Mafia 2 - what a frustrating game!

[MiracleOfSound]

EDIT:
Please. Read the OP in full before posting. It may prevent flame wars.

What I'm basically asking is, do people think the game would have been more fun to play if you could have been a little more carefree with your driving and it had tighter shooting mechanics?

I haven't been hearing much from the Escapists about this game and I wanted to see if anyone else was having the same experiences as me.

Not since San Andreas has a game had me swearing, spitting insults at the TV and wanting to punch holes in the wall the way Mafia 2 does... I ended up just laughing at myself because I got so mad. Haven't had that happen in a while!

The check-pointing system in this game is absolutely horrendous - most missions involve driving on long trips in badly controlling cars from one side of the huge map to the other, with no checkpoints.

The problem with this is how easy it is for your trip to be interrupted by the police or other annoyances.

Whoever sat down and thought it would be a good idea to include a mechanic where bumping into other cars in the street would make the cops start chasing you needs to be fed to the fishes.

Not to mention the fact that if some retarded AI driver comes flying into the side of your car through no fault of your own, it's you the cops decide to annihilate.

Or the fact that Vito can be one hit killed by a random gunshot from an enemy that you're clearly locked in cover against.

Or that a certain bossfight includes a character who can get ultra-cheap kills on you through cover using molotovs in a small room with no escape, sending you back to the beginning of an extremely long multiple-stage firefight.

Or that the sadistically placed girders on the walls along certain roads will one hit kill you if you so much as graze them when travelling at a high speed.

Or that the cop AI is inconsistent, broken and unpredictable and will keep chasing you even after you change your clothes and repaint your car.

Goddamn it! Just leave me alone!

Or that you will sometimes get cast out of a cutscene and immediately into a barrage of enemy fire, with just enough time to realise what's happened before you're gunned down in a split second. This happens three or four times, and on one of the times you have no weapons to defend yourself and no cover to hide behind.

Or that when you do die, you have to begin the entire fucking chapter again from the beginning with no checkpoint, which means sitting through unskippable in game cut-scenes, phonecalls and conversations again and again... this was especially maddening near the end when I had just spent half an hour grinding up enough cash to pay off a debt in order to finish a mission, got hit by a speeding AI, had the police come after me, kill me and have to repeat the entire previous half hour all over.

I don't accept 'realistic' as an excuse for these issues either. Screw realism, it isn't fun.

It's a pity, because there is so much to love in the game too... the setting, story and visuals are all top notch and my first few hours in the game were magical, wondering around the amazingly rendered New York.

Did anyone else find the game a bit on the annoying side due to these issues? Or was it just fine for you?

 

[MiracleOfSound]

all i hear is is crying and balling over insignificant things. the heavy would like a word with you.

it ADDS to the fun. clearly you want a low-brow shooter so why not buy halo instead?

I wouldn't call game-breaking flaws insignificant.

How exactly is repeating a half hour section of gameplay (involving repeatedly driving cars into a grinder) more fun? Have you even played the game?

 

[CCountZero]

Gotta agree on the story being a bit predictable, yes.

Good news is that all the combat you were lacking is present in Jimmy's Vendetta, which reminds me a lot more of the original Mafia in that sense.

I can't help but feel like somebody went and thought: "Hey. Why not put all the combat stuff, which people will eventually want once they finish the storyline, in a seperate DLC! Then we can have our wicked way with the actual game and get an extra buck in the process! Yey!"

But that aside, I still bought the damn thing, and I don't regret one second of it; so who am I to complain?



And for the OP:

I strongly suggest you research your games before you buy them.
Half the issues you point out were present in the original as well, and the other half is part of the gameplay, and 'thus not an actual problem.

Next time you want to buy a game, stick with GTA. It sounds more like that's what you're after.
(Disclaimer: Read it again. I never said anything negative about GTA. Now go away please.)

 

[MiracleOfSound]

[

yes and i beat it. the cops having intelligence makes it more fun. granted i don't get chased because I KNOW HOW TO DRIVE. seriously unless your reflexes are so piss poor you slam into every object on a ROAD they don't bother you.

So... basically you're using the old 'you suck at the game' argument.

And making your other point with a video meme.

Not really much point continuing this exchange as we won't see eye to eye.

 

[Mr. Grey]

Did you ever turn on the limiter to avoid the cops with speeding? Did you change the license plate to prevent the cops from tracking you when you changed outfits? Painting the car itself won't do much if they have your license plate. Won't do shit when they see you in said illegal car.

Or did they never catch your license plate and that's bringing up the frustration?

Also, turning on the limiter helps with handling the car. That's what I do when I come speeding along and have to make a turn, I immediately turn on the limiter when I'm coming to said turn. I do agree with the auto-saving and that I wish I could just save when I want, it's nice and all, but it's a pain when something like what you described happens.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

G

And for the OP:

I strongly suggest you research your games before you buy them.
Half the issues you point out were present in the original as well, and the other half is part of the gameplay, and 'thus not an actual problem.

Next time you want to buy a game, stick with GTA. It sounds more like that's what you're after.
(Disclaimer: Read it again. I never said anything negative about GTA. Now go away please.)

I actually played the demo and enjoyed it, that's what informed my purchase. I don't regret it either.

As I said in the OP, there's a lot in the game to love and that works really well. That, in a way, is what makes the frustrating parts seem worse.

As for the GTA comment... maybe read the second line of the OP again.

 

[hazabaza1]

Huh, I found it to be fine. I just kept a steady pace on the road, paid my tickets if I got any, and I'm pretty sure that the checkpoints never put me behind any cutscene I had seen.
What platform were you on?
Also, in the fight against

Spoiler

Derek

you were talking about, it's simple once you figure out the strategy.

