My silly Gripe with MMOs

EHKOS

Madness to my Methods
Feb 28, 2010
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I'm going to start this off by saying I'm very new to MMORPGs and have only become interested because of SWTOR. I'm a huge fan of the series so I figured why not play KOTOR III. My problem is that while summing up my thoughts, I keep encountering the argument "You're being selfish and a whiny, entitled gamer." My problem is that I would love to play the game completely solo, but between flashpoints, heroics, groups, PVP, and all that other crap, it's nearly impossible to stay leveled right. I just got to Hoth and I'm about three levels under what I should be.I'm a very shy person, so even asking for help online is difficult and when I do, people always change the subject on me. "Can anyone run me through Cademimu?" "Cad is the most worthless flashpoint. One time I...." My argument is that MMO's should have a simple dialogue box that asks if you want to play through the game without a group, and if you click yes, it adjusts the levels and difficulty. I've never had friends involved with video games, and I've always had to play the CPU in split screen. I'm having Pokemon flashbacks to where I didn't have a single person to trade with, and was left out of getting Gengar, Machamp etc.

So I'm wondering if I have a valid argument, and if anyone else feels like this too. Or if I am being entitled, should find a nice single player game, and leave MMOs to social people and shut my mouth.
 

Kopikatsu

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May 27, 2010
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Well, I'm sort of in your position. I own a mic but don't use it often because I'm a rather shy, quiet person and nobody can understand what I'm saying because I don't speak very loudly. Anywho-

While I sympathize, I do think it's unreasonable to expect them to make a single player game out of an MMO. It's even called a massively multiplayer online RPG.

So yeah, it kind of sucks to be excluded from games (or even genres) because of your disposition/luck, but it is what it is.
 

Sixcess

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Feb 27, 2010
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I play a lot of MMOs, but solo most of the time, so I sympathise with this... to a point.

It depends how it's implemented. I don't think you should ever need to do group only content just to level up - that sounds like there just isn't enough story/regular missions (I assume, I haven't played the higher levels of SWTOR.)

On the other hand, despite my preference for soloing, I dislike MMOs that take soloability too far, which many of them are now. I like for there to be some group content, even if it's only so I can really push myself and try to run it solo.

Since I'm not very endgame focused the only time group gated content ever really bothered me was in City of Heroes, and only because they had a bad habit of concluding zone storylines with a series of missions that required a minimum of 4, 6 or even 8 players just to start them. Once that becomes older content, and/or if you play at irregular offpeak hours, it can be near impossible to put a team together just to experience the end of the story. That did annoy me, and I would have loved to see an option to make those missions soloable.
 

frobalt

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Jan 2, 2012
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In some ways, I agree with you, but in this case I don't think you have a valid argument:

In TOR, if you do all the missions you can you should actually find yourself over-levelled for story content. I've not played it for some time now, so can't go into loads of detail for what you need to do, but your best bet is going to a lower level planet and completing some side missions.


Although, it has just occurred to me that you might not like doing this as well.

Like you, I tend to prefer going solo as well, although can find it fun to be in a group as well.


But I agree, you should be able to play solo to achieve things. It does bring up an argument that has been going on for a while in the MMO community though, as people would say 'what is the point of the "massively" in MMO if you only play on your own?'
 

Danceofmasks

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Jul 16, 2010
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I'm going to sum up your plight with a quote (from me): "looking for group is the most retarded thing in MMOs"
You sit around and not play the game. You have to try to avoid trolls or jerks or party compositions that don't work. Then people drop out halfway through ...

That's why Guild Wars 2 makes sense.
For the vast majority of content, you don't wait. Just go off and do whatever.
If there are other people around, you spontaneously cooperate.
Sure, there are group events, dungeons, and PvP you can't do alone, but for most group events and world vs world it's also a case of spontaneous cooperation.

Why does this work?
Downscaling.
Sure, being massively overleveled gives you access to gear with more total stats, and traits, and skills, but for the most part you're only slightly overpowered.
Being level 70 and going afk in combat for 5 seconds in a level 20 zone probably equals death.
That means you can pretty much run with anyone without the person doing "appropriate content" feeling useless.
(Exception: level 1-6 areas are way easy, 'cos they're designed for characters with next to no equipment or abilities - which can lead to highbies trolling those areas, in order to get crafting materials or complete events for the daily)
 

krazykidd

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Mar 22, 2008
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So you want to play a MASSIVLY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE game , solo . Your right this is a silly gripe . I can't sympathise with you , sorry , you don't play a multiplayer game then complain you can't play it solo .
 

Chased

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Sep 17, 2010
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krazykidd said:
So you want to play a MASSIVLY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE game , solo . Your right this is a silly gripe . I can't sympathise with you , sorry , you don't play a multiplayer game then complain you can't play it solo .
I have to agree with this good sir. It's like wanting to play a racing game without vehicles or a finish line.

I've played my fair share of WoW and up until 85 you can very easily play the entire game by yourself and still have a somewhat decent experience. Though you can do this the purpose of an MMO is foster the sense of world building by having large amounts of people play the game with you. Designing a game to be balanced with group play is difficult much less than also transforming an already group oriented experience into a single player one.

There are some single player games that still have that "MMO" vibe by having big open worlds with lots of space. The most obvious example of this that comes to mind would be Skyrim.
 

