Jimquisition: Fake Nerd Girls

[stonemaskstoryteller]

It's a little up-your-own-arse to assume that anyone who pretends to be nerdy, for whatever reason, is 'unworthy' to do so. That attitude just makes us sound snooty and elitist.
Besides, if people really want to spend their lives only 'pretending' to like something, then that's fine! I don't care, i've got my own life to deal with as do most people...i hope?
Personally, I find it great that even people who have never played a game in their life still find it worth their time to talk about freely.

Wether they truly like it or not, just decided how much of that time they're wasting. =/

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

There are lots of reasons. First off, being a nerd isn't bad at all. There's a huge community surrounding games, comics and themes, such as steampunk. It's easy to feel welcome there, to share thoughts while feeling comfortable and not being judged for them.
It's a safe zone and since we're highly social creatures, seeing a group calmly enjoying themselves seems appealing.

... and the harm in that is what? Isn't that exactly why all the male gamers are there - a safe environment to enjoy their interests?

And yes, nerds have a community. They've had one for years. That didn't/doesn't make Star Trek conventions any more accepted.

Insecurity is another reason. If they don't feel they fit in anywhere, they'll pretend to be interested, just to be around people.
Attention is another reason, since "nerds" are easy people to manipulate and cheat, because they're inherently open people and don't have the experience to tell the difference between a good and a bad match - because boobs.

I call bullshit.

There are easier communities to fake one's way into. Sports for one. Jocks don't care if you can't name the whole team roster so long as you wear the proper t-shirt and watch the game with them.

And you know what - I find sports DULL. Boring. I don't want to be part of that community - I want to be part of a community that shares my interests.

I was president of my college anime club (undergrad) and was in gaming clubs through both undergrad and gradschool. I have never seen any woman fake being a fan to get things from the men involved.

I have seen women fake being interested in a given guy to get things. I've seen that a lot. It didn't matter if the guy was in anime club or not. I've even seen a girl who was in the anime club string along people who weren't in the club, getting them to come to the club and turning them INTO anime fans while she sucked the money from their pockets.

So yeah, so far as I can tell, the "pretending to be into gaming to steal money from male gamers" is a lie. There are easier ways to do that.

However, it is possible that a female gamer might ALSO be a monetary predator. That's fine. It doesn't make the girl any less a gamer. It just makes her a gamer AND a manipulative *****.

 

[MrBaskerville]

I think I need to watch the first half again. I got distracted by that frankly baffling game footage with the chunky people running through walls...

Why haven´t you bought the game of the generation yet? Get out there, get a wii and download Muscle March dammit! it´s worth very penny!

Actually, seriously... the game is really fun .

 

[irmasterlol]

We're not pissed at the concept of the fake gamer girl. We're pissed at the attention whores and the posers. I look at them the same way I look at the guy who buys all the most expensive snowboarding gear and always talks about how he can't wait for the season to start, but can't ride worth a hot, steamy shit. Or the Tae-kwon-do white belt who insists he super deadly because he learned how to do some forms and punch the air, but can't fight his way out of a paper bag.

I think the poser lady nerds may get it worse because people get their hopes up. "What's this?" we say, "A lovely lady who shares my interests and with whom I can discuss them on an intellectually engaging level? Indeed, this must be true love. I think I shall ask her opinion on this related issue about which she must be informed if she loves anything geek-related... oh she doesn't know. Well maybe she knows about this other nerd thing? Nope? Well fuck dat noise, G, homie don't play dat. Homie's an OG and don't tolerate dat posah shit." (I assume everyone starts speaking jive when they're upset, but it could just be me.)

 

[Dire Sloth]

Poor Jim. You look like you could use a hug. And caffeine.

Thank you for calling the guys out on their calling the girls out. I work in a video game store, and on more than one occasion I've actually had some guys go as far as to ask me, "Why do you even work here?" Once I answered the phone and on the other end there's a guy asking if he could speak with a MAN on duty. Who does that???

I've only ever met one "poser" girl, and it was the other day working at my second job - clothes and swag and shit. She was buying a butt-load of Batman gear. I asked he if she liked the last movie, and she told me, "I've never seen the movies. I don't read the books either. Or play the games. I just really like Batman." It was kiiind of annoying, but hey. In her defense, Batman does have some pretty sweet swag.

 

[Taunta]

Okay, I recognize that's very snide and cynical. And others have raised a valid point that whether you're selling beer or video games, no one likes feeling they're being yanked around by their vulnerabilities. Still, I can't help but wonder if there isn't a subset for which the above description isn't fairly accurate.

