Norwegian Mass Murderer Defends Gaming Habits

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Gardenia said:
Edible Avatar said:
This is in Norway, but whatever, it's not like Sweden used to be the England to our Ireland or anything (spoiler: they totally were)
We already had this discussion in Norway. The overwhelming majority did not want to be murderers.
Thanks for pointing that out, my mind was somewhere else when I posted that.
 

The Artificially Prolonged

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Immsys said:
The Artificially Prolonged said:
GamerMage said:
I saw this and thought "I may be psycotic,but don't my intelligence. It is just a hobby."
Its a sad day when a pychotic mass murderer appears to have more common sense than the media.

On topic:

However this guy is completely sick and twisted. I don't think Norway has a death penalty but really this guy needs one.
I find it interesting to see this common mistake made: he is not psychotic. Just because he kills people, doesn't make him a psychopath. Soldiers kill hundreds of people, very few are psychopaths.

OT: fascinating to see people's reaction to this is typical of any society. I like to put this akin to what Catholics might have said about a protestant in their society and how similar the responses are. Simply dehumanizing is too often our response to these events, very rarely to we attempt to seriously asses the others point of view.
My bad, I always mix up psychotic and psychopathic.

I would still called him a psychopath not just for the killings but for the manner he carried them out and how he has shown no remorse, feeling or even awareness that he has done anything wrong would suggest him being a psychopath.

As for your point about dehumanising, I'm not exactly sure what you mean about catholic and protestant societies. I'm certainly glad that a typical society would demonise a mass murderer and I would be very wary of a society that doesn't. All I can really say on the matter is that I imagine we dehumanise people like him because it is damn hard to actually view someone who has done such terrible things as a fellow human i.e. someone who we can empathise with.
 

Rheinmetall

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What WoW and gaming have to do with this terrible crime? I suppose that the prosecutor is eihther completely idiot, or just average idiot.
 

Eveonline100

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The Artificially Prolonged said:
Immsys said:
The Artificially Prolonged said:
GamerMage said:
I saw this and thought "I may be psycotic,but don't my intelligence. It is just a hobby."
Its a sad day when a pychotic mass murderer appears to have more common sense than the media.

On topic:

However this guy is completely sick and twisted. I don't think Norway has a death penalty but really this guy needs one.
I find it interesting to see this common mistake made: he is not psychotic. Just because he kills people, doesn't make him a psychopath. Soldiers kill hundreds of people, very few are psychopaths.

OT: fascinating to see people's reaction to this is typical of any society. I like to put this akin to what Catholics might have said about a protestant in their society and how similar the responses are. Simply dehumanizing is too often our response to these events, very rarely to we attempt to seriously asses the others point of view.
My bad, I always mix up psychotic and psychopathic.

I would still called him a psychopath not just for the killings but for the manner he carried them out and how he has shown no remorse, feeling or even awareness that he has done anything wrong would suggest him being a psychopath.

As for your point about dehumanising, I'm not exactly sure what you mean about catholic and protestant societies. I'm certainly glad that a typical society would demonise a mass murderer and I would be very wary of a society that doesn't. All I can really say on the matter is that I imagine we dehumanise people like him because it is damn hard to actually view someone who has done such terrible things as a fellow human i.e. someone who we can empathise with.
Good point i suppose to take it a step further. I feel as though all mass murders are basically treated as monsters for 2 reasons the first is because of the reason you stated and 2nd is out of fear just google the green river killer, DC sniper, or the BTK killer(all them have been to known to kill in mass and instill fear). The green river killer because of well he killed 40+ plus people and their seemed like nothing the police could do. The DC sniper because well snipers are inheraently scaring(instantouns death from an unknown killer). The BTK killer because of how brutal he killed his victims(BTK = Burtalize them Toture them Kill them). In a way dehuminzing them to the point of monster because well thats how we(humans) see anything we can't empathize with and to lesser extent anything we can't understand.
 

