Lol Friend-zone

[barbzilla]

There is a valid position where friendzone is an applicable word, however that position only occurs rarely. Usually it is just a bunch of people whining about not being assertive enough to obtain their dream girl, but there are genuine occasions where you place your desires and intentions on your sleeves and women want to designate you to friends. This is where she will let you take her out and do stuff, but she strings you along as though you think you are progressing a relationship, meanwhile she is trying to find a friend that will validate her existence. While it doesn't happen often, it does happen. This is how I see the friendzone.

 

[Irridium]

This comic [http://aggregatoredicazzate.com/post/39128117570/the-friend-zoner-vs-nice-guy-mamamantis] is pretty much how I feel about this whole "friend zone" topic.

EDIT: I'm on the side of the women, by the way, not on the side of the type of guys the comic portrays. Just to be clear.

 

[Professor Lupin Madblood]

I really wish the term friendzone didn't exist. It implies there's something inherently bad with having a non-sexual relationship with a member of your preferred gender.

Also good life advice in general is to stop obsessing about sex and relationships. Sex is important, I get it, but it's not the end of the world when someone doesn't want to have sex with you. Shrug it off and move on. In fact, it's highly advisable to have discernment when it comes to sex. Not being willing to fuck anything that moves is a highly desirable trait in a human being, particularly in men (women have been told how to behave in matters of sex for so long that we should seriously give them a break. If they want to fuck anything that moves, let them), so cutting the desperation is always a good move.

You. I like you. You're going places.

 

[Kyrinn]

Well... this made me laugh a bit.

Yep, friendzoning is not A Thing, and I'm tired of people who pretend it is.
And it makes me a little sad that so many guys can't value females as friends.

Still, people have been less whiny about it on here recently, so this is a little out of the blue, but it's funny.
http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2012/12/problem-nice-guys/
More on that there.

I always get confused when people claim the friendzone doesn't exist. Person A likes person B, and they are friends. Person B does not not like Person A in the same way but wishes to remain friends. Thus Person A can be considered to be in the friendzone. And this doesn't just happen to guys. I've friendzoned a couple of my best female friends.
I also don't like this assumption that just because one person would like to date their friend means that they are not a genuine friend. Nice guys get painted as passive-agressive assholes who only care about getting into a girls pants via friendship. Yea these cases exist, but from my experience they are the minority.

The problem is that people like to make excuses and blame the friendzone for their problems.
The old "We're too good friends and I don't want to ruin that", gives the guy the impression that he would have a chance if they had never been friends. When really she just doesn't like him in that way and doesn't want to hurt his feelings.
The "We've been friends forever, why isn't she throwing herself at me" mentality is a problem most guys get out of once someone gets brutally honest with them.

 

[Vegosiux]

When a girl says that you should "just be friends" or that they "cherish your friendship too much to risk it on a relationship" the chances are they are trying to politely tell you they don't find you attractive. It's not some magical zone you are stuck in forever, they are not saying there is some crazy reason for why you cannot be together. They are probably trying to spare your feelings by not stating that they do not see you as attractive in the sense that you hope.

See, the issue I take with that is basically the fact that such a "deliberately soft rejection" somehow implies she believes the guy is so insecure he needs to be coddled and "let down gently". In defense of the girls, I suppose that happens to be the case often, but I'm one of those "Why the hell can't we just communicate loud and clear?" people.

Guys: If you want to date a girl, why the hell don't you just, you know, ask her straight?
Girls: If you don't want to date a guy, why the hell do you have to beat around the bush with hollow courtesy phrases?

(Ye gods, the stereotypes)

Communication, people, communication. It's a wonderful thing when you don't avoid it.

I really wish the term friendzone didn't exist. It implies there's something inherently bad with having a non-sexual relationship with a member of your preferred gender.

Also good life advice in general is to stop obsessing about sex and relationships. Sex is important, I get it, but it's not the end of the world when someone doesn't want to have sex with you. Shrug it off and move on. In fact, it's highly advisable to have discernment when it comes to sex. Not being willing to fuck anything that moves is a highly desirable trait in a human being, particularly in men (women have been told how to behave in matters of sex for so long that we should seriously give them a break. If they want to fuck anything that moves, let them), so cutting the desperation is always a good move.

