George Washington was a great general the same reason a coach is a great coach. They pull off the wins, regardless of numbers. yes england could of won if they diddn't pull out, but they diddn't. and the reason they even had to admit defeat was because washington was a a genius at maneuvering his army, and retreating. but it's not because colonies have no values, but that there was a giant indian cake to cut up that was more profitable. Colonies where lifeblood to european nations, where it's like locking up two dozen 10 yeards olds in a closet. colonies where like opening up the closet and showing them the backyard, colonies where MASSIVELY important during the COLONIal period.Evil Alpaca said:
Lies they told you in history class
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England's pretty good for not being biased when they teach you stuff. You'll get the odd rough patch but that's usually because of the teacher, rather than the course content and syllabus.
I've taken history since I could, currently doing it at A-Level, and everything I've been taught has been true.
As well as that, Germany's secret police, the Gestapo, was incredibly small compared to popular belief. There was around 20 Gestapo to a city, I think it was, and they just responded to accusations made by the German people. Neighbour's a Jew? Call the Gestapo. Neighbour criticised the Nazis? Call the Gestapo. Neighbour let their dog shit on the front lawn? Call the Gestapo and tell them they're a communist. The German people were very compliant with the Nazi's social and racial polices. Parents would send their kids to the Hitler Youth who would then be taught to attack Jews in class for being Jewish.
The only people who fought back against the Nazis were the Edelweiss Pirates. A group of kids who would do everything the Hitler Youth did without the racism and adding in 'beat up Nazis'.
I've taken history since I could, currently doing it at A-Level, and everything I've been taught has been true.
While the Nazis coated over the whole genocide thing, Germany was very anti-Semitic. The people joined in attacking Jewish shops and boycotting them. They may not have been genocide standard, many Nazi officers and soldiers went insane because of what they did, they weren't about to shout at the Nazis for what was going on. They were against the euthanasia policy and Hitler-eugenics. So much so that the Nazis had to 'stop'[footnote]Yeah, they didn't stop. They just started covering it up better[/footnote] doing it.Machati said:
As well as that, Germany's secret police, the Gestapo, was incredibly small compared to popular belief. There was around 20 Gestapo to a city, I think it was, and they just responded to accusations made by the German people. Neighbour's a Jew? Call the Gestapo. Neighbour criticised the Nazis? Call the Gestapo. Neighbour let their dog shit on the front lawn? Call the Gestapo and tell them they're a communist. The German people were very compliant with the Nazi's social and racial polices. Parents would send their kids to the Hitler Youth who would then be taught to attack Jews in class for being Jewish.
The only people who fought back against the Nazis were the Edelweiss Pirates. A group of kids who would do everything the Hitler Youth did without the racism and adding in 'beat up Nazis'.
Proper U.S history is way more interesting. Especially the lead up, the dissolution of colonial governments, and the general breakdown in negotiations. The colonies wanted representatives in British parliament, or at the very least autonomy, but I believe this statement pretty much sums up the British attitudes towards the colonies at the time.Glass Joe the Champ said:
"The colonies were acquired with no other view than to be a convenience to us and therefore it can never be imagined that we are to consult their interest preferable to our own."
The London Chronicle - 1764
Also:
They told me that the 'robber barons' like John Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, George B. Cortelyou, James Stillman, and J.P Morgan were corrupt and evil men when in reality they should be hailed as heroes by all accounts. Their contributions to the arts, science, and medicine propelled the world forward for decades and Morgan pretty much ended the Panic of 1907 single handedly. None of them killed anybody, none of them oppressed anybody's free will, none of them started any wars, they gave vast amounts to public works, and they worked together to end multiple economic depressions that made the current situation look like a little dip in revenue.
Every history class I took seemed intent on espousing the great good FDR's New Deal did for the US when, in reality, independent studies have shown that it deepened and extended the depression. It was only ended by our involvement in WWII.
Oh, and that unions somehow magically created the middle class when, in most cases, they were only established after most labor legislation had already been passed. As for that workers rights garbage it's also an interesting point that many unions formed with the implied intent of keeping minorities, women, and the poor from taking over their work, so there you go.