Soak

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Again, a slight "meh" to the Escapist, because this is barely game related. The only thing said is, that playing games may increase your hand-eye-coordination (which is a main factor for shooting practices), that playing a first person-shooter may have an increased impact in this matter and that it's possible to use "gaming" as a cover for other actions today.
Every newspaper, magazine or whatever implying something else, exspecialy in this case, is plane ignorant or stupid. If this is not what the Escapist wants to get at, but the "social-discussion" around the matter, it's ok.

There are some rather well reflected comments about this toppic, i want to refer to some, but because of space i won't quote all of it.
MetalMagpie said:
*snip*
I'm assuming no one. Pleading guilty would shorten his trial, giving him less of a platform.

The BBC's coverage gives me a picture of his "plan" as something like this:
*snip*
Kelthurin said:
*snip*
He's not pleading guilty, because he believes 110% in what he did, and what he's saying.
*snip*
plainlake said:
*snip*
A fucked up ideology, and that is what the media should focus on, facistic discriminating rethoric that is currently on the rise in Europe,(again).
*snip*


This situation is frigthening, close to horrifying! Maybe he is insane, but according to what i know, he might neither be neurotic nor psychotic (at least not in the "classical" sense, maybe psychopathic). This shows to us once more, that a (seemingly) high intellect and logic-analytical skills won't neccesarily keep you from committing horrible homocide out of ideals, even against children and developing a seemingly "rational" concept to legitimize this act and be without regret (to us, to the court and to the psychatrists his "rationality" makes barely to no sense, which is part of the reason some find him insane, but to him his acts make perfect sense). This is, even to an experienced court, a rare and critical situation and the reason they have to make a bigger process out of it. Most other concerns are already said/written, but the point to us, as a society should be, to learn from this situation and , how to deal with or how to prevent them (both situations and the ideals leading to them) better.
 

Saviordd1

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El Luck said:
-Concentrated Ignorance-
Seriously? Remember Columbine? How many people blamed the whole damn thing on games because one of the shooters played counterstrike.

This shit always bites us in the ass, wake up.
 

El Luck

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Saviordd1 said:
El Luck said:
-Concentrated Ignorance-
Seriously? Remember Columbine? How many people blamed the whole damn thing on games because one of the shooters played counterstrike.

This shit always bites us in the ass, wake up.
Ok then, so what exactly will happen if video games are blamed for this by a few media groups who are just trying to drum up a sensationalist piece to sell a quick paper here and there?

Because clearly I'm too ignorant to see it.

Or maybe, just maybe I realise that gaming has been around for fucking years and yet somehow despite all the shit thrown at games like Mortal Kombat, GTA, Carmageddon, Doom, Counter Strike, Mass Effect, Bulletstorm, WoW and countless others, its still here and its gone from strength to strength.

But no, ignorance, clearly.
 

ElPatron

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Eleima said:
Heating? Firearms usually have heatshields but if for some reason you're spitting so much ammo that it gets too hot to handle, gloves help a lot.

Recoil? Breivik used a Mini-14, it fires .223 Remington. It does definitely kick but it's very comfortable to shoot and doesn't usually surprise first time shooters.

Let's not forget that Norway's gun laws kinda "forced" him to train with his firearms so he wasn't exactly under-trained... He is probably shitting us but playing a game can increase the combat effectiveness of a soldier.

Nowadays soldiers have been exposed to shooters and they have a 99% chance of firing the first time they have a real human target on their sights.
 

Halfs-

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redisforever said:
Also, think about it, some of us may have played online with this guy...
*shudder*
I actually did know him in WoW (he played on Silvermoon under "Andersnordic"), by this I mean he was part of a few random group conversations and a few whispers here and there. Fact is though I'd have had no clue what so ever as to any of his views, he seemed just as "normal" as anyone who plays WoW. That has pretty much what most of my old guildmates have said as well, even his own guild would never have got close to guessing what he was planning all that time.

I find it odd that people are questioning his sanity though, we band around words like "crazy" and "nutjob" pretty liberally and while I don't think there is a punishment devised that could even come close to inflicting enough pain and suffering on the monster, his actions strike me as the acts of a rational mind. Sure a mind that has reached the most extreme and disgusting conclusions but a rational mind nonetheless, the amount of planning he appears to have gone to alone would surely be beyond anyone traditionally regarded as insane.