But taking that to its logical conclusion, it gets very conspiracy theorist. "Fake girl gamers" are all evil, cruel women who just want to use your interests to manipulate you into getting attention from them! THE HORROR, THE HORROR!

...When in reality, these "fake girl gamers" are either a) Not "fake" or b) not very knowledgeable about the subject, but are interested. That should be an opportunity to teach them, not to shun them out of your secret club.

 

[Sylveria]

So a few weeks ago Jim was decrying the occupation of Booth Babe... and today he's defending what is essentially the same thing, just less likely to be pulling a pay-check for it?

I'm growing increasingly concerned about the mind-set of gamers. First you have people like Movie Bob actively bashing on fan-service in games and basically saying have any even remotely attractive women in a game is either misogynistic or exploitative and stupid stuff like that.

Then, you have expos banning both babes because having attractive women around apparently drives all the men in to a rapacious frenzy and makes all the other women self-conscious and people seem to be okay that we've basically said that this form of modeling or advertising is wrong.. but only for games.

Now there's a problem with attractive girls who may have a passing interest in games or enjoy aspects of gaming but not the actual act and this offends the guys?

Okay, boys and girls, especially boys.. I know there's a lot of self-hate and masochistic tendencies among gamers, especially if you're in your 20s or older now and you had to suffer through the dark days before Halo came out and the "cool kids" played video games to, but this is getting pretty sad. There's girls out there who at least have some interest in your hobby. They may not play WoW 18hrs a day like you do, but they're not looking at you as the Cheeto encrusted blob they would have even 5 years ago. How about instead of kicking them in the shins and pushing them in the mud, you get a hair cut, take a shower, put on some CLEAN clothes, and say hello.

When you do stuff like bash on attractive characters in games and attractive women at cons or just showing interest in something video-game related.. frankly.. it makes you look like you hate women.. or you're gay.

 

[jmarquiso]

No I am not saying that games being popular now is bad I think its awesome I am saying that these people aren't interested in games they are just pretending to be to get the attention.

Basically my issue is that a person like that is pretending to be someone there not just to try and look cool and that annoys me.

The price of something being cool, is that a lot of people is going to pretend to know about it. This happened with alternative rock, with hippies, beatniks, even impressionists. It isn't and won't be anything new.

Guess what? Games are popular now. This is a good thing. People are going to try to get into the in crowd, and you know what - that also means they may even be interested enough to join in!

I remember being looked down upon for gaming. I also remember being looked down upon by gamers since I couldn't afford the latest system or game. I've had a friend who was almost jailed committing credit card fraud to have the latest and greatest hardware. That's an extreme example, sure, but it was that kind of elitist attitude that inspired people to go that far. Especially now that I'm an adult, the attitude looks stupid all around and I refuse to repeat the cycle.

Someone goes to a convention dressed in a costume. Big fucking deal. I don't understand it taken as a personal affront as much as people do. If you don't like it, ignore it. If you feel they don't know enough, be there to educate and answer questions about the hobby you take so much ownership of.

 

[Mordekaien]

Repeating Jim's comments: is this a thing, Internet? Really?

Yes, I would like to get that question answered too. Is this something you see done a lot? Because I certainly haven't.

OT, even if it was a thing, like Jim said, what of it? It's not hurting anyone, at least not now, nor is it enforcing any stereotypes, except of those of alone angry gamers who don't like social interaction with other gender.

Yes, I've seen it tons of times before. Example 1- girl on the bus shows off Pikachu t-shirt, can't name one main character from the show or another one of them.
Example 2- girl pretending to play DS, turns out she's just scrolling around in the menu. Original DS, mind.
Example 3- girl flaunting her knowledge of video games, lists Farmville, Cityville, Call of Duty, and Pet Society. She can't think of any more.
Example 4- girl saying that she loves video games, can't name a single console other than PS3.
I have tons more of these experiences. I don't get bothered by it, but I know someone who is, and I need to show him this ASAP.
Just listing some examples because it really does fucking happen, people

I still fail to see what is wrong with it. I mean, I used to wear sports T-shirts, yet I don't follow any of the mainstream sports (hockey, soccer) and everything was OK.
The only one who gets away from your examples as the dumb one is the girl in question.
Also, keep in mind that not everyone has to know every game, console and everything around gaming culture to be considered gamer. Hell, by those standarts, I can't be the part of video game community too. (That is specially true for your 3rd and 4th example)

 

[MonkeyPunch]

I found the start to be hilarious actually. The part where he pulls out the cheese really had me laughing, turning in to a roar when some black thingymajig was stuck to it.

