Justice League Director's Cut announced for HBO Max.

[Dwarvenhobble]

I didn't say I was talking about only the fans who want the snider cut. I just said fans in general can be toxic, which they can be. And yes I know we don't know the story, which is why i covered my statement with "this is speculation" warnings. But it's not out of the realm of possibility, given we have documented cases (one just a week ago of a female wrestler on some reality tv show) of people being driven to suicide due to social media harassment, and we know teenagers are especially susceptible to it, and we know that nerds can be incredibly hostile to people they think had any connection to something they feel was "ruined". All 3 of those being together in one situation isn't that big of a stretch to me. Again, I don't know it for sure, but considering OTHER people in similar nerd franchises, were harrassed to the point of near suicide and social isolation/mental instability, it's hardly a crazy speculation.

It's really not just nerds. Hell people point to nerds a lot to claim they're Toxic but it's worth pointing out.

Shippers have so far:
Caused the Star Wars social media manager to leave social media on their personal account because of Reylos harassing them
Sent Death Threats to the makers of the new Voltron series for not making the ship they wanted cannon.
Sent threats to Rose Leslie (Wife of Kit Harrington) because they wanted to make Kit and Emilia Clare (plays Daenerys) a real life couple
Been accused of sending racial abuse to Candice Patton (Plays Iris West on The Flash).
Twilight fans harassed and sent death threats Kirsten Stewart after she cheated on Robert Pattinson

And this is just what we know of

Other incidents worthy of note not from shippers:

The Steven Universe fandom threatening and harassing an artist to suicide for drawing a character too thin

 

[happyninja42]

It's really not just nerds. Hell people point to nerds a lot to claim they're Toxic but it's worth pointing out.

Shippers have so far:
Caused the Star Wars social media manager to leave social media on their personal account because of Reylos harassing them
Sent Death Threats to the makers of the new Voltron series for not making the ship they wanted cannon.
Sent threats to Rose Leslie (Wife of Kit Harrington) because they wanted to make Kit and Emilia Clare (plays Daenerys) a real life couple
Been accused of sending racial abuse to Candice Patton (Plays Iris West on The Flash).
Twilight fans harassed and sent death threats Kirsten Stewart after she cheated on Robert Pattinson

And this is just what we know of

Other incidents worthy of note not from shippers:

The Steven Universe fandom threatening and harassing an artist to suicide for drawing a character too thin

You seem to separate shippers from nerds, yet every example you give, is a franchise that is firmly in the nerd camp. And I never said that nerds are the only humans that are toxic, but when it comes to nerd related content, yeah it's mostly nerds spewing the bile. I mean, I'm sure there are some toxic baseball fans out there, that are equivalent to nerd shit, but I'm not one of them, because I'm not a baseball fan. So yeah, I don't see how your points at all disqualify mine, because I've yet to meet a single person who is a fan of any of those above mentioned things, who isn't considered a nerd.

That's just a relationship specific subset of toxic nerdom, instead of the minutiae specific subset. The ones who are like "Well actually, Superman didn't ever don the purple shoes until Ultimate Fighty Crisis 27: For Real This Time: The Return, issue 27! So the director putting him in this outfit here CLEARLY implies...blah blah blah" kind of toxic shit.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

You seem to separate shippers from nerds, yet every example you give, is a franchise that is firmly in the nerd camp.

Yes I happily do separate the two because often they're in it for very different reasons. Partly because a lot of the time shipping communities only build round properties that are big and popular in culture anyway.

There wasn't a shipping community round Star Wars until the new movies really.
Did the old TV show of The Flash have a shipping community? No but the new ones does.

And I never said that nerds are the only humans that are toxic, but when it comes to nerd related content, yeah it's mostly nerds spewing the bile.

But when it comes to sportsball related content sporstballers are the ones mostly spewing toxic bile..........

