Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII Review

Sheo_Dagana

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KazeAizen said:
james.sponge said:
KazeAizen said:
james.sponge said:
KazeAizen said:
Trishbot said:
Sounds like Bravely Default is going to be the best Final Fantasy game this year.
Is there some arbitrary standard for Final Fantasy games that I am not aware of?
Yes, and the standard died with FFX-2.
Please show me this arbitrary and convoluted standard for Final Fantasy games. I'd really like to see a solid graph or chart that has a list of them with a base line for what qualifies and what doesn't. You show me that.
It's actually quite simple FF1-6 + FFT and FF9 qualify and the rest of them are below the standard ;)
What no 7? See though this proves my point. No real standard for what does and doesn't qualify. Ergo people need to give a rest already. Hell XIII-2 got so much hate and bile spewed at it and it didn't even deserve it.
You mean the game with the pointless story that only had two playable characters? No, XIII-2 deserved all of the negative criticism it received. But what do I know? The last Final Fantasy game I enjoyed was X, since no one counts XI or XIV.

OT: I'm kind of surprised to see this game get such a high score. I mean, everything I saw for it has looked pretty bad. Not to say that my opinion should be the standard opinion, just surprised nonetheless. I wouldn't mind giving it a go sometime but the limited play time discourages me. I abhor time limits. I think they're a cheap way to convince people your game has replay value.
 

Tradjus

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No big surprises here. I'm honestly starting too wonder if Square would even still exist as a company right now if not for the newfound success of FF14. They just seem so utterly averse too making good choices.
 

Mangod

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I'll wait for a Let's Play, or at least a video review showing the game in motion before I'll pass my judgement on it. Some things cannot be described to you; they have to be seen with your own eyes.

I'll be honest though, the review didn't hype my up for the game in any way, and given how bad I found XIII, I don't have very high expectations...
 

daibakuha

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From what I understand, the Japanese didn't even like this game that much. X HD collection was outselling it in Japan.
 

Roofstone

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Arkhangelsk said:
Anyone playing an old and then a new FF game will immediately notice the massive differences (apart from graphics quality).
I did, however. I played XII as my first final fantasy several years ago. And I honestly like anything post X better than anything pre X. Except thirteen I suppose, story is just.. Ugh.

OT: I miiight buy this, I'll look at some gameplay videos first, and I'd need to watch a thirteen 2 playthrough first, or read a plot synopsis.
 

Another

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Despite having played and beaten every final fantasy game (sans XI and XIV), I won't be picking this up for one reason. The timer.

Having a timer completely drains the fun out of a game for me no matter how good it is. Being timed just stresses me out for some weird reason, even if its easy to manage. Haven't completed any of the Dead Rising games or Majora's Mask for the same reason, absolutely can't stand it. Sad part is that I do want to see how the story ends, but not if I'm gonna hate playing against the clock the whole time :(
 

PunkRex

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Okay Square, now you've finished your little... whatever the hell 13 was, can we maybe get an FF game with abit of whimsy, you know, castles and pantaloons, deep dark forests filled with strange creatures, get away from this hot topic/leather fetish you seem to have had since 8 and 10. If only there was some sort of really, really good game that came out between those ones to demonstrate what I mean't!

As for the reveiw, it was very informative but you didn't really talk about the aesthetics in any depth, which is my favourite thing to talk/hear about. Although, given i've seen the last two games I can guess what it sounds/looks like, and I don't mean the graphics.
 

Leonbelmont64

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Another said:
Despite having played and beaten every final fantasy game (sans XI and XIV), I won't be picking this up for one reason. The timer.

Having a timer completely drains the fun out of a game for me no matter how good it is. Being timed just stresses me out for some weird reason, even if its easy to manage. Haven't completed any of the Dead Rising games or Majora's Mask for the same reason, absolutely can't stand it. Sad part is that I do want to see how the story ends, but not if I'm gonna hate playing against the clock the whole time :(
Honestly majoras mask the timer wasn't a real timer as every time you played the song of time you reset it. It was only used for the day to day lives and events that transpired at certain times that made the game feel more alive. You kept all equipment regardless so the timer was more of something in some people's heads and I never noticed it. So it's still worth trying.

As for the hate for all post X ffs I don't understand it all my rl friends that have played them all seem to think X and xii were good ffxii had the most strategic combat system I've seen in the series and was hoping it would stick. I've played all ff games and a lot of the old ones have not aged well at all, the only ones I can go back and play are ff9 and ff4 outside of the ps2 era ones if I go back and try and play them.
 

Another

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Leonbelmont64 said:
Another said:
Despite having played and beaten every final fantasy game (sans XI and XIV), I won't be picking this up for one reason. The timer.