Also Jim, check a few links on that fake nerd girl thing. I read a lot of ladies getting pissed out about it. Maybe fewer than the lads (mainly because there still are fewer gals in gaming than lads) but the ladies were a lot more vocal and angry about it than the blokes.
Maybe it's because some female gamers feel that at least they had the nerd thing to gain them more attention and to set them apart from the typical hot chick and now some of those fit lasses are encroaching on that territory too!

 

[LiquidGrape]

Thanks Jim. Sincerely. This tendency of demanding women to legitimise themselves and their interest is absolutely asinine. Not least because the very model to which they are expected to adhere is often frowned upon to begin with.

 

[Soak]

Honestly, i don't know if this realy is "a thing".
However, i can understand it in one way, being about pretentious people for the sake of questionable social constructs, i.e. thinking that attention by itself is actually something important and even important enough to put up an act to receive it (at least i would call it that way). But this of course is neither bound to "girls", nor to "games" or "nerd-culture". And another thing would be people being hypocritical about that, blaming others for being pretentious while acting in similar ways, maybe in other topics. Fuck, i could be pretending right now i actually know anything about this stuff!

But, whatever, most of the other parts you already said: Why act all cracked up about it? Are they actually doing any harm? Well, on the other hand you could compare them to "booth babes" and ask: What are they good for? Should we support them in any possible way, considering they might represent/ be the product of a questionable social norm, like objectification of women or something.

Then again, is this realy a thing? And why should i care?

 

[ThriKreen]

I recall the storm around this opinion article [http://geekout.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/24/booth-babes-need-not-apply/] and his followup [http://joethepeacock.blogspot.ca/2012/07/the-response-to-response-to-my-booth.html#!/2012/07/the-response-to-response-to-my-booth.html]. A lot of the backlash was raised against his post, but I've noticed, many seem to miss the point of his article and attack the writer about his attempt at gatekeeping for the nerd culture, while they themselves are doing the same thing. The gist I got from Peacock's article was that any level of interest is fine - it's those that show none that are the problem, and he was calling them out.

I recall various comments on a reddit thread of said article of posters verifying there are types of both genders that do this preying of attention - the handsome underwear model that goes in as Superman just to get girls to fawn over him, the girl who goes to parties with Spock ears for free food, the cosplaying model that was at a comic convention that was handing out business cards for her webcam show (but she herself doesn't cosplay in said show). Problems that can occur are things like limited tickets for a convention (PAX, ComicCon) where these fakers are like sport game scalpers, reducing the amount for their own gain.

To use another analogy, it's like allowing the first thousand in line to get a Harry Potter book signed by JK Rowling, only to have some people in that line turn around and immediately Ebay it for an outrageous price - they have no interest in literature and are preying on the fanbase.

Or to use my own experience, going to GDC and seeing pretty girls (aka strippers) on the corners handing out cards for their strip club. They (most likely) have no interest in game development, compared to the thousands that are there for the convention, but are trying to prey on the male nerd stereotype. And chances are, they do this for every con that is being held there.

I'm also friends with some cosplayers who've complained about people wearing skimpier and skimpier clothing, taking attention from others simply because they're showing skin and cleavage.

Admittedly, seeing as I don't know of these fakers, chances are they're much smaller in population than the hype is, but they're there.

 

[ShadowKirby]

Seriously Jim? Fuck you on this one. This a far more complex issue of social interaction that relates to all male/female interaction(Including transgender and homosexuals of course) and not just gamers in particular. Why do think those movies about 3 buddies that get broken up by a random set of breasts appearing keep getting made?

A lot of male nerds have toiled to establish the nerd culture(just as you said) specifically or indirectly because they didn't have female companionship to distract them. So now that The nerd culture is bigger and more acceptable it is only natural for old timers to be suspicious of any new comers. The poser knows no gender but in my own credulity I have witnessed what happens when a random poser usually a girl enters the scene.
Groups break up,feeling are hurt, and friends no longer speak to each other. Maybe this isn't the girls fault maybe the guys in the group let their testosterone take control. I have had legitimate nerd girls in my circles of friends and it was cool but the painful times when things went bad are the ones that stick out in our memories.

What you are seeing is real concern and fear that is always exhibited when previously unknowns are introduced. Interactions between men and women are real chemical reactions because they are different some very distinctive ways. Of course since I am a Fat chud white heterosexual male neck beard in his early 30's you can dismiss my opinion as short sighted egotistical rantings.