And just to back up my statement on unions http://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.t02.htm compare men to women and white workers to minorities. When compared to the nation average these rates are over 4 times worse than normal discrepancies in compensation.
That?s been up in the air for a while. They have their own governing body and every once in a while they have an election of whether to become a state or not. By all accounts they're kinda ok with being a territory for the time being. The U.S house passed a resolution stating that Puerto Rico can vote on their legal status, they keep voting to stay a territory. They could become a state or a country if they want to but they don't.GZGoten said:
Hey, even with modern communications it took them a year and a half to get round to invading Iraq after Saddam tac-nuked the Twin Towers, and they didn't even have Blackberries back in 1915.Istvan said:
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*obvious sarcasm OFF*
The only load of crap I recall being taught as historical fact was christian creation mythology. Then again, I dropped history at age 13. It was DULL.
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So much for sarcasm being obvious.itchcrotch said:
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I think the end result was not that "we" won but that "we" didn't lose nearly as hard as "they" did.Max Ahriman said:
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Parts of it are relevant. The reason road signs get defaced and you have to mind your accent and town names in the Pyrenees, the fact that much of Laos is unsafe due to UXO all over the show, the victims of Agent Orange, the on-going messes everywhere from Algeria to Kashmir, tribal resentments in Zimbabwe, the discrepancy between living standards of Frank, Angle, Saxon, Teuton, Dane, Norse, Breton, Celt, Dacian, Roman, Spaniard, Arab, Turk, African, Khmer, Siam, Viet, Cham, Sin, Han, Miao, Japanese, Tibetan, Hmong, Mongol and suchlike "others" and those of natives in North America and so on all have historical bases. Understanding them may help in dealing with them, living with them, avoiding stepping on people's toes or whatever.immortalfrieza said:
Recent history, since the cultural shift away from "King, by the Grace of God" towards democracy in "our" parts of the world, also has a use in avoiding making the same mistakes again. Look up how things went for the US forces in Vietnam. Look up My Lai, 16 March 1968. Look up how things went for Israeli forces in southern Lebanon in the '80s and '90s. Look up the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps massacre. Look up how things went for US forces in Iraq. Look up Abber Qasim Hamza al-Janabi. Look up Fallujah. There's a saying, getting older all the time: "Learn from the mistakes of history or be doomed to repeat them." Know what happened. Understand the mistakes that were made. Learn. Avoid those mistakes.
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I do hope people are learning about the Reichstag fire. It's kind of relevant to more recent events in some ways. *glances sideways at the Patriot Act*Knife said:
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Background and causes: monarchies, treaties and the fact the powerful nations of the time had run out of "rest of the world" to conquer.itchcrotch said:
Yeah, yeah, maybe it was a little more complicated than that but we're not that much different from wolves in some ways.
I'd be tempted to let Wilfred Owen, Siegfried Sassoon, All Quiet On The Western Front and Blackadder Goes Forth cover it. Feckin' depressing however you look at it.
Personal conjecture: WWI stopped because one side ran out of young men. All the young men went home and went at it like rabbits. 19 to 21 years later, both sides suddenly had lots of young adults again .....
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Debating education with someone who can't spell "points of view" seems like a bad idea, so I'll stick to mockery:thethird0611 said:
"Oh no, blatant atheists! The horror! The horror!"
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Fair enough, although I think you have to go back a century in some cases.immortalfrieza said:
Hey, as long as Israel's saying they're allowed to do whatever they want because of The Holocaust The Only Holocaust There Never Was Another Before Or After And Jews Were The Only Victims people ought to know about the Armenians [http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-new-light-on-an-old-horror-ndash-and-still-there-is-no-justice-2352249.html], the other victims, the Naqba and so on. It's only fair, right?
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The whole British Empire was about food. Britain had the worst traditional cuisine you could imagine. The serfs were so far down the heirarchy they had to make do with the bits even the most minor nobles didn't want and a few vegetables that hadn't turned completely to grey mush yet, all stewed together until safely dead. We fought the French for a hundred years and kept kidnapping their patissieres, and from that we got ideas. We fought the Spanish and found out they had their own food, too, and it was also better than ours. Then we went further afield and found India, and you know how Brits like curries. Well, we liked 'em then, too, and set out to conquer every source of awesome food on Earth and bring back all their styles. It went pretty damn well until the other European nations twigged and started fighting us over it. Eventually, wars would bring the whole thing crashing down around us, of course, but by then we'd have worldwide cuisine and fusions thereof and that'd be Mission Accomplished. The reason we didn't try very hard to hang onto North America was ... well, have you tried the natives' traditional food? Shepherd's Pie is less bland.Evil Alpaca said:
There were lots of bias in the way we were taught history. Most of which were removed in high school.