Rooster Cogburn

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May 24, 2008
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This is where I pretend MMO means anything other than lots of people on the same map/world. In addition to that, it means whatever I arbitrarily tack onto it. If you play an MMO solo you should play a single player game instead, even though that's totally fucking arbitrary and they are fundamentally different.

Your issue is a valid one. The fact that any MMO devs knowingly include content that can be completed by a single player puts the lie to this silly notion that if you're not grouping the game magically becomes not an MMO. The ability to group with 40 people at once is not the genre's defining characteristic. If I don't want to do it, that's no reason to dismiss the genre.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
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its the same old black hole of grind and MMO lingo...it doesnt matter how nice the paintjob is...
 

maxben

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Jun 9, 2010
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Chased said:
krazykidd said:
So you want to play a MASSIVLY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE game , solo . Your right this is a silly gripe . I can't sympathise with you , sorry , you don't play a multiplayer game then complain you can't play it solo .
I have to agree with this good sir. It's like wanting to play a racing game without vehicles or a finish line.

I've played my fair share of WoW and up until 85 you can very easily play the entire game by yourself and still have a somewhat decent experience. Though you can do this the purpose of an MMO is foster the sense of world building by having large amounts of people play the game with you. Designing a game to be balanced with group play is difficult much less than also transforming an already group oriented experience into a single player one.

There are some single player games that still have that "MMO" vibe by having big open worlds with lots of space. The most obvious example of this that comes to mind would be Skyrim.
To call MMO a genre like Racing is silly, its like saying movies for theater and movies for home viewing alone, its hardly a genre. MMOs are RPGs with large world that CAN be populated by many people but a) They dont have to be (you can still play on an empty server) and b) Has no reason to force you to interact with those people. YOU, as the player, choose your interaction level like, to use examples from WoW, talking to ppl, doing quests with ppl, doing instances, using the auction house, joining a guild, etc.
Merely because MMORPG was the coined term does in no way mean that you have to play with other people, much like you dont drive on a driveway and dont park on a parkway.
Personally, I played one character solo, I played another character with dungeons, I played a 3rd character with dungeons and leveling guild, and then I played a 4th character with instances and end game guild. I personally think that the original poster needs to consider that it takes time getting used to the multiplayer and that its ok if he wants to solo to start his mmo experience. He will find that as he gets more comfortable with the mechanics and more knowledgeable about the game that it will be easier to interact with ppl and play the multiplayer sections. Being a complete noob in multiplayer is awful.
 

CoS_Dorian

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Aug 31, 2012
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I seriously think people have the right to play games soloing instead of always having to group with the others. True MMORPG means to socialize with the other players but that doesn't mean they have to do it all the time. When you feel like being alone in the game, you have every right to be so.
 

Fishyash

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Dec 27, 2010
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There is nothing wrong for solo play and I do think more MMORPGs should cater towards them a little more. GW2 does this really well with its dynamic levelling system, and the fact that everyone is in a "party" by just being near each other. I can see the advantage of this because even more social players won't always have someone online when they are, and will want to do something in the meantime that is fun.

On the other hand though, I do feel pity for you that you play MMORPGs as a solo experience. MMORPGs are generally pretty bad games on their own merit. You can't really experience all of its good sides without playing with others. A single player RPG will easily dwarf any MMORPG experience, they are put together without the programming limitations of always online play and the need to play it safe from their ridiculously high budget.
 

Fasckira

Dice Tart
Oct 22, 2009
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Understandable issues. Sometimes you just want to play a singleplayer version of an MMO when there is none, and when that happens it sucks.

What I would recommend though is a bit basic but it will work wonders: google for some good guilds/clans/organisations/whatevertheyrereferredtoasinthismmo based in your country/timezone. Check out their site pages, introduce yourself on their forums, get to know them. I find it a lot easier to get to know people on a forum than I do confined to a small chat window in-game and you might do too.

Once you've established a kind of relationship with a community, you'll feel like you've unlocked a whole new aspect of the game.
 

Sixcess

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Feb 27, 2010
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Fishyash said:
A single player RPG will easily dwarf any MMORPG experience,
There are some things that MMOs do that no single player game will ever equal. Even if you're not grouped all the time seeing other players around makes the world seem much more alive, and the worlds feel like worlds.

A little part of me died when I was playing Dragon Age Origins and following the introductory sequence I was all set to start on my epic journey... and that tiny little map screen popped up with its three or four possible destinations. The world suddenly felt very small indeed. Compare that to LOTRO, where I can get on my horse and ride from Bag End in the Shire to the gates of Moria, travelling through dozens of fully realised locations, and never encounter a single loading screen.

That alone is something few if any single player games can ever rival, and I could give other examples, but I'll just say that there are plenty of reasons why someone might prefer an MMO to a single player game, even as a solo experience.
 

Evil Smurf

Admin of Catoholics Anonymous
Nov 11, 2011
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my gripe is the monthly fees. But Guildwars looks good.

OP why don't you play bastion? it is a beautiful game
 

Slash Dementia

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Apr 6, 2009
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Monthly fees, or plain bad games. Also, the bigger the game community, the more chances of finding lots of annoying people (though you can block them). That, and I don't really want to get to know people to game with...