER!

Yes I got jolly cross with BioWare over the ME3 ending thing but to threaten to kill someone's children is WAYYYYYYYYY over the line! People who do that shit need to be castrated (preferably with a rusty butter knife) so they cannot pollute the gene pool with their own special brand of stupid.

Mind you...I'm guessing the type of turd who does such a thing couldn't get close enough to wave, let alone pro-create!

 

[Carpenter]

But how will you "reject" the "way things are?" Simply saying that changes NOTHING!

That "jerk" that you need to "remove from the gene pool" is probably a mentally handicapped or emotionally damaged kid.

By your standards, most of the population is mentally handicapped or emotionally damaged. I also hope you appreciate the irony of assuming that after rebuking him for "assuming" all the people involved were males.

This is socially learned behaviour. We don't make any progress by assuming mental defect or emotional trauma.

You have no idea what "my standards" but yes most of our society is mentally or emotionally damaged in some way. an emotionally stable person generally wouldn't attack a person they have never met because they don't like what they did with a video game.

Yes we do make progress by examining mental defect and emotional trauma. Pretending it doesn't exist is what makes the problem worse. Accepting that it exists allows us to examine the problem and look for solutions.

There's no irony in me rebuking him for "assuming" all the people involved were males, nothing was done that implies it was a male, on the other hand their actions clearly indicate emotional problems. I never said they should get a pass, just that saying we need to "remove them from the gene pool" is no better than what they did.

What exactly are you arguing here? That the person sending anonymous death threats is not emotionally unstable? Then I disagree, end of story.

 

[Tenkage]

Ok not cool, I don't if you don't like someone, you don't send death threats to them

 

[RJ 17]

Eh. Gaming as an art form is still very much in its infancy. I think there's room still to define what it can become and where it can go. Hepler's just thinking outside the box. There have been plenty of developers and people in the industry to make sniffy comments about the state of gaming, and express desires to send it hewing off in bizarre directions. I just don't find it that outrageous. If whatever they come up with is bad, it won't find an audience. Simple as that.

That's just the thing though. Her comments don't really imply that she wants to change gaming or come up with a new way of gaming story telling...they imply that she just doesn't like writing for the gaming industry in the first place. Not very many ways to interpret the sentence "My least favorite thing about the gaming industry is the games."

As for DA2...the problems in DA2 can ALL be traced back to its disastrously short development cycle. I can't imagine a scenario in which any of its problems could be logically attributed to Hepler.

And I agree, but that didn't stop the morons blaming Hepler for what they viewed as a horrible story. I don't blame her for the shortcomings of DA2, but obviously there were many that did.

Whether she was happy in her choice of career or not isn't really of tremendous interest to me. I know very few people who are delighted with their career choice. Doesn't stop them from being competent at it.

I was just trying to explain to you why some (well, actually many) found her comments to be so controversial. Personally though, I'm of the belief that if your heart isn't in your work, then your work won't be of the highest standards. Indeed, there are plenty of people who do a good job at jobs they're really not interested in. But the people that do the best job in their respective fields are the ones that really want to be doing what they're doing.