Joe Biden backs away from a public option.

crimson5pheonix

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Not even M4A, just a basic public option. It's literally too much to ask for from an incoming president that won on the back of people who are about ready guillotine over health insurance. Biden's currently released policy plan includes, frankly, very little apart from subsidies to insurance companies that have ballooned during the pandemic even as people are denied coverage, go bankrupt, and die. Biden is perfectly willing to be complicit in the deaths of Americans for the sake of his donors.
 

Chimpzy

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Sorry Crimson, I'm stealing your thing, but since you've refrained from an obvious opportunity, I feel this is fair game.


I'm honestly confused why some people seem to believe Biden is some kind of game changer. More like a reset button, I'd say, reverting things back to pre-2016.
 

stroopwafel

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He can't really do much without congressional support. He could do it per decree like Obama but he probably doesn't want to alienate 'moderate' republicans so early in the game.
 

Silvanus

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Pretty disappointing.

But it's worth noting the article is specifically about how the COVID-19 response/ vaccination plan doesn't include a public option & lifts from private insurers. It's not his long-term healthcare plan, which still includes a public option according to his website.

That's kind of to be expected, really. Complete healthcare overhaul is direly overdue, but it's simply not going to be immediate due to the legislative process in the US. It was never going to be ready to go in time for the emergency vaccination provision, which needs to happen immediately.
 
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tstorm823

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That's kind of to be expected, really. Complete healthcare overhaul is direly overdue, but it's simply not going to be immediate due to the legislative process in the US. It was never going to be ready to go in time for the emergency vaccination provision, which needs to happen immediately.
I'm sure many would argue that present circumstances make healthcare overhaul a more immediate necessity, but I personally think now is a terrible time to try and overhaul healthcare. And even without the pandemic, I feel like it would be foolish for Biden to waste any political goodwill he has to start with on Obamacare: Part 3. He's theoretically got 2 years to get Democratic wishes through, and that particular issue is 100% destined to lead to Democratic in-fighting.

He'd be better off putting that effort on hold until the health system re-stabilizes, and use his first big effort on an environmental package.
 

Schadrach

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He can't really do much without congressional support. He could do it per decree like Obama but he probably doesn't want to alienate 'moderate' republicans so early in the game.
I'm just going to go ahead and call it:

Despite controlling both houses of Congress and the presidency, precious little that's considered the "Democrat agenda" will actually get done, and they'll blame Republicans for it. Despite it being a simple majority vote to end the filibuster (and they made a point of holding such a vote about not using gendered language on the floor) they won't do that and then claim anything they can't get enough Republican Senators to agree to just can't be passed.

Which means they need to start every bill to the right of what they allegedly want, and when Republicans won't bite "negotiate" it farther right.

Anything that meaningfully changes will be mostly symbolic or some social issue that does not impact the donor class at all.
 

Silvanus

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I'm sure many would argue that present circumstances make healthcare overhaul a more immediate necessity, but I personally think now is a terrible time to try and overhaul healthcare.
I'm a little undecided. I certainly think a healthcare system that isn't profit-motivated would be immensely better placed to cope with a pandemic, and profit motivation has already hamstrung the US response. My immediate feeling is to be disappointed by this.

But I also recognise that speed of response is the single most vital element right now, particularly during the vaccine rollout window. And I can comprehend that systemic overhaul during such a time could cause supply-chain delays that we really do not need right now.

But... I genuinely don't know the extent to which that latter concern would actually be a problem.

I would be inclined to say Biden should introduce some kind of emergency measure to co-opt the existing system, removing the profit-motive and retooling it for direct and immediate public service. Then, after the immediate vaccine distribution networks are working & secure, bring in the public option as soon as feasible.
 

crimson5pheonix

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Pretty disappointing.

But it's worth noting the article is specifically about how the COVID-19 response/ vaccination plan doesn't include a public option & lifts from private insurers. It's not his long-term healthcare plan, which still includes a public option according to his website.

That's kind of to be expected, really. Complete healthcare overhaul is direly overdue, but it's simply not going to be immediate due to the legislative process in the US. It was never going to be ready to go in time for the emergency vaccination provision, which needs to happen immediately.
If you're not starting your overhaul at COVID relief with some odd 400000 dead already, you're just not going to do it. His website can say whatever it wants, it's clearly a crock of shit. There will never be better leverage to overhaul healthcare and institute even the half-assed public option than a literal pandemic that would be massively alleviated by such a shift.

Further, even taking this as COVID relief and nothing more, it's still shit. It's a bunch of corporate bailouts that don't help anyone except the rich. Isn't that what we complained about Trump doing?

Sorry Crimson, I'm stealing your thing, but since you've refrained from an obvious opportunity, I feel this is fair game.


I'm honestly confused why some people seem to believe Biden is some kind of game changer. More like a reset button, I'd say, reverting things back to pre-2016.
This is fine, I accept.
 
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tippy2k2

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If you're not starting your overhaul at COVID relief with some odd 400000 dead already, you're just not going to do it. His website can say whatever it wants, it's clearly a crock of shit. There will never be better leverage to overhaul healthcare and institute even the half-assed public option than a literal pandemic that would be massively alleviated by such a shift.

Further, even taking this as COVID relief and nothing more, it's still shit. It's a bunch of corporate bailouts that don't help anyone except the rich. Isn't that what we complained about Trump doing?
Not only 400,000 dead, we have millions of people have lost their job (and therefore their insurance coverage), the majority of democratic voters want it (plus a decent chunk of Republican voters), and we're still in the middle of a pandemic that is decimating people financially (so even those of us with insurance might not even be able to afford to use it)...

