Jimquisition: The Beautiful Irony of PC Gaming

Jimothy Sterling

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The Beautiful Irony of PC Gaming

Beauty is only skin deep, and a pretty face can only go so far. Fortunately, Jim Sterling is both beautiful and wise, so he is basically the perfect lifeform. In a way, he is very much like PC gaming -- visually stunning on the surface, but with a depth that nobody appreciates.

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Jimothy Sterling

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Great video, but I hated eye. It was a buggy piece of shit and infinite respawning really pisses me off when a fucking attack chopper comes at you every minute along with rocket launcher wielding goons.

Now if only console players would listen to this video...

You don't need to upgrade a PC every year and it doesn't cost thousands for a PC. Also the games are cheaper.

The mis-information annoys me.
 

Baneat

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sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?

Thanks to the 9 people that have answered this question, you can stop now!
 

winter2

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About dang time he got the black shirt and red tie back on. Looks so much more classier that way. :D

Sorta jealous of the sword though.. :(
 

Zhukov

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I clicked that video expecting a turd-slinging session. I'm relieved to be proven wrong.

Oh, and personally, I'm on a PC because I like the ol' mouse and keyboard. Graphics are nice, but they're hardly my primary concern.
 

Volothos

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A. Relic, i think they made space marine, gave him a wooden chainsword.
B.I wanna know too.

OT: In this case i think we should thank the god emperor...
Great vid Jim, cant wait till next week!
 

Arina Love

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Apr 8, 2010
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all those titles he was talking about....yeah i don't want to play them, well except Recettear. for everything else i want to play on pc that is exclusive to pc : witcher 2 and diablo III and for them i have to spend money to upgrade my PC. good thing witcher 2 coming to xbox. if my core2duo+8800gts will run Diablo III on very low settings then it's will be first PC game i played in years. My reason i'm on consoles because i like J-RPGs and console exclusives and don't care about graphics so i play on consoles all those games that on PC too, i can upgrade my PC just don't see point.
 

winter2

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A. That, my friend, is a Warhammer 40k chainsword wielded by the mighty Adeptus Astartes.

B. Have no clue.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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The biggest problem with graphics is that good graphics is insanely expensive to make. Furthermore, the scale is more logarithmic than linear. 10% increase in 'graphics quality' can cost 50% more. So yes, you graphics whore, shut up. We can chose between stupid short simple linear games with 'gooooood' graphics every year or two, or complex, huge games with poorer graphics which take longer to make. Oh wait, we don't have the choice anymore. The short retarded games for graphics whores have won. Well, thanks.

But no, I don't think the 'best' PC games have shit graphics. Don't even start with Minecraft or WOW. Let's be realistic here. Crysis was great and graphics was a good part of that. Graphics is important. Portal wouldn't be Portal without it's style. Yes, it's about STYLE, not about the number of polygons, thousands of motion captures and whatever. Developers, just make the graphic appropriate for the given game. No need to upscale all the time.
 

robert01

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I find that one of the biggest perks to PC gaming is the ability to mod games. Openly, freely and usually legally. Consoles don't have this without hoops, and tricks that aren't supported by companies. A lot of cult classics were kept a live for a long time because of the modding scene such as the Half Life series, because of how open the game content was to being modded.
 

ZeoAssassin

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winter2 said:
Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A. That, my friend, is a Warhammer 40k chainsword wielded by the mighty Adeptus Astartes.

B. Have no clue.
B. http://store.steampowered.com/app/41070/
 

LostTimeLady

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Excellent video. Jim's best so far in my opinion. As someone who's most up to date piece of gaming hardware is a 2 year old laptop I often get scared off by the PC gamer graphics wars. But! When actually getting down to it in the end the games I want to play are the games that run just fine on my laptop (even if it means setting minecraft to fast graphics and making the draw distance tiny when the processor starts to chug a bit) and the fact that I was hesetant was silly.

Also, cheers Jim for pointing out that for backwards compatability alone, PC gaming is a no brainer.

*contemplates playing old lucas arts games...*
 

Waaghpowa

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Apr 13, 2010
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Yes, Thank GOD for Jim, for saying what many of use PC gamers have been trying to say for years. Now that there's an official video, maybe this will put an end to the silly console vs PC threads. (I know i'm being optimistic)
 

Lordmarkus

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
It is...

*Drumroll*

Serious Sam 3!

 

BreakfastMan

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?

A: A Chainsword from Warhammer 40k: Space Marine.
B: Serious Sam 3.

OT: Good video. I used to be a pure console gamer, but I recently got myself a sweet rig, and I am now a console and PC gamer. And yes, the irony is that most of the games I have been playing are... not very graphic intensive. People need to understand that they don't need a thousand dollar plus rig to play some of the best games on the system.
 

beetrain

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That was a rather long tangent about EYE. Not that I'm comlaining, I love it myself and have Jim to thank for bringing my attention to it.

And yeah, I find most games I'm interested in run just fine on my laptop, except Amnesia.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Waaghpowa said:
Yes, Thank GOD for Jim, for saying what many of use PC gamers have been trying to say for years. Now that there's an official video, maybe this will put an end to the silly console vs PC threads.
Are you kidding, this will go right over most of their heads.

I don't mind when someone like consoles more than PC, I get annoyed when they spew BS about PC to try and justify being stuck with consoles.
 

Zipa

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Dec 19, 2010
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Great episode Jim and well said, quite a number of PC gamers have been saying this for years but are often not heard over the PC gaming master race people who bleat on at people who use consoles.

Also best use of the pen is mightier than the sword ever.
 

V8 Ninja

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A: As other people have said, Relic.
B: That would be Serious Sam 3: BFE. Croteam decided to add a few more weapons to the mix, specifically a pistol and a sledgehammer. They also decided to add more realistic textures.

OT: Pretty spot on, Jim. PC gaming is more about the abstract, the complicated, and sometimes the wonderfully insane.

EDIT: As for my answer to B, the true ninjas got here before me.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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I never thought i would say this but; Thank GOD for Jim. Great episode although i would like to add something;

Dear public;

please don't buy a computer from PC world or the like £1000 and expect to run most games. They use shite parts and more often than not don't even have low-end dedicated GPUs. Find something with a core 2 or above, put a 1/2 decent GPU in it and make sure you have plenty of RAM and for under £400 you can run 90% of modern games.

Regards; The Entire Fucking Internet





Seriously folks, many PCs have been miss-sold to the the point you CAN'T play most games on them either because they don't have a dedicated GPU in them or much of the time the PSU is not stable enough to even support higher-end one in some really expensive home PCs. 500w is really your butter-zone. A little knowlege will save you a lot of pain.
 

Waaghpowa

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Matthew94 said:
Waaghpowa said:
Yes, Thank GOD for Jim, for saying what many of use PC gamers have been trying to say for years. Now that there's an official video, maybe this will put an end to the silly console vs PC threads.
Are you kidding, this will go right over most of their heads.

I don't mind when someone like consoles more than PC, I get annoyed when they spew BS about PC to try and justify being stuck with consoles.
I edited it to say I know I was being optimistic, but I agree.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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I really think when you add everything up PC gaming is cheaper than console gaming. I have a really high end rig that I have spent nearly over $2000, if you include my 30" monitor, but the important thing to remember is that even if I never played a single PC game I would have put together the same, or almost the same computer anyway.

Most people own a computer for all the other reasons you would own a computer. Just like most people buy an iPhone to use as a phone but also can game on it. All it takes for most modern machines is the addition of a $100 graphics card and you can play any game that is out, although a few of the toughest titles might run only at low settings.

One of my favorite things about PC gaming, especially now, are all the wonderful indie games we've seen. They are doing stuff the big studios are too afraid to do for fear of releasing a game that doesn't sell 3 million units.

Anyway, good video Jim, thanks!
 

Jimothy Sterling

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I'd have to disagree on Amnesia: The Dark Descent. This isn't because you can't run it on a lower-end machine (i.e mine) but because it is a game where epic graphics are indeed necessary.

I had to run the game at low-mid settings which ruins several things the game wants to do:

Horrify me

Immerse me

It still did both of these things even with my graphical limitations, yes. However this doesn't negate the fact that if I had a graphical powerhouse that I would of felt more of the two above goals the game had going for it. Put Amnesia on the lowest settings and then on the maximum. Have two fresh pairs of pants and give them to two people who haven't played Amnesia before.

You'll notice the one on the lower graphical settings will have less of a shitty scent than the one who played with full shadow resolution.

 

SenseOfTumour

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Just gone in to check the specs of my epic gaming rig...

old style quad core 2.50 Ghz intel.
4gb DDR2 memory.
640GB 7200 HDD
and a Radeon 4830.

The graphics card I pulled from my old machine, I was too poor to shell out for a new one.

apart from that, the whole shebang set me back about £300, and don't listen to the crazy alienware fanatics who say you need to upgrade weekly, sacrificing half your paycheck to your local component store.

Now I happily admit, I think the latest game I'm running on PC is Just Cause 2, but it's flying at 1920x1080 with a bunch of settings up high, on a £300 machine with a 2 year old video card.

On another note, a friend of mine came into some cash and generously bought me a 360 and some games, so I could catch up to this generation, yet guiltily, I believe I've still spent more time on this web flash game, Gemcraft Labyrinth, than all the 360 content I have.

Lastly, please, whatever your opinions of WOW... How successful do you think it would have been if it had needed an i7 processor and a £300 video card. In many cases, being at the cutting edge of graphics technology can seriously limit your game's audience, just look at Crysis. (Oh no, that was piracy wasn't it? yeah, right...) Top tip, if only 200 PCs in the known universe can run your new game, don't cry when you don't sell a million.

To sum up, Blizzard and especially Valve (along with indie devs who can't afford an army of graphics coders), understand that there's a majority of PC gamers who for one, don't really care about technical specs, so long as it looks nice, and secondly, don't have the money to upgrade a PC, if it's that or skip your game, they'll be skipping it. WOW doesn't have 12 million Alienware owners paying them every month.
 

One of Many

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I want that chainsword......does anyone know where such a thing might be purchased? Or know someone other then Jim who has one and who you wouldn't mind seeing them mugged?
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Wow... just, wow.

Thanks Jim for putting the record straight about pc gaming. The true strength of the platform is it's openness and flexibility, both from a games marketing standpoint and the diversity and convergence of technologies. And by technology I mean everything from social media, the internet, open source & modding tools to competition in distribution channels.

Really liking the more thoughtful and less bombastic style Jim, cheers!
 

ms_sunlight

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What a gaming PC gives you, above all, is versatility. I can play the latest releases then fire up Planescape: Torment; my other half is obsessed with Maxis' A Train and that came out in 1992. I can play Deus Ex and DE:HR on the same machine. Shiny modern stuff, heritage, homebrew, online, casual gaming, episodic adventures, flash, RTS, retro remakes, Steam, emulation, GOG. (Loom is available on Steam, people. LOOM!!!) Choice, people, choice: I loves it I do!
 

Mausthemighty

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I agree, graphics are hardly the most important thing about games. I still love to play old classics like Warcraft 2, Red Alert and Baldur's Gate. It's nice to play games fluidly at the highest resolution with a nice framerate, but for me it's more important if the story or the gameplay is good.
 

mrc390

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With graphic fidelity stagnating in recent years, the idea you need a multi thousand dollar PC to run fucking counter strike is becoming less and less true.
Last year I built a gaming PC from scratch for ?700 that can run everything on medium-high settings, I have not had to upgrade anything yet.
 

Weaver

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There are a few false claims in this video, the first being that the source engine is the same engine as it was in 2004.

Valve constantly updates it, they even retroactively added HDR lighting to all of Half Life 2 via patches (which is why it still looks so good). This is like saying that because the Infinity Ward Engine uses the Quake 3 team arena engine called ID Tech 3 (and yes, it does) that it's now a 13 year old engine, despite all the extensions IW made to it. It's a completely fallacious statement and I feel it was wrong of Jim to lie like that.

Additionally, Recettear actually does require a pretty powerful computer because it was optimized like absolute shit.

ALL that being said, I understand the point of this video. PC is driving innovation not through graphics, but through gameplay. I also support trying to get non pc-gamers to try out some of the more unique but easy to run titles.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
I think that's the HD release of Serious Sam although I don't know for sure.
 

Swifty714

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Still, console gaming is cheaper. Not trying to undercut PC gaming and its apparent low standards for most popular games. However, even buying a decent rig, can sometimes cost a lot of money for someone who isn't used to shelling out $300+ dollars just so they can run something on mid to low quality. In that case, I rather just stick with the same console for eight years, then pay $120 dollars for the next console that holds my interest, or the next generation has come out.
 

DustyDrB

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Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper. Not trying to undercut PC gaming and its apparent low standards for most popular games.
Oh, well as long as you're not trying to undercut them...
For fuck's sake, man. I'm not even a PC gamer and this bothered me.
 

Jumplion

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I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
 

Iron Mal

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While those are valid arguements and I agree that not all of PC gaming is fixated on the new, shiney super-titles that come out today (the most recent game I have on my PC is The Sims 3) it is still a fairly significant thing and not exactly an arguement that can be easily side-stepped just by saying 'we have stuff that's just as good elsewhere'.

While it isn't nessercarily required of you to upgrade to a super-computer and keep it cutting edge just to play games in general, it would more than likely be fair enough to say that there is going to be a significant amount of cost and effort involved in being able to keep up with the latest releases (and to play them on the graphic settings that counter the arguement of 'why not just get the console version?').

Not all of the best PC games are the dazzling visual-obsessed spectacles that we are treated to today, but the same could be said for consoles too so this point doesn't really nullify or equalise any part of the 'PC vs. Console' debate (no matter what, the overall simplicity of a console will probably always remain unmatched, for the most part it's just plug in and play).
 

-Dragmire-

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My PC has been my main focus for gaming in the last couple months.

My last 3 games I bought/played:

Dungeon Keeper 2 (Good memories that still hold up today, nostalgia be damned)
Evil Genius(still on my to play list)
Baldur's Gate II (I'm severely late to this party)

[sub]Also Witcher 1, but that doesn't follow the trend of the other games I listed...[/sub]

Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper. Not trying to undercut PC gaming and its apparent low standards for most popular games. However, even buying a decent rig, can sometimes cost a lot of money for someone who isn't used to shelling out $300+ dollars just so they can run something on mid to low quality. In that case, I rather just stick with the same console for eight years, then pay $120 dollars for the next console that holds my interest, or the next generation has come out.
I don't know... I bought the PS3 when the 80GB version came out and that cost me $699. Not sure what new console your buying that only cost $120 unless your getting it used or through some special retailer online.
 