And for the record men don't get off judgement free Jim. You always have to worry about weather you are perceived as an alpha who leads or a beta who follows or risk being outcast because you don't have a defined role.

URHG! Nerd culture (whatever that is) was also founded by nerdy women like Roberta Williams, Carol Shaw, Dona Bailey, Anne Westfall, Jane Jensen, Brenda Laurel, Brenda Brathwaite, Janet Murray, Amy Briggs, Danielle Bunten Berry, etc...

If little boys cannot control themselves when a girl is around it is THEIR fault, not hers. There are no gatekeepers no geekdom. There is no test one has to pass to be accepted. Someone likes the same thing you like, that's cool. They don't need to know everything about every other subject you care about to be accepted as a TRUE geek.

Seriously, am I a real geek guy? Are you? Who knows! And more importantly, who cares! If your little boy club implodes because you a *gasp* girl into it, maybe it wasn't that much of a cool club to begin with.


As for those talking about hypocrisy. Get over it. It sucks you were bullied in high school or whatever because of what you liked, but becoming the bullies to people who are now showing interest to what you like is not some kind of sweet justice, it's just acting like an ass.

 

[jmarquiso]

So a few weeks ago Jim was decrying the occupation of Booth Babe... and today he's defending what is essentially the same thing, just less likely to be pulling a pay-check for it?

One is a marketing practice done by the companies that hire said women, and the other is a bunch of women expressing fandom. Entirely different things.

 

[Callate]

But taking that to its logical conclusion, it gets very conspiracy theorist. "Fake girl gamers" are all evil, cruel women who just want to use your interests to manipulate you into getting attention from them! THE HORROR, THE HORROR!

...When in reality, these "fake girl gamers" are either a) Not "fake" or b) not very knowledgeable about the subject, but are interested. That should be an opportunity to teach them, not to shun them out of your secret club.

I tend to agree, but I do want to leave an "out" for those who feel manipulated by the use of sexuality in the medium as a whole as opposed to those who just want an excuse to mistreat actual individual women (that is, immature jerks.)

 

[hermes]

I think Jim misses the point. Its not about girls having to prove they are "gamers" (a word that sounds pretty ridiculous itself), its not about being bother by people saying they are into something they are not just to fit in... its about female posers, people craving for male attention and going to such length to get it that it makes me suspicious of almost every instance I see someone (not even a woman) attractive being into a side of nerd culture.

I am not about getting the high ground and claiming I don't appreciate a good looking woman, but one that dresses up as a male fetish to have others oozing at them does insult my intelligence. It does because she (or the people that paid her) assumes that being a male gamer automatically makes me a loner that can't get his eyes out of anyone slightly attractive that makes so much as bat an eye to me. It insults my intelligence because she (or the people that paid her) assumes I am part of an audience that only needs a pretty face and boobs to get my attention. It insults my intelligence because it stereotypes me.

 

[Rabidkitten]

People are mad cause cute girls are cosplaying and wearing Mario Shirts? Why? It sounds like a win win situation.

 

[GLo Jones]

A wild counter argument has appeared!

I'd say that women in the gaming community are often seen as a personification of this kind of culture shift. It's not necessarily their fault, but they're simply an easy target for people to take out their frustrations.

 

[jmarquiso]

Lying to peoples faces isn't bad behaviour? Thinking that the people they're lying to are so stupid that they'd actually believe it?
Sure, I could just placate them or avoid them, but I'd rather show how pissed off that makes me feel and let them know that it isn't alright. In fact, I think that's a bigger sign of respect than any other response.

Who's lying? They took the time to find a costume related to gaming, learn enough to portray that person, and immediately they're looked upon as if they're fake. Whether they are or not. What's dishonest is looking at them that way in the first place.

Remember, even Felicia Day was recently called out on this (by a Destructoid contributor no less), a woman who built her entire career and production company around a show based on an MMO guild. She was asked to produce her "credentials" so to speak. Whereas Jim, Angry Joe, Total Biscuit have never been asked.

What does this have to do with any of the things I've said?
This is about people POSING to be something they're not, or at least that's the people I'm talking about.
What do you want me to say about it? That it sucks?
That's just how it is, prejudice goes both ways in all sorts of subjects. I have no problem with honest people.[/quote]

The point is that they don't get the third degree, but even someone who's long established her nerd cred does. You know why people are poseurs? To belong. Why do they want to belong? Because they're genuinely interested.