There is a valid position where friendzone is an applicable word, however that position only occurs rarely. Usually it is just a bunch of people whining about not being assertive enough to obtain their dream girl, but there are genuine occasions where you place your desires and intentions on your sleeves and women want to designate you to friends. This is where she will let you take her out and do stuff, but she strings you along as though you think you are progressing a relationship, meanwhile she is trying to find a friend that will validate her existence. While it doesn't happen often, it does happen. This is how I see the friendzone.

Also, these two folks have said pretty much all that needs to be said, so, that said, I shall take my coat and be off.

 

[Phasmal]

I always get confused when people claim the friendzone doesn't exist. Person A likes person B, and they are friends. Person B does not not like Person A in the same way but wishes to remain friends. Thus Person A can be considered to be in the friendzone. And this doesn't just happen to guys. I've friendzoned a couple of my best female friends.
I also don't like this assumption that just because one person would like to date their friend means that they are not a genuine friend. Nice guys get painted as passive-agressive assholes who only care about getting into a girls pants via friendship. Yea these cases exist, but from my experience they are the minority.

The problem is that people like to make excuses and blame the friendzone for their problems.
The old "We're too good friends and I don't want to ruin that", gives the guy the impression that he would have a chance if they had never been friends. When really she just doesn't like him in that way and doesn't want to hurt his feelings.
The "We've been friends forever, why isn't she throwing herself at me" mentality is a problem most guys get out of once someone gets brutally honest with them.

Let me try and de-confuse you.
Person A likes person B, person B does not return the feels, but they already have a nice friendship. They are friends. Romantic entanglement if attempted has been rejected.
It's called being rejected, or just being simply `friends`.

There is no magical `zone` you put people like that in.

 

[Patrick Buck]

In this image, Psy was kinda enough to act out the part of this thread.
Luke hiding, being me, seeing the thread, and KNOWING WHERE THIS IS GOING.

 

[SnakeCL]

I like how this post basically precludes any possibility of women being at fault in any circumstance.

Typical Misandrist bullshit.

There's no simple answer to anything like this, but pigeonholing people into gigantic groups isn't a good start.

 

[In Search of Username]

I always get confused when people claim the friendzone doesn't exist. Person A likes person B, and they are friends. Person B does not not like Person A in the same way but wishes to remain friends. Thus Person A can be considered to be in the friendzone. And this doesn't just happen to guys. I've friendzoned a couple of my best female friends.
I also don't like this assumption that just because one person would like to date their friend means that they are not a genuine friend. Nice guys get painted as passive-agressive assholes who only care about getting into a girls pants via friendship. Yea these cases exist, but from my experience they are the minority.

The problem is that people like to make excuses and blame the friendzone for their problems.
The old "We're too good friends and I don't want to ruin that", gives the guy the impression that he would have a chance if they had never been friends. When really she just doesn't like him in that way and doesn't want to hurt his feelings.
The "We've been friends forever, why isn't she throwing herself at me" mentality is a problem most guys get out of once someone gets brutally honest with them.

Let me try and de-confuse you.
Person A likes person B, person B does not return the feels, but they already have a nice friendship. They are friends. Romantic entanglement if attempted has been rejected.
It's called being rejected, or just being simply `friends`.

There is no magical `zone` you put people like that in.

Surely the zone is just supposed to describe a situation in which one person just wants to be friends and the other wants a relationship.

I genuinely don't understand when people say the friendzone is a misogynistic idea. Like, I hate misogyny, but when I see someone talking about being friendzoned I do not see someone who hates women, I see someone who is sad to have been rejected, and I feel sorry for them. Someone explain this to me better than that dickish article at the top did?

 

[Phasmal]

Surely the zone is just supposed to describe a situation in which one person just wants to be friends and the other wants a relationship.

I genuinely don't understand when people say the friendzone is a misogynistic idea. Like, I hate misogyny, but when I see someone talking about being friendzoned I do not see someone who hates women, I see someone who is sad to have been rejected, and I feel sorry for them. Someone explain this to me better than that dickish article at the top did?

Yeah, but that's not how it's phrased, is it.
Ok, for simplicity, we will go with person A being the one who wants a relationship and person B being the one who doesn't.