Poisoned Al

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While refreshing, I'm amazed that Jim didn't mention "that" pig-ugly success story. Anyway, nicesssssssss video this week.
 

Jandau

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One thing that bears mentioning (and that people keep forgetting) is that you don't need a massively overpowered machine to run new games at console-level graphics. People are always whining that PCs that can run the newest games at max settings cost so much more than a console, but that's a retarded argument - of course they do! And the game will look much better. However, if you wanted to run a game at the graphical level of a 360 or a PS3, you don't need to sacrifice your child to the dark gods. My 4 year old PC which was kinda crap when I bought it runs everything that comes out nowdays. It's got a GeForce 9500 and a plain 2.2GHz Dual Core processor and it runs Witcher 2, Crysis 2, Deus Ex:HR, Shogun 2, etc.
 

Elyxard

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As an avid PC gamer myself, I'm glad to see these points made. Graphical power is one of the least important things about owning a gaming PC.

It's flexibility, availability, and control over games (when developers don't put laughable DRM on them) is what makes the PC great. People wonder if we'll ever see a universal console, but the PC already is one. I have reverse compatibility that goes back to the creation of videogames; that is a big deal. It's a console that greatly helps preserve the history of this medium.

That said, nothing wrong with console gaming. A majority of my purchases are still console based.
 

Daveman

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I love PC gaming because anyone can fucking do it. People who get games consoles almost certainly have computers as well. Why not use the money to buy a slightly better computer? Even that is likely to be unnecessary. My laptop cost about £500 (and it's only that expensive because I felt I needed a 17" screen) 2 years ago and it runs anything I want, though admittedly I never tried to run the Witcher 2 on it. I'm thinking about getting a new one now though I could probably keep going with this one for the next couple of years anyway.

Plus, unlike the 360, I can play Portal or Plants vs Zombies when I'm on a long train journey.

Wanna play L4D2 round at a mates house? I just take my laptop with me. Seriously, laptop gaming is by far the best.
 

Bluecho

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I've recently come into PC gaming, and I can say for certain that (most) of Jim Sterling's points are spot on. My "gaming rig" is my laptop, and I've been able to play some pretty fun games on it so far, with a miniscule budget of zero no less. And really, the only way this has hindred my experience is that playing TF2 gets incredibly laggy at times.

On a laptop. If anyone out there complains about needing a powerful system to run their games right, just remember that I can play Team Fortress 2 on a laptop and only then does it give me problems. If you have a competant gaming machine that's not a laptop, you can have a fun time on the PC.

Lastly, I for one thank God for Jim Sterling. You wonderful, wonderful man.
 

emeraldrafael

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Im not going to lie, i thought he was just going to lift everything from the handguard up and reveal a standard size ball point pen on the inside.
 

SilverUchiha

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I couldn't disagree more. Sure, quite a few people do PC gaming for graphics. I do it because it is easier/possible to mod your games where as most consoles are difficult/impossible to mod because Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo don't like players doing that at all. I'm not saying all PC games are modded and that instantly makes them better. But I like having that option for custom levels. Custom skins. Custom challenges, and so on. That's also why I like Valve games so much because all the authoring tools are available for free for some rather fun community grade content. Stuff you can't get on any console.

Steam sales (going on Valve again) are also a highlight of PC gaming. No where other than steam would I have been able to get Arkham Asylum or KOTOR for $7.50 or less. (maybe Kotor now, but still).

Then take a look at Nintendo when it comes to Modifying Smash Bros and using the Homebrew Channel. Nintendo dislikes this so much (the latter part anyway), that they will update their Wii Menu just to delete that stuff. I don't appreciate Nintendo telling me what I can and can't do with my console after I paid money for it. It's mine and they can just deal with it.

That's my two cents on the issue. Graphics? Fuck em. I'm all about the mods.
 

Itsthefuzz

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I've always been a PC gamer, and though I will probably drop 700-800 on a high end computer for Skyrim... I could still keep using this one for a while and still play Skyrim on lower graphics and all the games I love.
 

varulfic

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Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper.
Except no, because you have to actually buy a console. Pretty much everyone already has a computer. Including you I assume, unless you posted from your phone or something.
 

Hagi

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Jim... I love you.

That was brilliant.

Can't really add more then that.
 

Neverhoodian

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Wouldn't it have been more appropriate to thank the God-Emperor this time around?

Good episode. I've been recommending services like Steam and GOG for years because of their libraries of older games that you can buy on the cheap, with next to no compatibility issues to boot. I play console games as well, but it can be inconvenient sometimes to drag an older system out of the closet just for nostalgia's sake.
 

Xardas5

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THANK YOU O LORD JIM, THANK YOU.
Finally someone who understands what makes PC gaming so awesome
 

Da Orky Man

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LostTimeLady said:
Excellent video. Jim's best so far in my opinion. As someone who's most up to date piece of gaming hardware is a 2 year old laptop I often get scared off by the PC gamer graphics wars. But! When actually getting down to it in the end the games I want to play are the games that run just fine on my laptop (even if it means setting minecraft to fast graphics and making the draw distance tiny when the processor starts to chug a bit) and the fact that I was hesetant was silly.

Also, cheers Jim for pointing out that for backwards compatability alone, PC gaming is a no brainer.

*contemplates playing old lucas arts games...*
By "old lucas arts games", KotOR? I've discovered that my year-old, 1.6ghz netbook can run it. HELLS YEAH!!!
 

NightHawk21

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I like PC gaming for certain types of games, and although graphics wise if you shell out for it you an probably get the best graphics on your pc (in comparison to a console), I love pc gaming for the modding community.
 

Lykosia_v1legacy

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Well, Jim. I have to say that I was pleasantly surprised by your video. You have said and wrote so much BS about PC gaming that when I saw the title, I was a little bit afraid. But you actually made some good points this time. Good work.
 

Stall

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Jim uses a lot of logical fallacies and very deceptive arguing, doesn't he? He's INCREDIBLY fond of straw men. I don't think anyone would say graphics are super important on PC exclusives, many of which he cited to construct his argument, but graphics are most certainly important when comparing the PC and console version of a multiplat. I'd like to see Jim do the same video, but using only multiplats to support his argument. Odds say his little thesis would fall flat on its face.

Graphics are one of the biggest reasons to play a multiplat on PC, which is something he totally and absolutely neglected. He used a straw man in the form of graphically unimpressive PC exclusives, aka where no one cares about graphics. He didn't refute the central point, however. Overall.... a pretty poor episode.

Father Time said:
I think that's the HD release of Serious Sam although I don't know for sure.
No it isn't. That's Serious Sam 3.
 

bombadilillo

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Father Time said:
Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
I think that's the HD release of Serious Sam although I don't know for sure.
Serious sam 3

But HD release of Serious sam 1st 2nd is awesome.
 

bombadilillo

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Stall said:
Jim uses a lot of logical fallacies and very deceptive arguing, doesn't he? I don't think anyone would say graphics are super important on PC exclusives, many of which he cited to construct his argument, but they are most certainly important when comparing the PC and console version of a multiplat. I'd like to see Jim do the same video, but using only multiplats to support his argument. Odds say his little thesis would fall flat on its face/

Father Time said:
I think that's the HD release of Serious Sam although I don't know for sure.
No it isn't. That's Serious Sam 3.
I think you just missed the entire point of the video...

He said.

1. People tend to think of graphics when they think of pc gaming.
2. Lots of awesome pc games arent graphic intensive.

He never argued graphics were/werent "important". So wheres the fallacies?
 

Tempest13

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How do you keep pulling me and and pleasantly surprising me with such great writing? Oh wait it's you.
 

Swifty714

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varulfic said:
Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper.
Except no, because you have to actually buy a console. Pretty much everyone already has a computer. Including you I assume, unless you posted from your phone or something.

Except yes, Console gaming is still cheaper.

People that have been posting, have said the have been paying 200 euro or more, just to get an upgrade. My Xbox 360 lasted me 4 years before I finally needed to 'upgrade' which even then only costed me $140 dollars at the local shop.

Also, not all computers are designed to run games. Mine is just a general purpose laptop.
 

Dogstile

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I find it ironic that you were saying how PC gaming's biggest strength wasn't graphics while showing some fucking gorgeous games and kind of convincing me a little that it was.

It isn't, of course, but still. Eye-gasm.
 

ruben6f

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I disagree, I will use S.T.A.L.K.E.R games as an example, sure they are great with the lowest settings ( the ones I play with *cries) but if you play with the highest settings or with a mod that makes the game look even better then the game becomes immersive and scary.

Yes there are awsome titles on PC that don't need graphics but good graphics create a feeling of immersion that can only be found on PC.
 

thiosk

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I would like to have that chainsword. I would carry it around everywhere.
 

Kimarous

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You know what always has and always will appeal to me about PC gaming?

The simplest, most overlooked aspect: keyboard and mouse controls.

That's it.

Now granted, there are times when I go PC gaming for the exclusives, or because of Steam deals, or because my fat box of an SD TV has trouble making text readable with newer games (*cough*MassEffect2*cough*), but overall, it's just that I prefer certain games to have a keyboard and mouse control scheme.
 

OtherSideofSky

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Thank God for PC games that don't require a powerhouse to run (and also for Jim, of course). I'll be in Japan for the next year with only my sort-of-okay laptop to satisfy my gaming needs and missing a lot of the big console exclusives that would normally be taking the next few months of my time as a result (I still weep at the thought of waiting a year for Dark Souls). Grabbing a lot of weird, often inexpensive stuff off Steam and GOG has been a godsend for dealing with the situation. Having said that, though, I don't think I'll ever be primarily a PC gamer because most of the games I really get into don't come to PC and wouldn't be that great with a mouse and keyboard, anyway.
 

Hobonicus

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Jandau said:
One thing that bears mentioning (and that people keep forgetting) is that you don't need a massively overpowered machine to run new games at console-level graphics.
THANK YOU. I constantly hear people say they won't get the PC version of a game because they wouldn't be able to max it out, when even not maxed it would still probably look better than the console version. I absolutely don't understand the obsession with max graphics or nothing.

Also, I built a $1200 computer almost five years ago, have never upgraded, and it can still max out most new games as long as I turn the anti-aliasing down.
 

vivster

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i really really hope he mispronounced recettear only to piss me off...
 

bombadilillo

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Hobonicus said:
Jandau said:
One thing that bears mentioning (and that people keep forgetting) is that you don't need a massively overpowered machine to run new games at console-level graphics.
THANK YOU. I constantly hear people say they won't get the PC version of a game because they wouldn't be able to max it out, when even not maxed it would still probably look better than the console version. I absolutely don't understand the obsession with max graphics or nothing.

Also, I built a $1200 computer almost five years ago, have never upgraded, and it can still max out most new games as long as I turn the anti-aliasing down.
Not exactly maxing out then is it?
 

CManator

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I'll admit to being misinformed about PC gaming and Jim has indeed enlightened me. It's probably because everybody I know who games on their PC is constantly upgrading and bragging about it, and those who have a low end PC don't really game with it.

Well guess i'll find out soon enough. A friend is giving me their old PC for free and I'll be seeing what I can do with it.

Still, I will most likely be primarily a console gamer. Frankly I don't see how a mouse and keyboard can possibly be preferable to a controller. (though i'm sure pc gamers feel the opposite)
 

josemlopes

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ruben6f said:
I disagree, I will use S.T.A.L.K.E.R games as an example, sure they are great with the lowest settings ( the ones I play with *cries) but if you play with the highest settings or with a mod that makes the game look even better then the game becomes immersive and scary.

Yes there are awsome titles on PC that don't need graphics but good graphics create a feeling of immersion that can only be found on PC.
Well, of course the graphics are important but they arent the only thing and STALKER also proves his point, it is a more open minded game with a lot of stuff that is out of the ordinary (like bleeding, the dificulty of the game, some gameplay mechanics, etc).

That is why when pc gamers cry that a game has been tweaked for consoles (although a lot of times they dont have reasons for such claims) they mean that the game will be more basic and less innovative. Console games will usually hold the players hand while PC games (not all of them of course, but having STALKER as an example) will say "FUCK YOU" and drop the player in a game that is hard to master (Witcher 2 is like this too).
 

zerobudgetgamer

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Not sure if it's been mentioned yet, but: Emulation.

I know I've seen 360's that can support it, and I'm not sure about PS3's, but Emulation both started and is at its strongest on the PC. And you wanna talk about true gems that are neither graphically astonishing or requiring a $3k computer to run, go no further. I have a 5-year old laptop, 512 MB RAM, about 1.6 GHz processor, and it can run SNES, N64 and PS1 Emulators without fail. If not for Emulation, I'd never have been able to play Earthbound, Xenogears, Seiken Densetsu 3, Banjo-Tooie, Conker's Bad Fur Day, the list goes on.

Not only is Emulation a great way to access the gems of the past, but it's also a VERY cheap way. Like I said, you don't need a whole lot of processing power to run emulators - a modern bargain-bin computer or equivalent older computer will do - and pretty much all of the ROMs on the Internet are completely free. I'm sure there will always be the nagging uncertainty of legality when it comes to emulation, but then most sites are pretty clear on what they can and can't offer. For instance, I believe ever since Nintendo started releasing their older games in their WiiShop, most ROM sites have had to take down various Mario and Donkey Kong properties. But that's a drop in the bucket compared to how much else is out there! If there's an older game you've always been wondering about, grab an Emulator, the ROM, and a PC Controller and have fun!
 

mjc0961

YOU'RE a pie chart.
Nov 30, 2009
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Doom is awesome. In fact, I did the same thing when I first got a 360. I stumbled across Doom in the XBLA, bought it, and played that while the new 360 games I had also bought sat somewhere still in their plastic wrap. And this is after I'd already played it countless times on PC and still had it there. And later I bought the Doom Complete Pack on Steam because it was on sale even though I only wanted Doom 3, Doom 3 RoE, and Master Levels for Doom 2. ...Some might say I have a problem, but fuck those people, it's Doom!

Anyway, I expected to hear "mods" or "keyboard+mouse", not graphics. If that's what some people want then. But whatever, I've been playing fine so far on a computer that's getting rather old now. I'll probably need to upgrade around the time where the heavy graphics get standard as new consoles come out and they push that tech further, but for now I can run even newer games pretty well so I'm happy. I want to upgrade more for better video editing and rendering power rather than games.
 

bombadilillo

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Hobonicus said:
bombadilillo said:
Not exactly maxing out then is it?
I think you missed the point of my post.
I think YOU missed the point of asserting you can max graphics with the described rig, except you can't. So you made a point then disproved it.