Having a timer completely drains the fun out of a game for me no matter how good it is. Being timed just stresses me out for some weird reason, even if its easy to manage. Haven't completed any of the Dead Rising games or Majora's Mask for the same reason, absolutely can't stand it. Sad part is that I do want to see how the story ends, but not if I'm gonna hate playing against the clock the whole time :(
Honestly majoras mask the timer wasn't a real timer as every time you played the song of time you reset it. It was only used for the day to day lives and events that transpired at certain times that made the game feel more alive. You kept all equipment regardless so the timer was more of something in some people's heads and I never noticed it. So it's still worth trying.
I know, but for some reason I just can't do it. It's more that even being told that I'm on a time limit just bothers me. It's silly, but that's just how it is for me :/
 

An Ceannaire

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So, as somebody who has never played a FF game before, but downloaded the demo for Lightning Returns and enjoyed it, should I consider buying this game or would it be a waste of time?
 

An Ceannaire

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Tradjus said:
No big surprises here. I'm honestly starting too wonder if Square would even still exist as a company right now if not for the newfound success of FF14. They just seem so utterly averse too making good choices.
I thought FF14 did badly?
 

Trishbot

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KazeAizen said:
james.sponge said:
KazeAizen said:
Trishbot said:
Sounds like Bravely Default is going to be the best Final Fantasy game this year.
Is there some arbitrary standard for Final Fantasy games that I am not aware of?
Yes, and the standard died with FFX-2.
Please show me this arbitrary and convoluted standard for Final Fantasy games. I'd really like to see a solid graph or chart that has a list of them with a base line for what qualifies and what doesn't. You show me that.
First off...


And, since you asked...
 

Slycne

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PunkRex said:
As for the reveiw, it was very informative but you didn't really talk about the aesthetics in any depth, which is my favourite thing to talk/hear about. Although, given i've seen the last two games I can guess what it sounds/looks like, and I don't mean the graphics.
If something is not great nor terrible we tend to avoid using space in a review for it.

In greater detail though I would say that the game has flashes of typical Square-Enix brilliance marred by a lot mediocrity - perhaps a statement that extend to the whole game. A good deal of the design work is excellent, like Lightning's garb and the occasional bit of architecture or location. But in greater proportion there is a bunch of laziness as well. Many of the NPCs, even those with speaking roles and scenes, appear as if someone simply hit random on a character creation and went with the first return. This is in turn coupled with the disparity between important models and textures and everything else as mentioned in the review. For instance, there was a quest concerning a cat early on that looked just awful. Outside of the visuals, the SFX didn't strike me either way, and similarly the music while in keeping with Square's generally high standard didn't particularly blow me away.
 

Bara_no_Hime

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KazeAizen said:
What no 7? See though this proves my point. No real standard for what does and doesn't qualify. Ergo people need to give a rest already. Hell XIII-2 got so much hate and bile spewed at it and it didn't even deserve it.
Oh, don't bother trying to argue with the haters. It just isn't worth your time and effort.

I love FF 7. And FF 5. And FF 10. And FF 13-2. FF 13-2 isn't anything like previous FF, but neither is FF 7 or FF 10. Sometimes good is just good - but a lot of people freak out if a game isn't exactly like its predecessors.

OT: Hell yeah! I can't wait to play FF 13-3! I just wish I had some extra cash at the moment so I could get it now.

I am a little sad about the lack of the FF 13-2 combat system - they did such a great job refining the one from FF 13 into something really fun - but I love the idea of quest-based leveling rather than battle based. It kinda reminds me of the "right" way to play FF 8 (the low-level run).

Being on a 13 hour timer is a bit intimidating, but perhaps they're trying to prevent perfectionists like me from getting 100% completion and the good ending the first time out?

Oh... I also wanted to say, KazeAizen... love the avatar. ^_~

Trishbot said:
Bravely Default does sound pretty neat. Too bad it's a 3DS game. If they port it to a system that I own, I'll give it a look.
 

PunkRex

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Slycne said:
PunkRex said:
As for the reveiw, it was very informative but you didn't really talk about the aesthetics in any depth, which is my favourite thing to talk/hear about. Although, given i've seen the last two games I can guess what it sounds/looks like, and I don't mean the graphics.
If something is not great nor terrible we tend to avoid using space in a review for it.

In greater detail though I would say that the game has flashes of typical Square-Enix brilliance marred by a lot mediocrity - perhaps a statement that extend to the whole game. A good deal of the design work is excellent, like Lightning's garb and the occasional bit of architecture or location. But in greater proportion there is a bunch of laziness as well. Many of the NPCs, even those with speaking roles and scenes, appear as if someone simply hit random on a character creation and went with the first return. This is in turn coupled with the disparity between important models and textures and everything else as mentioned in the review. For instance, there was a quest concerning a cat early on that looked just awful. Outside of the visuals, the SFX didn't strike me either way, and similarly the music while in keeping with Square's generally high standard didn't particularly blow me away.
I guessed as much.