There are a few- One, That Adolf Hitler was 1) a German 2) Completely insane 3) The most evil man on earth ever 4) completely ruined Germany forever. All of those i now see as face (Although he comes close in #2 and nearly #3)
And two; That Stalin was 1) Communist 2) Unaminously hated by the russian people 3) Completely ruined the entirety of russia forever 4) Not as evil as Hitler and 5) That Stalin was his real name.
(#1 is really a technicality- he wasnt Communist, he was Stalininst. Which isnt Socialist either, #2 He was liked by a large group of Russians- Although this was also a result of Propaganda. Beside this, they liked Stanlin better than they did Tsar Nicholas the 2nd. #3 If anything, Stalin saved russia. If Stalin hadnt done what he had, Germany would have certainly annihalated Russia in 1941, and from that, won the war. 4# in my opinion, Stalin was worse. Adolf Hitler had a reason to Massacre the Jewish people- even if it was a incredibly weak reason- But Stalin had very little reason. But this is down to personal preference. #5 Stalin was his revolutionary name.)
There are a few- One, That Adolf Hitler was 1) a German 2) Completely insane 3) The most evil man on earth ever 4) completely ruined Germany forever. All of those i now see as face (Although he comes close in #2 and nearly #3)
And two; That Stalin was 1) Communist 2) Unaminously hated by the russian people 3) Completely ruined the entirety of russia forever 4) Not as evil as Hitler and 5) That Stalin was his real name.
(#1 is really a technicality- he wasnt Communist, he was Stalininst. Which isnt Socialist either, #2 He was liked by a large group of Russians- Although this was also a result of Propaganda. Beside this, they liked Stanlin better than they did Tsar Nicholas the 2nd. #3 If anything, Stalin saved russia. If Stalin hadnt done what he had, Germany would have certainly annihalated Russia in 1941, and from that, won the war. 4# in my opinion, Stalin was worse. Adolf Hitler had a reason to Massacre the Jewish people- even if it was a incredibly weak reason- But Stalin had very little reason. But this is down to personal preference. #5 Stalin was his revolutionary name.)
luckily for me i had two amazing history teachers in high school (they taught me all 4 years, different history types) one was welsh and the other was quite possibly my favorite teacher i've ever had, as he taught every side of everything that he could (he'd bring in old veterans from BOTH sides of wars and historians to help illustrate key points.)
and for the welsh teacher we had daily essays to do and weekly papers to turn in over each part of history we were studying, so by the end i ended up typing 139 pages of "study guides" and 145 essays for that class...it was hell of alot of work but it definitely made me get my ass in gear and i can type papers like a boss now when needed.
if i was to ever "learn" a lie that was later debunked, it was probably that saudi arabia is just a desert with not much money or people in it...-_- (7th grade teacher)
and for the welsh teacher we had daily essays to do and weekly papers to turn in over each part of history we were studying, so by the end i ended up typing 139 pages of "study guides" and 145 essays for that class...it was hell of alot of work but it definitely made me get my ass in gear and i can type papers like a boss now when needed.
if i was to ever "learn" a lie that was later debunked, it was probably that saudi arabia is just a desert with not much money or people in it...-_- (7th grade teacher)
I shall ignore most of your post. That's just too much to get into right now. Let's just concentrate on the following: It can be argued that Hitler was German. Yes, I know he was born in Austria. Yes, I know he aquired 'German' citizenship later in his life. How can he be German, then?Jimmybobjr said:
Simple. Back then Austria was considered to be German. In the same manner as Bavaria, the Rhineland or Prussia were considered to be German. Granted they weren't in the political entity that was the German Empire/ Weimar Republic, but they didn't have a distinct cultural identity. This identity developed mostly after WWII.