Anyway whatever. I want challanging your point

It was just funny to hear. I CAN MAX THIS. EXCEPT THE SETTINGS ARENT ON MAX.
 

mcnally86

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I really want to hate you Jim. But you love PC gaming and now I am conflicted.
 

Soviet Heavy

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AC10 said:
There are a few false claims in this video, the first being that the source engine is the same engine as it was in 2004.

Valve constantly updates it, they even retroactively added HDR lighting to all of Half Life 2 via patches (which is why it still looks so good). This is like saying that because the Infinity Ward Engine uses the Quake 3 team arena engine called ID Tech 3 (and yes, it does) that it's now a 13 year old engine, despite all the extensions IW made to it. It's a completely fallacious statement and I feel it was wrong of Jim to lie like that.

Additionally, Recettear actually does require a pretty powerful computer because it was optimized like absolute shit.

ALL that being said, I understand the point of this video. PC is driving innovation not through graphics, but through gameplay. I also support trying to get non pc-gamers to try out some of the more unique but easy to run titles.
Infinity Ward also updates their engine for each COD, but it is fundamentally the same engine. There are clues that can tell you immediately if something is running off of the Source Engine for example.
 

Swifteye

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Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
 

namewon'tfitin

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Human Revolution was a bad example.
It's graphics are pretty unimpressive for it's time.
I would have chosen Crysis or Metro 2033.
 

Radioactive Kitten

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I built my PC for $700 a few months ago to replace my ancient 6 year old gaming computer, and it's been able to run everything I've thrown at it so far. My most recent purchase (that was graphically intensive by any means) was Deus Ex: Human Revolution, which it was able to run maxed out without breaking a sweat, though I have also been recently spending time playing games that could run on a graphic calculator (The original Deus Ex, Telltale's adventure games, Bastion, etc) as well as revisiting some of my childhood games through emulators.

I find the beauty of PC gaming is that I can enjoy both modern and classic titles all on the same machine with the same control interface I've become so comfortable with, and I get to enjoy some of the quirkier games that have been PC-only or only found success on the PC platform.

Plus, modding. Let us never forget the wonders and joys of modding.
 

Baresark

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I don't know if anyone has pointed this out, but "Recettear: An Items Shop's Tale" is pronounced like Racketeer, which is a person who runs an illegal business. I know what you're saying to yourself, how the fuck do you know, Captain Fuckin' Know-it-all!?!

The easy answer is that I have played that game extensively and they make a joke about the name and what it sounds like in the first 20 minutes of the game. I was saying it that exact same way prior to that.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Jumplion said:
I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
thats not ironic or hypocritical. Its two different facts
fact number one is that they can play things on so-so graphics
fact number two is they like the fact pc can have much better graphics.
And they can both be true statements, i have as much fun with magicka as i have with graphics demanding games with brink (perhaps more). But i do still enjoy shinyness, and who wouldn't.
 

PatrickXD

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Unfortunately for me, I am an avid PC gamer with a PC incapable of running EYE or Amnesia, or some of my favourite games on above minimum settings.
I need a new PC.
 

Hobonicus

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bombadilillo said:
Hobonicus said:
bombadilillo said:
Not exactly maxing out then is it?
I think you missed the point of my post.
I think YOU missed the point of asserting you can max graphics with the described rig, except you can't. So you made a point then disproved it.

Anyway whatever. I want challanging your point

It was just funny to hear. I CAN MAX THIS. EXCEPT THE SETTINGS ARENT ON MAX.
The point was that it's a five year old computer and still does very well, sorry if missing the word "almost" invited derision. It's generally accepted in the PC community (at least among non-elitists) that when talking about maxing out a game you don't take native resolution and anti-aliasing into account.

There are a lot of graphics features that aren't considered necessary for something to be "maxed out", it's not used with the dictionary definition. Otherwise, there would be too many "Maxed out, but-" situations over (often trivial) changes that increase the cost exponentially, such as ubersampling.
 

Wicky_42

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Ok,so Jim's been kinda hit and miss over his tenure here, but all is forgiven for showing up with that chainsword. Where, how much, how soon? :D :D :D
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Man if he's going to talk about not needing great graphics for a cool game should mention Civilisation or something of the like.
 

ms_sunlight

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Da Orky Man said:
By "old lucas arts games", KotOR? I've discovered that my year-old, 1.6ghz netbook can run it. HELLS YEAH!!!
I bought KotOR off Steam and am replaying it RIGHT NOW. +1!!!

But I'll see your KotOR and raise you Loom. LOOM!!!!!!
 

Lord_Gremlin

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Matthew94 said:
Great video, but I hated eye. It was a buggy piece of shit and infinite respawning really pisses me off when a fucking attack chopper comes at you every minute along with rocket launcher wielding goons.

Now if only console players would listen to this video...

You don't need to upgrade a PC every year and it doesn't cost thousands for a PC. Also the games are cheaper.

The mis-information annoys me.
See, a lot of console gamers are actually playing a lot of good old PC games and use console for latest AAA titles. Like myself. I play Quake, Amnesia, other good PC games on PC, I buy stuff like Bulletstorm or Batman for PS3.
 

Vigormortis

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Swifty714 said:
varulfic said:
Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper.
Except no, because you have to actually buy a console. Pretty much everyone already has a computer. Including you I assume, unless you posted from your phone or something.

Except yes, Console gaming is still cheaper.

People that have been posting, have said the have been paying 200 euro or more, just to get an upgrade. My Xbox 360 lasted me 4 years before I finally needed to 'upgrade' which even then only costed me $140 dollars at the local shop.

Also, not all computers are designed to run games. Mine is just a general purpose laptop.
Um...no, it's not. In the long run console gaming is FAR more expensive than PC gaming. Far more.

For example, to buy a new console within the at least the first year of release is every bit as expensive as buying brand-new hardware for a PC. Years later, the price of the console goes down but so too does the price of equivalent (and often times better) PC hardware. Ergo, your statement of "My Xbox 360 lasted me 4 years before I finally needed to 'upgrade' which even then only costed me $140 dollars" is a moot point. (also, upgrade? I literally laughed at this.) You paid $140 dollars for hardware that's at least 5 years old. I could spend that on upgrading a low-level PC and still end up with hardware far better than the 360.

Add to this the price of paying for things like Live, extra expense in the price of games, expensive proprietary control input devices, storage upgrades, other miscellaneous costs for services within consoles inherent closed systems, and console makers affinity for price hikes and in the end you pay far more over the years to game on something that has less than a third of the capabilities of a PC gaming rig. (and this doesn't include topics like modding, backwards compatibility, etc, etc)

I've often found those that say console gaming is "better" and/or "cheaper" are the same kinds of people that think like some of the die-hard Mac fans. I've met some that are convinced that once they buy a Mac computer, it's the only one they'll ever need. That somehow, Apple will "upgrade" the thing with software patches. And that these "upgrades" will allow them to run any bit of software for the foreseeable future.

Today's "newest" consoles are built on hardware that's well over half a decade old. Paying more than $100 for one (with controllers) is the exact same as someone needless spending $3000 on some top-of-the-line gaming rig. It's stupid either way.
 
Mar 5, 2011
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Volothos said:
Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A. Relic, i think they made space marine, gave him a wooden chainsword.
B.I wanna know too.

OT: In this case i think we should thank the god emperor...
Great vid Jim, cant wait till next week!
It is Serious Sam. Well the 3rd HD remake.
 

Da Orky Man

Yeah, that's me
Apr 24, 2011
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ms_sunlight said:
Da Orky Man said:
By "old lucas arts games", KotOR? I've discovered that my year-old, 1.6ghz netbook can run it. HELLS YEAH!!!
I bought KotOR off Steam and am replaying it RIGHT NOW. +1!!!

But I'll see your KotOR and raise you Loom. LOOM!!!!!!
Say hi to Bastila for me.

I see your Loom, and raise you The Curse of Monkey Island.
 

infinity_turtles

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Stall said:
Jim uses a lot of logical fallacies and very deceptive arguing, doesn't he? He's INCREDIBLY fond of straw men. I don't think anyone would say graphics are super important on PC exclusives, many of which he cited to construct his argument, but graphics are most certainly important when comparing the PC and console version of a multiplat. I'd like to see Jim do the same video, but using only multiplats to support his argument. Odds say his little thesis would fall flat on its face.

Graphics are one of the biggest reasons to play a multiplat on PC, which is something he totally and absolutely neglected. He used a straw man in the form of graphically unimpressive PC exclusives, aka where no one cares about graphics. He didn't refute the central point, however. Overall.... a pretty poor episode.
I think you're missing the point pretty hard. The point isn't that PC hardware being superior makes it a better/competitive choice for gaming. It's that regardless of hardware, a lot more games come out for it, and that because of that there's going to be a lot more diverse, creative, and interesting ones to be found. PCgaming strength lies not so much in what it can do better, as the things it can do that consoles simply can't. Licensing fees, the inability to offer the game as a downloadable title for consoles, and the huge financial risk they'd have to take in order to get the money to put their game on on enough shelves to cover the cost of doing so means small developers wanting to make a game pretty much have to do so on PC. And even with PSN and XBLA, that limits their audience and good bit and makes it hard to build a reliable fanbase. So if you want to access this huge stockpile of games, you have to go PC. And while a lot of those games suck, or are just average, with that many games there's going to be a lot of gems. Most of the good games for PS3 and 360? They're on PC too. Most of the good games on PC? Most console gamers will never hear of.

Sure, the PCs graphics might be better, but that's a pretty insignificant point when compared to the shitload of games I'd never have been able play if I stuck with a console. That, I believe, is what's meant by the title Irony of PC Gaming. It's like(Warning: Horribly exaggerated metaphor incoming) praising the smoothness of how a machine runs, when the machine in question cures cancer. Sure, you might be right that it runs really smooth, but if you want to tout it's quality, there's something a lot better to point out for that.
 

Jumplion

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bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
thats not ironic or hypocritical. Its two different facts
fact number one is that they can play things on so-so graphics
fact number two is they like the fact pc can have much better graphics.
And they can both be true statements, i have as much fun with magicka as i have with graphics demanding games with brink (perhaps more). But i do still enjoy shinyness, and who wouldn't.
I can understand wanting a fast PC with good performance, but that is not quite my point. I think it can fall into ironic/hypocritical as many of the people who say that "graphics don't matter" go on to reverse that when talking about PC vs. Consoles, something I have seen many times.

I'm talking about those that just scoff at a PC port that doesn't allow for, I dunno, HDR lighting or something means that the developer are "dumbing down" for consoles, and label the fact that the PC version of the game can support 4xAA rather than the console version with 2xAA as the sole reason why it is superior. At the same time, some of them backtrack and say graphics aren't important, yet cite graphical capabilities as a reason for superiority.

I just find it odd, is all.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
 

bombadilillo

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Vigormortis said:
Swifty714 said:
varulfic said:
Swifty714 said:
Still, console gaming is cheaper.
Except no, because you have to actually buy a console. Pretty much everyone already has a computer. Including you I assume, unless you posted from your phone or something.

Except yes, Console gaming is still cheaper.

People that have been posting, have said the have been paying 200 euro or more, just to get an upgrade. My Xbox 360 lasted me 4 years before I finally needed to 'upgrade' which even then only costed me $140 dollars at the local shop.

Also, not all computers are designed to run games. Mine is just a general purpose laptop.
Um...no, it's not. In the long run console gaming is FAR more expensive than PC gaming. Far more.

For example, to buy a new console within the at least the first year of release is every bit as expensive as buying brand-new hardware for a PC. Years later, the price of the console goes down but so too does the price of equivalent (and often times better) PC hardware. Ergo, your statement of "My Xbox 360 lasted me 4 years before I finally needed to 'upgrade' which even then only costed me $140 dollars" is a moot point. (also, upgrade? I literally laughed at this.) You paid $140 dollars for hardware that's at least 5 years old. I could spend that on upgrading a low-level PC and still end up with hardware far better than the 360.

Add to this the price of paying for things like Live, extra expense in the price of games, expensive proprietary control input devices, storage upgrades, other miscellaneous costs for services within consoles inherent closed systems, and console makers affinity for price hikes and in the end you pay far more over the years to game on something that has less than a third of the capabilities of a PC gaming rig. (and this doesn't include topics like modding, backwards compatibility, etc, etc)

I've often found those that say console gaming is "better" and/or "cheaper" are the same kinds of people that think like some of the die-hard Mac fans. I've met some that are convinced that once they buy a Mac computer, it's the only one they'll ever need. That somehow, Apple will "upgrade" the thing with software patches. And that these "upgrades" will allow them to run any bit of software for the foreseeable future.

Today's "newest" consoles are built on hardware that's well over half a decade old. Paying more than $100 for one (with controllers) is the exact same as someone needless spending $3000 on some top-of-the-line gaming rig. It's stupid either way.
You sir are wrong. PS3 plus gamefly = way cheaper then PC gaming. Unless I want to stick with flash games and gog. Then renting throws your whole argument out of the window. Game price goes from 10 more on console to aprox 45 less on console. Unless your the type of person who buys every game console is significantly cheaper in the long run
 

theonecookie

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Well I'm mostly a console gamer but I have to say i find my self spending more and more time with my 6 year old comp playing games like Jim just mentioned so point well made
 

Vigormortis

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CManator said:
I'll admit to being misinformed about PC gaming and Jim has indeed enlightened me. It's probably because everybody I know who games on their PC is constantly upgrading and bragging about it, and those who have a low end PC don't really game with it.

Well guess i'll find out soon enough. A friend is giving me their old PC for free and I'll be seeing what I can do with it.

Still, I will most likely be primarily a console gamer. Frankly I don't see how a mouse and keyboard can possibly be preferable to a controller. (though i'm sure pc gamers feel the opposite)
Well, for me it's matter of what I'm playing.

For something like a fighting game, racing game, platformer, or some action/adventure games a controller is preferred. However, for things like real-time/turn-based strategy games, point-and-click adventure games (durr), and especially first-person games, keyboard and mouse are much preferred. Controllers are just inherently flawed for the latter genres. Especially RTS and first-person games.

So while I will tend to prefer a keyboard/mouse setup, there are still plenty of games/genres wherein I would rather use a controller.

Also, what kind of hardware is in this friends "old" gaming PC? Depending on what's in there now, you could put a small amount of cash into it and upgrade it enough to run a fair number of today's newest titles.
 