If now isn't the time, when in the hell is the time to push for health care reform? Because we've been told "NEXT TIME" for thirty some fucking years at this point...
 
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Specter Von Baren

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Sorry Crimson, I'm stealing your thing, but since you've refrained from an obvious opportunity, I feel this is fair game.


I'm honestly confused why some people seem to believe Biden is some kind of game changer. More like a reset button, I'd say, reverting things back to pre-2016.
A lot of people seem to have the mistaken idea that resetting to pre-2016 means putting the boulder back on top of the hill when what it actually means is rolling it up a couple feet and letting it run you over again.

If you're not starting your overhaul at COVID relief with some odd 400000 dead already, you're just not going to do it. His website can say whatever it wants, it's clearly a crock of shit. There will never be better leverage to overhaul healthcare and institute even the half-assed public option than a literal pandemic that would be massively alleviated by such a shift.

Further, even taking this as COVID relief and nothing more, it's still shit. It's a bunch of corporate bailouts that don't help anyone except the rich. Isn't that what we complained about Trump doing?

This is fine, I accept.
There was also never a better time to take the Democratic party to task to put forth a good presidential candidate with an eye for real change but here we are...
 

Silvanus

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If you're not starting your overhaul at COVID relief with some odd 400000 dead already, you're just not going to do it. His website can say whatever it wants, it's clearly a crock of shit. There will never be better leverage to overhaul healthcare and institute even the half-assed public option than a literal pandemic that would be massively alleviated by such a shift.
The response to the pandemic would certainly be much better handled by a public system. But it's easy to see how vaccine rollout, which is now intensely time-sensitive, could be delayed by overhauling all the supply-chains mid-rollout.
 

crimson5pheonix

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The response to the pandemic would certainly be much better handled by a public system. But it's easy to see how vaccine rollout, which is now intensely time-sensitive, could be delayed by overhauling all the supply-chains mid-rollout.
It's easy to see how the vaccine rollout could be delayed by relying on for-profit supply-chains. It's not an excuse, there is no good excuse, it's just what everyone said was going to happen in the first place a year ago, Biden has no interest in changing the healthcare industry he helped set up to be as anti-poor as he could get away with.

Now is the time. Last year was the time. Four years ago was the time. Eight years ago was the time. Twelve years ago was the time. It's been the time. There is no time where it would be "convenient", but now is the time when it's necessary.
 

Thaluikhain

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I'm honestly confused why some people seem to believe Biden is some kind of game changer. More like a reset button, I'd say, reverting things back to pre-2016.
Some of the things most of the way back, perhaps, I don't think he'll even try to get most of them most of the way back.

Biden will go down in history as not as bad as Trump. Which, on one hand, given the alternative was Trump, is good, on the other, not very impressive.
 

stroopwafel

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I'm just going to go ahead and call it:

Despite controlling both houses of Congress and the presidency, precious little that's considered the "Democrat agenda" will actually get done, and they'll blame Republicans for it. Despite it being a simple majority vote to end the filibuster (and they made a point of holding such a vote about not using gendered language on the floor) they won't do that and then claim anything they can't get enough Republican Senators to agree to just can't be passed.

Which means they need to start every bill to the right of what they allegedly want, and when Republicans won't bite "negotiate" it farther right.

Anything that meaningfully changes will be mostly symbolic or some social issue that does not impact the donor class at all.
Isn't it a marginal majority though? It's also not like every democrat is equally left on the spectrum. It kinda makes sense Biden doesn't want to corner himself as a 'socialist' so early in the game when he just have given a speech how is the president 'for all Americans'. He probably wants to placate some of the more 'moderate' republicans while also not dividing the democrats that are more to the right. He probably wants to go for the widest possible base which I think is smart strategy when you are just beginning the presidency. It can only get downhill from here as far as congressional support goes.
 

tippy2k2

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Now is the time. Last year was the time. Four years ago was the time. Eight years ago was the time. Twelve years ago was the time. It's been the time. There is no time where it would be "convenient", but now is the time when it's necessary.
I gave it a LIKE but this part deserves way more than a LIKE.

Louder for all the centrists who want to plug their ears and go "We can't right now cause we can't risk it but NEXT time we'll try"

There's NEVER going to be a convenient time for this. You either care that millions of Americans die (or financially die because their entire life just got crippled as they declare bankruptcy for having the audacity to get cancer) every year from lack of insurance or you don't.

Fuck every single politican with their HeAlThCaRe Is A hUmAn RiGhT bullshit platitudes while sucking off the insurance companies. Either healthcare is a human right worth fighting for or it's not.
 

tippy2k2

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Sorry Katie's son, I know it sucks that you your Mom can't afford your insulin even though she has a full time job but we can't try to get any Health Care Reform right now! It's just too risky.

But don't worry, next time we'll fight for it! You, a nine year old child, can handle not having insulin for like...sixty years, right? Stop being so selfish and just wait for us to decide it's a good time for health care reform!!!
 

Seanchaidh

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Some of the things most of the way back, perhaps, I don't think he'll even try to get most of them most of the way back.
For example, he's already decided the embassy should stay in Jerusalem.
 

Silvanus

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It's easy to see how the vaccine rollout could be delayed by relying on for-profit supply-chains.
Yeah, it is. But the alternative isn't already in place, and will take a few months at the very least to establish (just like every public health service in the world has done). It's not an on-off, private-public switch. It's a huge undertaking.

Put it this way. Attlee and Bevan did not establish the NHS immediately after the 1945 election put them in power. It took 3 years. Does that mean it would be true for detractors to say they had "no plans" to implement one? Obviously not. It took a while, because these things do, and we got the NHS.
 
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