Mirror's edge DLC Trailer

[Caliostro]

Ask yourself this do you strafe when navigating the environment with the left stick in Prince of Persia or God of War?

Those are third person games, if you use the right analog stick to control the swing, what's going to control the camera? In any other First person game, the same axis that controls the forward and backwards controls the strafe. It's tried and true.


Let's not fuck up this game. Mirror's edge has many flaws, but that isn't one of them. Left analog stick is ALWAYS move forward, move backward, strafe left and right... right analog stick does the head turning and body movement.

 

[shadow skill]

So instead of forwards, backward, left and right / look up, down, left and right you want forwards, turn left (also known as look left), turn right (ditto), backwards / look up, down, left and right? Or even more mindbendingly look up, down, move left and right on the one stick? Where's the logic in that?

You're either creating a strange new control system or losing the strafe function and whichever you do you're giving a totally different control system to what virtually everyone expects from the game given the perspective. Sure the gameplay might be closer to games which use a different control system, but when you're in first person most people will expect first person controls.

No what I am asking for is what is called Legacy which is actually the first type of control mechanism for console First person Shooters. It's actually not strange at all when you realize that Legacy actually corresponds to the way people really move most of the time which is of course the point of this game as opposed to aiming where the modern default actually makes sense.

 

[shadow skill]

Ask yourself this do you strafe when navigating the environment with the left stick in Prince of Persia or God of War?

Those are third person games, if you use the right analog stick to control the swing, what's going to control the camera? In any other First person game, the same axis that controls the forward and backwards controls the strafe. It's tried and true.


Let's not fuck up this game. Mirror's edge has many flaws, but that isn't one of them. Left analog stick is ALWAYS move forward, move backward, strafe left and right... right analog stick does the head turning and body movement.

That's why Legacy exists and was the first type of control scheme for console FPS'....It was only after the advent of dual analog controllers that you saw the emergence of what you call the default control scheme on consoles. Let's also understand something else Mirror's Edge is not an FPS what makes sense for an FPS' does not necessarily make sense for a platformer even if the perspective is the same. Legacy is complicated if you are trying to aim a weapon in an FPS, but it's actually quite simple if your primary concern is movement through an environment.

 

[sheic99]

Ill get it when it comes out for pc hopefully, although i may wait to see if gamers are protesting about MAKING PEOPLE PAY FOR MAPS, which are essentially mods, which you don't usually pay for, unless its a mod turned COMMERCIAL QUALITY FULL GAME.

I seriously hope that its free.

The only mod you should ever pay for is Garry's Mod. And that is if you only want the most up to date version.

 

[Caliostro]

That's why Legacy exists and was the first type of control scheme for console FPS'....It was only after the advent of dual analog controllers that you saw the emergence of what you call the default control scheme on consoles. Let's also understand something else Mirror's Edge is not an FPS what makes sense for an FPS' does not necessarily make sense for a platformer even if the perspective is the same. Legacy is complicated if you are trying to aim a weapon in an FPS, but it's actually quite simple if your primary concern is movement through an environment.

I've tried FPSs on consoles. I own Unreal Tournament for the PS2.... The "legacy" system is a big hunk of crap IMO. First person shooters don't have a camera problem, so you can use both analogs. Left analog controls the direction of the movement, and the right controls the axial movement. It's far more intuitive and works better.


Although, I'll agree that the best option is ALWAYS to make the controls re-mapable. Sure way it fits everyone's taste. I honestly dunno why a lot of developers started making the controls "set in stone".

 

[Shellsh0cker]

So instead of forwards, backward, left and right / look up, down, left and right you want forwards, turn left (also known as look left), turn right (ditto), backwards / look up, down, left and right? Or even more mindbendingly look up, down, move left and right on the one stick? Where's the logic in that?

You're either creating a strange new control system or losing the strafe function and whichever you do you're giving a totally different control system to what virtually everyone expects from the game given the perspective. Sure the gameplay might be closer to games which use a different control system, but when you're in first person most people will expect first person controls.