NiPah

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This is actually how I became a fan of Jim, that he's a fan of the smaller (and for lack of a better word) Anime styled games. He wrote several articles on some of NIS America's recent work like Hyperdimension Neptunia and AT Qoga, and now a small shout out to Recettear... Maybe that could be another video, about how all of the people say JRPGs are dieing even when titles like Agarest War and Disgaea are becoming hits.

I do thank god for you Jim, I also thank him for the fact that there is an actual anime titled "Cat Planet Cuties" coming out next year thanks to our friends at Funimation.
 

MonkeyPunch

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To be honest I'd stroke that sword if I had one like it.
Good show.

CManator said:
Still, I will most likely be primarily a console gamer. Frankly I don't see how a mouse and keyboard can possibly be preferable to a controller. (though i'm sure pc gamers feel the opposite)
This is an antiquated view of PC gaming and one I see all to often on message boards and I'm not sure why that is... Most PC gamers own a gamepad too or at least an alternate input method.

I play a ton of games with a Gamepad (and have done for aeons). Fighting games, driving games, platformers and such like are all played on gamepad (other games I can think of are: Assassins Creed series and Just Cause 2).
In fact a lot of bad ports almost require you to play with a gamepad due to shoddy/lazy conversion.

What's more is that the PC allows for a far larger choice of control methods than any console does. I personally have 2 360 pads, a Megadrive 6 button, a Six-axis and Madcatz arcade stick all for use on my PC :)

As said I find it strange that people always seem held back by the control method when the PC is known for being a peripheral monster so to speak, and compared to consoles allows for a much broader range of 3rd Party hardware manufacturers, so it would sort of figure you could control it how you pleased.
 

Tel_Windzan

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I agree to Jim's view that some of the PC games that I enjoy don't look that pretty. But I get the feeling that the topic could be branched out in saying you don't need to make a game that fully uses the graphics capabilities of a machine all the time. Sure you can make it available to those who want to use it but other people can make games with other graphics and just be as good. Variety is the spice of life, after all!
 

Vigormortis

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bombadilillo said:
You sir are wrong. PS3 plus gamefly = way cheaper then PC gaming. Unless I want to stick with flash games and gog. Then renting throws your whole argument out of the window. Game price goes from 10 more on console to aprox 45 less on console. Unless your the type of person who buys every game console is significantly cheaper in the long run
Well of course "renting" will be cheaper. If you plan to only play a game once. I, and most gamers, prefer to actually OWN our games and play them whenever we wish. This is something even consoles can't do. Most new consoles aren't backwards compatible with their last generational brethren. Yet with my PC, I could go play some Doom, Half-Life, Starcraft, or even the DOS based Zork right now on the same rig I play Crysis, Portal 2, Deus Ex: HR, and Starcraft 2 on. Can you play every Xbox game on your 360 or every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.

So, no. My argument is not "thrown out the window". It only appears that way because you only play your games for a short time then move on to the next, popular title. Besides, what if you want to play a game again? Can you just go get the disc and pop it in your console? Oop! No you can't. You have to "buy" it again. Just to be able to play it once more. Seems to me that, in the long run, that'd be more expensive then owning the games on a PC. ;)
 

bootz

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So my computer which I spent $300 on runs witcher 2 at ultra with the dual graphic card thing disabled.

I spent the same for my ps3.

I like pc gaming not for the graphics but for the fact I can handle larger areas and more polygons and objects between loading areas.
 

bombadilillo

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Vigormortis said:
bombadilillo said:
You sir are wrong. PS3 plus gamefly = way cheaper then PC gaming. Unless I want to stick with flash games and gog. Then renting throws your whole argument out of the window. Game price goes from 10 more on console to aprox 45 less on console. Unless your the type of person who buys every game console is significantly cheaper in the long run
Well of course "renting" will be cheaper. If you plan to only play a game once. I, and most gamers, prefer to actually OWN our games and play them whenever we wish. This is something even consoles can't do. Most new consoles aren't backwards compatible with their last generational brethren. Yet with my PC, I could go play some Doom, Half-Life, Starcraft, or even the DOS based Zork right now on the same rig I play Crysis, Portal 2, Deus Ex: HR, and Starcraft 2 on. Can you play every Xbox game on your 360 or every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.

So, no. My argument is not "thrown out the window". It only appears that way because you only play your games for a short time then move on to the next, popular title. Besides, what if you want to play a game again? Can you just go get the disc and pop it in your console? Oop! No you can't. You have to "buy" it again. Just to be able to play it once more. Seems to me that, in the long run, that'd be more expensive then owning the games on a PC. ;)
So your arguement about price gets blown away and you pretend that wasnt the point at all??

Funny because you post was entirely about price, nice try but changing the subject does not work. You know what I have? I got a n64 and NES all hooked up to a crt in my garage, so yeah, I CAN play all those old games too. So You can argue convenience, but I still don't have to buy SMB 3 again. ;)

The point stands, you pay 50$ a new release that I can rent for dirt cheep. So in the long, short and medium runs, console is cheaper. Try and refute that without wondering off on tangents.
 

AJey

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what was the point of this episode?! People with half the brain realize that PC gaming is not about graphics only! Who the hell says it is?! There are many reasons to pick PC. Some of them were mentioned, for some reason he missed the main one - keyboard and mouse! Now is the FPS era, and mouse is perfect for that. Granted consoles try and add some balance, but between controller + autoaim and mouse, the later will always win! Also take hothey MMO's. Keyboard is the way to go here. Simply put, keyboard and mouse give way more to the game then controller (game control wise). Another point he fails to mention, is that we cant talk only about good games. Sure, most games dont require high graphics. But there are many bad or decent games that people want to try which do require best graphics cards. Another point - PC helps developers push the envelope. Devs who make games for consoles are limited, while PC devs can try and make game look more and more realistic! And there are many more good points that make PC they way to go! Extremely sloppy episode!
 

DirgeNovak

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Jul 23, 2008
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Vigormortis said:
Can you play [...] every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.
Yes you can. You should have gone with PS2 in your example... :p

OT: Good points, but I still prefer consoles, more specifically the PS3, because its exclusives are fucking awesome. And my shitty laptop can play most of the games he mentioned in the video, so I'm only missing out on games that do require a massive rig. And they mostly don't interest me.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Jumplion said:
bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
thats not ironic or hypocritical. Its two different facts
fact number one is that they can play things on so-so graphics
fact number two is they like the fact pc can have much better graphics.
And they can both be true statements, i have as much fun with magicka as i have with graphics demanding games with brink (perhaps more). But i do still enjoy shinyness, and who wouldn't.
I can understand wanting a fast PC with good performance, but that is not quite my point. I think it can fall into ironic/hypocritical as many of the people who say that "graphics don't matter" go on to reverse that when talking about PC vs. Consoles, something I have seen many times.

I'm talking about those that just scoff at a PC port that doesn't allow for, I dunno, HDR lighting or something means that the developer are "dumbing down" for consoles, and label the fact that the PC version of the game can support 4xAA rather than the console version with 2xAA as the sole reason why it is superior. At the same time, some of them backtrack and say graphics aren't important, yet cite graphical capabilities as a reason for superiority.

I just find it odd, is all.
again thats more an issue of wanting a bare minimum to control the thing we purchased.
 

Abedeus

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Scrumpmonkey said:
I never thought i would say this but; Thank GOD for Jim. Great episode although i would like to add something;

Dear public;

please don't buy a computer from PC world or the like £1000 and expect to run most games. They use shite parts and more often than not don't even have low-end dedicated GPUs. Find something with a core 2 or above, put a 1/2 decent GPU in it and make sure you have plenty of RAM and for under £400 you can run 90% of modern games.

Regards; The Entire Fucking Internet





Seriously folks, many PCs have been miss-sold to the the point you CAN'T play most games on them either because they don't have a dedicated GPU in them or much of the time the PSU is not stable enough to even support higher-end one in some really expensive home PCs. 500w is really your butter-zone. A little knowlege will save you a lot of pain.
Frankly, I'm upgrading my CPU, motherboard AND RAM at the same time somewhere this year. Already have Radeon 5770 HD so it's more than enough for now.

Phenom II X4 Quad 840, compatible motherboard and 8 GB RAM will cost me about.... 700 PLN, which is around $250. Toss in GPU for $100, some hard drive, DVD/BR (you need only DVD, frankly), an HDD for $50 and you're set.
 

Swifteye

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Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
 

CManator

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Vigormortis said:
CManator said:
I'll admit to being misinformed about PC gaming and Jim has indeed enlightened me. It's probably because everybody I know who games on their PC is constantly upgrading and bragging about it, and those who have a low end PC don't really game with it.

Well guess i'll find out soon enough. A friend is giving me their old PC for free and I'll be seeing what I can do with it.

Still, I will most likely be primarily a console gamer. Frankly I don't see how a mouse and keyboard can possibly be preferable to a controller. (though i'm sure pc gamers feel the opposite)
Well, for me it's matter of what I'm playing.

For something like a fighting game, racing game, platformer, or some action/adventure games a controller is preferred. However, for things like real-time/turn-based strategy games, point-and-click adventure games (durr), and especially first-person games, keyboard and mouse are much preferred. Controllers are just inherently flawed for the latter genres. Especially RTS and first-person games.

So while I will tend to prefer a keyboard/mouse setup, there are still plenty of games/genres wherein I would rather use a controller.

Also, what kind of hardware is in this friends "old" gaming PC? Depending on what's in there now, you could put a small amount of cash into it and upgrade it enough to run a fair number of today's newest titles.
Ok i can understand RTS and P&C, but FPS just baffles me. I don't play fps much anyway but it's beyond me how the left and right sticks are flawed for it of how m&k are better suited. Maybe I just lack imagination.

As for the hardware, no idea. Due to never owning my own pc, i'm pretty computarded. I can run programs and internets well enough, but specs are foreign to me. I may have to get a friend to explain this stuff to me afte I get it. I pretty much overheard my friend talking about giving their pc away and jumped at the offer. It'll be nice to join the 21st century lol
 

Prof. Monkeypox

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Actually, I thought Amnesia* (and Portal 2) were very good looking.
*Except when Amnesia tried to show actual humans onscreen.

Because they both had very good visual design, which made the most of their mid-level graphics engine.

Also: That E.Y.E. game looks pretty badass- I want to try it out now...
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
GPU aka Graphics Card

If you don't have a dedicated one then that is why it's hard to run any new games.
 

Jennacide

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I have to agree with just about everything here. Sure, it can nice having the visually superior version, but I favor PC gaming for different reasons. First being glorious indie games. Console gamers only recently got to taste Cave Story and Spelunky, and will likely never try such nice little gems as Desktop Dungeons and VVVVVV. The second, and probably bigger, is user generated content. Having a shitload of fresh maps to play on TF2, new quests to go do in Oblivion or new environments/additions like weather in New Vegas, I just can't get that with consoles. Well, mostly. LBP did an awesome job at this, unfortunately it's about the only one. Infamous 2's UGC isn't bad, but also isn't as striking as anything made for Oblivion. Sure, we get garbage UGC too, but the good pieces always outweigh the bad. For every generic Sephiroth sword+outfit, we get stuff like Nevada Skies in New Vegas.
 

MonkeyPunch

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Vigormortis said:
bombadilillo said:
You sir are wrong. PS3 plus gamefly = way cheaper then PC gaming. Unless I want to stick with flash games and gog. Then renting throws your whole argument out of the window. Game price goes from 10 more on console to aprox 45 less on console. Unless your the type of person who buys every game console is significantly cheaper in the long run
Well of course "renting" will be cheaper. If you plan to only play a game once. I, and most gamers, prefer to actually OWN our games and play them whenever we wish. This is something even consoles can't do. Most new consoles aren't backwards compatible with their last generational brethren. Yet with my PC, I could go play some Doom, Half-Life, Starcraft, or even the DOS based Zork right now on the same rig I play Crysis, Portal 2, Deus Ex: HR, and Starcraft 2 on. Can you play every Xbox game on your 360 or every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.

So, no. My argument is not "thrown out the window". It only appears that way because you only play your games for a short time then move on to the next, popular title. Besides, what if you want to play a game again? Can you just go get the disc and pop it in your console? Oop! No you can't. You have to "buy" it again. Just to be able to play it once more. Seems to me that, in the long run, that'd be more expensive then owning the games on a PC. ;)
Indeed.
Apple and Oranges.
Secondly, three words: Steam Summer Sale. BF:BC2 and all the expansion packs for 15?. And that's just one example of the ridiculous prices you could get stuff for during the summer sale.
So right there during the sales (which happen all year round too, but admittedly intermittently) buying games through Steam will be cheaper than renting a console game. Plus you then have the perk of being able to play games where ever you want. For ever.

Also when I look at games available for PC and Consoles the PC versions tend to be a fair bit cheaper.
Example: SSFIV AE PC: 30 euros
ALL Costumes - 14 euro (I know console owners were quite annoyed at this as PC owners get all costumes for 15$ where as console owners pay roughly 17$ per costume pack)
So in a nutshell just there, PC version of AE plus all costumes is cheaper than buying the console version)
 

nickpy

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Although I agree with the general principle that gaming (in all it's guises) should not be just about the graphics, I have to say that chuggy framerates or poor textures really do annoy me. It's one of my main gripes with my PS3 (which don't get me wrong is a great machine) but it's absolutely terrible at shadow generation, and I always, always notice it.

Yes, you can play almost all good computer games on a computer that costs around $500-700, but you'll never get the best that the game can offer. That's probably one of PC Gaming's real beauties - it's scalable. Yes, you can run it on a PC that costs the same as a PS3, but then you'll only get PS3 level graphics. But if you do want something more special and are prepared to pay for it (as I am, I must admit), then you can do so. The difference I saw in my upgrade from an HD5650 -> HD6850 was astounding, and I don't regret it one bit.

Also, the Keyboard & Mouse control scheme is just so much better suited to certain genres, just as the Dualshock is better suited to others.

I don't think either the PC or Console inherently better, but I see them as both offering different things, and my personal preferences forces me to lean heavily in the PC direction.
 

The Artificially Prolonged

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Jul 15, 2008
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Too true Jim. I was suprised how cheaply building a decent gaming pc can be done. Now that I have a good pc to play games on, I barely used my ps3 since and have become a prodomintely pc gamer thanks to gog.com and steam sales.
 