Spoiler: Spoilered because the character would get spoiled due to the map layout

Run to the left and up the stairs, and go into his office and take cover in there, by the window. You'll take a beating going up, but he won't throw molotovs there, and the enemies will funnel into your view. Make sure to generally use the shotgun so you're never found without ammo!

 

[MiracleOfSound]

D
Also, turning on the limiter helps with handling the car. That's what I do when I come speeding along and have to make a turn, I immediately turn on the limiter when I'm coming to said turn. I do agree with the auto-saving and that I wish I could just save when I want, it's nice and all, but it's a pain when something like what you described happens.

Indeed, I do all these things.

The problem for me is that one has to do this stuff to get by... the game, in my view, would be more fun if you could be a little more carefree with your driving as you do so much of it.

 

[JourneyThroughHell]

Wait, wait, wait, there are no checkpoints?

I think there were ones in the demo.

There certainly were ones in the first game, or it would've been entirely unplayable.

no point in exchanging anything since you want all games to be halo and GTA. way to dumb down the medium so that NO game has any artistic meaning/realism/thought and limiting gaming to children.

I am sorry for getting involved in the discussion I didn't start, but where in the hell did this one come from?

Seriously, I played Mafia 1. It was frustrating. That doesn't mean all I like is Halo and GTA and hate everything realistic, does it?

Also, "limiting gaming to children"? Seriously?

 

[CCountZero]

There are checkpoints.
I don't know why the OP didn't get any.
It's mystifying.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

no point in exchanging anything since you want all games to be halo and GTA. way to dumb down the medium so that NO game has any artistic meaning/realism/thought and limiting gaming to children.

Read the OP again. Really. I mentioned GTA was just as frustrating. I also praised M2 for its thematic and atmospheric aspects.

It's almost comical how much you're missing the point here.

if gaming just pushed out halo and GTA it would fail the miller test and gaming would be banned. god forbid a game shows a cop AI that isn't retarded and TRIES to do its job, because that means the cops might pose a real threat *gasp*.

I don't mind the cops being a real threat... except when 90% of the gameplay is driving around trying to be careful of them. It's slow, repetitive and boring to me. My point was that the game may have been more fun were it easier to get around, and I was asking if people agreed or not.

At which point you seem to have taken it upon yourself to embark on a heroic crusade to save gaming from Halo and GTA.

how the HELL do you die in a game with REGENERATING HEALTH with plenty of COVER? its damn near impossible unless you try to run headfirst into a tommy gun.

I really don't think you read the OP properly, did you?

If you could take a quick break from your hyperbolic vitriol for one moment and re-read the original post, you will probably see how one dies in a game with plenty of caps locked COVER.

 

[Mr. Grey]

D
Also, turning on the limiter helps with handling the car. That's what I do when I come speeding along and have to make a turn, I immediately turn on the limiter when I'm coming to said turn. I do agree with the auto-saving and that I wish I could just save when I want, it's nice and all, but it's a pain when something like what you described happens.

Indeed, I do all these things.

The problem for me is that one has to do this stuff to get by... the game, in my view, would be more fun if you could be a little more carefree with your driving as you do so much of it.

Huh, that's odd. I did all of that and didn't catch much trouble from the police. Until they slammed me into the car shop and had me caught that I had to shoot them all dead before getting in. Which was a further pain because then I had to drive all the way to that fancy clothing store to steal a new suit and shoot up the cashier so she doesn't cause trouble.

Anyways... sounds like you wanted a sandbox out of a narrative. Not that I disagree, I'd love the same engine made for a sandbox. It's just this is a narrative, very close to a movie. The realism in this game isn't too far fetched when you consider it. I think Mafia II wants you to take it seriously unlike Saints Row, that's the way I see it.

Think of it as Godfather versus Quentin Tarantino. Not that Quentin Tarantino is bad, it's just his stuff is over-the-top.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

Anyways... sounds like you wanted a sandbox out of a narrative. Not that I disagree, I'd love the same engine made for a sandbox. It's just this is a narrative, very close to a movie. The realism in this game isn't too far fetched when you consider it. I think Mafia II wants you to take it seriously unlike Saints Row, that's the way I see it.

Actually I loved the narrative in the game. To me it was the best part. In fact, I felt the repetitive, drive across the map like a yo-yo mission structure was at odds with the lofty aspirations of the story and way it was told.

If all the missions were as fun as the ones with the window cleaning bomb, the brewery shoot out or the drunken ride home listening to the guys singing, then I would have loved the game a whole lot more. And all of those missions helped develop the characters too, which made them even better.

It just seemed that far too often the game fell back on 'drive slowly to point b while avoiding police'.

I do agree that a sandbox built in that world would be fantastic. It's a hell of a game engine they have there (the destructability in certain missions was very impressive)

 

[MiracleOfSound]

There are checkpoints.
I don't know why the OP didn't get any.
It's mystifying.

I got checkpoints, I just felt they were missing at very important parts, like at the mid-point in the long firefight down at the docks before you enter the molotov-hell warehouse to

Spoiler

kill Derek

.

 

[Evilsanta]

Well the only thin i could agree with is the checkpoint system it sucks...

I hade stocked upp on all weapons full ammo and went to the mission to crash on something on a highway and die...And i hade to watch a damn unskipable cutscene and hade to drive all the way t Harry's gunshop. Damn what a pain.

 

[SquadronAce]

I completely agree, that game was a massive let down