No what I am asking for is what is called Legacy which is actually the first type of control mechanism for console First person Shooters. It's actually not strange at all when you realize that Legacy actually corresponds to the way people really move most of the time which is of course the point of this game as opposed to aiming where the modern default actually makes sense.

Except for the fact that you don't push a control stick around to move in real life. Not that I should really be arguing, because as I'm about to point out, it's all a matter of preference. Yeah, they should've included the legacy option for those who wanted it. Can we stop arguing now?

Also, if any of you had bothered to look up [a href=http://kotaku.com/5101853/mirrors-edge-getting-time-trial-map-pack-in-january]the Kotaku article[/a], you'd know that the map pack will be free on PSN, but cost 800 points on XBL Marketplace for some reason, and an equivalent $10 on PC.

 

[shadow skill]

That's why Legacy exists and was the first type of control scheme for console FPS'....It was only after the advent of dual analog controllers that you saw the emergence of what you call the default control scheme on consoles. Let's also understand something else Mirror's Edge is not an FPS what makes sense for an FPS' does not necessarily make sense for a platformer even if the perspective is the same. Legacy is complicated if you are trying to aim a weapon in an FPS, but it's actually quite simple if your primary concern is movement through an environment.

I've tried FPSs on consoles. I own Unreal Tournament for the PS2.... The "legacy" system is a big hunk of crap IMO. First person shooters don't have a camera problem, so you can use both analogs. Left analog controls the direction of the movement, and the right controls the axial movement. It's far more intuitive and works better.


Although, I'll agree that the best option is ALWAYS to make the controls re-mapable. Sure way it fits everyone's taste. I honestly dunno why a lot of developers started making the controls "set in stone".

I agree that legacy does not work well in an FPS (Goldeneye really had no choice though and that fucked up n64 controller lent itself to Legacy.) but Mirrors Edge just isn't an FPS so the same concerns don't apply here. in fact this game, because of it's structure, introduces some new ones.

Shellsh0cker if you scroll up you will see that earlier I made the point that good software does not needlessly break real world parallels where they fit in with the task of a software.

 

[Shellsh0cker]

Shellsh0cker if you scroll up you will see that earlier I made the point that good software does not needlessly break real world parallels where they fit in with the task of a software.

Still feels more natural to me to go with traditional FPS controls, but like I said, it's all a matter of preference; there's really nothing to argue about.

 

[Caliostro]

I agree that legacy does not work well in an FPS (Goldeneye really had no choice though and that fucked up n64 controller lent itself to Legacy.) but Mirrors Edge just isn't an FPS so the same concerns don't apply here. in fact this game, because of it's structure, introduces some new ones.

Actually it is. You have guns you can shoot, although a lot of people ignore them. But anyways, it's first person movement. Legacy does not work well with ANY kind of first person. It's not intuitive to have your hands control motion AND rotation at the same time on the same hands. There's a reason why legacy died in first person games.

 

[shadow skill]

I agree that legacy does not work well in an FPS (Goldeneye really had no choice though and that fucked up n64 controller lent itself to Legacy.) but Mirrors Edge just isn't an FPS so the same concerns don't apply here. in fact this game, because of it's structure, introduces some new ones.

Actually it is. You have guns you can shoot, although a lot of people ignore them. But anyways, it's first person movement. Legacy does not work well with ANY kind of first person. It's not intuitive to have your hands control motion AND rotation at the same time on the same hands. There's a reason why legacy died in first person games.

Having guns in Mirror's Edge no more makes Mirror's Edge an FPS than Half Life is a platformer because of segments where you much jump on various objects. (Like the fight with the Nihilanth.) Typically First person games have focused on aiming at targets, doing this with two hands probably going opposite directions is just physically difficult period. But you won't actually have this problem with Mirror's Edge since the point isn't to shoot people.