BlueInkAlchemist

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Jun 4, 2008
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bombadilillo said:
Vigormortis said:
bombadilillo said:
You sir are wrong. PS3 plus gamefly = way cheaper then PC gaming. Unless I want to stick with flash games and gog. Then renting throws your whole argument out of the window. Game price goes from 10 more on console to aprox 45 less on console. Unless your the type of person who buys every game console is significantly cheaper in the long run
Well of course "renting" will be cheaper. If you plan to only play a game once. I, and most gamers, prefer to actually OWN our games and play them whenever we wish. This is something even consoles can't do. Most new consoles aren't backwards compatible with their last generational brethren. Yet with my PC, I could go play some Doom, Half-Life, Starcraft, or even the DOS based Zork right now on the same rig I play Crysis, Portal 2, Deus Ex: HR, and Starcraft 2 on. Can you play every Xbox game on your 360 or every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.

So, no. My argument is not "thrown out the window". It only appears that way because you only play your games for a short time then move on to the next, popular title. Besides, what if you want to play a game again? Can you just go get the disc and pop it in your console? Oop! No you can't. You have to "buy" it again. Just to be able to play it once more. Seems to me that, in the long run, that'd be more expensive then owning the games on a PC. ;)
So your arguement about price gets blown away and you pretend that wasnt the point at all??

Funny because you post was entirely about price, nice try but changing the subject does not work. You know what I have? I got a n64 and NES all hooked up to a crt in my garage, so yeah, I CAN play all those old games too. So You can argue convenience, but I still don't have to buy SMB 3 again. ;)

The point stands, you pay 50$ a new release that I can rent for dirt cheep. So in the long, short and medium runs, console is cheaper. Try and refute that without wondering off on tangents.
I humbly direct you to the following.

Jennacide said:
I have to agree with just about everything here. Sure, it can nice having the visually superior version, but I favor PC gaming for different reasons. First being glorious indie games. Console gamers only recently got to taste Cave Story and Spelunky, and will likely never try such nice little gems as Desktop Dungeons and VVVVVV. The second, and probably bigger, is user generated content. Having a shitload of fresh maps to play on TF2, new quests to go do in Oblivion or new environments/additions like weather in New Vegas, I just can't get that with consoles. Well, mostly. LBP did an awesome job at this, unfortunately it's about the only one. Infamous 2's UGC isn't bad, but also isn't as striking as anything made for Oblivion. Sure, we get garbage UGC too, but the good pieces always outweigh the bad. For every generic Sephiroth sword+outfit, we get stuff like Nevada Skies in New Vegas.
Can you download new shooter maps on the PS3 easily? Or will you not bother because you need to send the disc back to GameFly? What about mods, or DLC? Are they even worth the trouble since you're simply renting instead of buying? How is that backwards compatibility issue coming along, can you play all of the games you use to play on older versions of the console & still own the discs for, or do you need to pay money to download them onto your console? Sure you have SMB3 and Ocarina of Time to play, but what about Mass Effect or Assassin's Creed or Deus Ex? You may get the urge to play a new release when it's no longer new to get some achievements or try a different way of playing (something not always available on the aforementioned old consoles you have hooked up to a CRT), but now you need to get it back from GameFly in lieu of a new release. Time to dust off the N64 while you wait, I suppose.

It's true, you get the high-end graphics in a sleek little package that looks great in your entertainment center, and you save a little money renting instead of buying. But you have little backwards compatibility, no chance to experience expansions or mods, and the spectre of needing to hock the aforementioned old games and perhaps an internal organ or two to afford the next iteration of your console in a few years. Meanwhile, most PCs that people are assembling or buying these days will have a much longer shelf life due to future part compatibility and the general longevity provided by proper maintenance that is impossible on most consoles without throwing your warranty in the garbage.

Naturally, if you don't care about such things, that's your personal opinion. You'll simply have to forgive some of us for not buying it. In fact, this isn't an opinion I'm even interested in renting.
 

MonkeyPunch

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bombadilillo said:
So your arguement about price gets blown away and you pretend that wasnt the point at all??

Funny because you post was entirely about price, nice try but changing the subject does not work. You know what I have? I got a n64 and NES all hooked up to a crt in my garage, so yeah, I CAN play all those old games too. So You can argue convenience, but I still don't have to buy SMB 3 again. ;)

The point stands, you pay 50$ a new release that I can rent for dirt cheep. So in the long, short and medium runs, console is cheaper. Try and refute that without wondering off on tangents.
He wasn't saying it wasn't about price but you're comparing renting to buying. Apples and Oranges.
On that note I can rent PC games at my local library for 1 euro for 5 days. But that's not the point.

But if we compare buying games, then it's usually cheaper to buy on PC.
A great example of this is Super Street Fighter 4 AE.
On PC it costs 30 euro. You get all costumes for 14 euro (a fact that had a lot of console owners up in arms when it was revealed as console owners have to shell out 17$ per costume pack) So in a nutshell buying SSFIV AE for PC plus all the costumes is actually cheaper than buying the game alone for a console.

Further I have 3 words for you: Steam Summer Sale.
BF:BC2 plus all expansion packs for under 15 euro. And that is just a single example of some of the ridiculous prices you could get games at during the sales.
The sales happen all year round too, though admittedly only intermittently. But I just stocked up during the summer sales, personally. And those prices are cheaper than even renting a console game and then you know... you actually own it and can play it when you want.
Plus with Steam you can then play the game where you like too as an added bonus.
In fact if you buy smart during Steam sales you can stock up so many games in the summer sale that you have enough to play until the winter sale and you end up with a pile of games at the cost of a single new AAA game.

I own consoles too and I usually find it cheaper getting the PC versions.
 

Lord_Gremlin

New member
Apr 10, 2009
744
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Kakulukia said:
Vigormortis said:
Can you play [...] every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.
Yes you can. You should have gone with PS2 in your example... :p

OT: Good points, but I still prefer consoles, more specifically the PS3, because its exclusives are fucking awesome. And my shitty laptop can play most of the games he mentioned in the video, so I'm only missing out on games that do require a massive rig. And they mostly don't interest me.
Just saying - a few PS1 games have issues on PS3.
 

MatsVS

Tea & Grief
Nov 9, 2009
423
0
0
The availability of such glorious graphics on PCs is, if anything, detrimental to my enjoyment of them. You see, by the virtue of their very existence, I find myself annoyed and unable to enjoy new games unless I can experience them as I imagine the developers would want me to; ramped up to fuckin' eleven!

As such, whenever a brand new sparkly title is released, I almost inevitably end up postponing playing them until I can play them properly. This is, of course, completely stupid and ridiculous and probably some sublime statement about the utter vapidity of my soul, but alas, it is the hand I have been dealt. :\

That said, everything Jim said about lesser known and older titles being the true treasures of the PC-gaming experience all rings true, so there's always that.
 

Jennacide

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Dec 6, 2007
1,019
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CManator said:
Ok i can understand RTS and P&C, but FPS just baffles me. I don't play fps much anyway but it's beyond me how the left and right sticks are flawed for it of how m&k are better suited. Maybe I just lack imagination.
Simple answer, you have more fingers than thumbs, and your wrist has far higher precision than your thumb. Here's an easy example, how often do you crouch jump in console shooters? How quickly can you aim while switching weapons and chasing a target? It's things like this. Sure, preference helps a bit, but the main reason this is always cited as PC is better for FPS is reasons like this. You don't have to stop aiming at target and moving while swapping weapons and bounding toward them.

Actually, here's an even better example of complexity of movement, that anyone who's played TF2 on both console and PC can attest to. How often do you see rocket jumping in TF2 on consoles? Almost never, because it requires you snap aim down, jump, fire a rocket, and crouch, all within a second. Your hand needs to move like a trained spider to do that with a 360 controller. On PC it's simply moving your arm forward real quick, clicking with one hand and using your thumb and pinky to hit two keys.
 
Feb 9, 2011
1,735
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0
It's funny, I do the same thing too. I replaced my dated laptop and built a new six-core tower, only to end up playing Team Fortress 2 instead of, you know, anything that actually requires the specs I put into it. I guess I should load up something a bit more graphics heavy and get my money's worth. <_<
 

PunkRex

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Feb 19, 2010
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WHA, WHO, HOW, EEH... CHAIN SWOOOOOOOORD!!!

It does suck I can no longer play alot of my old games on Playstation as my old one broke, i'll still whip out the Gamecube every now and then because I looooove it but still... I miss Spyro.
 

Furioso

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Jun 16, 2009
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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
A: The chainsword from Warhammer 40,000
B: Serious Sam 3 which is coming out soonish
 

Jumplion

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Mar 10, 2008
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bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
thats not ironic or hypocritical. Its two different facts
fact number one is that they can play things on so-so graphics
fact number two is they like the fact pc can have much better graphics.
And they can both be true statements, i have as much fun with magicka as i have with graphics demanding games with brink (perhaps more). But i do still enjoy shinyness, and who wouldn't.
I can understand wanting a fast PC with good performance, but that is not quite my point. I think it can fall into ironic/hypocritical as many of the people who say that "graphics don't matter" go on to reverse that when talking about PC vs. Consoles, something I have seen many times.

I'm talking about those that just scoff at a PC port that doesn't allow for, I dunno, HDR lighting or something means that the developer are "dumbing down" for consoles, and label the fact that the PC version of the game can support 4xAA rather than the console version with 2xAA as the sole reason why it is superior. At the same time, some of them backtrack and say graphics aren't important, yet cite graphical capabilities as a reason for superiority.

I just find it odd, is all.
again thats more an issue of wanting a bare minimum to control the thing we purchased.
And again, if graphics aren't that important then why do those same people tout graphics capability as a selling point for PCs?

I'm all for having control of your rig, I'm just saying that it's inconsistent with other beliefs.
 

SonOfVoorhees

New member
Aug 3, 2011
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I agree.....for once. lol. Look a Crysis 2, played it and completed it and sold it. It was a fun play but nothing to make you play it again. But pc gamers ***** about it and got there graphical update to make it look better with better shadows and reflections etc. But the graphics dont make the game better, just prettier. Still wouldnt make me play it again. Look at Morrowind....have played the vanilla version on both PC and xbox many times because that games story and gameplay is awesome. I guess those with a £3000 rig need reasons to make it worth while, but an average game is still average, regardless if it looks amazing.
 

Ulquiorra4sama

Saviour In the Clockwork
Feb 2, 2010
1,786
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0
Still not convinced.

I'm pretty shallow as far as these things go. I love my PS3 and i love gaming. I'm just no sure that there's anything to my taste that's on the PC that i can't get elsewhere.
 

Amalith

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Mar 29, 2009
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This video is not what I was expecting based on the title. It is so much better. I'm gonna have to say I disagree with you though. All of those games you listed looked pretty damn good graphically. Sure, they aren't demanding on hardware, and might not be photo-realistic, but they still look great. Definitely, there's far more to PC gaming than graphics, and modern high end gaming PC's are unnecessary for 95% of it.

People always overestimate the cost of said PC's anyway, and while it's true that there is a fanatic elite that spends way too much money on these things, a good enough to play everything currently out fully maxed is probably $600. Maybe less. $800-$1200 is more the norm, for the sake of having the most current high end hardware out, not because games demand such, and it's unnecessary to pay more than that, or buy computers more than every two years (and really, my current one lasted four years, I added a $200 graphics card, and it's lasted me two more so far. I'm probably gonna replace it soon anyway).

Unrelated to the above, I'm glad to see that someone else loves E.Y.E. I haven't really seen many reviews for it, and the general impression people give is lukewarm, but I found the game a blast.
 

Jimothy Sterling

New member
Apr 18, 2011
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Jumplion said:
bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
bahumat42 said:
Jumplion said:
I was expecting the "irony" of PC gaming would be that whenever someone complains about the graphics/visuals of a certain game being muddy or ugly, people will go off and say "Graphics don't make the game! I could play a game that's nothing but mud so long as it's fun!"

And then, whenever the topic of PC vs. Consoles comes up, the PC crowd almost always goes off saying how pathetic the console's are when it comes to hardware, how they all upscale their games, not true 1080p, how their RAM is so pitiful, how their PC games can run 100+ frames per second, etc....

Generally, that's the biggest irony/hypocrisy I find with PC gaming.
thats not ironic or hypocritical. Its two different facts
fact number one is that they can play things on so-so graphics
fact number two is they like the fact pc can have much better graphics.
And they can both be true statements, i have as much fun with magicka as i have with graphics demanding games with brink (perhaps more). But i do still enjoy shinyness, and who wouldn't.
I can understand wanting a fast PC with good performance, but that is not quite my point. I think it can fall into ironic/hypocritical as many of the people who say that "graphics don't matter" go on to reverse that when talking about PC vs. Consoles, something I have seen many times.

I'm talking about those that just scoff at a PC port that doesn't allow for, I dunno, HDR lighting or something means that the developer are "dumbing down" for consoles, and label the fact that the PC version of the game can support 4xAA rather than the console version with 2xAA as the sole reason why it is superior. At the same time, some of them backtrack and say graphics aren't important, yet cite graphical capabilities as a reason for superiority.

I just find it odd, is all.
again thats more an issue of wanting a bare minimum to control the thing we purchased.
And again, if graphics aren't that important then why do those same people tout graphics capability as a selling point for PCs?

I'm all for having control of your rig, I'm just saying that it's inconsistent with other beliefs.
Again not really?
stating a fact doesnt mean that you can't have you opinions that disagree with it. For example take this
Avatar is a beautiful movie
But i hate it.
(both true facts but lets not divert the topic too much)

Another example would be to say i was trying to convince somebody that aston martins are amazing cars, primarily i love them due to their looks and everything else is unimportant to me, but in the case of trying to convince some body of other tastes then the point of its speed or mileage would be valid to raise.
 

Kapol

Watch the spinning tails...
May 2, 2010
1,431
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0
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Apr 18, 2011
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Oh for fucks.... look, Cthulu sold like shit on XBL Indies because it was PUT on Xbox Live indies, a service where nearly everything else is shit. If it had been sold on the main storefront it would have sold like gangbusters. On Steam, they pimped the fuck out of that game. The difference in exposure explains the difference in sales, nothing else.
 

BoTTeNBReKeR

New member
Oct 23, 2008
168
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You want to know the reason why I prefer PC gaming over Consoles?

Frames
Per
Second

Seriously. I've played my fair share of PS2/PS3 and I can honestly say that a lot of games have some pretty shitty FPS. Hell, even the games that don't have framerate issues run at around 30FPS while I really do prefer 40+ fps. It just makes the game run soo smoothly that, to me, it's simply more enjoyable.
 