I don't blame Square for going down this route, just like I don't blame those who enjoy this futuristic, too cool to smile FF, I just don't get why they like it. Sazh and Fang seemed generally likable, as did Lighning and Vanille... sort of, but all the wonder I remember from playing 9 and, to a lesser extent, 7 seems long gone.

Oh well, I hear Bravery Default is mean't to be quite good.
 

Slycne

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Feb 19, 2006
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PunkRex said:
Oh well, I hear Bravery Default is mean't to be quite good.
Yeah, I quite liked Bravely Default - http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/editorials/reviews/10987-Bravely-Default-Review-Damn-Fine-RPG
 

Infernai

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Trishbot said:
Sounds like Bravely Default is going to be the best Final Fantasy game this year.
On a similar note, thank GOD we're getting another Drakengard game. For those interested, here's a trailer:


Yeah, that trailer does seem a bit like your stereotypical JRPG in setup but there's one very VERY important difference this time around: That sister bringing about the worlds destruction? She's the one you're playing as. In other words: Congratulations, you're playing the main villain. This game is gonna be one helluva dark, deconstructive and disturbing little romp and I'm gonna love every motherloving second of it because of it.

Your party members are, in short order: A 14 year old sadist who just wants to see people suffer ("This is exactly the kind of insane world i always wanted!"), A perverted old man with some magical powers ("How Delightful!"), A gentlemanly masochist ("I must do this. It is my...reward."), and finally a compulsive liar swordsman ("I am just an idiot"), and finally your dragon who's still only a child in dragon terms.

After Final Fantasy 13's little clusterfuck compilation, I think some deconstruction from the guys who brought us Nier is probably just what the doctor ordered alongside something more traditional like Bravely Default. Which will probably at-least adhere to the normal storytelling method rather then mildly adhere to it as a guideline like 13 did.

I still don't know what drove them to try to sequalise Final Fantasy 13 to the extent that they did...from what i remember, nobody was really clamoring for a sequel to the first game (Even those that really enjoyed the first game) and there wasn't really anything THAT in need of expanding on or explaining from the game anyway what with all those datalogs that they were obsessed with using. I guess I just kind of see the other final fantasy 13's, and subsequently this one, as a waste of resources they could have used to instead make something good. 13-3 had an interesting gameplay idea and setup, but it's brought down by it's connection it's got to the novella crystalis trilogy.

Here's hoping final fantasy 15 does better, it's got alot of potential.
 

major_chaos

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Feb 3, 2011
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Trishbot said:
personal preference. jpg
the problem with these review threads is that im never sure if people like you are joking or if you seriously think you are the final word on quality. Also I disagree with almost everything in your picture, opinions are a thing you know and yours is not any more correct than mine.

OT: I really enjoy Kingdom Hearts style real time RPG combat so I think I'll like this game. Cant wait to play it when I get back from college in a few hours.
 

karma9308

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We clearly need Jim to review this to give us a complete BIAS FREE review!
(if you don't know what I'm talking about, click this: [link]http://www.destructoid.com/100-objective-review-final-fantasy-xiii-179178.phtml[/link])

I'm upset to hear that there's no way to turn back the timer and if you run out of time, you're just screwed. I was hoping it would just lift the mechanic from Majora's Mask completely. What makes MM so good, is that the timer gives a natural sense of pacing without the game having to force you to do anything. But if you screw up, or don't know what to do, you can just play the backwards song of time to give yourself nearly double the amount of time, or the song of time to just go back to 6am on day 1. The player could control the pacing, and I loved to try and limit myself to only resetting time 2 times to try and make the game feel truly tense.

While it's "realistic" to not allow the player to control the flow of time, it's final fantasy for fucks sake. Realism should probably take a backseat to gameplay.

I wasn't a fan of either of the other 13 games (except for watching LPs making fun of them), but I had some interest in this one. I'll wait until the price drops and maybe watch a LP or two before making a decision on this one.
 

Ipsen

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An Ceannaire said:
So, as somebody who has never played a FF game before, but downloaded the demo for Lightning Returns and enjoyed it, should I consider buying this game or would it be a waste of time?
Go for it, if you actually enjoyed it. Might feel better if a price drop is waited for, but I say that if you have the means, and you enjoy the play and story, than price (<$60) be damned.

Uh, just try not to consider any previous (or probably any future) entries by standard of XIII-3. Or XIII series at that.