Jimquisition: Think of the Children!

demented

New member
Oct 15, 2012
11
0
0
Irridium said:
You know, I used to care about children. Used to not hate them.

Then Fallout 3's Little Lamplight happened.

Now every time I see a child in game I view it with suspicion and contempt. Either they'll use their perk as children to ***** you out knowing you aren't able to do anything back, or they'll be a cheap pull at a heart-string.

So thanks, Bethesda. Thanks for making me hate kids in games.

Oh, and Retro-City Rampage is available on GoG as well [http://www.gog.com/en/gamecard/retro_city_rampage]. So if you want it without DRM and some extra stuff like the soundrack, go GoG.
You can actually sell those kids them into slavery. It's possibly the darkest act you can commit in the game but if you despise them that much, it might be worth it.

God, I hated Dawn. There were times I wanted to murder the actor playing her just so she would be gone from the show.
 

Pink Apocalypse

New member
Oct 9, 2012
90
0
0
Shiro No Uma said:
Saying "Children are just basically shitty adults," is messed up. CHILDREN ARE NOT JUST SMALL ADULTS. (That's psych 101.) Treating or thinking of them as such is not just unfair to any child, or adult, but perverse.
Very much agreed.

Jim makes a great point about the laziness of (non)characterization, but you can't simply write children as interesting miniature adults with a few quirks ('frail', 'emotionally clutching', etc). As much as media may sometimes portray it, they simply aren't neurologically capable of the psychology required to fully interact in a way that a (selfish) adult wouldn't describe as 'shitty', or at least 'annoying'. And before anyone does, please forgo the 'but I know a little kid who does' speech, and research statistical averages. Exceptions do not make the rule.

Also, portraying them as little adults can get pretty creepy, frankly. And it also seems that Bethesda delights in making the children in their games as grating as possible.
 

Dragon Zero

No one of note
Apr 16, 2009
710
0
0
Jimothy Sterling said:
Think of the Children!

Children are the holy grail of conflict.

Watch Video
What about Duck? What do you think of him? Granted he is just a side character and not really a big focus of the story, like Clementine.

OT: I really have to agree with you about the Heavy Rain kids. Hell I think the only time I had any connection with them is at the very beginning, when the pet dies and you see the child reacting to it. Kids are really hard to get right, at least in an audio/visual medium IMHO, you either wind up with obnoxious little jerks or just adults with smaller proportions, hell I can't even think of a child in game that I remember other than kids in Fallout/Fable/Elder Scrolls, which my opinion varies and Pandora from God of War 3, whom I despise but I have issues about GoW3 that cloud my judgement and I don't really care to go into detail.

Anyway, great video as always!
 

ex275w

New member
Mar 27, 2012
187
0
0
There are a lot of good kid characters creators should research if they want to create a kid. Kids like Calvin, Susie Derkins, the whole Peanuts cast sans Rerun in comics are varied kids. The cast of Earthbound and Okamiden in videogames are pretty decent and not annoying. The point is treating them with the same seriousness as an adult, kids can be as capable as adults sometimes, if a bit simpler in their thought processes.
 

Silverback91

New member
Oct 5, 2010
50
0
0
In terms of Mass Effect 3, I think that Shepard's emotional torment at the kid is moreover his distress at actually not being able to save someone. That sends him on the stress spiral where he has to come to grips with the idea of galactic triage. Granted, that makes a bit more sense if you play a paragon Shepard and didn't do the Arrival DLC but still.

On another note, am I the only one that was kinda insulted by Modern Warfare 3's "shocking moment"? It felt like the developers were telling me that they think the only way to get me to care about a city full of civilians getting hit with nerve gas was to have a American family and a child in particular die from it? I hope I'm not the only one.
 

ToastiestZombie

Don't worry. Be happy!
Mar 21, 2011
3,691
0
0
Yeah, child characters are normally really shit. I watched the crapfest Insidious the other day, I didn't care for shit because the whole story was just "save this little boy from the demons!".