Goliathvv

New member
Nov 8, 2009
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Thanks Jim. Finally a reasonable analysis regarding PC gaming. People must understand one simple thing: there are things that CAN and WILL only happen on pcs due to the openess of the platform. Anyone can simply make a game, set up a payment system with paypal and expose that game on a web-page(minecraft style). On consoles this would be impossible, simply because the game would have to go through an approval process and stuff like that.
 
Jun 11, 2008
5,331
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0
I got to be entirely honest I thought the major selling point and the whole point of PC gaming V Console gaming was the freedom through things like mods and insane ideas not graphics cards made from Optimus Prime and the All Spark.
 

Swifteye

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Apr 15, 2010
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Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
GPU aka Graphics Card

If you don't have a dedicated one then that is why it's hard to run any new games.
That's probably it cause I remember trying to play total war shogun 2 and it was just unplayable I mean cut scenes just completely lagged and everything was unmovable. And I find that really annoying. This is a relatively fresh computer and the fact that a game a couple years younger can be unplayable. Well it says alot without saying too much.
 
Jun 11, 2008
5,331
0
0
Kapol said:
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
You do know that is the is more or less the same with every game. Go read the Terms for Black Ops or any other game and they basically state you have bought a "licence" to use one copy of the game. Technically speaking you can't even lend games to your friends.
 

Mana Fiend

New member
Jun 8, 2009
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Alas, I'm running my gaming on a laptop with integrated graphics, so I can't get my copy of Amnesia to run. Heck, it's even bugging trying to run 2-player TF2. True, I do love games like Cthulhu Saves the World, Torchlight and Recattear (wow, 3 RPGs... Guess my favourite genre :p), but the reason why I prefer home consoles to PCs is that I like to sit back with a controller in hand and look over the situation presented on screen. Plus, I suck at shooters and RTSes, so having a keyboard and mouse over a controller is not a major problem.

However, I do have to agree that the versitility of a PC is wonderful. My steam is chock full of little indie games that wouldn't exist on a console, such as The Path (in fact, anything by Tale of Tales), Beat Hazard and the afformentioned Recattear. It's just that I prefer to play with a controller than a mouse.

Still, excellent video, and a discussion I often have with my more PC-focused brother.
 

Jimothy Sterling

New member
Apr 18, 2011
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Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
GPU aka Graphics Card

If you don't have a dedicated one then that is why it's hard to run any new games.
That's probably it cause I remember trying to play total war shogun 2 and it was just unplayable I mean cut scenes just completely lagged and everything was unmovable. And I find that really annoying. This is a relatively fresh computer and the fact that a game a couple years younger can be unplayable. Well it says alot without saying too much.
All it says is your dad bought you a bad PC for gaming.

Just get a decent GPU and make sure you have a spare PCIe socket and can afford the extra power draw and install it, it will make games run fine.
 

Kapol

Watch the spinning tails...
May 2, 2010
1,431
0
0
Glademaster said:
Kapol said:
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
You do know that is the is more or less the same with every game. Go read the Terms for Black Ops or any other game and they basically state you have bought a "licence" to use one copy of the game. Technically speaking you can't even lend games to your friends.
True, but normally you can only get banned from single games unless you do something like get caught pirating on consoles. And even then, bans are hard to 'earn.' I've heard many a story of people doing nothing and getting banned from Steam, cutting them off from access to every single steam game they have, online and off. It's not like Sony or Microsoft is just going to come to your house and take your physical copies if you get banned from their systems.

What doesn't help is that Steam has horrible customer support from what I hear. Again, I've never had to deal with them thankfully, but I've heard multiple stories from many different people saying the Steam support isn't very good. And so if you want to appeal your banning, then you're going to have to deal with that on top of the ban itself.

I do understand what you mean though. Technically, I suppose many of these companies COULD come to your house and take your games... though I've never heard of that happening and would be shocked if it ever did.
 

Swifteye

New member
Apr 15, 2010
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0
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
GPU aka Graphics Card

If you don't have a dedicated one then that is why it's hard to run any new games.
That's probably it cause I remember trying to play total war shogun 2 and it was just unplayable I mean cut scenes just completely lagged and everything was unmovable. And I find that really annoying. This is a relatively fresh computer and the fact that a game a couple years younger can be unplayable. Well it says alot without saying too much.
All it says is your dad bought you a bad PC for gaming.

Just get a decent GPU and make sure you have a spare PCIe socket and can afford the extra power draw and install it, it will make games run fine.
*sigh* I don't really want to fiddle with the insides of my computer given that it's the only one in the house that really works. I'd rather just have my computer like it is now play games on my consoles and then when I get around to building another computer i'll make a note about the graphics card.
 
Jun 11, 2008
5,331
0
0
Kapol said:
Glademaster said:
Kapol said:
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
You do know that is the is more or less the same with every game. Go read the Terms for Black Ops or any other game and they basically state you have bought a "licence" to use one copy of the game. Technically speaking you can't even lend games to your friends.
True, but normally you can only get banned from single games unless you do something like get caught pirating on consoles. And even then, bans are hard to 'earn.' I've heard many a story of people doing nothing and getting banned from Steam, cutting them off from access to every single steam game they have, online and off. It's not like Sony or Microsoft is just going to come to your house and take your physical copies if you get banned from their systems.

What doesn't help is that Steam has horrible customer support from what I hear. Again, I've never had to deal with them thankfully, but I've heard multiple stories from many different people saying the Steam support isn't very good. And so if you want to appeal your banning, then you're going to have to deal with that on top of the ban itself.

I do understand what you mean though. Technically, I suppose many of these companies COULD come to your house and take your games... though I've never heard of that happening and would be shocked if it ever did.
The only reason it happens more often on Steam is that it is easier on Steam and the only complaint I would have with Steam support is that they are a bit slow but other than that they have been fine for me. Although usually when that happens in the wrong they do get their accounts back from what I have heard.
 

Vigormortis

New member
Nov 21, 2007
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0
CManator said:
Ok i can understand RTS and P&C, but FPS just baffles me. I don't play fps much anyway but it's beyond me how the left and right sticks are flawed for it of how m&k are better suited. Maybe I just lack imagination.

As for the hardware, no idea. Due to never owning my own pc, i'm pretty computarded. I can run programs and internets well enough, but specs are foreign to me. I may have to get a friend to explain this stuff to me afte I get it. I pretty much overheard my friend talking about giving their pc away and jumped at the offer. It'll be nice to join the 21st century lol
Well, controllers are inherently flawed for first-person gaming because they impose an unnecessary delay in how quickly you can turn. Think of it this way. Let's say you want to move move a cup full of water from one spot on the table to another. What's the quickest way to do it? Freely moving it by picking it up and placing where you want? Or, sliding it to the desired position, having to do it slowly so as to not spill? The same logic applies to a controller. With an analog stick, you are limited to how far you can tilt it. Then, after you do, you have to wait for the game to turn your character to where you want. It's not only slower, it's less accurate. Whereas with a mouse, you are free to move it as far as you want, provided you have the desk space. This lets you be as fast, slow, and accurate as you want. There's even been studies performed that indicate the vast differences in performance, reaction time, and accuracy when comparing mice to analog sticks. If I had a link, I'd post it.

Regardless, on to the free PC. If you can find out the hardware specs, let me know. I'd be more the willing to help you upgrade (if the need/desire is there) so it'll play just about anything you want. :)
 

qeinar

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Graphics has never really meant the world to me when it comes to a game, so using it as a arguemnt for getting a pc have just seemed a tad wrong (although some people i know will go: "awmahgawd insane graphics i need this to live O_O", at that point it's hard to not point out they'd get a better experience with it on pc, since well the graphics will be better there). Most of the people i know that don't tend to play pc, but stick to consoles usually have the complaint that they wanna sit on the couch and play on the tv with a controller, to which i usually respond: well you can do that on a pc aswell. You can have any setup you like with a pc, which is one of it's strengths.
 

5t3v0

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anthony87 said:
Fair play for talking about PC graphics and not bringing up Crysis.
This isn't about graphics. If it were, it would be mentioned every second word or something.

o/t: One thing I love about PC gaming is actually getting in there and building one. I think us hardware-heads don't upgrade yearly because we NEED to. Some get this euphoric feeling over it, knowing that you built something yourself.
 

Vigormortis

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Kakulukia said:
Vigormortis said:
Can you play [...] every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.
Yes you can. You should have gone with PS2 in your example... :p

OT: Good points, but I still prefer consoles, more specifically the PS3, because its exclusives are fucking awesome. And my shitty laptop can play most of the games he mentioned in the video, so I'm only missing out on games that do require a massive rig. And they mostly don't interest me.
Actually, thank you for pointing that out. That's actually what I meant. I should probably fix that in the original post.

bombadilillo said:
So your arguement about price gets blown away and you pretend that wasnt the point at all??

Funny because you post was entirely about price, nice try but changing the subject does not work. You know what I have? I got a n64 and NES all hooked up to a crt in my garage, so yeah, I CAN play all those old games too. So You can argue convenience, but I still don't have to buy SMB 3 again. ;)

The point stands, you pay 50$ a new release that I can rent for dirt cheep. So in the long, short and medium runs, console is cheaper. Try and refute that without wondering off on tangents.
I'm sorry but, is this a joke? This has to be a joke. It's almost like you're not even reading or really responding to my, or even your own, original post. Either that or you're just trolling me. I'm thinkin' the latter.

It's funny to me that, after addressing every point you try to counter me with, you just try to pass it off as me "changing the subject". Seems to me you have no reasonable argument or counter-point and are just defaulting to repeating yourself and insulting me. At the same time, you only reenforce my point.

You have Super Mario Bros 3? Good for you. So do I. I guess we can both go and play it again. But what about, say, something more recent? Or even something a year or so old? Let's go back and play Batman: Arkham Asylum. I'm sorry, what's that? You only rented it back then? Oh, that's a shame. I guess you'll have to pay for it again if you want to play along. Gee, seems to me you're gonna pay more to play it over time than I paid to get it once and play forever.

But, this is all moot. I said this exact same thing in my first post but you either over looked it, didn't comprehend it, or just actively ignored it because you had no reasonable retort except to repeat yourself and say I was "wondering off on tangents". And, frankly, I expect the same thing to occur with this post. Either way, I'm just going to ignore you.

Oh, and by the way. Saying you can still go back and play SMB3 doesn't help your case buddy. You bought that game back in the day. That's why you can go back and play it again. If you had only rented it, you'd be s.o.l.

[edit] Upon taking a quick glance at your profile, I notice you're already up to six ticks in your forum health meter. Why does this not surprise me?
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Matthew94 said:
Swifteye said:
Hm. Well as someone who has tried getting into PC gaming I have some issues with your statements Mr. sterling. For one thing when you say people can play most pc games what kind of games are you referring to? Anyone can play the endless sea of flash games but actual games that you buy welllll. Okay. So I have a new windows 7 computer right? Okay I didn't build it myself it was a gift from my father so it's new and I keep it running well. Okay then lets go and play Spore that game came out a year or so ago and I actually liked it. Won't really run on my windows 7. Okay. Lets play dragon age instead. It works! For a day. After a whole day of playing my computer needs to empty out all the cache and restart just to get rid of the lag the game gives me and this is even with special software just to run video games better.

Ya know that doom game you were talking about? I hate doom and all shooting games especially during that era but ya know what I did play back then? Point and click adventure games like pajama sam and cluefinders. and I can't really play those things on my windows 7 either. Luckily I have an old vista laptop that can play those games but still. New hardware sometimes has some serious roadblocks for old software. That said I can get privateer and some old games to run on my system but it's a shot in the dark to do so.

One of these days i'm going to buy a computer piece by piece and get all the specs checked out and even build it with my own two hands. That computer will get me into PC gaming no problem and pretty much any game new or old would run well and all these problems would go away. But so far that Computer has been estimated to be about 770 dollars. Kind of more expensive than say buying a PS3 getting a littlebig planet combo deal that bundles an extra controller. and then just getting a 50 dollar gift card for psn and going to town. You have some nice points but it still doesn't negate the fact that PCs are a variable system and nothing is quite concrete as it is when you get a console.
Do you even have a dedicated GPU?
Hmm. I might not. I should know this but I can't think of what that is.
GPU aka Graphics Card

If you don't have a dedicated one then that is why it's hard to run any new games.
That's probably it cause I remember trying to play total war shogun 2 and it was just unplayable I mean cut scenes just completely lagged and everything was unmovable. And I find that really annoying. This is a relatively fresh computer and the fact that a game a couple years younger can be unplayable. Well it says alot without saying too much.
All it says is your dad bought you a bad PC for gaming.

Just get a decent GPU and make sure you have a spare PCIe socket and can afford the extra power draw and install it, it will make games run fine.
*sigh* I don't really want to fiddle with the insides of my computer given that it's the only one in the house that really works. I'd rather just have my computer like it is now play games on my consoles and then when I get around to building another computer i'll make a note about the graphics card.
Ok then but it's incredibly simple.

You put it in, screw it to your case and attach the power cable. Bam! Done, then just download the latest drivers and there you have it, your PC can game!
 

ImprovizoR

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I'm a PC gamer so I know for a very long time that graphics don't make a good game. How else would you explain that vanilla Morrowind is better than modded Oblivion. Or that the most played game on Steam is still Counter Strike 1.6!!! Most PC gamers I know also don't care about graphics that much. All they care about is frames per second. I see it everywhere. PC gamers that I know have no problem running the game on lowest settings if they can get more frames per second. We just love playing at 60+ fps. Sure I like a pretty game too, but there are only a few games that actually benefit from amazing graphics. Crysis for example, wouldn't be half as fun if it wasn't a graphical marvel.
Atmosphere is more important than polygons and other graphical effects. New Deus Ex is a perfect example. Most Source games look better than Deus Ex in terms of graphics, but the atmosphere is top-notch. I really dog the black and yellow it uses as a canvas for everything.
 

TsunamiWombat

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A Chainsword, fantastic! Swift Justice or Hells Teeth pattern? It looks like Swift Justice. It's definatly not Hecate - Hecates are rounded off and are lighter for parrying.

...Why yes, I am a nerd.
 

Jumplion

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bahumat42 said:
Again not really?
stating a fact doesnt mean that you can't have you opinions that disagree with it. For example take this
Avatar is a beautiful movie
But i hate it.
(both true facts but lets not divert the topic too much)

Another example would be to say i was trying to convince somebody that aston martins are amazing cars, primarily i love them due to their looks and everything else is unimportant to me, but in the case of trying to convince some body of other tastes then the point of its speed or mileage would be valid to raise.
That's not what I'm trying to say. From where I stand, you're saying that these are just opinions. I'm saying that these are inconsistencies from fervent PC gamers (and make no mistake, I am one as well).

