No Man's Sky is starting to look a bit rubbish.

[Cowabungaa]

What you do in Minecraft is up to you, but you DO things, change your environment, build things. In NMS you don't appear to have anything like that degree of control over your environment.

massive tl;dr

I never thought I'd see the Gish Gallop from someone defending a game, but wow, there it is!

Well, it kinda depends on each person's definition of "doing something". Clearly it sounds like there is plenty to do in NMS, but if none of it fits someone's preconceived definition, it's much easier to chalk it up as GG.

Fair enough!

Yeah right, just like Bill Clinton was a virgin depending on your definition of the word "is".

No, that's not fair. There are plenty of activities. Exploring, trading, piracy, just to name a few. That might not be your thing, and that's fine, but that doesn't equal "There's nothing to do." That's clearly false.

 

[Lacedaemonius]

What you do in Minecraft is up to you, but you DO things, change your environment, build things. In NMS you don't appear to have anything like that degree of control over your environment.

massive tl;dr

I never thought I'd see the Gish Gallop from someone defending a game, but wow, there it is!

Well, it kinda depends on each person's definition of "doing something". Clearly it sounds like there is plenty to do in NMS, but if none of it fits someone's preconceived definition, it's much easier to chalk it up as GG.

Fair enough!

Yeah right, just like Bill Clinton was a virgin depending on your definition of the word "is".

No, that's not fair. There are plenty of activities. Exploring, trading, piracy, just to name a few. That might not be your thing, and that's fine, but that doesn't equal "There's nothing to do." That's clearly false.

Exploring is the basis of the game, did you really think that I or anyone here forgot about that? As for the rest, trading for what? With whom? For what? What are you going to pirate, and why would you, and how would that even make sense in a game that's mostly empty space and not other players?

 

[Vendor-Lazarus]

I think it looks pretty good actually. Though I haven't played it yet.
It matches up well with my demands from a game and I am rather fussy in that aspect.
The only two demands-albreakers I had have become only one since it's confirmed offline singleplayer and that is third person piloting (chase cam a la Freelancer).

When piloting anything other than a person it's a must for me due to perspective, claustrophobia and immersion.
Even when I'm piloting a person I up the FOV.
I love spaceship games but far too few ever include a worthwhile third person cam.

Oh, and I really really hope that the "gameplay" aren't designed for controllers or behave as such.
Like the character having such a wide turning angle that you have to have a truck driver's license to be able to steer, etc.
It has become a worrying trend.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Exploring is the basis of the game, did you really think that I or anyone here forgot about that? As for the rest, trading for what? With whom? For what? What are you going to pirate, and why would you, and how would that even make sense in a game that's mostly empty space and not other players?

Most of that has been revealed already and even talked about in this thread. But the 'why' behind isn't very relevant for the argument that there's not even a 'what.' That's clearly false and that's all my argument really entails.

Now, if that 'what' doesn't sound like fun to you; fair enough.

 

[Zeke63]

ya it looks beyond empty...for the people saying it's an "exploration" game so its ok it is not!!! Having no alien races to interact with or questlines that exploration will be so empty!!

 

[DeliveryGodNoah_v1legacy]

It only really needs to nail one thing well for me: Exploration.

I have no delusions that the randomly generated worlds will be completely different from each other, but my hope is that at least many of them are different enough.

Also robots and droids are scary. And this game has that. Which I like being scared.

I don't play a lot of space games, or really any for that matter. The prospect of a game being nothing but sitting in your ship circling another ship for minutes hoping your shots hit some part of them rarely appealed to me. To me it's kind of like if in GTA you couldn't get out of your vehicle to explore the world. I want to not only pilot a ship across the universe, but I want to be able to land and explore those planets almost seamlessly.

For the most part, I'm hoping No Man's Sky fulfills that.

 

[fix-the-spade]

The only thing on offer that looks remotely appealing at this point is the spaceship dogfights. But I'd rather play a game that focuses on being a good spaceship dogfighting game than one that includes shallow dogfights alongside a few other equally shallow activities.

To me this game looks to have the same merits and problems of Eve Online and Elite: Dangerous, in that it's a bottomless pit of you figure it out.

I can see how that's not a very compelling prospect to many players, but I'm nearing the end of a seven months trip in Elite Dangerous. The last time I saw another player was before Christmas, I've been literally to the other end of the Galaxy, as far from Earth as it's possible to go.

Games like this appeal to me, I love ridiculous, enormous goal I can do just because. No Man's Sky looks like being that kind of game.