GZGoten said:
still what benefit does US get from it? do they give us $ or soldiers or anything worth the while? or are they more of a liability. Don't get me wrong I appreciate The Mars Volta and Coheed & Cambria as much as the next guy but I just don't see the benefit for us as a country, and in that matter although to a lesser extent Hawaii too
As I understand it, we burned it during the war of 1812, after reconstruction there was still a lot of fire damage, so it was painted white.
I also think (think!) that the term White House didn't come into common use until the late 1800s/early 1900s...
I have no inclination to confirm either fact with my own research as, ultimately, they're both meaningless bits of trivia. However I do know a fair old bit about the war of 1812, given I wrote my dissertation on it at Uni.
(Main Conclusion: It was a colossal waste of everyone's time and effort).
do you mean about the americas? yes we do. we had to memorize many of the tribes that inhabited the lands before hand (i used to know that damn map that had a rough sketch of who "claimed" what land tribe to tribe)Summy said:
and if you meant it in the literal sense of learning about stuff outside of america, yes we do, we have entire classes dedicated to it.
i know, all they ever talked about really was the trail of tears. in the fourth grade i had to do a biography, so i chose sitting bull cuz it sounded sweet.... i've been depressed since. we screwed them so totally and enthusiastically... it was like a guy coming up to you, raping you, forces you to move out of state 6 times, then gives you small pox and kills you.aashell13 said:
I hope that this is relevant. In the early 2000's I was reading a small report a newspaper that said the Americans had just compensated us (the brits) for the tea lost in the Boston tea party. I think it was around 13 thousand (or million, it was a long time ago when I'd seen it) that was payed back. Two things where on my mind at the time. First was why? And the second was if the schools in america would teach the kids about this?
Czechoslovakia may disagree with you on the Poland point, and it wasn't really a democratic election that got Hitler into power. President Hindenburg got coaxed into letting the man into the position of Chancellor, thinking he could be easily controlled. And really, what could have possibly gone wrong?Knife said:
Personally, I've had a couple of History teachers over the years, and while one of them was a bit lax with the learning, I learnt a huge amount in Years 11 and 12 about WW2, essentially covering 50 years of German History (at this point I should mention I'm Australian). We covered the Eastern front in a large amount of detail, covering everything from the siege of Stalingrad to the fall of Berlin. Overall, I'd say history was one of my better subjects.
Now English, on the other hand was excruciating. My teacher was a ditz who made me ruin Blade Runner for myself by making me dissect it thoroughly, understanding none of what I was saying, and gaining nothing from the experience.
I think it was mentioned in another post, but to state again, the video posted was from a Saturday morning cartoon from the 70s and 80s it's not from the govt or a school system. Even that said, though it's a bit off in how it describes it, but when you are teaching elementry students, you aren't getting all the details. They want kids to remember the names Mayflower, Kind George, Tea Party etc.Glass Joe the Champ said:
As for lies, I think History in most general education classes has a limited amount of time to discuss items, so it will be limited. You could spend a year talking about WWII and all the nuances around it. I believe history in school, was there to spark further interest. it did to me, so if I see something high level, I usually dug deeper. But I think some things such as Columbus, the revolution, civil war, were generalized. And many items were one-sided, the American view of things (I am from the US), but that seems typical of any country. So they probably avoid some of our uglier things.
What I find interesting is the shift of teaching history. Probably through the 50's and 60's in the US, things were very US centric about our positives and avoiding our negatives. Then in the 70s you had more of a liberal movement and everything became anti-US, then in the 80s it shift again and now I think it is getting back to more liberal. There should be a happy middle ground, every country has it's bad and good and it should be there for all to see. But in no way is all the detail going to be provided in 30 hours.
I remember that video. Frankly when I was little that's how what I thought the British were like back then. Thankfully my later history classes cleared things up for me. Now I think that video is clearly biased towards America's favor.
As for lies told in my history class, I don't exactly remember any of them lying to me. But I do remember learning about the various theories on who found America first in my history class in college. Such as the Scandinavians or the Bering Strait.
As for lies told in my history class, I don't exactly remember any of them lying to me. But I do remember learning about the various theories on who found America first in my history class in college. Such as the Scandinavians or the Bering Strait.