It's more like, say, if someone was going on about how visuals don't matter in a story, and then lambasting someone for having a 24-inch Plasma TV when their 46-inch LCD brings out a much higher quality picture with three times the refresh rate. Or, say, someone goes on to state how they don't care how bad their car looks so long as it gives good mileage, and then one day goes off about aesthetics of aerodynamic cars and sleek design scoffing at others who can't keep up with modern design.

Now, there's a difference between simply trying to get the best out of your machine, graphics-wise or not, and just doing a 180 in the "graphics don't matter" department which is what I see at times.
 

42

Australian Justice
Jan 30, 2010
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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?
It's Serious Sam 3!!! with new weapons!!!
 

Hyper-space

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As a great man once said: "Thank God, for me".

Beautiful episodes and THE reason for your continued contribution to this site.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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This is probably Jim's best episode yet! Mainly because it was structured like a good essay, it told us what was being talked about, made it's points with evidence then summed everything up at the end. If he had done this from episode 1 there would not be as much hate for him as there is now... then again... first impressions are EVERYTHING in this industry...!
 

Iron Lightning

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Oct 19, 2009
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Wow, I completely agree. I never thought I'd say that about one of Jim's videos.

Also, a half-mainstream gaming show mentioned The Void which means it might be finally coming into the public consciousness, awesome.
 

Not G. Ivingname

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Jim Sterling said:
Why didn't you mention currently the best selling game on PC right now, Minecraft?

It runs on about anything that runs FLASH, it would of been laughed at in the quack era by its graphics alone, yet it has sold more copies of any game ever before its official release.
 

realslimshadowen

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Whenevr I see Jim, I think he looks a lot like Jim Cornette, which means he surprises me whenever he opens his mouth. If I saw his scripts I could imagine them in Cornettevoice and be twice as entertained.
 

MarsProbe

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Dec 13, 2008
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Good video.

Also, next time someone says to me "the pen is mightier than the sword" and I just so happen to be wielding a large sword, I'm going to have to use Jim's line there.

This is what I write with!
 

Something Amyss

Aswyng and Amyss
Dec 3, 2008
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I love Recettear. Of course, I'm mostly a "console kiddie," but a lot of my PC titles would run on my old setup, which was a powerfully dated machine. And yes, that was awesome.

I need to upgrade my power supply and graphics card to handle some of the games I DO want, but they are not the majority of the titles I enjoy.
 

Ushiromiya Battler

Oddly satisfied
Feb 7, 2010
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That was nice, kinda expected console bashing there....
Well done JS!

Off Topic: A: What's that big sword.... It's a chainsword, not Relic like a lot of people for some stupid reason is saying....
 

karamazovnew

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I like Jim's videos, but I can't understand the point of this particular one. It's not that I don't agree with what he says, but I can't think of anyone who'd disagree with it.

To say that you play PC games because they have better graphics than consoles is simply stupid, for one sole reason: there isn't much of a difference. Sure, we had Crysis 1 and Witcher 2 which really were GOOD, but the rest of the AAA titles don't come even close. I have a 4 year old Quad Core with 4 gigs of DDR2 and a DirectX 10 GTX275 (my old 8800 ultra burned out). And I can still play most games at maximum settings, at full HD resolution. Back in the good old days, after 4 years, a PC couldn't run ANY new games, let alone at decent framerate. Ok, I did spend a LOT on my PC but I never expected it to last so long and so well. And I see no point in upgrading 2 years from now on. Heck, 6 years is a good life cycle even for consoles. We've come to a point where technology needs to actually slow down, to allow games to catch up. And they've already hit a level of graphics that makes them very expensive both in money and time. That's why we have so many series of games (CoD) and so many indie games. People now spend money on design, not polygon count. It's why Bastion looks so damn well. Back in 2000, I used to drool at screenshots of upcoming games. I can now watch almost photorealistic previews of Battlefield 3 and not give a damn about graphics. Ok, again, we did have Crysis, but the problem is that even now Crysis is the best looking game ever made. Show's over, at least for a while. Maybe the next-next generation of Nvidia cards will force the gaming industry, who knows?

So no, the beautiful irony of PC gaming is that even with the motion controllers (Wii, Kinect, Move), nothing can ever beat a keyboard and a mouse. The same things we use to write reports and spreadsheets are still the best for gaming. Console games are perfectly fine for gamepads, I actually play many of them on PC (Darksiders, PoP) with a good gamepad. But shooters, strategy games and simulators are the main reason I haven't switched to consoles, not graphics.
 

punipunipyo

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?

Thanks to the 9 people that have answered this question, you can stop now!

1. it's not that it don't run, you just need to reload a few time... I'm guessing that it's the flood of people trying to access the vid, and we hit the limit... again... reload the page a few times...

2. I WANT AN IMPERIAL CHAIN SWORD (Warhammer4000, look it up! it came B4 GoW by like a few decades!)!!!! DAMN!!!~~~~ WHERE YOU GET THAT BABY?!

3. Serious Sam 3... coming out this year.. I think... but i don't like it too much... because it's got too many "realistic" weapons... looks like Sam is joining the "normal weapons" club... I sad...

4. Totally agreed, I felt the same way PC gaming was all about BACKWARD, Tweak, Twitch, and Fearless(shameless) STYLIZATION!~

5. and yes... I'll look in to "EYE".....
 

Piorn

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I bought a brand new PC a few days ago, and I've been only playing dwarf fortress on it yet. Weird...
 

Jimothy Sterling

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I play equally on my PC and my PS3. I will have to stop that when Skyrim comes out, because all Bethesda games should only be played on PC cause of the epic modding community, but my computer won't be able to run it. And I don't have $400 lying around to upgrade, so...

PS3 for the forseeable future.
 

floobie

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PC gaming certainly has its appeal, and it certainly goes beyond graphics. My gaming PC is over three years old, I've only upgraded the RAM to 4gb, and it can still handle most games well enough. But, at this point, I just don't care about most of what PC gaming has to offer anymore. I played nothing but PC games for 15 years or so. I do "get it". I don't really have the time to play every interesting indie title or mod that's out there. I flat-out don't play multiplayer games. I have other hobbies. So, I tend to stick to the AAA titles that interest me, or older, cheap AAA titles that I didn't have time to get around to before. And, for my purposes, those AAA titles work just as well on my PS3 as they do on my gaming PC. Hell, it's usually significantly easier.

I do agree, though. A lot of the greatest PC games ever aren't very graphically intensive at all. And that works out just fine for me. I don't need a dedicated gaming PC anymore. My Macbook can run any source engine game to my satisfaction, SC2, definitely Torchlight... so, I'm covered. Completely writing off PC gaming is a bit excessive. But, I think it's reasonable enough to not make it one's "primary" gaming system.

So, really, use what works best for you. If you appreciate the benefits of PC gaming, do your gaming on a PC. Pretty simple.
 

remnant_phoenix

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I'm surprised he didn't mention Minecraft.

There's a game with NOT beautiful graphics that PC gamers have been all over.
 

wheelchairman2

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thank the god emperor for you jim

another series that could only ever exist on pc, ArmA, a balls out hardcore milsim fps that is genuinely scary, but every release is so buggy it normally takes the community six months or so to make it playable, would console gamers stand for that? of course not, but many pc gamers see such things as opportunities rather than annoyances, and that's what makes the pc gaming community unique, among other things
 

ResonanceSD

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Great video!! Absolute truth about PC gaming right there.

*hides GTX 580 SLi*
 

Chris646

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AC10 said:
Additionally, Recettear actually does require a pretty powerful computer because it was optimized like absolute shit.
I have a pretty crappy PC and I can run Recettear just fine. I just had to mess around in the options for a bit, disable some things, but it runs decently.

OT:
I think that Jim made a bunch of very good points. Good job.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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I agree with you, Jim. PC games offer a unique experience that cannot be told on consoles.

But you wouldn't think that with the gaming communities I've seen. Especially on Gametrailers.com

Not to trash the website, but to their PC gamer, graphics are everything. If a game has bad graphics, it's a bad game. No matter how up their alley the game is. If it has good graphics, then it is automatically good. No matter how contrived or awkward the gameplay is.

On the other side of the coin, I find plenty of games on consoles that would never be adequately told on PCs. Particularly games by From Software like Armored Core and Demon's Souls.

Sure, you could emulate it. But you will never have the true experience of playing those kinds of games when at your desk.
 

bombadilillo

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Vigormortis said:
Kakulukia said:
Vigormortis said:
Can you play [...] every PS1 game on your PS3? I thought not.
Yes you can. You should have gone with PS2 in your example... :p

OT: Good points, but I still prefer consoles, more specifically the PS3, because its exclusives are fucking awesome. And my shitty laptop can play most of the games he mentioned in the video, so I'm only missing out on games that do require a massive rig. And they mostly don't interest me.
Actually, thank you for pointing that out. That's actually what I meant. I should probably fix that in the original post.

bombadilillo said:
So your arguement about price gets blown away and you pretend that wasnt the point at all??

Funny because you post was entirely about price, nice try but changing the subject does not work. You know what I have? I got a n64 and NES all hooked up to a crt in my garage, so yeah, I CAN play all those old games too. So You can argue convenience, but I still don't have to buy SMB 3 again. ;)

The point stands, you pay 50$ a new release that I can rent for dirt cheep. So in the long, short and medium runs, console is cheaper. Try and refute that without wondering off on tangents.
I'm sorry but, is this a joke? This has to be a joke. It's almost like you're not even reading or really responding to my, or even your own, original post. Either that or you're just trolling me. I'm thinkin' the latter.

It's funny to me that, after addressing every point you try to counter me with, you just try to pass it off as me "changing the subject". Seems to me you have no reasonable argument or counter-point and are just defaulting to repeating yourself and insulting me. At the same time, you only reenforce my point.

You have Super Mario Bros 3? Good for you. So do I. I guess we can both go and play it again. But what about, say, something more recent? Or even something a year or so old? Let's go back and play Batman: Arkham Asylum. I'm sorry, what's that? You only rented it back then? Oh, that's a shame. I guess you'll have to pay for it again if you want to play along. Gee, seems to me you're gonna pay more to play it over time than I paid to get it once and play forever.

But, this is all moot. I said this exact same thing in my first post but you either over looked it, didn't comprehend it, or just actively ignored it because you had no reasonable retort except to repeat yourself and say I was "wondering off on tangents". And, frankly, I expect the same thing to occur with this post. Either way, I'm just going to ignore you.

Oh, and by the way. Saying you can still go back and play SMB3 doesn't help your case buddy. You bought that game back in the day. That's why you can go back and play it again. If you had only rented it, you'd be s.o.l.

[edit] Upon taking a quick glance at your profile, I notice you're already up to six ticks in your forum health meter. Why does this not surprise me?
Yep everyone who proves you wrong is trolling. You are just that awesome. Man I wish I was you.
 

Baresark

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Da Orky Man said:
ms_sunlight said:
Da Orky Man said:
By "old lucas arts games", KotOR? I've discovered that my year-old, 1.6ghz netbook can run it. HELLS YEAH!!!
I bought KotOR off Steam and am replaying it RIGHT NOW. +1!!!

But I'll see your KotOR and raise you Loom. LOOM!!!!!!
Say hi to Bastila for me.

I see your Loom, and raise you The Curse of Monkey Island.
I don't know how far this has gone, but I see your Curse of Monkey Island (still one of my all time favorite games) and raise you Space Quest 1! Muahahahaha.
 

Jake Martinez

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The most hysterical thing to me about all the bloviating you read on the internet on the great "PC vs Console" flame war of doom, is that the future is PC gaming.

It's just not the PC gaming we are used to calling "PC Gaming".

Already with systems like Onlive, you'll be seeing more remote gaming sessions streamed to either a television via a set top box, or more likely, as an application that you download for free on your home computer that you use for school or work.

The technology for this already exists and is being implemented as we speak. There are geographically located virtualization farms out there that run these virtual machines for remote access and modifying this into a game subscription model isn't the work of sci-fi, it's just a matter of time.

I know it bugs the hell out of a lot of people, but consoles and especially physical media are on their way out. It won't happen in the next few years, but within the next decade or so, I see it being the business model that publishers are exclusively pushing because it eliminates both piracy and their profit sharing with retailers and distributors.

Never underestimate the power of market forces.
 

JohnnyDelRay

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I might be missing the point, but all I got from Jim today was that "PC gaming is much more versatile". It can do the high-end graphics stuff, as well as run some smaller developer titles that are awesome sauce, including old school titles through emulators and wrappers and thing.

Torchlight is fantastic and even has a netbook mode. And yes, upgrading my computer to play Witcher 2 was nowhere near as expensive as I thought it would be, and I had to upgrade everything from motherboard up - RAM, GPU, CPU, PSU (my, what a bunch of 3-letter acronyms).

But yeah, granted not everyone has the know-how to do this properly and affordably. I notice that also as some developers get more ambitious in keeping up with PC, they push those framerates quite hard, and playing at 720p on my xbox gets a bit jaggy at times. I mean still very playable, just not quite as smooth and fast as PC, but maybe I notice that more since I have my PC hooked up to the TV.
 
Sep 14, 2009
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AC10 said:
Additionally, Recettear actually does require a pretty powerful computer because it was optimized like absolute shit.
capitalism hooo!


i felt that was necessary right there...

OT: nice, i usually don't watch these but was slightly intrigued, and liked it. Def will check out more in the future.
 

Godhead

Dib dib dib, dob dob dob.
May 25, 2009
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Soooooooo, Jim worships Slaanesh right?

Anyway good vid, haters gonna hate etc. etc.
 

Estocavio

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Matthew94 said:
Great video, but I hated eye. It was a buggy piece of shit and infinite respawning really pisses me off when a fucking attack chopper comes at you every minute along with rocket launcher wielding goons.

Now if only console players would listen to this video...

You don't need to upgrade a PC every year and it doesn't cost thousands for a PC. Also the games are cheaper.

The mis-information annoys me.
I never had Any bugs in EYE whatsoever. Not even One.
Its certainly not a Game that holds your Hand, but the game isnt about the Player - The Warfare is seperate to you. But then, ive heard others who get Crashes every 2 feet.

Heh


OT: It is Nice that Stereotypes can be cleared out from time to time.
 

Danzavare

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Matthew94 said:
Great video, but I hated eye. It was a buggy piece of shit and infinite respawning really pisses me off when a fucking attack chopper comes at you every minute along with rocket launcher wielding goons.