 

[JaKandDaxter]

Yea I'm not too confident on the gameplay mechanics for NMS. It can still be a good game, but I'm not sold on the mechanics. Will have to give the game a run to see for myself.

I like the idea of a content generator. And in the right game with great or even good gameplay mechanics, it will be awesome. Could solve content issues of many games. Although it will lack some level of detail of traditionally made levels from the ground up.

 

[JaKandDaxter]

Double post

 

[Lacedaemonius]

Exploring is the basis of the game, did you really think that I or anyone here forgot about that? As for the rest, trading for what? With whom? For what? What are you going to pirate, and why would you, and how would that even make sense in a game that's mostly empty space and not other players?

Most of that has been revealed already and even talked about in this thread.

Yeah, it has, and not to the favor of NMS.

But the 'why' behind isn't very relevant for the argument that there's not even a 'what.' That's clearly false and that's all my argument really entails.

Now, if that 'what' doesn't sound like fun to you; fair enough.

Actually no, the "Why" does matter. There's something in even the most basic gameplay and storytelling called "Stakes"...

 

[Cowabungaa]

Actually no, the "Why" does matter. There's something in even the most basic gameplay and storytelling called "Stakes"...

It matters as such, yes. But it doesn't matter for the specific thing that I addressed, namely that the claim that there's nothing to do is false. Whether the activities that we can do are worthwhile is another matter.

For me I just need one activity, with the other activities supplementing/fueling that, namely exploration. If it does that good I'm satisfied. Hence why I also don't believe that what we know about the game's activities doesn't speak in favor of NMS.

 

[Lacedaemonius]

Actually no, the "Why" does matter. There's something in even the most basic gameplay and storytelling called "Stakes"...

It matters as such, yes. But it doesn't matter for the specific thing that I addressed, namely that the claim that there's nothing to do is false. Whether the activities that we can do are worthwhile is another matter.

For me I just need one activity, with the other activities supplementing/fueling that, namely exploration. If it does that good I'm satisfied. Hence why I also don't believe that what we know about the game's activities doesn't speak in favor of NMS.

Are you desperately trying to rack up internet points, or have a discussion? I get the sense that you're aiming for the former, while I'm really trying for the latter. If you like, I can give you ALL OF THE POINTS, and we can just talk about what you know everyone here including myself is expressing concern over. Or, if that makes you uncomfortable, you can just stop altogether, whichever works for you.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Are you desperately trying to rack up internet points, or have a discussion? I get the sense that you're aiming for the former, while I'm really trying for the latter. If you like, I can give you ALL OF THE POINTS, and we can just talk about what you know everyone here including myself is expressing concern over. Or, if that makes you uncomfortable, you can just stop altogether, whichever works for you.

No, what I'm doing is communicating clearly. Making clear what my argument was and most importantly where it stops. Making sure stuff doesn't derail and I don't get attacked on things I never said and making sure that people don't feel attacked by things they might perceive me saying.

Like your concern about the stakes, which I'm not arguing against. You can be concerned about whether the stakes behind NMS' activities aren't high enough to motivate you all you like because I don't have an issue with that at all. You be concerned, I'll be hopeful. That's all fine by me.

And if you want to know why I'm hopeful, that's because I think that me wanting to reach the center of the universe and cataloging all kinds of creatures and stuff along the way is enough to make me do some of the game's activities. Exploration in itself is motivation enough for me, providing that the universe is interesting enough to explore, which I think it will be. That's what I hope for. Might not be the case, I might be disappointed in the end. But I like hoping. Hopefulness feels good.

 

[Chester Rabbit]

Starting? Once you get past the indie spectacle, when did it not look rubbish? I still have no clear idea of what the hell this game even is. I know what you do it in, but I don't see any central idea that ties it all together; and what I do see, looks flimsy at best with the only thing carrying it being the size of the game.
So far it's just some big game where you do shit in it...

 

[Fox12]

Once upon a time, not so very long ago, I was excited about No Man's Sky.

It looked pretty and the seamless open-universe approach was intriguing.

However, almost right from the start people were asking questions to the effect of, "Okay, but what does the player actually do?"

Now that large quantities of gameplay footage are running free on the internet, those questions seemed to have been answered with, "Not fucking much."

On planets you walk around gathering resources for upgrades. You can scan procedurally generated animals and plants, which does basically nothing. You can make holes in the terrain by shooting it. You can engage in some browser-game level first person shooting. In space you can get into dogfights while flying between planets.

It all looks incredibly basic, the kind of thing that one can tire of after an hour or two.

The other big draw is the procedurally generated worlds which allow for massive amounts of (technically) unique content without the devs actually having to personally having to make that content.