It's phrased as `Person B put me in the friend-zone!`.
But they didn't.
Person B has being going on their merry way assuming they were friends, and found out that the friendship was a way for person A to try and get invited to person B's pants-party.
When person B responds that they do not want a sexual relationship with A, they are not putting them anywhere. They are rejecting them.

It's like if you and I were having chocolate and you also wanted to split a portion of grapes.
You say `do you want some grapes?`
and I'm all `no`.
I haven't put you in the chocolate-zone.
I have just denied an advancement on the snacktimes.
I dont like grapes.

 

[barbzilla]

snip

Pretty much this. Communication could solve many of our worldly woes. But instead we are vague and un-trusting of each other. This leads to miss-communication and problems. Is there an easy answer, I wish. The only thing I can say is, man up and speak your mind if you think you are stuck in the friends zone.

 

[chadachada123]

In response I give you a reply to that original post because i'm too lazy to think of one and I bet this is equally as valid.

I really want to like these ?anti friend-zone? posts. I really do.
A lot of them start out with ?hey, girls are people and you should treat them like people? and say a lot of really great things about not reducing an entire gender to STRANGE GIRL BEINGS
...and then they proceed to go on and reduce all guys to being penis-creatures that only care about sex. Like... I know there are guys out there like that, but it's always kind of seemed to me like the self-labelled Nice Guy types are more looking for emotional validation, or just to have someone out their find them desirable, which... is not at all a healthy reason to want a relationship, but still. People are complex, and as this post has discussed, should not be reduced to sex objects or objects-of-sexing.

BUT OTHER THAN THAT THIS POST ACTUALLY HAS SOME GOOD ADVICE.

also, guys, if you have no interest whatsoever in being friends with a girl and you just want sex, then don't try to be her friend. just flirt and if she doesn't respond or appear interested, then POLILTELY MOVE ON AND FIND SOMEONE ELSE. Don't spend all your time trying to turn a friend you don't even want to be friends with in the first place into a girlfriend.

and if you DO have a friend that you genuinely care about but also happen to have unrequited feelings for, just be honest with her, and respectful of her feelings and desires. If the feelings are making it impossible for you to be a good friend without constantly feeling bitterness or anger, it might be for the better of both of you if you just take a break from the friendship for a while until you can be actual friends again.

tl;dr: guys are complex and girls are complex so how about we just listen to and respect each other and not reduce each other to sexual stereotypes or sex objects okay? also FRIENDS ARE GOOD THINGS MMKAY?

source

I agree with most of this post, and the last bit especially: If I end up being relatively close friends with a girl, and after pronouncing my love for her, she starts doing the avoiding bitchy thing, then I just stop talking to her. No pain, no worry, everyone is happier, nothing is awkward. I only do it in response to her own actions, where if she makes it clear that she doesn't want to be close friends by being a bad friend, I just drop her as a friend. I have numerous girl friends, some exes, some just ex-fuck buddies, others just regular friends, where we continued being normal friends even after one of us openly liked the other without reciprocation.

But, definitely, if you don't feel comfortable talking to this girl who doesn't love you back, just stop talking to her. If she asks, just say that you don't really feel comfortable being friends at the time given your feelings, that it isn't her, it's you. You don't have very active control over whether or not you enjoy hanging out with someone, and shouldn't be expected to continue doing so if the net happiness is lower than if you both parted ways for the time being. And if she responds with bitchiness, then more power to you, since you'll likely be more inclined to stick with ignoring her.

Don't forget, though, that there are numerous instances where the boy/girl in question WON'T be super close friends before she officially puts him in the friendzone. She'll respond with actual flirting and then pull back as soon as the question comes out, essentially using the other guy. Additionally, as I mentioned above, there are girls who will, as soon as they realize that the guy likes them, just start avoiding them, not because the guy is awkward, but because the girl is being childish. These instances might be rare, but they DO exist, and I've seen them firsthand. These justified cases shouldn't be ignored just because most of them are actually pretty pathetic.

 

[SnakeCL]

I genuinely don't understand when people say the friendzone is a misogynistic idea. Like, I hate misogyny, but when I see someone talking about being friendzoned I do not see someone who hates women, I see someone who is sad to have been rejected, and I feel sorry for them. Someone explain this to me better than that dickish article at the top did?

To put it simply, friendzoning is a situation when one person is attracted to another, and said other person is not attracted to the first person. It has nothing to do with gender.