Maybe it's a issue of definitions in that respect, at what point do extreme views become grounds for insanity?
 

nukethetuna

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Yeah, he's awful, murder is terrible, but I just can't stop connecting him and Anders from Dragon Age 2.

Radical extremist views from an otherwise rational mind causing something catastrophically unforgivable.
 

plainlake

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HyenaThePirate said:
Should... I be concerned that I'm starting to develop a begrudging respect and perhaps even a slight modicrum of admiration for this man? I mean, I've never been so convicted about anything ever in my life ever. Worse, I've never had such conviction AND the ability to apply it coolly and logically in casual conversation without resorting to troll-baiting and backhanded insults.

Why is this mass murderer starting to look like he's a superior human being to me in a number of disturbing ways?!
Yes, you definently should. beeing cold, calculating and have a die hard conviction for a set of beliefs is not something to be admired.

You should always be open to the possibility that you are completely and utterly wrong in some or all aspects. But unfortunately that is alot harder to do.
 

Saviordd1

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El Luck said:
Saviordd1 said:
El Luck said:
-Concentrated Ignorance-
Seriously? Remember Columbine? How many people blamed the whole damn thing on games because one of the shooters played counterstrike.

This shit always bites us in the ass, wake up.
Ok then, so what exactly will happen if video games are blamed for this by a few media groups who are just trying to drum up a sensationalist piece to sell a quick paper here and there?

Because clearly I'm too ignorant to see it.

Or maybe, just maybe I realise that gaming has been around for fucking years and yet somehow despite all the shit thrown at games like Mortal Kombat, GTA, Carmageddon, Doom, Counter Strike, Mass Effect, Bulletstorm, WoW and countless others, its still here and its gone from strength to strength.

But no, ignorance, clearly.
Public opinion lowers, always lowers, will continue to lower unless it changes.

All of those blows have set gaming back by years and months. Gaming is still always on the political chopping block because it is still seen as evil by idiots.
 

nikomas1

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Look, videogames certainly do make good training tools and in that regard even cod does the job, lets just quickly run down what you can learn at a glance from even cod shal we?

- How to reload most weapons, or at least a basic understanding of it
- Bringing the weapon to your shoulder and aiming down the ironsights makes you much more accurate

There, even those two things and you have a good head start on some others, now take something more hardcore like Arma or an old rainbow six game? They'll teach you pretty much anything from safetys to fire modes just from playing, he could certainly have "Learned" some things about weapons from playing COD, even if it would be extremly innacurate information and only work when shooting unarmed civillians.

But well...

Basically, I'm pretty confident that if you give me anything from a handgun to a LAW, that I could have the weapon loaded and prepped to fire fairly quickly without even touching the thing simply from being used to the weapons from games.

At least, that's how it went the first time I fired a 9mm handgun, after the instructor went trough the safety rules I could ready the gun without any help on my first try...


So bottom line, most shooters and specially the more realistic ones are practically instruction manuals for how to handle weapons on the technical side, the practical one (recoil and such) would still need actual practice but even here you would know from games that the recoil from a 5.56 M16 and a 7.62 AK is different, even if they are both assault rifle type weapons.



That aside, guy is still a psycopath and manuals never made sane people do horrible things, well, not counting religious texts...
 

Kapol

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According to the actual article, while he did say that WoW didn't make him think of himself as though he were in a fantasy world, it's important to note this:

Without the "training" of the video game, he said, "I would not have been able to do this."
Something that this article doesn't mention. I don't believe that the game itself caused him to do what he did, but it is possible that playing the game at least improved his skills to a certain degree. That said, I'd think him actually going out and using the weapon more likely made it possible, since it's said he liked to hunt.
 

Strazdas

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May 28, 2011
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WMDogma said:
On trial for killing 77 people in July of last year in one of the worst acts of mass murder ever committed,
***** please


Also seems that he does not want the blame to go for gaming, which is intresting that he would even care about it.