I fully agree with you on Clementine. The only mass-anger-over-a-trivial-thing I'll be fine with in gaming is if ANYTHING bad happens to Clementine in the last episode. I don't think I'd be able to handle it if she died. Still hope it's a possible outcome though.
 

soh45400

New member
Jun 1, 2012
52
0
0
Zachary Amaranth said:
Ickabod said:
Writers writing stories about children don't have children of their own, thus they don't know what children are like
Yeah, that's not the problem. Like, at all. You don't need children to write compelling children and you don't start writing them just because you have them.
True. What about thinking what they were like as children?
That is an easy way of writing a child character. Just think, if I was a child and was put in that situation what would I do? and write that.
Whenever someone whines about children, they should be reminded that were children themselves once.
 

TwiZtah

New member
Sep 22, 2011
301
0
0
ex275w said:
There are a lot of good kid characters creators should research if they want to create a kid. Kids like Calvin, Susie Derkins, the whole Peanuts cast sans Rerun in comics are varied kids. The cast of Earthbound and Okamiden in videogames are pretty decent and not annoying. The point is treating them with the same seriousness as an adult, kids can be as capable as adults sometimes, if a bit simpler in their thought processes.
I think Calvin is a fucking prick, I'm seriously annoyed to oblivion by him. Even from a young age, I have not been able to stand most children cartoon characters. Winnie the Pooh is retarded from the earth the moon and back, all of Astrid Lindgrens characters are obnoxious little fuckers.
 

Canadamus Prime

Robot in Disguise
Jun 17, 2009
14,334
0
0
The phrase "think of the children" makes me want to puke, because it's used as the rallying cry of parents lobbing the government(s) to enact legislation so that they won't have to think of their children. (in other words, do their parenting for them)

A little more on topic, this is why there are mods that allow you to kill children in games like Skyrim, Oblivion, Fallout 3 etc.
 

Assassin Xaero

New member
Jul 23, 2008
5,392
0
0
So, then, guess we'll have to see how The Last of Us turns out. Not sure where the cut off age for "children" is, but guess she is supposed to be 14 and doesn't seem like the typical annoying as hell teenager.
 

Rad Party God

Party like it's 2010!
Feb 23, 2010
3,560
0
0
Yeah... last night I was watching a re-run of the second season of The Walking Dead series... and I was reminded, like if someone hit me in the head with a rock (or a kick in the nuts), why I fucking hated that season and almost made me hate the entire fucking series... women and children.

Seriously, I don't have anything against children and women (Aliens being the perfect example of both superbly done), but it's like if the writers of the TWD series were lobotomic monkeys with a grudge for women and children.

The day Lori (and hopefully Carl) get killed will be the day I fucking get off my chair to start dancing and screaming in joy like a little girl.

The game on the other hand... I fucking love Clementine...
 

Domogo

New member
Aug 7, 2012
157
0
0
Did anyone else notice that the baby's head was dented in at the end and then suddenly back to the semi-normal creepy fake baby head after the plug?

OT: yea yea good episode blah de blah de blah...
 

Gennadios

New member
Aug 19, 2009
1,157
0
0
But Jim, TWD also had an insufferable child who'se only real accomplishment was
pinning a guy under a tractor.

Should have showered him with your attention as well.
 

Jimothy Sterling

New member
Apr 18, 2011
5,976
0
0
Dragon Zero said:
Jimothy Sterling said:
Think of the Children!

Children are the holy grail of conflict.

Watch Video
What about Duck? What do you think of him? Granted he is just a side character and not really a big focus of the story, like Clementine.

OT: I really have to agree with you about the Heavy Rain kids. Hell I think the only time I had any connection with them is at the very beginning, when the pet dies and you see the child reacting to it. Kids are really hard to get right, at least in an audio/visual medium IMHO, you either wind up with obnoxious little jerks or just adults with smaller proportions, hell I can't even think of a child in game that I remember other than kids in Fallout/Fable/Elder Scrolls, which my opinion varies and Pandora from God of War 3, whom I despise but I have issues about GoW3 that cloud my judgement and I don't really care to go into detail.