There's been this oversimplification used in a lot of feminist circles that the only reason this happens is because men are naturally up to no good, and somehow all view women as vending machines that you put kindness into and get sex from. Thing is, such an oversimplification is wrong. It precludes the idea that someone could genuinely be using another "in the friend zone" because that person is a jerk, regardless of gender. Or that the person friendzoned could, ya know, genuinely be attracted or heck, in love, with the other person.

If you're close to someone for years, and realize that "wow, I actually really like this person" well tough crap. Apparently you're only interested in getting in their pants. And only if you're a guy.

Or you have the occasions where its a one-sided friendship. Where one individual uses the other as a way to vent about things, and then resume in self destructive behavior.

All of these examples happen, but the only one that anyone seems to give any credence to is the "all men suck" one.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Friend zone is usually used by people who want to date someone who isn't attracted to them but they still like them as a friend. That's a hard situation to be in because you feel like you are now somehow beneath them and it's difficult to be friends with someone when you have that bitterness in the back of your mind. It hurts a lot.

I kind of have no problem with people using the term if joking about it makes the hurt easier :/

Spoiler: This one always makes me chuckle

 

[The Artificially Prolonged]

I'm sorry you lost me around the point of smurf dicks and PCP. What in the all merciful crap was all that about?

 

[In Search of Username]

Surely the zone is just supposed to describe a situation in which one person just wants to be friends and the other wants a relationship.

I genuinely don't understand when people say the friendzone is a misogynistic idea. Like, I hate misogyny, but when I see someone talking about being friendzoned I do not see someone who hates women, I see someone who is sad to have been rejected, and I feel sorry for them. Someone explain this to me better than that dickish article at the top did?

Yeah, but that's not how it's phrased, is it.
Ok, for simplicity, we will go with person A being the one who wants a relationship and person B being the one who doesn't.

It's phrased as `Person B put me in the friend-zone!`.
But they didn't.
Person B has being going on their merry way assuming they were friends, and found out that the friendship was a way for person A to try and get invited to person B's pants-party.
When person B responds that they do not want a sexual relationship with A, they are not putting them anywhere. They are rejecting them.

It's like if you and I were having chocolate and you also wanted to split a portion of grapes.
You say `do you want some grapes?`
and I'm all `no`.
I haven't put you in the chocolate-zone.
I have just denied an advancement on the snacktimes.
I dont like grapes.

So it's a problem because it implies that person B is doing this deliberately and maliciously?

Thing is, I still don't see how that's misogynistic, person A is just understandably annoyed at this girl, and while it's not her fault either, she can't help if she doesn't like him in that way, I don't think you can really read hatred of women into some guy who just got rejected's anger at the girl he likes.

If it's the whole 'all women are evil and will only go out with douchebags!' mentality that makes people label the friendzone as a misogynist thing then yeah I understand that's stupid but there's no logic to thinking everyone who uses the term friendzone thinks that. And tbh I can understand partially where they're coming from anyway; confidence is generally more likely to get you a girlfriend than just being nice in itself, which is generally why the 'douchebags' (as well as some genuinely nice confident guys, of course) tend to end up getting all the girls.

I'll stop rambling now.

 

[RandV80]

Well... this made me laugh a bit.

Yep, friendzoning is not A Thing, and I'm tired of people who pretend it is.
And it makes me a little sad that so many guys can't value females as friends.

Still, people have been less whiny about it on here recently, so this is a little out of the blue, but it's funny.
http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2012/12/problem-nice-guys/
More on that there.

That was posted on here wasn't it? I think I recall reading it, though i didn't comment at the time. Seemed like a real bitchy argument to me... I'm sure the whole 'friend zone' thing can go down in a number of different ways, yet this article frames the male side in the worst possible way building a strawman that absolves the female side from any responsibility or guilt.