Which makes more sense make it more difficult to move around by forcing players to use two sticks for movement when the point of the game is to negotiate the environment (move) while making it easier to aim a gun which is not the point of this game, or make it easier to negotiate the environments (The point of the game.) whilst making it harder to aim (Which isn't the point of the game anyway?

 

[The Wooster]

Looks like they finally figured out what made Mirror's edge actually good. Hopefully the 3 star times are a touch more forgiving this time around.

 

[number2301]

How does more functionality make it harder to move? This legacy control system you're talking about goes back to the original Wolfenstien days, back then you couldn't look up or down but it didn't matter as there was no point. So you just had forwards, backwards, turn left and turn right on the keyboard and it was fine. With modern proper 3D FP games you don't want that reduced level of control.

 

[The Wooster]

So instead of forwards, backward, left and right / look up, down, left and right you want forwards, turn left (also known as look left), turn right (ditto), backwards / look up, down, left and right? Or even more mindbendingly look up, down, move left and right on the one stick? Where's the logic in that?

You're either creating a strange new control system or losing the strafe function and whichever you do you're giving a totally different control system to what virtually everyone expects from the game given the perspective. Sure the gameplay might be closer to games which use a different control system, but when you're in first person most people will expect first person controls.

No what I am asking for is what is called Legacy which is actually the first type of control mechanism for console First person Shooters. It's actually not strange at all when you realize that Legacy actually corresponds to the way people really move most of the time which is of course the point of this game as opposed to aiming where the modern default actually makes sense.

Except for the fact that you don't push a control stick around to move in real life. Not that I should really be arguing, because as I'm about to point out, it's all a matter of preference. Yeah, they should've included the legacy option for those who wanted it. Can we stop arguing now?

Also, if any of you had bothered to look up [a href=http://kotaku.com/5101853/mirrors-edge-getting-time-trial-map-pack-in-january]the Kotaku article[/a], you'd know that the map pack will be free on PSN, but cost 800 points on XBL Marketplace for some reason, and an equivalent $10 on PC.

And if you'd bothered to read the article you'd know it says nothing of the sort.

This special DLC pack will be available for $10 USD or 800 Microsoft points. As an added bonus, all PLAYSTATION 3 Mirror?s Edge fans will be able to download an additional map for free.

The mappack will not be free on PSN, PSN users will get a bonus map and there's no mention of how PC DLC will be delivered just yet.

 

[Shellsh0cker]

And if you'd bothered to read the article you'd know it says nothing of the sort.

This special DLC pack will be available for $10 USD or 800 Microsoft points. As an added bonus, all PLAYSTATION 3 Mirror?s Edge fans will be able to download an additional map for free.

The mappack will not be free on PSN, PSN users will get a bonus map and there's no mention of how PC DLC will be delivered just yet.

I stand humbly corrected.

 

[Caliostro]

Having guns in Mirror's Edge no more makes Mirror's Edge an FPS than Half Life is a platformer because of segments where you much jump on various objects. (Like the fight with the Nihilanth.)

It's a First person game, where you have the option to spend most of the game shooting. So perhaps a First Person Platformer/Shooter is more appropriate, but to be entirely honest who cares about the category?

Typically First person games have focused on aiming at targets, doing this with two hands probably going opposite directions is just physically difficult period. But you won't actually have this problem with Mirror's Edge since the point isn't to shoot people.

Which makes more sense make it more difficult to move around by forcing players to use two sticks for movement when the point of the game is to negotiate the environment (move) while making it easier to aim a gun which is not the point of this game, or make it easier to negotiate the environments (The point of the game.) whilst making it harder to aim (Which isn't the point of the game anyway?

I'm sorry but you don't have to aim in mirror's edge? Not at a head, or a torso, but you sure as fuck gotta aim at ledges, look up, look down... Why restrict movement which is so necessary? The Legacy system cuts down reaction time by forcing the brain to mix signals. It's a lot easier for your brain, thus making your reaction time faster, if one hand controls 1 type of movement, and the other hand controls the other.