Anyway, great video as always!
I didn't have time to talk about Duck, but I liked him. What I loved was how he started as the stereotypical annoying, helpless kid, then subverted expectations by being funny, charming, and even useful (in his own useless way). Duck will get written off by many due to his introduction, but there is a lot more going on with him than he'll ever credit for.
 

TheOrb

New member
Jun 24, 2012
169
0
0
Heh, this reminds of an old sport in Scotland called Midget-Tossing, but it was banned because of Health & Safety.
Or it could be a legend, I'm not sure which...
But I hope it's true!
 

Scorpid

New member
Jul 24, 2011
814
0
0
Jimothy Sterling said:
Dragon Zero said:
Jimothy Sterling said:
Think of the Children!

Children are the holy grail of conflict.

Watch Video
What about Duck? What do you think of him? Granted he is just a side character and not really a big focus of the story, like Clementine.

OT: I really have to agree with you about the Heavy Rain kids. Hell I think the only time I had any connection with them is at the very beginning, when the pet dies and you see the child reacting to it. Kids are really hard to get right, at least in an audio/visual medium IMHO, you either wind up with obnoxious little jerks or just adults with smaller proportions, hell I can't even think of a child in game that I remember other than kids in Fallout/Fable/Elder Scrolls, which my opinion varies and Pandora from God of War 3, whom I despise but I have issues about GoW3 that cloud my judgement and I don't really care to go into detail.

Anyway, great video as always!
I didn't have time to talk about Duck, but I liked him. What I loved was how he started as the stereotypical annoying, helpless kid, then subverted expectations by being funny, charming, and even useful (in his own useless way). Duck will get written off by many due to his introduction, but there is a lot more going on with him than he'll ever credit for.
I liked Duck because he went from a rambunctious little idiot to taking much more after Clementine by how the situation dictated he must and the time they spent together while still remaining unique. Though his first introduction had me sighing in frustration because I thought he was going to keep getting into such trouble, on top of that I really liked Ducks poor victim. =/
 

Kapol

Watch the spinning tails...
May 2, 2010
1,431
0
0
Jimothy Sterling said:
I didn't have time to talk about Duck, but I liked him. What I loved was how he started as the stereotypical annoying, helpless kid, then subverted expectations by being funny, charming, and even useful (in his own useless way). Duck will get written off by many due to his introduction, but there is a lot more going on with him than he'll ever credit for.
I was actually going to comment saying I was surprised you didn't mention him, if only because he was initially a pretty good example of the worst one can do with children characters.

In the beginning he seemed like a way to ratchet up the conflict and help drive Kenny in many ways. He was the initial reason why the feud with Larry started, he was the one held hostage by the last of the Saint Johns at the end, and he pretty much killed the person who helped you in the first episode to get you kicked off the farm. I personally found him annoying and mostly helped him to keep Kenny on my side.

But then episode 3 happened. He started being useful, funny, and even somewhat interesting. And just as he finally got some really characterization, he was bitten. And the annoying little kid who ran around like a hyperactive monkey turned into a quivering, silent little boy who we knew had no chance after finding out he was, in fact, bitten. It made me regret being so hard on him before. And even if it was still done in a way to drive Kenny's actions, it was done so well that I can forgive it.
 

shrekfan246

Not actually a Japanese pop star
May 26, 2011
6,374
0
0
Falseprophet said:
My favourite child character in a genre film? Newt from Aliens. Yeah, she was definitely a scared little girl, but she showed the survival instinct that allowed her to survive for weeks on a xenomorph-infested complex (about 1:00 in the clip below):

Which is why I hated the opening to Alien 3 all the more...

OT: Interesting. I may need to play The Walking Dead after all, which I haven't yet because Adventure games are always a little too obtuse for me to enjoy.