I mean, I'm sure there are some toxic baseball fans out there, that are equivalent to nerd shit, but I'm not one of them, because I'm not a baseball fan. So yeah, I don't see how your points at all disqualify mine, because I've yet to meet a single person who is a fan of any of those above mentioned things, who isn't considered a nerd.

That's just a relationship specific subset of toxic nerdom, instead of the minutiae specific subset. The ones who are like "Well actually, Superman didn't ever don the purple shoes until Ultimate Fighty Crisis 27: For Real This Time: The Return, issue 27! So the director putting him in this outfit here CLEARLY implies...blah blah blah" kind of toxic shit.

Mostly people calling out inconsistencies like that that aren't the Toxic ones. Pedantic and slightly annoying maybe but a lot of the calls towards fans of being toxic is being done by hacks pissed off people calling out the problems in their work and won't be good little consumers and

 

[happyninja42]

Yes I happily do separate the two because often they're in it for very different reasons. Partly because a lot of the time shipping communities only build round properties that are big and popular in culture anyway.

There wasn't a shipping community round Star Wars until the new movies really.
Did the old TV show of The Flash have a shipping community? No but the new ones does.

If by shipping you mean "people who wanted to see two characters hook up", yeah there was most definitely a group of those around the original series. They just didn't have the internet to spread their shipping love as wide.

But when it comes to sportsball related content sporstballers are the ones mostly spewing toxic bile..........

Yes? Which is my point? That the people IN the franchise/sphere of the thing being toxified, are the ones toxifying it. I mean in theory their might be somebody out there that doesn't like baseball at all, and yet obsesses every waking moment about how much he hates it, and revels in sharing that hate in social media, but I doubt it, and he's certainly not the standard type to fit that bill.

Mostly people calling out inconsistencies like that that aren't the Toxic ones. Pedantic and slightly annoying maybe but a lot of the calls towards fans of being toxic is being done by hacks pissed off people calling out the problems in their work and won't be good little consumers and

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Yeah using the Well Actually example I did probably wasn't the best one, but I felt that my point was understood. However, I could easily direct you to the FFG forums in the Star Wars section, and point you to a few posters by name, who are incredibly toxic, and they are the Well Actually style. Very often, the people who toss out shit, are doing so because of some incredibly minute detail that they feel is just absolutely SO IMPORTANT, when it really isn't. Now I'm fine with constructive criticism, when it's done in a mature manner, which does amuse me that you used a clip from Red Letter Media, a group that are pretty shitty about trolling people and acting like assholes, to try and counter the idea of people who do the Well Actually defense NOT being toxic.

It's the same mentality that has people have flame wars about "Who Would Win in a Fight?" , and devolve into shit-flinging . Yeah it's not the only flavor of toxic fandom out there, but it IS out there.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

If by shipping you mean "people who wanted to see two characters hook up", yeah there was most definitely a group of those around the original series. They just didn't have the internet to spread their shipping love as wide.

I didn't think the 1990's series of The Flash has much that would appeal to the shipping community at all......

Yes? Which is my point? That the people IN the franchise/sphere of the thing being toxified, are the ones toxifying it. I mean in theory their might be somebody out there that doesn't like baseball at all, and yet obsesses every waking moment about how much he hates it, and revels in sharing that hate in social media, but I doubt it, and he's certainly not the standard type to fit that bill.

yeh but I was more on about people who started watching something because it was the in thing and other were talking about it rather than being actually into it much beforehand.

E.G. the people who have 0 history with Doctor Who suddenly coming out of the woodwork to yell "At last Dr Who has a strong female character at last positive representation for women" while in doing so showing complete ignorance of the show beforehand.

Now I'm fine with constructive criticism, when it's done in a mature manner, which does amuse me that you used a clip from Red Letter Media, a group that are pretty shitty about trolling people and acting like assholes, to try and counter the idea of people who do the Well Actually defense NOT being toxic.

They do it because some people do need to sometimes be taken down a peg or two. They're pretty mild considering some stuff done in the past towards people. The fact people consider the toxic shows how far things have fallen when most of the time they're more blunt than overtly nasty.