However, now that I've seen a bunch of these procedurally generated worlds, my response is, "So what?" The whole thing amounts to this planet having blue grass while that planet had red and this planet having six-legged animals while another had lots of birds. It's like the difference between Minecraft maps. "Well, last time I started near the sea and there was some trees over here. But this time I started on a hill and the trees are over there!"

I'm actually a fan of randomized content, but it works best as a complement to fun mechanics that forces the player to adapt rather than learn content by rote.

The only thing on offer that looks remotely appealing at this point is the spaceship dogfights. But I'd rather play a game that focuses on being a good spaceship dogfighting game than one that includes shallow dogfights alongside a few other equally shallow activities.

Isn't this basically what they're trying to do with the new Mass Effect? Or, heck, the first mass effect? The only unique thing I see here is procedurally generated content, but all procedurally generated content ends up looking the same after a while. It may be a relaxing exploration game, but I wouldn't pay top dollar for it.

 

[Mangod]

Are you desperately trying to rack up internet points, or have a discussion? I get the sense that you're aiming for the former, while I'm really trying for the latter. If you like, I can give you ALL OF THE POINTS, and we can just talk about what you know everyone here including myself is expressing concern over. Or, if that makes you uncomfortable, you can just stop altogether, whichever works for you.

No, what I'm doing is communicating clearly. Making clear what my argument was and most importantly where it stops. Making sure stuff doesn't derail and I don't get attacked on things I never said and making sure that people don't feel attacked by things they might perceive me saying.

Like your concern about the stakes, which I'm not arguing against. You can be concerned about whether the stakes behind NMS' activities aren't high enough to motivate you all you like because I don't have an issue with that at all. You be concerned, I'll be hopeful. That's all fine by me.

And if you want to know why I'm hopeful, that's because I think that me wanting to reach the center of the universe and cataloging all kinds of creatures and stuff along the way is enough to make me do some of the game's activities. Exploration in itself is motivation enough for me, providing that the universe is interesting enough to explore, which I think it will be. That's what I hope for. Might not be the case, I might be disappointed in the end. But I like hoping. Hopefulness feels good.

I think a better way to formulate this discussion would be "Is there a reason to do anything in the game, other than just doing them? What's the in-game motivation?"

Lacedaemonius seems to be concerned that, while there's stuff to do, there's no internal motivation for it.

 

[Cowabungaa]

I think a better way to formulate this discussion would be "Is there a reason to do anything in the game, other than just doing them? What's the in-game motivation?"

Lacedaemonius seems to be concerned that, while there's stuff to do, there's no internal motivation for it.

I stated that very motivation in that same post you quoted; to explore. You need better and better stuff to go further and further. Most of the activities are ways to get better stuff. To explore is, I hope, the only motivation I'll need.

 

[Mangod]

I think a better way to formulate this discussion would be "Is there a reason to do anything in the game, other than just doing them? What's the in-game motivation?"

Lacedaemonius seems to be concerned that, while there's stuff to do, there's no internal motivation for it.

I stated that very motivation in that same post you quoted; to explore. You need better and better stuff to go further and further. Most of the activities are ways to get better stuff. To explore is, I hope, the only motivation I'll need.

So, exploring just for the sake of exploring? There's no end goal? Because for a lot of people, that can be a dealbreaker.

 

[ryan_cs]

Are you desperately trying to rack up internet points, or have a discussion? I get the sense that you're aiming for the former, while I'm really trying for the latter. If you like, I can give you ALL OF THE POINTS, and we can just talk about what you know everyone here including myself is expressing concern over. Or, if that makes you uncomfortable, you can just stop altogether, whichever works for you.

No, what I'm doing is communicating clearly. Making clear what my argument was and most importantly where it stops. Making sure stuff doesn't derail and I don't get attacked on things I never said and making sure that people don't feel attacked by things they might perceive me saying.

Like your concern about the stakes, which I'm not arguing against. You can be concerned about whether the stakes behind NMS' activities aren't high enough to motivate you all you like because I don't have an issue with that at all. You be concerned, I'll be hopeful. That's all fine by me.

And if you want to know why I'm hopeful, that's because I think that me wanting to reach the center of the universe and cataloging all kinds of creatures and stuff along the way is enough to make me do some of the game's activities. Exploration in itself is motivation enough for me, providing that the universe is interesting enough to explore, which I think it will be. That's what I hope for. Might not be the case, I might be disappointed in the end. But I like hoping. Hopefulness feels good.

I might have missed something, but why do we need to upgrade our ship to go further? Are there stronger enemies near the center or is there some other reason?