Now if only console players would listen to this video...

You don't need to upgrade a PC every year and it doesn't cost thousands for a PC. Also the games are cheaper.

The mis-information annoys me.
But it's not misinformation. If I want to play something like Dues EX I do need a really good and really expensive computer. A lot of the big mainstream games are graphics intensive and you can't get past the fact that you need a computer than can cope with that. You don't /need/ to put lots of money into a good computer, it's just if you don't do so you miss most of the mainstream releases...?

I don't particularly buy the whole genre argument some people mentioned in the facebook comments. RTS games are a tad trickier, but I'm comfortable enough with any other genre to play just fine. But hey, unless I exclusively stuck to one genre, I couldn't see much reason to buy an entire new machine for a tad more convenience.

That being said I agree with the video. I use both consoles and a PC. The consoles are for mainstream titles (with the occasional Xbox Live Indie game) while my PC gaming is done pretty much exclusively via Steam. I love buying old games that are years old at discounted prices. There are quite a few I wanted back in the day I could never afford, and I'm free to play them. It's also where I go to play the strange Indie games. None of my PC games are particularly graphic intensive, but I love them all the same. (Unless the graphics are outright ugly it doesn't really reduce my enjoyment of the game) There's no doubt the PC offers are truly unique experience I wouldn't otherwise have, but I don't think I'd put all my eggs in that basket. So yes, I do both, and frankly it works out cheaper than just buying one high-performance computer. : )

Edit: It should be obvious, but I'm referring to the new Dues Ex.
Oh, and I'm really enjoying your videos Jim. I don't like your earlier ones, but most your newer ones are entertaining and make some interesting arguments.
 

Metalrocks

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my pc has a Q6600 intel CPU, and a 3850 graphic card from ati and i still can run the newest games with a resolution of 1920x1080 and everything on high. no problems.

i did play "amnesia" and "the void" and they are both good games. sure they are not up to date with the graphics but the games as such are good. "amnesia" was good but dint find it scary at all. "the void" was really something special. use colours to defend and fight..., no way you can do this with a controller (console), to draw these symbols. i can recommend "the void" if you like something different for a change. surely worth a look. but its a slow game but really special made. available on steam ;) .
i also play doom on my system so as duke 3d. its hard not to play these classics.

sure, graphics are important but does not have to look amazing. as long it suits well with the atmosphere it wants to create, thats all i need. thats why i cant understand some people who complain about the source engine. i think its still a very good looking graphic which looks amazing and detailed. its hardware friendly and it works perfectly on slow pc's.
 

Aprilgold

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Baneat said:
sir.rutthed said:
Error 200 Stream not found. Please fix.
Works just fine.

A: What's that big sword?
B: What's that game that looked like Serious Sam but had a few weapons I haven't seen?

Thanks to the 9 people that have answered this question, you can stop now!
I don't know about the sword either, then maybe fan boy love to Warhammer?
That serious Sam game is Serious Sam 2, and Serious Sam 3.

I liked it, a lot, thank you Jim. *huge smile*

My only ask, could you make a small definition for each video, please?
 

RedHighwind07

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Love "Jester's of the Moon" in the background. anyway I totally agree that you find incredibly good games that don't require a beast to run. Especially when the originality of next gen games has gone completely down the toilet (I'm looking at you MW3 and BF3).
 

brainslurper

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Only problem with PC gaming as I see it is that the primary PC gaming operating system is owned by a company that's best interest is to see PC gaming die in a fire.
 

Piecewise

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Well, console gaming does have one advantage: No DRM.

Anyways, did we really need another video about how great pc gaming is? Yes, it's good, thanks, I really needed to be told that again. Also, nothing better then being told something we've heard a million times from a pompous annoying obese asshole.
 

octafish

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Kapol said:
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
Read the EULA of any PC game, unless you bought it before 2005 or from from GOG you don't own it either, you just have a licence to use it. Don't go accusing Bioware of selling their souls to EA either.

Graphics are nice and all and I'll admit I do like a good looking game, however the games I'm playing the most at the moment are Frozen Synapse, Minecraft, and well yes Deus Ex: Human Resources is an ok looking game but not overly resource intensive.
 

Kapol

Watch the spinning tails...
May 2, 2010
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octafish said:
Kapol said:
My main problem with PC gaming is (and this is something I'll likely take a lot of crap for and is entirely personal preference) the mouse and keyboard layout. I hate mouse and keyboard. It drives me insane. Don't get me wrong, I still play some that require it from time to time. Games like Killing Floor get used every so often. But, as I'm getting more into PC gaming thanks to having a decent laptop and a fairly good gaming rig, I normally just end up using my wired 360 controller at this point. But not having controller as an option has caused me to not buy games I otherwise would have bought in a heartbeat.

Other then that, my problem with the main platform of PC gaming, Steam, is that you don't actually own your games and they reserve the right to take access to them away from you for just about any reason they can think of. That, for me, is a major problem. And since a lot of bigger-named games are using Steam as their DRM, it makes it unavoidable.

I do think that it's fairly funny that the same group who says 'graphics don't matter as much as gameplay' to defend their 'system of choice' so quickly go to the fact that PC games can have better graphics as a defense.
Read the EULA of any PC game, unless you bought it before 2005 or from from GOG you don't own it either, you just have a licence to use it. Don't go accusing Bioware of selling their souls to EA either.

Graphics are nice and all and I'll admit I do like a good looking game, however the games I'm playing the most at the moment are Frozen Synapse, Minecraft, and well yes Deus Ex: Human Resources is an ok looking game but not overly resource intensive.
I suppose that only really strengthens my arguement against it in that respect. But even ones you download from others places (GOG, Amazon, etc) won't lock you out for being 'banned' from them (though I doubt you could be banned from those places anyways unless you got caught doing something illegal like using other's credit cards). It might be in the EULA, but Steam, or any other major 'pc platform' I suppose, makes it easy to lock you out of all of your games for doing something wrong in just one of them.

Also, where did the Bioware thing come from anyways? I don't remember mentioning them at all...

I'd say that Frozen Synapsis and Minecraft don't really use great graphical power because they decide to go with a very stylized look. Sort of like what they did for Limbo; get rid of the need for graphics since there's no budget to make them by giving the game 'it's own style.' Not that that's a bad thing mind you.
 

octafish

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Kapol said:
snip
Also, where did the Bioware thing come from anyways? I don't remember mentioning them at all...
snip
EA locked a guy out of Dragon Age 2 completely because he said the Bioware had sold their souls to EA on a Bioware forum. It isn't just Steam that can stop you accessing your software. Ubisoft, EA and others can do it too.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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Jumplion said:
bahumat42 said:
Again not really?
stating a fact doesnt mean that you can't have you opinions that disagree with it. For example take this
Avatar is a beautiful movie
But i hate it.
(both true facts but lets not divert the topic too much)

Another example would be to say i was trying to convince somebody that aston martins are amazing cars, primarily i love them due to their looks and everything else is unimportant to me, but in the case of trying to convince some body of other tastes then the point of its speed or mileage would be valid to raise.
That's not what I'm trying to say. From where I stand, you're saying that these are just opinions. I'm saying that these are inconsistencies from fervent PC gamers (and make no mistake, I am one as well).

It's more like, say, if someone was going on about how visuals don't matter in a story, and then lambasting someone for having a 24-inch Plasma TV when their 46-inch LCD brings out a much higher quality picture with three times the refresh rate. Or, say, someone goes on to state how they don't care how bad their car looks so long as it gives good mileage, and then one day goes off about aesthetics of aerodynamic cars and sleek design scoffing at others who can't keep up with modern design.

Now, there's a difference between simply trying to get the best out of your machine, graphics-wise or not, and just doing a 180 in the "graphics don't matter" department which is what I see at times.
thats just bragging rights, again like trying to prove a point you use whatever ammunition you have regardless of if it fits with your ideals.
 

Moonlight Butterfly

Be the Leaf
Mar 16, 2011
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lol This is so freaking true.

I can play Crysis 2 on max graphics and it looks so freaking beautiful you want to cry but OH MY GOD do I feel horribly guilty when I wander off and play Arcanum or Bastion or somthing.

I imagine looking across to the perpex window of my rig and seeing my second GTX580 graphics card with a forever alone face taped on to it.

:<

If anything really high spec games are the least of what I play. Even Skyrim doesn't have DX11 and tessalation. (Although there is going to be a high res texture pack I think)

However Crysis 2, DA2 and to a lesser extent Deus EX (The TR:Underworld engine? Really guys?).
look absolutely, rainbow spewingly, gorgeous.
 

Bob_Dobb

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Why wasn't Dwarf Fortress mentioned as low graphic, highly immersive PC game. It's ASCII (can g et graphics pack) and its the best game I have ever played.
 

Jimothy Sterling

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WTF?

So you start the video by naming multiplat titles (Torchlight, Portal 2), mention PC's second biggest flaw (constant upgrades) and downplay that by syaing that you can play old games on it like as if only PC offers that ability - forgetting PSN and Virtual Console much?

This video is nothing more than highly biased BS. The biggest flaw that PC gaming has is the elitist fanboys who are fed by this kind of misinformed gobbledygook. Guess what, PC is no better and no worse than consoles in all reality. Both have moments of greatness, due to some very creative titles (minecraft, LBP, etc) ; and moments that are not so great due to reliance on stagnant genres (*cough*FPS*cough*); and everything in between. I myself prefer to be able to experience this by not having to place a small fortune in upgrading every other year (money saved that I can put into more games), but hey, whatever floats your boat.

Videos like this do nothing but feed the appetite of voracious elitist fanboys by providing only half of the equation. We need less of them.

If you like PC, great! I do enjoy some PC games as well (Starcraft, Civ). But don't try to convince me that most of the nonsense in this video can ONLY be applied to PC. I play a lot of old games, on my consoles. Do I care if they don't always look all new and shiny? No, I don't.
 

5t3v0

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s69-5 said:
WTF?

So you start the video by naming multiplat titles (Torchlight, Portal 2), mention PC's second biggest flaw (constant upgrades) and downplay that by syaing that you can play old games on it like as if only PC offers that ability - forgetting PSN and Virtual Console much?

This video is nothing more than highly biased BS. The biggest flaw that PC gaming has is the elitist fanboys who are fed by this kind of misinformed gobbledygook. Guess what, PC is no better and no worse than consoles in all reality. Both have moments of greatness, due to some very creative titles (minecraft, LBP, etc) ; and moments that are not so great due to reliance on stagnant genres (*cough*FPS*cough*); and everything in between. I myself prefer to be able to experience this by not having to place a small fortune in upgrading every other year (money saved that I can put into more games), but hey, whatever floats your boat.
Um, sorry, but I don't mean to be a dick or anything (I dunno what it is about this forum that just makes us all raging savages...) but I don't recall him saying anything about constant upgrades other than the fact that he is upgrading THIS YEAR for battlefield 3.

Also, time and time again, us PC gamers have been trying to say that "Constant upgrades" is a myth. Those who upgrade bi-yearly are usually hardware-nuts who like me love the feeling of building a PC, or have a game that is not available on console that has rather steep requirements for one reason or another. But Just because you can't play crysis on full doesnt make you a non-PC gamer. Don't listen to the hardliners. You can probably get away with upgrading every 4 years and still be able to play modern games in the 5th (albeit with tuned down settings).

Its just while we are elitist often, it doesnt help if opposition and critics of PC gaming spread misinformation like that. Again, I'm sorry if I'm coming off as elitist, but I just want to, as many PC gamers, clear up that myth.
 

infohippie

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EverythingIncredible said:
On the other side of the coin, I find plenty of games on consoles that would never be adequately told on PCs. Particularly games by From Software like Armored Core and Demon's Souls.

Sure, you could emulate it. But you will never have the true experience of playing those kinds of games when at your desk.
That's only because of the bane of the gaming industry - exclusivity. I would love to see Armored Core on PC. We need a good mech sim game on PC since Microsoft bought rights to the Mechwarrior series, turned it into an arcade style shitfest, and made it console-only.
I would have even bought the giant expensive specialised controller for it.
 

Starik20X6

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My problem with PC gaming isn't financial, got nothing to do with upgrading my computer or anything like that. No, my issue is that every single person I know who labels themselves as a PC Gamer is such an elitist fuckpuppet about it and all spend frighteningly large amounts of time telling me how inferior my consoles are to their PCs that it makes me avoid it almost entirely out of spite.
 

weirdee

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Apr 11, 2011
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Damn. I saw that chainsword in the gamestop rewards program (lol people who hate gamestop) for like, 80000 points, and it was in limited quantities....and it ran out within a couple hours.

If there's one thing that warhammer fans are known for it's a disposable income.
 

Kathinka

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Danzavare said:
Matthew94 said:
Great video, but I hated eye. It was a buggy piece of shit and infinite respawning really pisses me off when a fucking attack chopper comes at you every minute along with rocket launcher wielding goons.

Now if only console players would listen to this video...

You don't need to upgrade a PC every year and it doesn't cost thousands for a PC. Also the games are cheaper.

The mis-information annoys me.
But it's not misinformation. If I want to play something like Dues EX I do need a really good and really expensive computer. A lot of the big mainstream games are graphics intensive and you can't get past the fact that you need a computer than can cope with that. You don't /need/ to put lots of money into a good computer, it's just if you don't do so you miss most of the mainstream releases...?
if you are statisfied with playing it on a graphical level identical to an xbox360, you can get a very, VERY cheap pc, for less or about the same as you would have to invest in a console. of course, if you want everything cranked up to the max, you'll have to pay for it. but don't forget: an xbox is just a small, pretty outdated pc itself. how many years is that thing old now? 4? you can get a 4 year old pc with similar power for next to nothing. this age old argument for consoles is nothing but fabrication and/or misinformed drivel.
 

Versuvius

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What the fuck. Chainsword replica. Want, want it like ...like a triple cunted hooker.
 
Sep 3, 2011
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weirdguy said:
Damn. I saw that chainsword in the gamestop rewards program (lol people who hate gamestop) for like, 80000 points, and it was in limited quantities....and it ran out within a couple hours.

If there's one thing that warhammer fans are known for it's a disposable income.
Armies and tables cost a s*** ton
 

JoelChenFA

Play Minecraft. Watch Top Gear.
Nov 24, 2010
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Escapist could quite easily have practised some quality control and maybe not pay their inferior content providers but instead pay those that might want to leave when not paid.
 

carpathic

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Ahhh excellent. Jim is actually an Astartes! I learn something new everyday.

Hopefully he is a dreadnought!