Why change what already works perfectly? You need 2 thumbs to control the full-free movement of your character, assuming you have no cognitive handicaps that do not allow you to coordinate both of your hands, that leaves around 4 fingers free for buttons (4 need to hold the controller from bellow). More than enough for any moment. That way you can strafe, rotate, jump, grab things, interact and an extra key for whatever. All at the same time, all moving as perfectly as you can on a controller (mouse and keyboard>controllers, but that goes without saying).

Why dumb down gameplay because you can't keep up? Why make the movements more rigid, cut down the flexibility of movements and your reaction time?

The "legacy" system in first person games is a thing of yesteryear for a reason: it's obsolete.

 

[D_987]

anyone know if your gonna have to pay for these on the 360?

Knowing Microsoft dick moves, yes.

They only are partially in charge of that.

Its gonna be 800 MS points no doubt, and thesame price for whatever PSN uses. (guess)

 

[shadow skill]

How does more functionality make it harder to move? This legacy control system you're talking about goes back to the original Wolfenstien days, back then you couldn't look up or down but it didn't matter as there was no point. So you just had forwards, backwards, turn left and turn right on the keyboard and it was fine. With modern proper 3D FP games you don't want that reduced level of control.

There is nothing reduced about Legacy on a console Mouse/keyboard is a totally different beast.

How does more functionality make it harder to move?

Where did I say it did?

 

[number2301]

You said the current system makes accurate movement harder than a system with either no strafe controls or strafe on buttons.

 

[shadow skill]

You said the current system makes accurate movement harder than a system with either no strafe controls or strafe on buttons.

Where did I say that quote me.

 

[shadow skill]

Having guns in Mirror's Edge no more makes Mirror's Edge an FPS than Half Life is a platformer because of segments where you much jump on various objects. (Like the fight with the Nihilanth.)

It's a First person game, where you have the option to spend most of the game shooting. So perhaps a First Person Platformer/Shooter is more appropriate, but to be entirely honest who cares about the category?

Typically First person games have focused on aiming at targets, doing this with two hands probably going opposite directions is just physically difficult period. But you won't actually have this problem with Mirror's Edge since the point isn't to shoot people.

Which makes more sense make it more difficult to move around by forcing players to use two sticks for movement when the point of the game is to negotiate the environment (move) while making it easier to aim a gun which is not the point of this game, or make it easier to negotiate the environments (The point of the game.) whilst making it harder to aim (Which isn't the point of the game anyway?

I'm sorry but you don't have to aim in mirror's edge? Not at a head, or a torso, but you sure as fuck gotta aim at ledges, look up, look down... Why restrict movement which is so necessary? The Legacy system cuts down reaction time by forcing the brain to mix signals. It's a lot easier for your brain, thus making your reaction time faster, if one hand controls 1 type of movement, and the other hand controls the other.

Why change what already works perfectly? You need 2 thumbs to control the full-free movement of your character, assuming you have no cognitive handicaps that do not allow you to coordinate both of your hands, that leaves around 4 fingers free for buttons (4 need to hold the controller from bellow). More than enough for any moment. That way you can strafe, rotate, jump, grab things, interact and an extra key for whatever. All at the same time, all moving as perfectly as you can on a controller (mouse and keyboard>controllers, but that goes without saying).

Why dumb down gameplay because you can't keep up? Why make the movements more rigid, cut down the flexibility of movements and your reaction time?

The "legacy" system in first person games is a thing of yesteryear for a reason: it's obsolete.

First off you really don't want to jump while looking down at objects in this game it makes it very likely that you will miss the grab if you end up being a bit short. Really anything but dead centre is asking to miss. Secondly turning is always faster when moving forward or backward in Mirror's Edge than strafing is. Thirdly when was the last time a racing game split the turning controls from the stick that controlled forward motion? Might have something to do with the task and the fact that cars are not usually built with that capabiltly, not to mention it would be slower than turning even if cars were built to be able to mover laterally.