To make a counter point example of a more innocent form of friend zoning where neither side is really 'bad', the TV show Stargate Universe has a classic example. Take a socially awkward young adult male on one side and an attractive young adult female on the other. Normally the two would never cross paths let alone interact, but through circumstances they find themselves working together. This could be a college assignment, office workplace, trapped on an ancient spaceship billions of light years from earth, or whatever. The natural occurrence is for the attractive female to come to appreciate the awkward male for his support and friendship but doesn't harbour any romantic feelings. The awkward male having a complete lack of women in his life will obviously start crushing on the one he's with now simply because he actually gets to spend time with her, but lacks the experience and knowledge in how to take it any further. Also being the only female interaction he really has he likely becomes terrified of messing things up and losing it. For a normal guy you take a swing and if you miss there's always someone else out there, but for socially awkward guy while it may not be correct to him it may seem like this could be his only chance. Overall the fault is more on the awkward male side here but you can't really blame him because you don't know the circumstances that lead to him being socially awkward. Perhaps he didn't quite fit in through public school, which lead to a lot of bullying and an overall stunting of his social development. Either way though using the example of Eli and Chloe neither of them are deserving of any sort of character attack or shaming.

Back to the topic at hand though... what I'm wondering though is this whole 'friend zone' or anti 'nice guy' bit seems to get played out a lot on the internet these days, but just how common of an occurrence is this anyways? I mean people make all these stereotypes but personally I've never known anyone that really fits the description. Almost seems to me like people are arguing and getting angry over a whole bunch of strawmen.

It seems like guys started it by complaining against women being pro-douche bag (of the stereotypical variety), and women plus the guys others are labeling as douche bags have started pushing back by attacking this 'nice-guy' archetype. It all seems pretty damn silly to me.

 

[Phasmal]

So it's a problem because it implies that person B is doing this deliberately and maliciously?

Thing is, I still don't see how that's misogynistic, person A is just understandably annoyed at this girl, and while it's not her fault either, she can't help if she doesn't like him in that way, I don't think you can really read hatred of women into some guy who just got rejected's anger at the girl he likes.

If it's the whole 'all women are evil and will only go out with douchebags!' mentality that makes people label the friendzone as a misogynist thing then yeah I understand that's stupid but there's no logic to thinking everyone who uses the term friendzone thinks that. And tbh I can understand partially where they're coming from anyway; confidence is generally more likely to get you a girlfriend than just being nice in itself, which is generally why the 'douchebags' (as well as some genuinely nice confident guys, of course) tend to end up getting all the girls.

I'll stop rambling now.

Yeah, that's why it pisses me off. It implies it's something the person who doesn't feel the same has done to the person who has the feelings.

I didn't say it was misogynistic. Can't help you there.
Bitter guys who have been friendzoned often can be, but that's just because they are sad about being rejected.

 

[In Search of Username]

So it's a problem because it implies that person B is doing this deliberately and maliciously?

Thing is, I still don't see how that's misogynistic, person A is just understandably annoyed at this girl, and while it's not her fault either, she can't help if she doesn't like him in that way, I don't think you can really read hatred of women into some guy who just got rejected's anger at the girl he likes.

If it's the whole 'all women are evil and will only go out with douchebags!' mentality that makes people label the friendzone as a misogynist thing then yeah I understand that's stupid but there's no logic to thinking everyone who uses the term friendzone thinks that. And tbh I can understand partially where they're coming from anyway; confidence is generally more likely to get you a girlfriend than just being nice in itself, which is generally why the 'douchebags' (as well as some genuinely nice confident guys, of course) tend to end up getting all the girls.

I'll stop rambling now.

Yeah, that's why it pisses me off. It implies it's something the person who doesn't feel the same has done to the person who has the feelings.

I didn't say it was misogynistic. Can't help you there.
Bitter guys who have been friendzoned often can be, but that's just because they are sad about being rejected.

Ah fair enough, I was talking to the thread in general more than you specifically.

 

[Daveman]

Well that was a rollercoaster of a reading experience. Amazing.

Anyway, upon getting more female friends now I'm almost out of university I have gradually grown out of this notion. You being friends with a girl isn't going to reduce your odds of getting off with her, if anything you're more likely to have a chance. No guarantees though...

I suppose it's also because I really only want a proper relationship I can only see myself going out with a friend which is why in the past I've only fancied girls that were my friends and hence why the idea of the friendzone developed. The idea of going straight from not knowing somebody to dating seems retarded to me if you want to find love, I mean no wonder people will get in shitloads of relationships then, better to make friends first and then decide if you're attracted to them.

Maybe it helps that I'm naturally flirtatious with all my friends and our banter can be construed as negging. LOL.